Alison - Mrs. W posted to you and asked to pointed questions. I'm really interested in reading your responses. Can you post some answers on them please?

If Marriage Builders had a poster child, Faithinme would be it. She studied and learned the MB principles to a "T" and used them perfectly.

She can attest that MB principles aren't a guarantee that the WS will wake up in time, but she knows that she did all that she could. As long as you allow this A to continue by conspiring with them to keep the secret, it will florish and grow. You're assisting them in making their bond stronger day by day. Affairs thrive in secresy and die with exposure. I don't know how many more times this can be told to you before you get it.

He's jerking you around and you're allowing it. He's crazy. Good grief he's wanting the three of you to be friends. How much sicker can he get? How would that be explained to your daughter? How would that be explained to "their" children? Many a ow traps the MM with pregnancy. Check out JustPeachy's history. Go to the Pregnancy board and see what heartache resides there.

Are you beginning to see some hostility in responses to your posts here? After awhile, people will grow weary of your repeating the same posts time after time..."he comes over to see DD and we fight...what do I do now?" "I'm mad..I love him." "I can handle it...I can't handle it."

Your time is running out and you know it. They're having an affair and you know it. He's jerking you around and you know it. They're discussing your sex life and comparing it with theirs and you know it. Their sick and they've trapped you into their sickness as well and you know it.

Your choice...continue to participate or do something about it. Expose.

Mrs. -- 1.) I have no idea. But I know I am scared. But I also think at times, "wat do I ave to lose - he as already left."

2.) I have no idea. But I know I am scared. But I know I cannot live this way. It hurts too much.

I know I am enabling, I know I am... I know he is justifying, I know he is ashamed. I want someone to shake the SH*T out of him to make him realize what an [censored] he is being...

My H truly is justifying this by blaming our marriage and me and him (his passivity in not wanting to fight about him being able to be imself in the marriage) -- Yes I know the truth in my gut. I do... And I also feel that he would not treat me the way that he does if he truly loved me...

I can't help but feel that I deserve better than this... I feel this man is not the man for me and that scares me. If his morals allow him to even think of another woman, then why do I want to be with him???

He has been asked numerous times by me, "will you give up this "friendship" for the sake of our marriage?" and he always says NO... He even said to me last night, "if I want to go out with a friend that fills a need that you can't give me, why shouldn't I be allowed to do that?" I said, "because it simply hurts me. Do you want to hurt me?"
He then said, "If I don't go out because it hurts you, then you are satisfied for 1 night and I am unhappy because I didn't get to go out with my friend."

Any takers on that one??? Who am I dealing with here??

I'll take a shot.

A 12-year-old.

Okay - so - do I enable him and go with him to see his brother or do I stand my ground and just say I can't put up this front for you...

Alison, do yourself and your marriage a favor. Pick up the phone and call the BIL and tell him the situation.

Then first thing Monday morning pick up the phone and call the HR person or the president of WS' company.

It's not fair to you to have to pretend that all is well when it is NOT. I still think you should spend time with BIL and give him a big welcome back from Iraq. Tell him we appreciate his sacrifice and service.

After you hear all about Iraq and his tour, you might mention quietly that things are not going well in your family - that his brother has a woman friend who he values more than he does his marriage.

Alison, I really have no business writing to you, because I've only read a little bit of your story -- the beginning, because something about it caught my attention, and the last few posts just now. (I try not to spend as much time here anymore)
Having said that, I'm in a go-out-on-a-limb mood, and want to say a few things anyway.

My untrained mind thinks...

1) you'd better move fast (EXPOSE the disgusting thing), because time IS of the essence
2) every day that goes by: your H is losing more and more respect for you, you're losing more respect for your H, and most importantly... you're losing more respect for yourself

At what point in your life/marriage did you decide that you didn't have a right to, or weren't worthy of, sticking up for yourself and your marriage?

3) your H is acting not only like a store-variety WS, but (I'm surmising that) he's also carting around an Extra-Heavy dose of Entitlement and Selfishness and... all the fun stuff that goes with it.

IF you think you can have a happy/loving/fulfilling/trusting/et al future with the guy -- do something now, before it's too late.

You sound like a great person, and I'm really sorry you're going through this.
There's NO easy (ie. less-than-really-painful) way out...
the best way, and LEAST painful way, is to...

follow the advice of all the experts who have been trying to help you.
Not only do they know what they're doing, they also care a lot about you. Can't beat that.

Alison...

That someone is you...you do it by exposing this A...he will never wake up while in the throes of an A...exposure will "shake the SH*T" out of the fantasy that he has created for himself and the OW...you have to puncture that "fantasy bubble" with the "reality stick" of exposure...sorry to be blunt here Alison, but "put your big girl panties on" and "get in the game"...

Sorry if the tone of this offends you, but I want you to succeed...right now I'm trying to "shake the SH*T" out of you and make you not only realize, but get you to actually wield the power that you do hold here...PLEASE USE IT...


Mrs. Wondering


P.S. Alison, if the situation were reversed, do you think that your H would accept your treating him like this? What would he do if it was you that was having the affair?

So what's the latest update, Alison?

Hi Jennifer, Just continuing Plan A... Had a fun great weekend with H and BIL last weekend. Brought up the fact that H doesn't live with me and DD but BIL never said anything... They will be spending some alone time this weekend so maybe my H will tell BIL...
Spoke to my IC this week about who I married and the man he is now and that H seems to be making me suffer consequences for my actions, but he is not feeling any consequences for his actions...
I am feeling that once BIL leaves that I am going to take a break from H. B/C honestly it is as if we are not separated at all. He comes here every night, then sleeps at is own place...
I don't feel like I am andling the sitch with dignity and integrity. I feel needy and dumb and lonely. I want to be able to just be without for a little bit so I can focus on me and DD and just being with myself. I have been feeling like I might be one of those people who think they always need someone in their lives in order to be happy - and I don't want to be that person.
Don't get me wrong - I want my H, but I also have to prepare myself for life without him - ya know...

Anyway - thst is about it. I have been reading here daily, but really have not had much to say - Thanks for thinking of me. Hope everyone is doing well!!!

Hi, Allison. Sorry to sound like a broken record here, but it's not a real plan A without exposure. A plan A without exposure is really plan doormat, letting the WS walk over you, having his/her cake and eating it too.

If you scroll back through my old thread, you'll see some 2x4's from experts... I didn't want to expose at the office, either. I exposed to everyone I could think of... our friends, his parents, his sister, some of his other relatives. OW is unmarried and doesn't have a lot of family, so there wasn't much I could do there.

The one exposure I should have done better was the office. WH had gotten her a temporary job there a couple months before he left me, even asked her to live IN OUR HOME while she looked for a place, which went from just a few days, to a week, to THREE WEEKS! Ugh. The experts here pressured me for DAYS, urging me to call the powers that be at the office. In the end, I did the only exposure I could get the nerve to do... I called one day to leave him a message, and when the secretary (someone who we had hung out with as friends before this) asked how DD and I were, I told her what he had admitted to and that he was living with her. That night, he blew up at me, saying I was taking pot shots at his coworkers, that if he lost his job "my entire existance would be threatened."

Unfortunately, he's so far gone that it didn't help. I've heard that OW was eventually demoted and let go b/c she wasn't catching on to what they'd hired her to do, but I have no idea if that's true or not.

I'm sorry this is so long. Please take the advice of the experts here. They really do know what they're talking about. I know it's hard, but think about your DD. (((Allison)))

I saw a reference to this post on another thread. This is an post from FWS who used to hang out here at MB. He was a great poster and he is missed. I re-read it and I thought of your WH.

2Oak's post:

Well this sucks but is part of my own debt repayment so I'll be real honest...

He can keep the friendships with other women, call them, text them and email them and spend time alone with them.

OR he can be married to you.

There is a lot of talk about what recovery looks like and lots of it misses the point. A FORMER wandering spouse is not one who no longer screws the OP, the recovered WS is one who...
1. No longer forms inappropriate relationships with opposite sex 'friends'. Anything involving intimacy of feelings, discussion of marital problems etcetera is inappropriate for a FWS. Recreation time spent together is inappropriate. Alone time is innapropriate.

2. Is verifiable. Cell records online, pager records online (or handed over), Money accounted for to the penny (don't ***** about the new perm/bowling ball on this - if it ain't something that is linked to affairs save that discussion) and who is always reachable and accountable for their time.

If you have a WS who insists on the need to keep close friendships (attention) with opposite sex friends then they haven't learned anything. Affairs don't start in bed, they start when someone is allowed close. Unless you are dealing with two total sociopaths who shake hands and go screw the affair starts as a friendship.

When you are single, have lots of opposite sex friends. Once you are not single those relationships need some boundaries.

A cheater who needs opposite sex attention and affirmation primarily is a serial cheater.

Long answer to a short question, the short answer is that if he won't honor simple, reasonable boundaries then you have to enforce those boundaries. See Plan A and Plan B.
.............................

Alison, I hope this helps clarify the boundaries your WH will have to get to if you can recover your marriage.

This is what I have been struggling with for a while. I do not mind if he has Different gender friendships, but the one he has with this particular woman - I cannot accept. I have not told him this yet. I am waiting until his brother leaves town. I don't want to rock the boat right now - that is my choice.

I believe that I am just going to have to tell my H that he can either have his friendship with Traci or he can be married to me...

Not really sure what his answer will be at that point, but he basically has already answered it once before. He said he would not give up the friendship for the sake of our marriage. I guess I should have known then, but I wanted to believe that he would want me...

He will have to live with the consequences of his decision -and it is not one which I can make for him... But you are right - I do need to set limits and boundaries - I have yet to do it, and I think it is because I am scared of what he will choose...

I suppose that if he does choose her, there is not muchh I can do about it. I will continue to be a great mom and a wonderful person, but I can no longer be a good wife to a man who does not want one...

Saddens me to death, but I have to do it for me and for DD..

Read up on Plan B and write the Plan B letter. Stick to it.

You would also be wise to change your idea that it is ok for him to have 'friendships' You have already seen how that goes.

Learn from that.

Has anyone ever felt like they were not strong enough yet to do a good plan B?? I just feel like I am not comfortable enough in myself to do it.

I am very lonely - I have contact with a 10 month old 24 hours a day. I am going to start to go back to the gym, but that is only an our a day and a baby sitter I cannot afford very often...

I want my H to pay the consequences for his actions, but I don;t want to lose him and I sort of feel like Plan B will really take it to the next level...

I am scared to death of it all... I want very badly to go away for a few days witout DD and so I don't have to think of anyone but myself... But like an idiot, I feel if I go away that would give my H all the room in the world to be with the WHO*E...

Why do I care so much about a man who treats my like poop??? I feel I am losing myself every day in this and I just die inside little by little...

I want my life back... My life which I lived for me and no one else... Please don't get me wrong, I love love love my DD, but I just need a break...

The MB program works. Do you believe in it?

You should consider using it. Not little bits and pieces but the whole powerful program.

Think about it this weekend.

Thanks Lexxxy - I do believe in MB, I wouldn't be here if I didn't. I have chosen not to do some things 100% (ie: expose at work completely - many people know, just not the boss - who is quitting - and now the WHOR* may actually be is boss)...

I am doing the best that I can right now... I also am trying hard to live for me - which has been very difficult since I feel like I am losing my life, my future, and my dreams...

H told me he told his IC about Traci - finally - and that se acked him all sorts of questions about their relationship. So H feels like his IC is finally getting somewhere. Maybe she can get him to see that it is not fair to his family...

I don't know. I am rambling... Sorry - I am having a bad day today - shocker... Thanks to everyone who as shown their support. I appreciate it and I am taking the advice given as best as I can... I promise I want my M to work. I love this man with all my heart. I just want him to love me back...

I'm sorry you're going thru this, Alison. Life just stinks, sometimes, doesn't it! I've been there, and I truly know that "aroma". Hang in there, and stick around here for strength! I'm thinking of ya'!

Jennifer

Good Morning Everyone: H and I were talking last night and he was telling me that he was not going to change himself for anyone and that he would continue to be friends with Traci... I then said I am not going to change myself for anyone and I feel very strongly about you NOT having a friendship with Traci.

I was assuming that he would have been like ok well - I guess that's it then. That is how I was feeling - I told myself I am not backing down on this one. This is a big boundary for me if he wants to be married to me... I told him this...

So I asked him - well where do we go from here since we both agree that neither one is going to change - and he said it's not over Ali, we just need to compromise... I asked him who would be compromising cuz I told him it wasn't going to be me, he said he didn't know but that we could figure it out.

Am I fooling myself to believe that he may be realizing what he is giving up???