Of course I'm not WAT, and I have nothing new to tell you, but maybe it will help to remember some thinngs. Probably lots of people read your thought, but don't comment. I hope you don't mind some thoughts.



1 week into Plan B. I feel like I did back on D-day. Grieving the loss of my H. I cry at the drop of a hat. I want my life back, I want my H back, and I'm really scared that we will never get past this.

I see you are scared that "we" will never get past it. You may have to get past it yourself - you are right, it may not be a "we" thing. I think WAT is proof that YOU can get past it if that is what is needed. Of course, that is still something no one wants to think about yet. Remember that you have options too. You have choices. To have choices is not a bad thing.



On my way home from work this morning, for the first time, I allowed myself to picture them together, imagined him holding another in the arms I love so much.
How could this be us? Everyone who hears of it is blown away and says the same thing..."anybody but you two".

I have not been where you are, and I don't know how you feel, but I feel for you, and I wish it were better. I think you know you will be OK no matter what - but it's getting from here to there. The part in the middle is so difficult. Keep in mind who you are, and what your goals are.

If you get to a point where hanging on to him takes you away from your goals, and not towards them, then you will know it's time to make changes. One of the things you can do in plan B, is think about who you are, and what your goals are. Define your future so to speak. I think you have what it takes to make your dreams come true - don't be afraid to dream them...... even now.

He hasn't changed his address yet. Got 2 bills delivered here. Should I return to sender? Forward them to his PO Box?

It's usually best to give choices. Perhaps a note telling him that if a change of address form hasn't been filled out by (insert date) then you will beginning having his mail returned to sender. Then it's his choice what happens.

Having dinner with BIL and SIL tonight. Would just like to curl into the fetal position instead.

The pain part takes a while. From my reading I would say from one to two years in most cases. So sorry, wish it were otherwise.

I can't believe that WH is feeling anywhere near as much pain as I am. He seemed to be okay the last time I saw him.
I have old voice mails on the answering machine that I listen to just to hear his voice. Unfortunately, none of them are from before D-day...the ones that ended with "I love you". What I wouldn't give to hear those words from my H again.

And so.......... I see you still dream about him, and you still love him. Plan B will make that love last a little longer. Don't feel bad about that, it means you are who you want to be. Loyalty, and love are strengths, not weaknesses. These same feelings that torture you now, will someday provide joy and happiness all over again. You were not born to fail, but to succeed. Happiness is still out there - and you'll find it again.

Dream, have faith, think on your goals. You can do this, and I think you know it's true.

May happiness come quickly.

SS

Thanks for the thoughts SS. They are much appreciated. It is nice to know that someone will take the time to reach out and respond.

BIL and SIL just left. BIL did not tell WH about the info we heard on OW, said he couldn't find a good time as WH seemed already to be a "little down". I wish he had told him. Actually, the problem is that I wish he had told WH, and that WH would have an epiphany and say "WTF am I doing?" and come rushing back to me. I am my own worst enemy here. I am holding onto the past - my memories, my hopes and dreams...and I don't want to let them go. I want to be able to control it all...and I CAN'T.
I'll keep reading. I get so much help from other posters.
I am also mad at OWH. Sounds like he is enabling the affair to continue as this is their usual routine.
So how does my Plan B work in the face of that? I know, Plan B is for me..but there is a large part of me that is hoping Plan B will be the thing that saves the marriage.

Thanks for listening.

Went into town to do some errands today. As I was pulling into post office, WH was there pulling out. We passed each other looking straight ahead. No eye contact, nothing. I was doing a little better up until then, but now feel awful again.
I thought, how sad this all is. The man that I have loved above all others just passes by like we never even met.
Bit by bit, day by day, watching it all slip away.

I am missing WAT <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I don't blame you for missing WAT. He is very good at this, and he cares what happens to you.

I was doing a little better up until then, but now feel awful again.

Do you understand these feelings?
It's not like we can change them by force of will, but do you udnerstand them........ know where they come from?

I have learned that time and patience are necessarry to get past the feelings. In all my reading here, I haven't seen any way to short cut the experiance. There will come a time when you realize you are past it, and it will be a good thing. (This is no matter what happens - or which way this goes)

What do you do to cope? How do you channel your thoughts from the dark ones, to the good ones? There are ways to help at least. Are you working on that?

SS

Tomorrow is 2 weeks of Plan B. I am hanging on but it is HARD. I went with BIL and SIL to a cousin's house for the weekend. He is in a new relationship and had kind of a housewarming party. It was good to get away - got lots of family support (WH's family, BTW), got to cry and vent. I feel really selfish because I found myself almost resenting his happiness and feeling that life is SO not fair. Of course, I don't really resent his happiness - he's a great guy and deserves this. It's just hard to watch a couple in love when your marriage just fell apart, My WH and I were that couple in love and lately I feel that I just have to let it go. These past 2 weeks have actually been like a period of mourning as I've had to say good-bye to my H and my M and the life that I treasured. I feel like I went to bed one night and when I woke up, I was living someone else's life.

bump ^ for WAT

I feel ya lizzie.

Not what you asked for. Hope you get some more help. Just be still. YOU ARE WORTHY. Don't forget that. You are getting some awesome help here.

Love in Christ,
Miss M

Hi Lizzie -

I know I nor others can offer words to remove your pain. We can only validate it because we've been there, too. Try to take heart that you are "normal."

It's really important that you not give up on Plan B. Think of the alternative - you allow him to influence you directly. That can't be better before he decides you are the better choice afterall. Worse, quiting Plan B returns control to him. In Plan B, you are in control, even though it doesn't feel like it to you right now.

Another way to look at this is that he is not that "former" guy you are yearning for. That guy may return or that guy never existed. In my case it was the later with regards to my wife. It was very tough for me to finally accept that I had been so blind for so long - to overlook her deep, deep issues and the terrible way she ttreated me that others so easily could see.

Hang tough, Liz. You WILL come out of this a better person no matter what happens.

WAT
---------------
Staying in the center of the channel.

I thought Plan B was supposed to help preserve my love for WH. Instead I am feeling more and more like throwing in the towel. I am angry...angry that he did this in the first place, angry that he saw my pain day after day when he first began the "I might leave because I want a child" thing all the while he was f'ing his married wh*re, angry that he has thrown my love and forgiveness out the window, angry that he has trampled on the hearts of two boys who loved him, and angry that he hasn't even tried to break Plan B. I have tried keeping my thoughts on other things - I still read, run, exercise, swim - I went away for the weekend, I play pool, I took the kids to dinner and a movie - but, it's ALWAYS there. I think about it before I go to sleep at night and it is the first thing I think of when I wakke up in the morning. I've been reading my Al-Anon books and trying to let go, but I don't seem to be able to.
I feel like I should cut my losses... and then I think of how he was and how we used to be and I think I can hold on. I am just so confused.

Hi Liz -
But you are getting wiser every day. Be patient. The answer will come.

WAT

Today is day 24 of Plan B. This past week has been really good for me. I have still cried every day, but I feel stronger and had pretty much decided that I no longer want to recover my marriage. I am still very angry about WH's affair. Angry that he used the excuse of wanting a child, angry that he has hurt my boys so badly, and angry that he wanted to wait and see if OW would leave her H before he made a "decision" - like I am something that he will settle for, a back-up plan. Excuse me lizzie, but would you get in line behind the slut, please? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

I had just gotten out of the shower and I heard my son yell "Mom" and I heard the dog barking. I was putting on a robe and there was a knock at the bedroom door. WH saying "Can I come in?" <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> I went out to the living room and he handed me a letter that he wants me to read. He tried to engage me in conversation, but I just cut him off.
The letter was an "I want to come home letter". I will post it in it's entirety tomorrow for more feedback (I left it at home), but it basically said that he's sorry, all the things that he misses about home, and that it's over. said he wanted to waut a couple of weeks before contacting me but that he knows "time is of the essence".

This is where it gets messy. I went out on a date last Thursday with one of the men who plays pool in the same league. Single. Asked if I felt like I was ready to start dating. I said yes. Had a really nice dinner, he bought me flowers, and we are planning another date on Saturday. I am feeling really confused. Don't know if I even want to try to salvage marriage. Wonder if I am in my own fog, it has been so long since someone treated me nice, not sure if I want to give it up. WH must know about this because of his time is of the essence remark.

WH asked me to go to a baseball game with him on saturday. I already know that I will tell him no. But I guess we should talk. Oh, where to start? What to do? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Lizzie - first, congrats on the stellar Plan B. I'm glad you're feeling better, and you can see that it DID have an effect on your WH.

***This is where it gets messy. I went out on a date last Thursday with one of the men who plays pool in the same league. Single.***

Big, big mistake here, for a lot of reasons:

First, you are still married. YOU are married, even if your WH has told himself he's not. You've got to be the sane one here and uphold some sort of stability for your two boys. Seeing you start dating just a few short months after WH leaves, without benefit of divorce, is a terrible example for two young men who will soon be dating and soon be choosing their own life partners.

Second, even aside from the legalities, you are emotionally fried and in no condition to start any kind of relationship with another man. It's not fair to him and it's not fair to you.

Third, if you have any thought whatsoever of recovering your marriage you will have ZERO chance if you start "dating" before you are even divorced. I fully understand being emotionally starved to death, but this is a very bad road you have started down.

Why not post WH's letter here, and then watch to see what he *does*. See if his actions match his words, and then see how you feel if/when that happens.
Mulan

Please listen to Mulan. She is dead right. You are married. Having your own affair is wrong.

Liz,

Stop dating, you are married. You pass it off as being ok, but you are setting yourself up to be just like all the other married men you complained about: Justifying an affair because your marriage isn't going well.

How much of a coincidence is it that you aren't sure that you want to save this marriage and the fact that you just went on a date with a new man?

If you fall into the same path as your WH, you will find yourself wanting to continue this affair, to see where it goes. You'll shrug off your husband and only after a few years or months will you realize this new guy was just a temporary fix.

You don't know this man, nor will you really see the true side of him for months or years. Work on your marriage or finish it off, but don't go this route.

I couldn't agree more, Liz.

Cut off the "date" pronto. This clouds your ability to objectively evaluate the potential for marriage recovery. Call the guy and tell him you screwed up by exploring too soon.

Now, that said, your suspicions of your H getting off his butt because he heard you were on the market are probably true. This is a well known cause and effect, just not proper to use in the "war."

So, assuming you're going to wise up, reveal the details of his letter and be thinking of what his NC letter to OW ought to include.

WAT

OK, OK...apparently I screwed up. I thought I read somewhere on the forum that it was OK to date, just not anything serious.

I understand that it could cloud my ability to think rationally right now, but if you look at my posts since I went into Plan B, I have not been too sure that saving my marriage is what I want to do. The date was not to get his attention or to try to use it against him.

So, here's the letter:

"My Dearest Elizabeth,

I want to start by saying "I'm sorry". I'm sorry for everything I have put you through for the past 8 months. I was completely wrong and I apologize. You were right all along. I've come to realize that our marriage, though not perfect, was pretty dam* close. I've also realized in the past couple of months that i do still love you and that I miss you. I also miss having a nice home to come home to, with a loving wife there waiting for me. I miss the dog, the cat, the boys, and everything that goes along with it. Except maybe the pool. I never liked the pool. I even miss the thought of going to Countryfest with everyone, and the thought of our party. Believe it or not, there's even a part of me that misses working on the house. I've actually been thinking about the basement and porch a lot recently, trying to figure out what it's going to take to finish each.

You told me not to contact you until I was done seeing Toni. Well, I'm done. I hope it's not too late. i did want to wait a couple of weeks before contacting you, but I understand time is of the essence right now. I know you don't owe me a dam* thing, and I deserve even less, but I would like a shot at regaining what we had, and becoming the husband that you were so in love with. I have 2 tickets to a Mets game on Saturday. Please come with me. It could be the beginning of the rest of our lives together. I'll be waiting for your answer.

I Love You.
Moon and Stars,
Scott"

Waiting for feedback.

I fully understand that you were teetering on giving up on the marriage and I actually was leaning that way for you. I'm sure you recall my questions to you on the wisdom of it, right? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

BUT - his letter sounds sincere and I think you've got little to lose and MUCH to gain by giving it a shot.

Why not?

Maybe it would be wise for you to start back at the beginning of your MB posts and just re-read them. Recall the effort you put it and even the pain you felt. After all that, doesn't it make sense to see what you can harvest?

And just for the record, dating is a bad idea until divorce - and even then, ought to be done wisely so as not to "rebound" into something too early.

WAT

lizzie, WAT is exactly right, dating is a very bad idea because a vulnerable BS is so needy she could fall in love with a tree if it waved at her. And believe me, I speak from experience! It is a set up for more heart break.

If you do decide to give it another shot, it is REAL IMPORTANT that he agree to a plan of recovery, lest you will just be dealing with this all over again next year. The first step in restoring the damage would be to write a nc letter to the OW. [sample below] It should be written together, approved by you and mailed together.

He should also agree to the Four Rules of Protection as outlined by Dr. Harley: http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5065_qa.html

If he won't agree to these things, then he probably not sincerely committed to rebuilding your marriage. In that case, you would be setting yourself for a fate worse than death: the FALSE RECOVERY! So, please be careful here and don't settle for crumbs if you decide to take him back.

Sample NO CONTACT letters


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dr. Harley?s (From SAA)

(OP), I want you to know that out of respect and love for my wife and children, I have come to realize that I must never see or talk with you again. My relationship with you was a cruel indulgence that (BS) did not deserve. While I cannot completely repay (BS) for the pain I have caused her, I will do my best to become the husband she?s been missing. I care a great deal for my family and I would not want to do anything to risk their happiness. I will not make any further contact with you and I do not want you to make any contact with me. Please respect my desire to end our relationship.
Sincerely,
(WS)

Went to WH's house to talk about his letter. I had a list of questions that I wanted answered. Apparently, he last slept with OW on Wednesday and talked to her on Thursday to hear her final decsion. She and her husband are selling their house and moving. She has decided it is over. I feel like a second rate citizen. As soon as OW decided to end it, he came running over to me with his "sorry" letter. I gave him a copy of SAA and told him that I needed a no contact letter. He says the letter would be humiliating for him as he has already ended it. I also told him a copy needed to go to OWH. I told him the no contact letter was about me and my feelings, not his. He is reading the book and I told him that I will not sit in limbo anymore. I need to have those letters in my mailbox by the morning or we have nothing more to talk about. I also told him that counseling is a must. He is not keen on doing this without a guarantee from me. I spent a lot of time telling him how I feel and what I need in order to consider moving forward, but that there are no guarantees. My conditions are non-negotiable. So, we'll see. Still not sure about how I feel, nor about his sincerity. I still think there are some sexual issues with him. He admitted to internet porn and having "really good sex" with her. She also emailed him naked pictures of herself but his computer crashed so they are lost....boo hoo. Am I still really pissed off? You bet. But at this point, I have NOTHING to lose. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

Another thing....my kids HATE him. I really see this as hopeless.

^^^Bumping for feedback^^^

Another thing that I am struggling with is:

How can you say you love someone and then go [censored] someone else? I have so much trouble wrapping my head around this. It is not something that I would ever do so I just don't get it. I feel like the fact that he had an affair negates everything that we ever had, everything that he ever said. It feels like our entire time together has been a lie.