The resent discussion about betrayers feeling remorsefull about their affairs caused me to think.<P>My H also has told me he has felt no remorse over his relationship with the OW. He has expressed that he was sorry because of the pain and anquish it has caused all of us, including the OW, but that he is kinda glad that it happened, because the OW widened his perspectives about what marriages would, could and should be like. He thinks she actually helped our marriage. He cannot say that my discovery of the affair has helped us be stronger tho, because a year before the discovery I had already begun making changes in my attitudes and expections which were causing positive reactions in our relationship. Had she never existed, would the changes I was making have made our marriage stronger, us closer? On the other hand, the during the first year of H's affair, when I did not know about it, his actions and reactions to his family were classic of someone in an affair. He was sarcastic, mean spirited, unhappy, stayed away as much as possible, etc. Generally, a butt to be around. He says he was unhappy to some extent or other, kinda in waves, before the OW, but that having the OW caused his unhappiness to take a "louder" form, thus causing me to reexamine what I needed to do to make things better between us. Would I have read the "self-help" books if he had not gotten so buttish toward me? Would he have gotton so buttish if he had not met her? We will never know for sure.<P><BR>For your information...<BR>remorse= moral anquish arising from repentance for past misdeeds; bitter regret<P>remorseless= having no pity or compassion;merciless<P>sorrow = mental anquish or suffering because of injury or loss<P>Feel free to discuss the differences.<BR>Would like to hear the debate!<P>Is remorse a prerequisit to marital recovery?<BR>If so, why? If not, why?<P>Gotta go. will check back later.<P>Beth

My comment is perhaps a parralel to the principle of: "If this bad didn't happen, this good wouldn't have either".<P>On the way home from school yesterday, my 6 year old was talking about his substitute teacher, and then about how much he prefers his real teacher, and what a good mom she would be, and then would he be here if dad had a different wife - would he have been born to his first wife?<P>And I told him that, no - you would have only been possible if I was your mom and your dad was your dad. <P>So, he says - so if divorce is so bad, and dad got divorced and you got divorced - then you guys got married again, am I bad too?<P>NO!!!! Because the beatiful thing about bad things, like divorce - is that there is a God, who promises that even in the bad he can use that situation for his purpose. And God had a purpose for you to be here.<P>(Romans 8:28). <P>TNT

Hi Beth,<P>I'm chuckling as I write this because the way you presented this discussion reminded me of that Mike Myers Saturday Night Live character, Linda Richman. You know, the one who says, "I feel ferklempt. Let me give you a topic. A "chickpea" is neither from a chick or a pea ........ DISCUSS." <P>Also, I LOVE your posts, btw. I wish you posted more often. Thank you for giving the actual definitions of remorse and sorrow. I, for one, needed to read them. <P>That definition of remorse is pretty stiff. At the risk of getting flogged like Pod Person, I'll have to admit that, by this particular definition, I guess I don't feel "true" remorse. Like your H, I am extremely sorry for the pain that has resulted because of both my H and my affairs because I love my H dearly and I don't want him to hurt, ever. But I can't honestly say that I have moral anguish over it. That said, by the definition you presented, I'm definitely not remorseless either. So, where do I fit? <P>I think I'm pretty close to feeling as your H feels. I'm sorry for the pain that we both have felt during this ordeal, but I'm also sorry for all the pain we both felt throughout our marriage that we weren't skilled enough to get a proper handle on. I'm sorry about all of that, but I can't regret my entire life. There would be so many things my H and I would have to regret that I'm afraid hardly anything would be left.<P>I guess I feel our infidelities were all "part of the process." And I guess I am just going to try to trust the process and let it take us where we need to go rather than regret virtually everything we've done in our lives. I love where we are now, and unfortunately, I doubt we'd be here if we hadn't went there. That doesn't mean I'm jumping up and down cheering "Go Affair, Go!" No way! Both my H and I know exactly why it happened, and we know how it happened. There is no mystery to it. The dots connect so neatly it's uncanny. So, these days we're drawing a different puzzle. On a completely different course than we were before. That way we know the outcome will never be the same.<P>So, to answer your question, by the definitions you gave, no, I don't think remorse is a prerequisite to rebuild a marriage. I believe I've read Dr. Harley say the same thing, and now I understand why. But what I think is a prerequisite to rebuild a marriage is achieving an understanding and acceptance of what has happened. I think this is necessary to plot your next course toward a more successful marriage. I see a lot of people still looking at their marriages and seeing nothing seriously wrong, and I feel for them. If all they see is "the affair," and nothing that led up to it, then I can understand why some are still stuck in that push and pull stuff, going 'round in circles. <P>Personally, I hate going 'round in circles. Makes me dizzy. No, this time, it's full speed ahead or I'm politely excusing myself from this ride.<P>------------------<BR>Love is meant to heal. Love is meant to renew. Love is meant to oust all fear. Love is meant to harmonize differences. Love is meant to bring us closer to God.