Yes, I am a whiner! But I still think I have every right to be. I have tried, and tried to "forgive and forget" but I'm not entirely sure that is ever possible. I had lunch and my hubbys place of business yesterday and "saw" his precious Mia there. She is so damn pretty, had alot of friends and seemed happy. Yes, I know she works there. And probably somewhere in my mind, I actually wanted to "see" her. But I didn't think it would bother me as much as it did. Even though my H as said she broke up with him, and even though Mia herself posted here that she was sorry, I don't believe either of them. Maybe my heart is stone. Maybe I'm chosing to stay miserable. I can't seem to find a way to move past this hurt and betrayal. I know I contributed to the breakdown of my marriage, and I know in many ways I'm not doing anything but pushing H away. So, at this point the only thing that may help both of us is to separate. I'm seeing an attorney today so I can at least get all my facts straight. <P>I know how hard all of you try to work and salvage your marriages. I just think sometimes it's just to darn hard for some of us who maybe aren't as emotionally strong.

Did you ever drive to his office that night?

Tired Lady, who said your not as strong? I had such a hard time confronting the OW and seeing her again at a family event, you can sit and have lunch and not let it bother you over much, your a very strong lady. I think you are what you say you are, tired. I think maybe your afraid as well. I think also that you may be confused about how to handle this. How long ago did you find out about it? It took me months to decide that my marriage was really what I wanted. I kept thinking that no one else I knew would have put up with this and stayed, so why should I? But after a long long long time of thinking about it a friend said "Look, he's said he's sorry, he's said he's committed, and he's said he wants to be your everything and you need to give him that chance to do the right thing by you." I know this doesn't make sense but I can say that our marriage IS much better than EVER before,,,,, in some ways thanks are to the affair. But, if you are tired and feel you can't make this work then you need to do what is right for you. I am saying that you need to give yourself enough time to get past the shock of this and then consider your options carefully. God Bless

Holly, sorry for double posting! By the by, if there are children envolved you do need to have a relationship with him, for their sakes. Maybe you should start there.....<P>------------------<BR>Chick's<P>You won't see things until your ready to not be blind!<BR>

At some point you're gonna HAVE to believe your H if you want to start healing. I'm sure trust cannot be easy after a betrayal, but suppose he IS telling the truth?<P>I'm so sorry there's so much pain in your heart. <P>You said the Mia was with her friends and looked happy? Quite possibly she's getting on with her life, TL. She said she stopped the affair, said she's sorry ... you need to accept that.<P>Your suspicions will eat you alive over time and you'll never be able to have a healed marriage.

Hi Tired Lady<P>Actually going this route also shows your strength. You are feeling very hurt right now and I guess you are starting to realize that only YOU can make yourself happy. Filing for separation is not my idea of rebuilding a marriage and I hope this action is for YOU and not to hurt your H. <P>Stay strong and be proud of yourself. Humans can only endure so much, so take care and do whatever makes you feel good for the long run. once you feel good about yourself then you can build on that with others.<P>Good Luck<BR>_____________________________________________<BR>"Better to die on your feet than live on your knees"

I've read so many of your posts, and I'm so sorry this is happening to you. There's a couple of things I want you to remember:<P>1. You named yourself "tired lady" for a reason. This whole thing has tired you beyond belief. That means you are tired, not weak.<P>2. Mia may or may not be happy. Who cares? She may feel she took some high road by coming here (to MB) but to me she made a huge mistake and infringed on your privacy and safe place. That added to your pain, not helped it.<P>3. Whether or not she's pretty has nothing to do with anything. My H's OW (there were two) were not all that attractive, and if you saw my OM you would probably LOL. Pretty or not pretty doesn't hold people together. Love and committment do.<P>4. A separation is not a divorce, but it can be a real love buster. Why not go on a vacation away from it all, but do nothing legal. Literally, go away for a week, give your H the phone #, go to Mom's, anywhere that will give your head some space to think.<P>I feel so bad for you because you have tried so hard and you keep seeming to be hit in the face with your OW. In your life SHE DOESN'T MATTER. She was like a tumor and now think of the tumor as shrunken... maybe not healed yet, but smaller. You are so much more important in your H's life.<P>Best wishes...<P>------------------<BR>Marriage: the most important contract you'll ever enter into, and the most sacred.<BR>

Yeah, going on a vacation would be a great idea. Just get away from it all for a while ....<P>Then you can re-group and decide what your plan of action needs to be to reconcile your marriage.

Whatever you do with your marriage you need to address your anger. I highly recommend counseling. You can't live with anger and bitterness and having a heart like a stone--whether your H is in your life or not.<P>Forget about Mia. She's nothing to you. She may be pretty on the outside, but her actions have been ugly.<BR><P>------------------<BR>Lor<BR>"Do not get tired of doing what is right, for after awhile you will reap a harvest of blessings if you do not get discouraged and give up. (Gal 6:9)<P><BR>

Thanks for all the responses. To update some of your questions - I have known about this affair since the end of May 99. It started sometime in November 98. I do not believe by any stretch of the imagination that it is "over". My H shows me no affection at all, nor does he do anything to indicate that he is committed to working on this marriage. I cannot save the marriage myself. He has gone to counseling in the past with me, but even the counselor says that with the atmosphere I have created at home, why should he want to be there with me? As harsh as this word is, I hate everything he has done to me. And yet I know I am as much to blame for the contributions to our marriage breaking down.<BR>Sometimes I think I want to hurt my H by filing for separation so I can force him into a decision. I sometimes think if I make him guilty enough for leaving me and the kids (ages 16 & 13) then he'll stay. But it won't be because he loves me, it will be for them. And like I said before, I can be just as miserable without him.

Oh, yes a vacation would be a good thing for me. Maybe I should go off by myself and leave him home with the kids so he can see what it will be like without me.

Tired Lady-<P>I don't think I ever posted to you but I have followed your story from the beginning. I want to say that I think you and H can survive this. You were honest from the start about your part in the breakdown of the marriage and you continue to post honest and raw feelings. I admire that and believe that this will be the foundation for your rebuilding.<P>I know you are devastated and your anger is justified. However, do you think that part of your anger may be at your own self for your part in the breakdown? I know that admitting my own failing in the marriage was difficult considering he had been the one who cheated. For me it was hard to separate the affair and its effects from the flawed marriage that led up to it. The pain of the affair was so overwhelming and seemingly so unjustified that it is difficult to admit to any part of his vulnerability. Somewhat like a defense mechanism...what I did is not worse than what you did w/cheating, blah, blah, blah.... (The blame game at its best)Too focused on the "affair" and unwilling to admit that I could have contributed in any way, shape, or form. This "blind-eye" was yet another source of internal conflict for me as I wrestled w/my pain.<P>I had to take a long look at myself and my own behavior. It wasn't always pretty! While I found bad, I also found much good that I had long overlooked. It set me off on a new journey of self-discovery that has provided ME with a totally new perspective on MY life. I re-evaluated my values, boundaries, behaviors, skills, etc. I've forgiven myself and am I'm finding ME again. Helps me to deal w/him much better.<P>You, however, readily admit to your own behaviors that broke the marriage. If you can work through those and try to reduce some of your anger, you may be surprised at your progress.<P>I see a bright future for you...but I'll say a prayer anyway! <P>Good Luck and God Bless!