I suppose enabling would be different for each person. What may be demonstrating love and trust in someone, may actually be enabling their A. I always tried to be supportive of my WW, not objecting if she wanted to go out with her girlfriends, and repecting her need to be alone at times even though I might have wanted to spend that time with her. To me, this seemed like I was showing trust and respect for her, however, I think this enabled her A.

I don't know about you, but I could tell when the A started and could tell when she was lying to me. I don't know how I could tell, but something just wasn't right. You now have those feelings that something is not right, and I would trust those feelings. IMHO, maybe you should set some boundaries, let him know what those boundaries are, and remain steadfast in enforcing them.

Tired41

I know something isn't right. And I trust my feelings, I just don't want to. Last night, he came home from work and brought me roses and candy. We then went out to eat. I hear his phone vibrating, he starts reaching for it. But, tryint to do it without me noticing (the phone was in the door pocket on his side) I said "what are you doing?" "oh i thought I heard my phone ringing" I say, "it wasn't ringing, it was vibrating".. He checks his voice mail and tells me that it's some lady from work, about work, he was lying...I know this. It may have been someone that he works with but I can guarantee it wasn't about work. Why is he lying to me? Our M is over so why is he lying? This makes no sense to me. And is this considered an A? Since we are about to be divorced...in the "peoples" eye and in God's eyes...is it an A?
After dinner, we came home. I don't want to make anyone puke, but he had brought home a bottle of wine so he poured us both a glass, I lit some candles and drew him a bath and gave him a bath. I'll let you take it from there, please no puking on MB. What are we doing? What am I doing? Becuase I have not the slightest idea. If anyone, you tired or anyone. Tell me what I am doing? What boundaries do I need to set? I am in such a tornadoe right now that I don't even know if I am capable of anything my own self. Help!!!

Are you convinced that he is having an A. If you are not sure, you probably need to do some snooping to find out. I absolutely hated doing this, but it has to be done. Check cell phone records, the cell phone call log, text messages, emails, anything that you can get your hands on. Once you know for sure, the pros on the GQ II forum can guide you from there.

If it is an A, you are most likely enabling big time. Right now he has the best of both worlds and will probably keep on cake eating indefinately. If you are like me, you probably want things to work out so badly, that you will allow yourself to be a doormat. I think this is what caused my WW to lose some respect for me. I never said it was ok for her to have OM, but I could have tried harder to stop it. By the time I got my boundaries set, she was too far gone.

Convinced? Just a gut feeling. I had the feeling before and I was right then. So I am inclined to trust that feeling this time too. Checking? Cell phone bill is mailed to his mother's house. Says he is not hiding anything, yet he won't have it mailed to our house. Email, don't have access to it. I know he has lied about calls, the other night it rang and he said it was his dad. I checked the next day and one of his co-workers had called, on a Friday night at 10PM. Now come on- I know it wasn't about work. Door mat? Yeah, that's what I'm doing. I guess I keep hoping that if things go really good, that after the D is final then he'll miss me and how good it was and then come back. But why would he when he already has someone else to date and jump in bed with. I feel really pathetic today. Anxiety has started several times today, I have to go a breath and calm myself down. I'm so nervous all the time. I know one of the girls that calls him, the one that called late Friday night. She works with him. If I were to ask him he'd just fuss cause I was snooping. He told me that the reason we can't move past all of our troubles is not because he cannot get over my A, but becuase I wont quit snooping. but after a year I did find proof that he had an affair, don't know how long it lasted but I know it started in June 04. She is supposeldy married now. I don't know. I don't know I don't know. I guess he feels that what he's doing is not wrong since we are gettin D. So why would he lie? If it's over then why lie?

Soon, I really hurt for you. I was doing basically the same thing. Trying to show WW how good it could be, and hoping she would find her love for me again. But in that stage she would not let me fill her EN's. After she kept promising NC and the breaking that promise, I finally had enough and filed for D. She moved out and into an apartment. She is dating OM and apparantly has no regrets at all. I always hoped that with separation, that she would find that she missed me, but it's just not happening. If that happens, it will be when the A breaks up.

They do get mad when you snoop. My WW was furious. She said "If you would have stayed out of this, everything would have been ok". Ok for who? Her and the OM? It made me physically sick to snoop and find the things I saw. But I had to know the truth. I couldn't live a lie any longer. At some point I had to lay my cards on the table. I told her to choose between me and OM, and she wouldn't do that, so I made the decision. I do not want a D, but I can't keep living with a WW. I would die for my old W, but I won't for this WW.

I, once again, encourage you to read "Love Must Be Tough" by James Dobson.

Tired

I will get it. Anything that well help or atleast shed some light. I guess it would make it easier, maybe I could get some closure if he'd just tell me the truth. That he's seeing someone else. It would hurt, but sitting around wondering and knowing about all of his lies is what hurts the most. I stood up and told him the truth, so why can't he do that for me? Because in his eyes what he's doing is not wrong. I guess I'm looking on here for something that I am just not going to find. I don;t like being a door mat. I hate it. but on the other hand I long for him so much. I have longed for him to treat me the way he is treating me for months and months now. Please pray for us.

You are in my prayers. The lies are what hurt me most too. I think he knows what he's doing is wrong, or the snooping would not bother him.

I didn't like being a door mat either. I just want my STBXW to see how wonderful our life could be together, but she doesn't want to see that. I realize that I couldn't make her happy, but I was willing to make any changes that I needed to so she could find happiness in herself. I guess that includes giving her up.

Keep your head up and find something to smile about. I will send you some pictures of my Basset Hound if you want, that will make you smile (or laugh).

Tired

Bassett Hounds are funyy looking. I bought a bassett hound for an old boyfriend one time for his birthday. His name was LaMonte, he named him after the son on Sanford and Son, tv show. I loved that dog till I kept him one day and he chewed up one of my favorite pair of shoes. OK, I feel a little better now. It is slow here at work which makes my mind turn in a hundred different directions all day. I really don't like to get on here a whine and gripe all the time. It makes me feel like Im this doormat who can't stand up for herself or even take care of herself for that matter. But thank you.

My Bassett Hound is named Samson. He doesn't chew up things too bad, just his toys. He is funny looking, but he doesn't know it, he thinks he's beautiful.

I don't like to cry and whine about my situation either, but it helps to talk it out. As time goes by, hopefully we will need to talk about it less and less. I try not to think of it as being a door mat, but rather someone who tried to give the very best I had, even when it was tough. It's easy to feel loving when everything is going great, but true strength is to be able to love when things are going bad. Maybe we were doing it wrong and by that we became door mats, but we were trying our best, and that allows us to sleep at night. Sometime in the future, that will be remembered. I no that doesn't help us much, but that may be all we get.

Might thoughts are with you.

Tired41

Another thing, the night he told me he wanted out, he said "I love you, but not like a husband should love a wife". "I love you but I don't want to be married to you". "I can say to myself and anyone who asks, I put 100% of myself into trying to make our marriage work, but it just didn't work out". Where was the 100%? How can he say he tried 100% when he hasn't been completely honest with me about his other women, when he lies everytime he turns around the corner? He loves me enough to bed me down! I guess what he meant was, he doesn't love me enough to be committed to me. He hasn't been committed to me in over two years. OK, now I'm getting frustrated more and more. This is my cycle, hurt-anxiety-hurt-anger-sad-anger-anxiety-hurt. How long will it take for me to get over this man? Should I keep trying, or just give it up. Let him be as free as he wants. 23409875235987asldkjas

I absolutely, positively, hate that "I love you, but not like a W should love a H" speech. I heard that many times. Why would you say that to somebody? Would it not be easier to say nothing or just say I don't love you?

Another thing my WW said a few times was "I know I am acting childishly, but I expected more out of you!" What the h*** is that supposed to mean?

My cycle is about the same as yours, with a little indifferance sprinkled in at times. I don't know how long it will take to break this cycle. I think that you have to keep trying until you know in your heart that you are wasting your time. My WW and I went a MC and he gave us some homework assignments and a book to read. I asked her afterwards if she wanted to do the work and read the book, and she said "No", so I knew if was time to give up. I still pray that she will have a change of heart and come home, but I know it's not going to happen.

Vent on me anytime.

Tired41

How long has she been gone? Are you D yet? Or just seperated? I am exhausted. I'm so tired and I don't want to give up. But it seems to me that this is going nowhere. I am going to bet my boys now and head home. I hope things go well this evening. It's getting harder and harder for me not to open my mouth and ask him what the **** he is doing. I pray for you, keeping you in my thoughts. And thank you for talking to me.

You are welcome. Anytime you need to talk, I will be glad to. Thank you for listening to me also.

She moved out on Jan 3rd. She received her summons in the mail yesterday, and a court date will be set after a 20 day waiting period. I still see her at work almost everyday, but we don't speak or even make eye contact. From what I know, she is dating OM as if she is already single. She will email or text me occasionally regarding selling our house, etc., but it's always strickly business. No how are you's or anything like that, just business. From all appearances she is feeling no remorse whatsoever. I've got to get over this! I'm getting tired of feeling sad all the time.

I will pray for you also, and while doing so, give thanks for MB and all the good people here.

Tired41

I feel for you. I don't know if I could make it having to work with my STBXH. It's odd to me that you can be with someone for so long, married to them...and they can just get up and walk away with no problem whatsoever.
I hope your day goes well. I am very bored here at work lately, have a lot of extra time on my hands because it is so slow, so I get to stay on the computer all day.
Last night, I came home and my Valentines day card was laying on the kitchen table. He had forgotten to give it to me on V-day. It was quite a let down. The card I had given him said things like "my big strong man, my knight in shining armour" etc. This is what his card said:
"Hi it's me," I openend it up and the card said "forever wishing beautiful things for your life"...so, how do I say it...."friendly like". On the side he had written this "Baby, I wish I could put into words just how much you mean to me. I do love you so much. I just wish I could express that to you better".
He has already expressed how much he loves me so what the crap does that mean? Wishing beautiful things for your life, made me sick to my stomach. I guess I should just appreciate that fact that I even got a card. But he gave me roses, went out to eat, had some wine when we got home...did the deed and then he says "wishing you beautiful things", I have been thinking about writing him a letter. I don't know why. Nothing hateful or anything. Just letting him know that there's no need to express his so called love for me becuase I already know how much he loves me. He I go again, another day lost.

Yeah, that's what I feel too. I mean they are your best friend for so many years, and now they won't even say "Hi" in the hallway. It also makes me feel bad to see that she is going on with her life like nothing ever happened while I wonder if I can make it through another day.

I'm glad you got a V-Day card, even if it was weird and late.

I hope you have a good day too. I check on here often throughout the day, so post whenever you need to talk.

Tired