I was a regular reader of the forums a few years back - I don't remember my login name or anything and have since moved and changed email addresses.

Short Version:
H (then boyfriend) cheated on me with 2 different women - one has decided to become our personal stalker and the other has had a baby since since - her baby was born May of 2003 - me and H got married September of 2003. There was a chance the baby wasn't his and we moved on.

Fast Forward: Present - we hadn't heard from OW until a few months ago when she asked for child support. They have their court hearing today @ 3. For some reason, I can't get over it. It's like all those feelings came rushing back. Anger, disappointment, feeling like I was the one made a fool of. Yes, I married him. Yes, I said I forgive him but now I worry that maybe I really haven't.

He wants absolutely NOTHING to do with this child. When she got pregnent he told her he didn't want to be a father to her child (she has 2 other children by 2 other men) - she asked him about marriage...he said no. They talked about an abortion, she agreed and then a few months later, called him back and said she changed her mind and it was too late now anyways.

She (according to mutual friends) wants him to be a part of her and her childs life. She wants her babys name to legally be changed to ours. She wants him to have visitation with my H. She wants the child to develop a father/son relationship with H. I understand all this. I'd want the same things. But I feel so torn.

I'm hurt....I am so angry at him and I catch myself saying rude things to him. Sometimes I look at him and can hardly stand him. I'm really worried about this whole issue with this other child. It's going to have an impact on us no matter what...

I'm rambling....I'm sorry. Not sure what else to say.

DNA. DNA. DNA. DNA.

Nothing should change until DNA is done.

Please read the MB suggestions for a strong marriage.

No time for long reply right now. Best wishes,
J

This is very normal, not that that makes you feel any better. I'm dealing with this myself and can totally empathize with you. Things that were dealt with and long buried are being flung back at you. It's heart wrenching to say the least. My H keeps asking me to forgive him. I told him I forgave him long ago and don't need to forgive again but that doesn't stop the pain or memories. It will just take time for them to subside again. We'll all be here for you to vent or give comfort.


From what I've read here (and others will probably corroborate), if he doesn't want contact he doesn't have to have it. I know each state is different in their child support laws but I'm sure if he hasn't had a paternity test, that will be the first step. You didn't mention anything regarding that. Give her a NC letter. If she still bothers you, file restraining orders. She can't force your H to have a relationship if he doesn't want one. There is nothing wrong with you feeling torn but you have to think about what is best for you and H and not worry about the OC.

Paternity test was done - attorney generals office set it up. Came back 99.99% it was his.

So now the child support hearing is this afternoon. We live in a different state so it'll be a conference call between my H, the OW, and the "negotiator".

I have talked to my H about C with OC but he said no way. He wants nothing to do with the entire situation and feels that she tried to "trick" him into marrying her and taking care of her and her children.

He said after they talk about the child support payments and what is reasonable - he will tell them that under no circumstances will he allow the child to have his last name and that he wants no parental rights. He says he doesn't feel bad about it because he told her from the get go that it wasn't going to happen - that he wasn't going to be the kind of father she was wanting. She never responded.

I'm scared and most of it is unreasonable. Worried he'll want to have contact with her - jealous that this woman has a child and more than likely I will never have a child with him. Especially now, no way we'll be able to afford one. We currently have 5 children. 3 boys which are mine that live with their father and I pay child support for them, and 2 step children that live with us.

I'm worried about the kids finding out about this OC. What sort of impact will it have on them? I'm worried about OW trying to contact H and him not telling me. I'm just worried about it all.

I guess I'm just venting. Sometimes I feel like I have no one to really talk to about this because it's just embarassing -

Just makes you wonder why she waited 2 years to ask for CS. How old are your kids? It's ok to have some worries, just don't let it consume you.

Yes, it does make us wonder. I personally think she was using it as a backup plan. She directly asked my H for his SS#, birthdate, etc. and said she needed that information to get his parental rights terminated but then never did. Apparently, acccording to the clerk at the attorney generals office, she is in the middle of losing her middle child to his father which essentially means, she won't be getting that child support here in a month or two. AND she also has a few bad check charges against her that just popped up this month. I think she needed money, and thinks that this is a way for her to get it since apparently she can't get a better job than what she is currently doing.

My boys are 13, 11, and 10. My step children are S14 and D11. They are all the love of my life. My stepchildren are very devoted to their father and I know that this will devestate them.

SLOOOOOW DOWN.

1. Your husband will have to pay child support. That is a given. It is to bad you didn't separate legally to protect your family finances. But you can still look into protective measures for future increases, etc.

2. Update your will, leave the other child one dollar and explain that you did not forget about him/her, but that you choose to not leave anything to her child. If you don't, these types come and can take from your children.

3. If your husband doesn't want contact, go with it. Get the child support set up. NEVER SEND A PERSONAL CHECK. EVER. Especially since she has his SSN. She would then have access to your financial accounts. SEND A MONEY ORDER or have it done automatically. We had an account set up in a random bank that we did not use. Each month the CS was put into her account. She never had a check from us.

4. Send her a letter stating that she is not to call you for any reason at anytime. If she starts calling, emailing, etc. Keep all proof of the harrassment and then bring her up on charges. Stay firm and strong on this, she will figure it out eventually.

5. Take care of you and your family. Those children of his come first before this other child. Yes the will be devastated, so protect them and love them. Fight for their right to a peacefull upbringing. Do not let this ow wreck havoc on your home, stand tall and fight back. She may get child support, but she isn't going to ruin thier lives. This is not the time to be weak and frail. You can have your breakdown later. Right now, be firm, be united and be tough as ******. If you dont' want contact, fight for it to be the way you want it.

Actually, the only thing she will get is child support. From then on, everything is up to you and your husband. Don't want contact? You don't have to. She can wish all she wants, but she doesn't matter now does she? If you want contact you could and she couldn't say no. You could get contact and never have to see her. A third party could be brought in to take care of the hand-off. See? She has no control at all over what is decided upon.

You might want to take a peek into the future here. If/when your step children reach age, they may no longer be tax deductable. Make DAMM SURE you speak to a laywer about this to protect assets. Start looking into the future to protect you and yours. What is done is done.

Don't let this tail wag the dog, ok? Deal with the legalities of the oc, get things set up the way that works best for YOU and YOUR family, then move on with your life. Go and live, laugh and love. Enjoy your beloved children and family. Don't let this ruin one day of your life ok?

BE STRONG.

Well - I guess it didn't turn out as bad as we we thinking. She's getting alittle over 500 a month from us for her child. including back child support from when he was born but they cut it in half. They asked him if he wanted to have the baby's last name changed, he laughed and the negotiator said, "I'm guessing that's a No." - We have to carry him on our Medical Insurance. And when the visitation part came out - the negotiator asked him if he'd like visitation, H said no, he wasn't interested so she said she wouldn't put it in the contract and that when that happens, it's just assumed that the standard visitation rules apply.

That was that - we're past the hard part - but why do I feel the way I do? I am still so angry at him! He told me last nite that he figured I'd feel better about things but I don't. I tried to explain to him my fears of losing him to her and her baby. I tried to explain my fears that they talk (and I sometimes think they have even though he says no) - that she's emailing him baby pictures, calling him to "chat" - he told me I'm being irrational and that since we've been married, he's tried to prove to me that he can be faithful and trustworthy but it's not fair for me to bring up the past constantly.

Did any of you ever wonder what things were said between OW and H when they were together? I DWELL on it. I worry that he said all the things he's said to me to her. lol. I feel like I'm going totally insane - I have absolutely no one to talk to about this - makes me feel lonely and alone. This just isn't the type of thing I can bring up with anyone. The few friends I do have that know about this - are close to my H also and I just don't trust trust them. *sigh*

How long will this take? How long will it be before I feel "normal"?

You have to let it go and not obsess over it. Why kill yourself wondering what was said? Is it going to help with your healing if you know he said this or that? My H just recently told me something that I could have gone the rest of my life without knowing. He told me that he knew the minute he laid eyes on OW he wanted her. Did I need to know that 20 years later? NO! I was so shocked when he said it that I didn't reply. I do need to tell him sometime how much that bothered me, I just haven't yet. I started thinking about things like, did he feel that way about me? Now, on top of reliving the hurt and betrayal I have this additional item to process. I think you are better off not knowing any specifics. Assume nothing was said ~ that they were only concerned with each other and what they were doing.
I don't have an answer about how long it will take other than TIME. Take it one day at a time.

I don't believe I know how to let it go. I know that may sound stupid but seriously - I feel at times that I'm making a big deal out of nothing .... he cheated on me while I was away before we got married - okay..understandable. Found out about both women and one of them being pregnant .. okay..forgave him. Got married September of 2003 - things seemed like a dream. I love him....desperately so sometimes, he's always been my rock, the one that was there for me through out all the crap I was going through. We were best friends through out our prior divorces....we, together, have been through alot.

He knows about my past and maybe that's the problem. I had him up on his freaking pedestle and he sort of shattered my image of him being this all perfect man. lol.

In the back of my mind, there's this voice telling me he'll hurt me again, he's lying....don't trust him. :-( Meh....psychotic episode?

I've went to see a doctor - didn't help. I've tried to talk to H about it - I feel guilty and he doesn't understand fully. *sigh*

He's been perfect though, I'll admit. Never ever goes out alone with the guys, calls me all the time, at work, on the way home, anytime he's out of town, emails back and forth. He says he does these things to help me in my healing process and so I can learn to trust him. He said he realizes it's a long road but he said he can tell I'm not happy and it bothers him because he know's its his fault and he's not sure what to do. H told me last nite that he's doing the best he can but feels fustrated.

(sorry - venting - I just have a TON of stuff to get off my chest)

Do something else that will help take your mind off of the situation. I know it feels all consuming but you have to try. Do you have any crafts or hobbies? Do you like to read or work out, play games with the kids?
Have you gone to see a counselor or a pastor?
It takes time to rebuild shattered trust. It sounds like he's doing what he can to help.

MC,

Hi and welcome to Marriage builders. Sorry you had to find us but i am glad you are here.

personally, i think what you are feeling is pretty normal. It is gunna take some time before you are able to lay these feelings aside and it probably wont be easy. sorry.

it sounds to me like you never really did get over the affair in the first place. You just stuffed it all down and avoided dealing with your emotions. Now that the OW is back in the picture all those old feelings have come flooding back out and this time they wont be so easy to aviod dealing with. dont feel bad. lots of people do this, myself included.

one thing i have learnt in all of this is that rebuilding from this type of devestation is really a ground up exercise. you cant patch and run.

Your h is right that you are being irrational and paranoid but that is hardly suprising given the situation. infact i think it would abnormal if you werent felling that way.

It is not usual to want to know the nitty gritty of what went on between them. and to constantly quiz and compare answers too, looking for inconsistancies. dwelling on those events is not exactly healthy but i also think it is fairly normal. i think that eventually, when you have started dealing with your insecurity issues arising from this situation, the images and thoughts will lose their power over you and while thinking about it will never be pleasent, it wont be the gut wrenching misery it is now.


I think you really do need to spell out for him how this has affected you in such a way that he can understand it is not an attack on him, just what you are going through and it is his job to help you through this. I know that is hard to do.

For me i found that i could communicate much better through writing than in words. When i tried to talk to my h about these issues i would find i would get divirted and sidetracked as the conversation evolved and would end up only saying about a third of what i needed to. I am also a gold star conflict avoider so any resistance from him and i would crumple like a slack sail.

So i would write it all out. Just the act of writing it out can take the sting out of it for you. it can also help to clarify your thoughts.

Aside from all the really good resources available on this site to help you build a strong happy marriage I would also really recommend a book that helped me loads called "how can i forgive you" by Janis Spring Abrams. It really helped me navigate through this nightmare and understand my reactions and what i could do to work toward happiness again.

again, welcome to Marriage builders.

Carolyn

MC, i just saw you last post.

You say you found his cheating before you were married as understandable and you forgave him. I dont think you did. I think you thought you should and you might have even told him that you did, but deep down, you are holding on to it.

I say that without wanting to make it sound like an accusation, cause it is not.

My situation mirrors your own a lot. in my situation the affair occured before we were married. i also had a ****** of a time "letting go" of everything and moving on. It haunted me day and night. H didnt understand but was doing his best to do what needed to be done to rebuild my trust, like being accountable for time etc but it all meant nothing to me. i couldnt explain it to him. i needed something from him but i had no idea what it was and he had no idea how to give it to me. I kept telling him that i forgave him but i hadnt really. i was just trying to convince myself that i had.

Here is what i learned. Many people forgive becuase they think they have to. We are taught that to forgive is divine. That forgiveness is the gift you give yourself. Forgiveness is a selfless act. To a certain extent that is all true. What no one tells you is how you actually go about forgiving someone.

A lot of people when confronted with this sort of situation offer a kind of cheap forgivness to their transgressor. It is offered almost automatically and is pretty meaningless really. The WS has done nothing to earn the forgivess so does not value it and the BS quite often feels resentment at being expected to offer it.

That resentment plus all the other emotions that come with infidelity end up putting the BS into an emotional pressure cooker. you wind up letting off steam at your betrayer in little short bursts that make no sense to the WS becuase they seem to come out of nowhere. One day he wont put the cap back on the toothpaste and you will rip his head off out of all proportion to the "crime". you live in an extended state of misery feeling unjustifed in your emotions and reactions.

The key i think is to work towards real forgiveness. real forgivness is a process that involved both the BS and WS. It is a process of the WS really learning, understanding and accepting the consequences of their actions on the BS and making what restitution they can for them. it is not easy. it takes time, hard work and lots of patience. For the BS it invloves learning to accept what the WS did and that you cannot change it no matter how unjust and unfair it was and continues to be. Once you have achieved that, the WS apologys will start to have more meaning to you and wont sound like such hollow statements.

I am very sorry that you are having to go through all of this now, when you thought it was all over. i am very sorry that you found yourslef in this situation at all. it seriously sucks. Doxie is absolutely right in that you do need to look after yourself here and not let yourself withdraw from the world. Get out there and force yourself to see thing and do things. Fake it till you make it as they say.

Hugs to you. Feel free to vent here all you like. We all know and understand excatly what you are saying.

big hugs

Carolyn

Carolyn,

You hit the bullseye. Everything, absolutely everything in your post hit something within me. I believe I haven't forgiven him fully which is why I am having a hard time letting go. I keep thinking to myself that there's something wrong with me for him to have strayed. I guess there comes a time when you stop blaming yourself...

I actually emailed H this morning and explained it all to him. It was a LONG email. lol. Told him my fears, about my anger and so forth. Then I emailed him back this afternoon and told him about me coming to this site for support and help in my healing and wanted to get his input - thus far he has been opposed to counseling - I sent him a bit of what you posted and he responded back with:

I agree with most of what's in there.
I do try and do my part, but it's hard if you can't let go and move on.
Maybe hearing it from someone else will help. Let me know what else
I can do.. I will.

I love you


It's funny today is the first day that I feel alittle lighter. Alittle less stressed...
Good sign, eh?

Thanks all.....really.

Hang in there Morning Clouds - everything you have described is normal in a sitch like this. It takes time to work through all of these emotions. Even when you are at a point where you've come to your own terms with it and it is no longer hindering you living and enjoying your life, something can happen (maybe just a song in the radio)that will trigger you and those initial emotions come flooding back.

I know alot of people have said it before on these boards and if you go to counseling they will say it too - This type of situation requires working through stages of grief, just the same as when someone dies. In a sense, something has died - the picture of your marriage and family has been altered forever. It takes time - but as my favorite Dr.Phil quote goes "It's not just time. It's what you do with that time that counts."

You have come to a good place. Our stories are all a little different (some H/W had A during M that produced OC, some had A before M or during separations, some H/W are now finding out an OC exsists, etc.)but we are all dealing with a similar sitch and can learn from each other and encourage each other.

I know when my nightmare began I felt like the only person in the world that had this problem to deal with - but then I found this board. I posted some but read alot. It has really been a good tool for me in working through all this garbage.

Hang in there - keep posting.

It is hard. Like yesterday, I had a good day....was fine with everything. Got home - husband was and is always very attentive to me - hugs and kisses - talk about the day - we talked a bit about this board and how I felt that just reading your stories and advice really really helps me out. More so than a psychiatrist - I just have a hard time talking to a stranger who can't relate to me - he said that was good I found this place and he called you all my help buddies. lol.

But then, I'm sitting on the couch later and it's like I had a mood change. He looked over at me and said, "oh no, did I sense something change?" I just smiled and said, "I'm fine." - he said, "No, you aren't. Did you need to talk some more?" - I hate that - the feelings that just pop into my head at times. I hate that I feel the need to "talk" about it some more. I've gotten to the point where I'm sick of talking about it or thinking about it but it's like I can't control what I think about anymore.

I remember a time when I was carefree, happy go lucky, patient, nothing ever bothered me. This woman I am now, it's like I don't know her. This isn't me. I want to find the woman I once was but I'm afraid that she's gone forever. Does that make sense?

Running through these forums and reading your stories makes me realize that I am not the only one going through this. At one time, I felt like I was the ONLY person dealing with this and that NO ONE understood me. I have no one to talk to about this because well, frankly, it's an embarassing topic to bring up. I have friends, even best friends, but even with them, I have a hard time opening up with this. So I keep it in - and it just sits there and festers until it opens up and I just let loose.

I don't want to live my life like this because I can see he does love me - I don't want to be the cause of our marriage collapsing because I have the inablility to let go.

I worry - I have this FEAR (and it's huge) of him not being in my life. It's not that I can't find anyone else, or that I'll live the rest of my life lonely. It's not having HIM in my life that scares the bejezus out of me. He said it's irrational of me to have this fear and that HE worries about me leaving him. He always says I can do better and he realizes that and he's trying to prove to me and make up to me the hurt/harm he's caused.

There's this part of me that keeps thinking he'll hurt me again and I need to protect myself and get the heck out of here. Did any of you feel that way? It's almost like I better leave before he hurts me - even though the chances of it happening are slim..the thought is there. *sigh*

Who would have thought that being a woman and having all these emotions would have been a pain in the butt?! lol

MC, this situation is like when you have a sore tooth. No matter how much you tell yourself to leave it alone, your tounge keeps going back to it almost of its own accord.

It is amazing the leaps your mind can make. somehow you can be concentrating on writing out a shopping list and suddently find yourself contemplating (or worse yet, visualising) them having sex or mentally scoring the calender for when they first met, when they had sex, etc etc. Dont beat yourself up about it. it is normal. but dont let such thoughts rule your life. There is a technique called Congnitive Bahvioral Therepy that can work wonders. it is a fancy name for something really very simple. Next time you catch yourself wandering off mentally for some self torture, visualise a stop sign, hold the imagine in your mind and concentrate on it until it pushes the other thoughts out. Tell yourself that you are not going to be upset today and mean it. it is hard at first but once you get the hang of it, it can really help to stop those intrusive thought patterns.

I am afraid though that the woman you were pre affair is gone. At the moment you are in transition. By the end you will be a much stronger, wiser woman. The pre affair person might have been carefree but that was only because she didnt know the dangers, not becuase they didnt exist. Life changes us. It moulds us to its purpose. fighting it is like fighting the tide. Know though that when you come out of this process you will be twice the woman you were back then (that which does not kill us...).


Think about it this way. if you were in a boat and you encountered very heavy seas suddenly. it just blew up from nowhere. you were tossed about, battered and bruised and nearly thrown overboard. you hung on to the side for dear life. Then the seas calmed. blue skys again. wouldnt you still keep a firm hold on the side. just in case? and would you also maybe keep an eye out for a bigger boat or for land?

i think we have all at one point or another contemplated whether it was worth hanging around. whether we would be better off just cutting and running but the fact is we dont leave our baggage behind. Even if you were to up and leave, you would face all the same issues in the next relationship you had, expect then your new partner would have no idea where any of it came from.

Better go. I am at work at the moment and they do like me to actually do some now and again (how unreasonable!).

hugs

Carolyn

I have definetly felt this way, the worst time is when we are having our intimate moments. I often find myself in tears at the end. I hide it from him, but I can't help imagining him and her doing the same. It is beyond hard.

crazy - 1 1/2 years after DDay, I still go there during intimates moments now and then. I try to push them away, but he usually knows when they creep in. He usually behaves MORE lovingly and comforting and talks about it if I ask. I don't feel the angry passion or emotion anymore, I see it for what it was, but that doesn't make it sting any less. I think because we have C it's more at the forefront, I can't just pretend it never happened, but I don't know because we haven't been NC since birth of OC. Take care all! We will survive, hopefully thrive through all of this.