I have a quandry here. I'm doing my best at a Plan A here with the WW. She is still in contact with OM, D is still there but on hold pending her decision. How can ANY trust be rebuilt here?

My snooping seems to do more harm than good as I tend to jump to conclusions whenever I find something for example; she's been looking at airfares to visit OM, she hasn't actually booked anything, just looking. I find out and confront her about it. She gets mad that I am snooping and tells me that she's only looking. Do I just need to chill and let things happen here? Niether one of us will ever be able to trust one another at this pace.....

Bark

Seems to me that ANY contact or THOUGHTS of any contact with OM do nothing to build trust or move the M recovery forward. I think that the burden of proof is on her at this point. She should give you all email passwords, accounts, cell phone records, be willing to place a GPS in her car and account for all of her time. If she has nothing to hide then there should be no problem with this. If she has something to hide then she will have a major problem with it and she should be assumed guilty until proven innocent. You shouldn't have to be snooping, she should be a clean as glass to you if she truly wants to work on M and stop D. Otherwise I would suggest there is not committment on her end. Just my opinion.

Dude, I am in the same place. If I look around and caugth it blows into, 'see you don't trust me'. We need some good comebacks or help on this....anyone?

Yea. The A is 99.99% EA since he is in CA and we are in IL. He doesn't travel much at all so, phisical contact is severly limited. I just need to get her weaned away from speaking with him. Lately it's been very little compared to a few months ago. They only speak every 3 days or so and only for a few minutes. They used to spend 4-6 hours a day on the phone. E-mails have stopped too. The only thing I can't track is if they are sending postal mail to one another but I highly doubt that as on several occassions, she's started writing a letter but never finished them.

I feel the less she is in contact, the more of a chance we have. I just had an opportune moment to ask if the D was on hold and she said "it depends on you (meaning me)" So, I'm guessing I'm facing some fog talk as well as fence sitting. I just need the strength to wait this out..... Need to find a middle ground to help with the trust issues here....

Something invaluable I took home from this site:

Don't trust her. Don't ever expect to fully trust her again. Trust can be a bad thing.

I told my FWW that I'll never fully trust her again and had her read Dr. Harley's take on it and she understood and accepted it... after a while.

Trust cannot be rebuilt as long as she engages in untrustworthy behavior. Trust must be EARNED and you would be insane to trust an untrustworthy person.

Just the fact that she gets MAD at your snooping should tell you that she is not trustworthy. People who have nothing to hide, DON'T HIDE.

So, it appears that you need to protect yourself from her, but if you already KNOW she is having an affair, I don't see the point. You don't need to snoop to find out what you already know, do you?

Actually, it is SHE who needs help with the trust issue. She is the one who has to EARN it, so it is really her issue.

What have you done to bust up this affair?

WW: "YOU DON'T TRUST ME!!"

BS: "Of course I don't trust you, you are untrustworthy. Trust has to be EARNED."

My DH said this inanity to me ONLY ONCE and I stopped him dead in his tracks with the above statement. I did add: "DO I LOOK INSANE????"

Melody, Good point! I guess I should just stop going through her things and let it go until she is ready to stop the A. Their primary mode of communication is her cell phone and she knows I check the call details several times a day. When I see a call to OM, I call her on it and tell her to stop. She doesn't seem to have a problem with it so, she is somewhat selective with her privacy.


D-Day was 8/1 and exposure to friends, relatives and neighbors was within a week of D-Day. I even gave her family all the e-mails I had that basically said that she didn't care if her family approved, OM was the man she wanted to spend the rest of her life with. OM is single/divorced so, I don't know if there is anyone to expose to there. I thought of exposing to his employer since he spent much of his working hours on the phone with her, used company computers to send e-mails to her and such but he's a car salesman and car dealerships aren't the best for HR issues.

It seems the more I "tell" her anything, the less she listens and retreats to the OM. I've been in Plan A for about 4 weeks now and since they are in limited contact, it seems that she is here more than in the fog.

Also, I completely understand the trust issue, I've told her many times that I do not trust her at all and she must earn my trust. It going to be a long hard road if we ever find the path. The way I look at this is we have a 50/50 chance of rebuilding or divorce. I must keep on track with Plan A keep her engaged and in less contact with OM. The less she is talking with him the more time she spends with me and our family.

So, my exchange looks like this:

WS: I don't trust you!

BS: I don't trust you either! You betrayed the trust of our marraige when you started this affair!

WS: Sure, you know everything! It's always about me!

BS: Yes and it was your choice!

We generally go round and round about who was worse at betraying the trust. She's very good at denial.....

Me: Doc, it hurts when I do this.

Doc: Then don't do that.

Bark, I think it is a good idea that you continue to confront her because if you don't, she will just get more and more uncomfortable in the affair. My point is that if she admits she is having an affair, then snooping is not your answer, but perhaps something else, like Plan B or further efforts to disrupt the affair.

A couple of things come to mind. It might help for you to pay a visit to the OM yourself. Steve Harley once counseled one of our members to do this. It gives the OP a chance to see the real live person he is hurting face to face instead of the fantasy demon your OW has described. Ask him "what are your intentions with my wife?"

Another good exposure would be his work place and his parents. Do you know how to contact his parents? Are you CERTAIN he is divorced?

When WH complained of snooping - I told him that if we could share the deepest and most private parts of our bodies, and had pledged and shared the deepest parts of our souls, what on earth could make emails or phone calls out of this sharing loop. I did A in spades, never took the smile off my face or raised my voice. Just spoke as if he was asking why the rain came down from the sky instead of going up from the ground. Simple unnaffected response. When he bought up trust, I told him that he would earn it when he could consistently act in a trustworthy and open manner - not for an hour or a day or two. So - it has taken a few years but we are there, on part B, it is just discovering old unknown and unrevealed trust issues that sometimes trip me up. Honesty for him is what comes to mind at the time - he has a conveniently bad memory for things he has done in the past, so some of them are small fry, but some knock me off my seat for a bit.

Linda

Plan B is not possible niether one of us can leave due to financial constraints.


That would NOT be a good idea. I would wind up in jail. Probably for life if I actually confronted him. This is no joke.


He works at a car dealership. Last place that would even consider making an HR issue out of some slob like this OM. They'd probably have a party to celebrate how successful this guy is with the ladies! I am positive he is divorced (twice to be exact) he has two kids from his second marraige too. His father is deceased, I do however, know where his mother lives, I've thought about contacting her to let her know what her son is up to. I think I'll reserve that one as an absolute last resort.

This guy has no morals or care for anyone but himself, he is a player extrodinarre, I know his history, my SIL is a notch on his belt too!! He is very close with his family and probably has them completely buffalo'd about his escepades. If I tried to expose to his mother, I'm guessing they would come to his defense relentlessly.

For now, I'm just going to concentrate on WW. Continue monitoring her cell phone and confronting her whenever she talks to OM. I also need to keep tabs on her the end of March when I take the kids on a trip for a few days during spring break.

That in itself (I believe) will be another critical juncture in our relationship as I've told her, if she goes to visit OM while we are gone, I will take that as her decision to move forward with the D. It's her choice and she understands.

On another note, I have an appointment to speak with Steve Harley on Monday so, we'll see if he agrees with my strategy or has some better suggestions.