[First post] I am a BS (found out ~2 mos ago) and am trying my best to do a Plan A with my WW (for about 1 month now). I wanted to ask if anyone had advice when there is a OM2 and OM3 in addition to OM1? In other words, does Plan A need to be customized? Should I expose affairs with OM2 and OM3 to OM1? Is the situation hopeless or is WW a sex addict? General advice is welcome, but here are some specific details.

Married 3 years. One 13 year-old daughter - WW's biological child from a long-time out-of-wedlock affair (10 years; he was married the whole time, she didn't know that initially). D is also mine via step-parent adoption finalized two years ago.

Major issues: I admit to being critical in nature and not cherishing her as I should. She believes I am controlling and prevent her from 'having a life' or any individuality or freedom. I am not yet convinced I am like this. WW has major health issues and extreme problems with self-image and co-dependency (living vicariously through 13yo daughter). WW admits to being 'sorry' but essentially blames me for the entire situation (accepts no responsibility).

OM1: WW has known OM1 for 4 months. She has affection for him and has admitted PI (twice). Only about 40% of what she has told me is true. AFAIK, WW contacts him several times a week but may not have seen OM1 for past two weeks (probably because of my snooping and confrontation, circumstances (e.g., he lives 40 miles away) and maybe guilt). I originally found WW with OM1 in a parked car at a interstate rest area at 6:30am after she was out all night.

OM2: A co-worker. I am convinced that this was a physical affair and I suspect little emotional involvement. WW contacts him sporadically, but 2 weeks ago mentioned an interest in a meeting (for physical infidelity). WW denies this relationship and affair.

OM3: Met 4 months ago in same context with OM1 (two week out of town trip). Relationship involves communication about 'neutral' matters, flirting, and suggestive conversation. I can't tell if they have been physically intimate or not. If not, I'm sure its only a matter of time.

I have a hard time understanding the need for multiple, simultaneous affairs. The best theory I can come up with is that WW has an overriding need to feel physically/sexually desirable by men (part of a need for Admiration a la Harley's HN/HNs) and wasn't getting this need met through me. Self-esteem and body image are chronic issues with her (resolved a weight problem through surgery; consumed with interest in cosmetics, perfume, clothes; thinks about additional cosmetic surgery; feels she is unattractive). I also probably failed her in terms of her need for Affection (and related issues like respect).

WW admits to EI/PI with OM1, but denied any other inappropriate entanglement. I know this to be false, but I confront her by letting her know that I know there are others but without informing about the source of my evidence. Naturally she wants to know what I know so she can put the best face on everything (as she has done repeatedly so far). I want her to be completely honest and forthcoming. If I reveal my sources, I will lose unique and informative views of her activities. I don't want to make WW a 'smarter betrayer'. If she can't eventually be honest about things, how will trust ever be restored?

Any thoughts?

Thanks!

She seems to have a lifestyle of infidelity.

What do you think about that? Might that be accurate?

YOU cannot fix WW .... her history of a long-term affair with a married man says (to me) she does not respect the boundaries of marriage ... not in other people's marriage, and not in her own.

again ... might very well be a lifestyle choice

what do you want to do?

I don't think a 'lifestyle of infidelity' is quite right. Of course, how can I really know. My estimation is that she will indulge in immoral behavior (or make really, foolish decisions that lead to the same) to try and make herself feel good. I don't think there was any infidelity in the first 2 (of 3) years in our marriage. She claims she didn't intend the affair with OM1 to happen, but it did. She was unhappy and depressed and so I do believe this.

I don't really think she is a sex addict, but having read the book (Out of the Shadows) by Patrick Carnes, I fear she is vulnerable (or possibly predisposed) to that addiction.

what do you want to do?

First, I don't think you will need to do anything different than a real Plan A. Recovery from an A (or multiple A's) is not about the OP, it's about the M, so telling everybody SHE knows about the fact that she's had multiple A's instead of just one might be more damaging than it's worth, especially if she has serious self-esteem issues.

Otherwise, what your W is telling you is what EVERY WW says, so far as I can tell (though I can only speak from experience with ONE FWW.) Psychologically a WS, while still in the A is not capable of seeing beyond themself. They will do anything to continue to satisfy their selfish desires. Even if she SEES that she's hurting you, she won't care, and the best way to accomplish that feat is to convince herself that you DESERVED to be hurt for what you did. Hence, she will also re-write an awful lot of your history.

It's good that you're willing to see that you have not been everything you coulda-been/shoulda-been all along. Unfortunately, you (and I hate to admit it, but this applies to me, too) are unable to go back in time and change history. So, the best you can do is be the best person you can be. You've adopted her daughter, so do your best to take care of her. She shouldn't be or feel rejected by you because of what her flake-of-a-mother is doing.


Finally, if she's willing to do counseling with you, I would strongly suggest contacting MarriageBuilders.

We do understand your pain.

God bless.

I am dealing with the same thing. My WH had 2 long-term concurrent affairs, one of which had ended (by the OW) 3-4 months before I found out, one which continued even after DDay. When DDay #2 came around (I found out that he was still seeing OW#2 and had started talking to OW#1 again) I exposed them both to each other. Neither one knew that about each other or even about me. By doing this my WH's world was completely disrupted. It was a wake-up call that couldn't have happened any other way. Now, we are no where near the road to recovery, but I do know that if I hadn't exposed everything that he would still be contacting or seeing both of these women and our chance for recovery would be nil.

I agree with Pepperband that this may be a lifestyle that your WW has accepted. She may not understand any other way of life and without serious effort on both of your parts that may not change. I think exposing the fact that your wife has been carrying on multiple relationships may be useful, but be careful about exposing the specifics (names, identities). Tell each one that you know about their relationship with your wife and that they are not the only one. That should be enough to get them to back off. It doesn't sound like any of her relationships are too serious, which is at least one saving grace.

Good luck.

Is there any history of abuse or molestation in your wifes past? The problems you describe are almost typical of someone who was abused or molested.

She could also have an obsessive compulsive type disorder, considering her focus is on self-esteem and body image. She may be seeking affirmation through the sexual affiars, which would be simular or like a sexual addiction.

If she struggles with an OCD type anxiety, then a psychiatrist treating her with the proper SSRI, along with proper therapy it's possible for her to recover from this problem. I have seen others with something similar.

The best thing to do is see if you can find a psychiatrist or counselor trained in sexual addiction and have your wife see them. Mention the same things you did above, the obsessions with cosmetic surgery, clothes, perfume, looks, the affairs, etc.

Pep wrote: “She seems to have a lifestyle of infidelity. What do you think about that? Might that be accurate?”

Oooh, oooh, waving arm widely, I know the answer to this one, Pep. Call on me! I know! I know!

Oh, sorry, I see the question is for WG. Sheepishly sitting back down…


WG, Pep has an unfortunate tendency to ask the important and the difficult questions. She doesn’t grade on the curve, either. I suggest you do your homework and come prepared.

For reference, my FWW sounds somewhat like yours, like in the more than one A and an LTA with a married OM parts. Sheesh.

The best thing you can do if you want to try to salvage your M is first realize there is not much there to salvage. You will have to start over completely with her. And that is best accomplished by ending all life as she knows it. Yes, she needs to become a different person entirely.

Only way for her to do that is with a lot of professional help.

But, nuclear exposure is a very good place in which to start this total makeover. Until she is standing amid the glowing ruins she will not take a step out in any direction.

There are risks. She might not be able to change. You will in fact make things worse in the near term. But you will have to leave this M if she doesn’t become a new person.


“again ... might very well be a lifestyle choice. What do you want to do?”

Dang, Pep. I’ve only been here two years so far. This is a graduate level question.


With prayers,

PepperBand asks what I want to do.

My heart, which can't be trusted, wants out. Yes, its a roller-coaster ride, but I believe that ultimately I'd be happier (even dealing with the pain of divorce) than in the marriage. There are other complicating factors that my previous post didn't get into. My WW cannot bear additional children and we were in the middle of an international adoption [now cancelled]. It seems to me that the prospects for raising additional children are slim to nonexistant. And this is a grevious personal blow for me. BTW WW is 36, I'm 38. I'd have to believe my M was exteremly stable before choosing to bring a child into our family.

Still, seeking happiness shouldn't be my life's goal. (Potential) loss of additional children is in some sense, just *more* pain. If I feel called by God to turn the other cheek and show my WW love, then that's what I should try and do. It does make it hard to do a great Plan A, when I am hurt as I am and when I am partially motivated to salvage the M based on 'duty' or 'acting rightly' rather than personal fulfillment.

I appreciate the helpful responses here!

wounded - how old are you? And, I have a followup question.

edit: sorry, missed that fact in your last post.

Here's my "new" followup question:


Why not?

nevermind... I re-read and it was so clear .... sorry <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

AskMe asks ;-) about any history of sexual abuse. WW has
denied this (though I have had friends who have also asked
about this issue). I suspect some 'emotional abuse' when she
was growing up that I'd describe as neglect or feeling
unappreciated and unloved by her parents. I'm estranged at
the moment from my in-laws and I'm basing this on previous
conversations. I suppose sexual abuse is possible, but I
don't think I'll find out about that anytime soon if ever it
did happen.

WW expressed suicidal thoughts about a week after the affair
was discovered; this happened right at a moment when I
confronted her and discussed the possibility of divorce. She
became seriously depressed and said that 'I and our daughter
deserved better', 'we'd be better off without her, and the
like.' The upshot was a 3-day stay in a psych ward with a
diagnosis of 'generalized anxiety disorder' and 'major
depressive disorder'. I'm not sure what I think about
that. Mental health disorders all blur together to
me. Bipolor disorder or OCD seem possible (boy do I think
she has a cleaning fetish). WW is on anti-depressant meds
now. Other than making her sleep even more, I've not seen a
big effect. Perhaps she has fewer angry outbursts.

(woundedgentleman)

And Worthatry asks a good question:


I should better have said "shouldn't be my primary goal or only goal". I'm not so stoic that I believe one shouldn't seek to be happy. But just seeking to be happy is a pretty self-oriented
goal.

Not that I come anywhere close to consistently acting this way in practice, but my personal beliefs are that honoring God and putting the well-being of others (especially family) first are more important.

If she has OCD anxiety, she doesn't have to have the type of OCD behavior you always see in the movies where a person is repeating the same thing over and over. If can be just an obsessive thought pattern or compulsions, like for instance the cleaning. OCD anxiety takes higher levels of SSRI medications than normal anxiety to conquer. For instance I take Cymbalta for my sexual addiction. It's normal dosage is 60mg, my psychiatrist prescribes 120mg in order for me to eliminate my OCD thoughts. I had the cleaning problem, when my anxiety was high, I cleaned the house like crazy, taking about the closets, the drawers, etc. My wife loved it, but it drove me crazy. But it's how I dealt with my anxiety, I had to have things in order.

It's just something to think about. Many doctors miss the OCD part of anxiety if it's not the extreme classic type. She would need to see a psychiatrist who understands OCD and addictive behavior.

Wounded,

Are the affairs still happening? Is contact still happening with OMs1,2, or 3?

I agree that there doesn't seem to be much to salvage. Did her physical transformation occur after you married?

Please be aware that you share NO BLAME for her affairs. You may share 50% responsibility for the unhappy marriage, but YOU DID NOT DRIVE HER TO BE UNFAITHFUL...three times (or more???)

My God man, you have only been married 3 years!! Sounds like a lifestyle to me.

That she thinks you are "controling" and will not let her have a "life" is a red flag.

Please explain PI and EI. Personal or physical intimacy?

There of course can be no trust to restore if there is still contact.

Good luck with this!

k

Just my practical side here ... get tested for STDs and don't engage in sex with your wife until she has been cleared as well.

I'll cut to the chase.

You're only 38 years old, you have no biological children with this miltiple affair woman-child, and you're been married only three years.

Save yourself.

Get out of it.

Cut your losses.

WAT

I'm with you WAT....UNLESS she is willing to go to IC for a really, really long time. If you really love her and want to be with her more than anything then you are going to have to draw up some boundaries with consequences.

And all of this coming from the BS of a serial cheater! My husband did get the help he needed. He has healed the wounds that allowed him to make such stupid choices and he is now a very safe and loving partner. I would never have stayed with him without the guarantee that he go to therapy for as long as I felt he needed it.

I'm so sorry that you are going through this. I'd suggest that you get yourself into counseling to get through all of this too.

Stillwed

Hi, woundedgentleman.

You can't fix your wife.

She is unlikely to change.

Repeat after me three times "I can not fix my wife", then click your heels together and hire the best lawyer you can afford.

Get out of the marriage and before you engage someone else, figure out why you had a need to play "Mr. Rescue" with this wife before you married her.

Then go find yourself a nice faithful younger woman and have a family.

All the best,
Gimble