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We took the EN Questionaire when this started 6 weeks ago. I have been focusing on them. The only one I can't do as much for as I would like is Financial. But I am doing what I can... barely spent a dime on self since this has started. other high needs are conversation and recreation and we are working on those.
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You said "We" are working on those.....I don't understand, I thought she wanted to separate.
In any event, you need to snoop, and continue to fill her top EN's as best you can. What his her main financial complaint? Is it that you spent too much on yourself? Or does she want you to make more money?
That's really all you can do until you've gathered enough evidence to confront her, and in the great scheme of thinks 6 weeks is a drop in the bucket.
God Bless,
-Caren
Always Look For Grace Given, Even in the midst of Grace Denied.
BS-Me 39
WH-37
Together 15 years
Married 12 years
7 kids total, His: SD20, SS18, Twin SS's 16.
Mine: DD22, DD15
Ours: DD12
Affair began Fall 04, Separated Fall 04,2 Failed Plan B attempts, False recovery of sorts Spring 05.......Still pluggin' away.
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well.... it was "we" until she said that seperation might be best. She says that I don't make enough. She comes from a wealthier family than I do, so I think thats where that difference comes from.
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fighting,
Please try to elaborate more on your posts, it's a little difficult to keep up with you at times.
Where did you find the phone number? Why do you think it's the person she is having an A with? Did you get it from a cell phone? If so, you can look at phone logs to see how often she calls him.
Do you think he works with her? Can you call her office acting like someone else and ask for him by name to see if he works there? You need to find out if he is married or involved with another woman.
When is she most likely finding time to be with him?
Does she have an email account that you can sneak a look at to see if they are writing each other? Does she use a computer often at home?
Right now you don't have enough information to confront her. If you tried to, she'd hide the affair even deeper and you'd have much more trouble gathering proof. So, for now, you dont let her know you are suspicious.
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Sorry, for the lack of info in some posts. I am at work (and emotionally unstable <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> )
I found the number on her cell. This number sent her a graphic picture telling her its hers and another message asking to see something she has. Almost positive he works with her, as his contact name in directory was Work related. She is a nurse and has a pretty stressful job. She was working nights, so she had many opportunities while I was at work if she wished.
Email I have access to and she doesn't message him. Cell phone records I am working on.
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I'm glad you posted here on GQ's. Remember, a lot of what we say to you is just our guesses about what is going on. Rest assured we all hope it is not an affair (either EA or PA) you're dealing with. But, since it all sounds so familiar, we'd be remiss in not advising you of the possibilties of an OM. Anyway, here is a cut-n-paste from a reply from Star*fish to me when I exposed my ignorance about a proper Plan A. Plan A as Harley meant it to be...
Plan A is not (repeat NOT) about making the WS happy, or feeling good.
Plan A is NOT, contrary to popular (and very incorrect opinion), about "making yourself a better person," or "working on yourself."
Plan A is ALL ABOUT the straying spouse. In Willard Harely's ever brilliant words, Plan A is a stategy to end the affair and to entice the straying spouse to reconsider the marriage.
So, it has several elements that should be done at the same time.
First is to eliminate LBers and to meet needs as best you can... recognizing that the unfaithful mate may not allow the betrayed partner to meet needs.
Second is to CONFRONT the unfaithful partner with what you know. Doing so (of course) in a way that is respectful and about you... how you feel, how you are affected by the affair.
Third is to expose the affair to the scrutiny of the world. The lover's spouse or s/o, coworkers, family, friends, church family, children, etc.
ALL OF THAT is Plan A. And it should be done as much as possible simultaneously. (If you don't believe me call the radio show Mondays and Thursdays at 1pm Central Time and ask Dr. Harley for yourself.)
Plan A must have a deadline. It's called Plan "A" because there is a second step... aptly named Plan "B." Willard Harley suggests a max of 6 months for men and 3 months for women before going to the next step. If Plan A hasn't worked in that time, it's not going to.
(I challenge you to find anyone who has done Plan A longer than that and been successful. I define successful as the A ending, n/c promised and verified, and the couple working a good recovery plan which includes meeting needs, eliminating LBers, getting in 15 hours a week of UAT, and most importantly following POJA.)
--
Plan A is not about being a nice guy. Plan A is about ending the affair.... being a nice guy is part of that, but only part. That's why confronting and exposing are crucial elements of Plan A... and if you're not doing those things then you can't really say that you're doing Plan A. Note that Dr Harley does include confronting your WS (Wandering Spouse) with what you know. So make sure that you have your facts correct. I would strongly advise you to contact the Harleys for counseling. You can call yourself - your wife need not participate if she so chooses. The Harleys will help you formulate and implement a solid plan to rebuild your marriage. And they are reported as being very good at what they do - including getting the 'reluctant' spouse on board. Make the call!
Disclaimer: This is free advice - at least you are assured of getting your money's worth!
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When you look at the fact that she want's a trial separation and that she is getting this kind of message from the OM on her cell phone, you probably already realize it appears that it's an affair. You just need to keep gathering proof.
Many cell phone companies have websites where you can view a log of all cell phone activity. It usually includes the actual phone numbers dialed and the amount of time, so see if your provider has such a website.
Is there a way to forward that text message (picture) to yourself, to keep for the time being? If you reach the point of exposing to his superiors, this would the human resource department's worst nightmare.
Speculation: She wants to leave you so she can see if this relationship with him will work out. If it doesn't, she will still have you in her back pocket, hence the 'trial separation' talk.
Find out if he is married and what his role is in the place where she works. You are doing good.
When you expose, you do it all at once. Also, you NEVER threaten exposure, that'll just make her see you as the enemy and back her into a corner.
Let us know what else you find. Good luck.
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I can't get into her cell records without resetting her password. anyone know another way I might crack a phone record?
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Is your name on the cell plan along with hers? If so, you could go to a local office and they could print out a copy of the history for you. They'd probably just ask for picture id.
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ok... I have access to the phone bill. I have numerous calls up until the 22nd of December after that they have stopped.
Here is the info that I have:
-name
-number
-dirty picture sent to her from him
-He works with her (her manager)
-I am almost positive he is married
-a substantial # of phone calls.
-I believe he has children as well
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That's very interesting that the calls stopped on the 22nd. Makes me wonder if he got caught or backed off. Do you recall her mood around the 22nd of last month? Did she seem excessively happy or upset?
It wouldn't be the first time that we've seen a WS try to separate from their spouse, even when the OP has tried to end the affair. The withdrawal effects can make people do loopy things.
Would be worth getting a keylogger setup on her computer. In my case, my wife had setup a secret yahoo email account, so that the email account I knew of was clean. Once I got the keylogger, I found her new account (including the password) and all the emails they were sending each other.
Is she still working nights? If she is at home much while you are not, consider getting a voice activated recorder and hook it up to the phone line. Radio Shack has all the stuff you need to do this.
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He's married? Fricken sweet!! That's a good thing, then you can expose to his wife when the time is right. There's no way to copy that pic on her cell unless you sent it your cell, can you do that????
Does your WW use the computer??? If so, I 2nd the keylogger, it can track EVERYTHING she does on the computer, even if she empties the cache.
You also may want to put a voice activated tape recorder somewhere indiscreet in your house, a lot of times they'll talk on the land line when the BS isn't home, also you may catch her talking to one of your friends about it, and you could get some background.
I'm sorry if I sounded short with you before when I made the "we" comment, I didn't mean to, I didn't think it sounded that way until I re-read just now.
I've worked a long, long day today, and my back is killing me from my workout tape....I have things sore I didn't know I had, LOL.
Anyway, I will definitely check in several times tommorrow, the posts get few and far between on the weekends, but I always try to check in to see if I can be of assistance.
Good Luck and God Bless,
-Caren
Always Look For Grace Given, Even in the midst of Grace Denied.
BS-Me 39
WH-37
Together 15 years
Married 12 years
7 kids total, His: SD20, SS18, Twin SS's 16.
Mine: DD22, DD15
Ours: DD12
Affair began Fall 04, Separated Fall 04,2 Failed Plan B attempts, False recovery of sorts Spring 05.......Still pluggin' away.
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Just checking in, guess your busy Plan Aing <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Well I'm around if you need me.
Good Luck and God Bless,
-Caren
Always Look For Grace Given, Even in the midst of Grace Denied.
BS-Me 39
WH-37
Together 15 years
Married 12 years
7 kids total, His: SD20, SS18, Twin SS's 16.
Mine: DD22, DD15
Ours: DD12
Affair began Fall 04, Separated Fall 04,2 Failed Plan B attempts, False recovery of sorts Spring 05.......Still pluggin' away.
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We had a talk a little earlier. She is saying she needs her space and still wants seperation. I almost confronted about the A. our MC whom I spoke to one on one over the phone yesterday says I should ask aboout the pictures, that I shouldn't suppress my feelings on this.
W says that if I met all her needs she would still feel like she hasn't experienced independence. I am lost and don't know what to do.
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ok... I have access to the phone bill. I have numerous calls up until the 22nd of December after that they have stopped.
Here is the info that I have:
-name
-number
-dirty picture sent to her from him
-He works with her (her manager)
-I am almost positive he is married
-a substantial # of phone calls.
-I believe he has children as well Sounds more like she got another phone.
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well calls stopping the 22nd fits with her story of not talking to this person for awhile. I don't think she has another phone as I have searched EVERYWHERE in our house for evidence, including cars.
Last night I asked her Why she doesn't let me touch her. She said it was because she didn't want me to think our marriage was getting better because I was able to touch her.
On top of all this stuff we are supposed to go on vacation in 2 weeks. SHe still wants to go and is looking forward to it. I'm hoping the time alone wil improve her outlook.
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Plan A is going to be really difficult as this guy is her boss and hes always gonna have contact with her. How have others handled a situation like this?
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Okay first I want to address this:
"Last night I asked her Why she doesn't let me touch her. She said it was because she didn't want me to think our marriage was getting better because I was able to touch her."
CLASSIC WS babble.....ugh, I've heard this one before myself, I think I probably had it a little easier being that my WS is a man, and I could talk him into SF pretty easy...well...I didn't *talk* exactly...LOL
Now the only way to *handle* her boss being her OP is for her to quit the job or be transferred. That's really what she's going to have to do (Wait until someone else comes along to tell you when to bring this up with her, don't do it yet).
Good luck and God Bless,
-Caren
Always Look For Grace Given, Even in the midst of Grace Denied.
BS-Me 39
WH-37
Together 15 years
Married 12 years
7 kids total, His: SD20, SS18, Twin SS's 16.
Mine: DD22, DD15
Ours: DD12
Affair began Fall 04, Separated Fall 04,2 Failed Plan B attempts, False recovery of sorts Spring 05.......Still pluggin' away.
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I think I've narrowed down to 2 possible addresses as well.
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W says that if I met all her needs she would still feel like she hasn't experienced independence. 'Fog-Speak' - your wife will say things that make little sense. Like her head is in a fog and she cannot see reality. I am lost and don't know what to do. Explain your reasons for not getting expert advice & coaching from the Harleys. There are innumerable ways to screw this up and one way to get it right. Call them.
Disclaimer: This is free advice - at least you are assured of getting your money's worth!
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