Dorry, you said:



But Dorry, my FWH said this same thing WHEN HE WAS DEFINITELY ADDICTED..HE SAID EXACTLY THAT OVER AND OVER: "Let me go...I don't love you anymore..go on with your life.." I told this to Steve Harley..asking Steve if he meant this..Steve said: "YOU HAVE TO BELIEVE AND UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS AN ADDICTION" despite what your WH is saying.. I guess since this was my situation I think it very well may be true for many others.

Post deleted by Cherished

I am not saying listen to your WS mimi <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

of course EVERY WS is going to tell you that.

See - Harley tells you it's an addiction - which in your case it was, but in Cherished case - let go...and in her case I do agree....

There are many OTHER cherish's on here....

Cherished:

I haven't been keeping up with your situation..

Why has Dr. Harley been recommending for you to "let go"?

Post deleted by Cherished

Dorry!! Hi there! Hope all is well with you.

I thought about what you wrote and to some extent I see it and yet can also see where the in your face stand up and look at yourself talk turns into a hammering.
I dont think its even meant that way perhaps more a result of where the poster is more than anything.

I have to admit to getting angry when I read a WS start to justify or give excuses WHY they cant do the right thing. However I will try to help over & over those who are honestly so afraid to do something they know is right - is that coddling? maybe, but I dont think so.

Xmas was a time of immense pain for many this year, more so in my opinion than ever before on this forum. Not sure why, perhaps just so much going on. Perhaps the forum has had a bit of hit from that.

The more I learn about myself & m & realtionships the more I find myself reluctant to give the rote answers on MB. But I dont think the Harleys ever meant them to be rote responses but rather guidelines which work most of the time WITH good counselling as well to alter and tweak them as needed.
However, that said, I agree that I would have tried to downplay my affair and blame everyhing BUT myself had I been given the leeway - but people like LM, believer, mel, FF, AD and goodness there are so many others slapped me into line and gave me blunt options like - do you want to divorce then do that! Many times very kind about it but still very to the point and yes like you said, it hurt a lot.
Denial really isnt just a river in Egypt. Not for us FWS.

I do think the HARSH words need to stop at the personal level - criticize the behaviour not the person. Though I have to admit my fingers itch at times to type "STOP WHAT YOU ARE DOING YOU STUPID ARSEH...." but I Nobly refrain from it <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> ( well most of the time)

Of course this is only MY opinion <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

AW

(((HUGS)))

I miss ya! I haven't chatted with you in for ever. Hope all is well down under and ya know I always love your opinion <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I love everyones opinion. It was some of the blunt and harsh posts here MB that showed me that just because my opinion isn't the same as my husbands it doesn't make me right <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> That his opinion and perspective is just as right as mine <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Let me tell ya - since I grasped that concept - the fights at my home have changed dramatically - there is no more pushing opinion on eachother until we are blue in the face.

Had people not been blunt with me and my own PERSONAL treatment of my husband (even when he was a WS and treating me the way he was) I would have never really "got it"

While the harshness isn't for everyone...I would hate to see the harsh people get chased away for all the "ME's" that come here lol

Dorry ~ I agree with you. The board has become coddling, AND meanspirited.

There is alot of self-will running rampant on the board right now - people want their lives and relationships fixed, on their own terms with their own quick-fix plans (Plan X, Y and Z) and are unwilling to do the personal work that recovery (personal, marital or both) requires.

I don't post much anymore. I read just about every day. Why? Because its been very clear for quite some time that this board is no longer about recovery.

It's very much become about being right.

Hi BR! I miss you around here. I guess we have to decide do we want to be right or do we want to save marriages?

well it goes 2 ways.

oldtimers can not hand out shortcuts to newcomers and demand/expect that people will or should just bow to their wisdom.

Respect has been sorely missing from this forum.

newcomers have to rollup their sleeves and be willing to listen and try something new, instead of expecting answers on a silver platter...the 'quick fix'.

Sharing about my own struggles has always seemed to help others...but I will not force my 'shares' on those who do not welcome it.

There is a huge attitude problem on both sides of the fence.

Jaded, harsh, "right" oldtimers.

Lazy close-minded "right" newcomers.

Thanks for offering that balance Bramble Rose. I sadly agree.

I keep hearing how "bluntness" or "harshness" is what is being addressed instead of mutual respect and marriage building. I'm not sure where that comes from? No one was asked "not" to be honest or blunt. We were asked to be respectful and keep the topics on MB. I also keep hearing that we've now "lost" our best members because they can't post in a style that some find uncomfortable even though I doubt anyone's been "banned".

Well, truth (especially about infidelity) cannot always be packaged in pretty paper, and adherance to ethics and MB is oftentimes painful so we need tough posters....but the goings on of these dynamics are not about that. This is not about style or toughness....never was. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

I have seen everyone mentioned use their snappy, no nonsense, hard hitting style in respectful, funny, intelligent ways that didn't compromise their message one little bit! In fact, that's how they usually use it....for the good...and have done loads of good. When they don't....they are subject to the same kinds of warnings just like everyone else is. Lord knows I've gotten a few *blush*. I consider it a badge of honor, that I can admit that and say "I needed that". Do you really think us oldtimers with blunt styles don't need 2X4's sometimes too dorry? LOL.

But I've seen this board's ability to function as a marriage building place come to standstill while posters duke it out trying to "one up" each other as all energy goes to some controversial thread (yep, even admit to starting a few sadly). The reason I've gotten warnings is precisely BECAUSE folks have respect for me and I ought to know better. The longer you're here doesn't entitle you to more perks or status....it's like getting a new job title (oldtime) with no raise....just more responsibility. The more people look up to you....the more noticeable you're going to be to the mods if you cross the line.

I've seen too many threads recently...only designed to rile people up or covertly criticize individuals, groups...even religions....basically pot stirring or bullying. Threads where being right becomes more important than being helpful, ethical or compassionate.....and where being old or new somehow creates a hierachy of how "right" you can be.

No single person is responsible for that....but a noticeable contribution or trend is going to be addressed when the complaints start piling up. It happens from time to time....I've seen this cycle more than once....even more so now that membership has gotten so large. Much of it is growing pains. None of it is tragic except for the posters who get lost in the shuffle.

When I got a warning.....I used it to re-examine my posts, look at choices, motives, priorities, word choice, misunderstandings and grow as a person....keep the good parts of my style...jettison the parts that probably needed some adjusting....get back to marriage building.

Don't worry chere....they'll be back. Everybody comes back sooner or later.

Hi Dorry,

Been reading this thread and thinking upon it. Over the years this site has cycled between sort of "comfy", to "mean spirited", to a mix of "here is how the cow at the cabbage and I am sorry you are here."

Balance is hard to come by and to some extent everything is in the eye of the beholder. Melodylane and Pep are classic examples of sometimes really rubbing someone the wrong way, but getting to the meat of things with almost unerring accuracy. I just love their posts. Pep for her brevity and economy of words, and Mel??? well she is from Texas, what else can I say. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

I do agree there seem to be more and more posters (possibly because of the growing popularity of this site) that have NOT read the articles here, much less information on the plans. Hence you see a lot of "modified" plan a's and b's that are neither. It is not about adopting these plans and making them your own, they simply don't understand the plans to begin with. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Some of this has always been true, but with more people and activity, one seems to see more of it.

You also mentioned people NOT letting go. I will say that the most frustrated I have been is with BS's, not the WS's that come here. I understand wanting to save a marriage, and I am in amazement in the strength that many here show, but I don't understand going against the data. Cherished is NOT one I am thinking of, but a few BS's have had victory in their grasp if they would simply go to plan B and let it go and allowed the WS back home and their continued affair. It drives me crazy.

Usually, you will see a harsh post from me, and when that does not work, I cease to post to them. No use talking to a wall. It is not about them not listening as you might expect a WS to do. It is about them deciding they really do know how to do this when all of the data shows that they do NOT.

Oh well. I liked this post, I do wish more people read the articles here, and understood that sometimes the only way to save themselves and YES their marriage is to let go.

God Bless,

JL

Amen brother.

I Try to remember to encourage any New posters I communicate with to go and get to the real MEAT of the site for themselves.

Yes,
to use the discussion forum as a supplement, a place to vent and even ask questions.
But not as the end all.

Thanx for reminding us all of that once again.

Indeed.

So if Everybody's "right" ......what seems to be the problem?? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Hey,
is it 2 rights make a left or something?? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Or was it 2 Rights produce a hippee rebel? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

Oh yea,
Gosh darn'it:
Must be that darn'd ol presentation thingee again.
ya know ...honey & vinegar and all that jazz.

TP,

It is 3 rights make a left. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> OR it is 3 lefts make a right. That is to be politically correct. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

JL

"I will say that the most frustrated I have been is with BS's, not the WS's that come here. I understand wanting to save a marriage, and I am in amazement in the strength that many here show, but I don't understand going against the data. Cherished is NOT one I am thinking of, but a few BS's have had victory in their grasp if they would simply go to plan B and let it go and allowed the WS back home and their continued affair. It drives me crazy."

Are those my ears burning?


BTW, 2 rights = 2 lefts = backwards.

A lot like LTA recovery....

err...just my opinion, of course.

with prayers,

Um, no.

It's "2 wrongs don't make a right, but 3 lefts do."

-ol' 2long

...it's important! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Ap,

Your ears are NOT burning from anything I have said, trust me on this.

JL

unfortunatetly I am begining to feel too much of a dayum'd if you do and dayum'd if you don't feeling about being round these parts....

not comfortable with being grouped as some type of "oldtimer nazi poster"...

thinking about dumping my nick..though I would miss her awfully....

I guess if and when someone has a problem with MY posts..for I can only speak for me...

if it is out of line with guidelines of the forum...

report me please...

if you don't agree with my ADVICE believe me...I offer it with no great illusion that it is correct and MUST be followed....

tell me or ask me to step away...


for the record it is infact a personal opinion of mine that this is NOT a support board...
cause there are a lot actions from a lot of people I am not comfortable with SUPPORTING....

hmmmmm...

thinking of a new nick...

ARK^^

ark^^,

I'm thinking that I might make a change from star*fish to fishy*smell considering how dated and putrid my advice probably is from time to time.....being an oldtimer and all.

Do you think support hose counts?