Currently in plan A with supposedly NC, doing the looking-happy-while-torn-up-inside thing. Found out a few days ago WW was still checking her secret webmail account daily for signs of contact from OM, although it appears she wasn't e-mailing OM. I confronted her, after which she deleted all 41 messages and I closed the account. The aftermath of exposure wasn't very pleasant. She is sleeping in the guest bedroom, not wearing her wedding ring and has taken down all our wedding pics. She disagrees that it is necessary to break off all contact, which I discovered was OM opinion in one of the secret e-mails. She says she has many unanswered questions and thinks it would be better to gradually break things off!!!!

The usual withdrawal behavior it seems...

I have not told my WW's father and her friends about the A yet. I don't get why this is so important? Won't recovery be hampered if she is being judged by everybody (we are from a pretty conservative background).

Another question, the OM was a friend and has a store 10 mins away from where I work. I've wanted to go beat him up, but realize it won't achieve anything. Will talking to him or warning him to stay away from her (stop e-mailing) achieve anything?

Sounds like a classic case.


I thought "conservatives" eschewed judging. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

What would you prefer - maybe a tougher job at recovery, or no chance at recovery?

If the affair is still ongoing - which it sounds like it is - exposure is your only weapon. Will it end without further exposure? Maybe. How long are you willing to wait to find out?

Because affairs thrive in secrecy. In many ways, it is part of what makes them exciting. In truth, affairs are something to be ashamed of and your WW knows this. Once exposed, affairs look just like what they are, tainted, ugly, immoral activities.

Exposing the affair is one of the most powerful tools you have in ending the affair. Use it.

Who

So how should I approach exposure? Do I tell her what I intend to do, or do I just go ahead and tell her family and friends? I'm already dreading the backlash from this...

To forewarn is to forearm...no warning just do it, and do it all at once.

She be shocked and mad. She'll tell you you've crossed an imaginary line and there is NO reconciliation to be had. You'll second guess whether you did a good thing. You'll regret it for a few days or a week. But in the end...you will be proud of yourself and see it was the best thing you could have done for your family at the time.

Good luck...there is no courage in talking about...the courage is in the doing. There are numerous "exposure 101" type threads on this very board. Seek them out...read them...post your plan and do it tonight or tomorrow.

Mr. Wondering

If the A is still going on then exposure is something you do without warning her. If you warn her then she has a chance to spin the story to her favor and make you look bad. Let her friends and family know of the A. Tell them how you found out and what is still going on. The point of exposure is similar to an intervention... the more support from loved ones the better chance you have to making it to recovery.

I'm of the take that exposure is needed...TO END THE AFFAIR.

If you are convinced that the affair is truly ended...that NC is established and in place, and you have reasonable expectations that she's gotten to a point where it will stay in place, then personally I would hold off on exposing.

If you find that contact resumes...if you even have a reasonable belief that it has....THEN expose.

Exposing when your spouse is NOT in contact and the affair has ended will end up being seen by your spouse as a major LB...especially if they know that they HAVE been sticking to what they're supposed to be doing.

This may not be completely MB advice, so take that advice with this in consideration.

Myself, if you truly feel the A is over at this point, I'd save it as a trump card to head off the A IF it resumes.

Owl: “Myself, if you truly feel the A is over at this point, I'd save it as a trump card to head off the A IF it resumes.”

To me, this sounds an awful lot like closing the barn door after the horses are gone. In fact, it's an internally inconsistient statement.

Depending, of course, on the circumstances of the A (such as an LTA, a Type II entangled affair, previous D-Days with no lasting effect, to a drunken ONS) and to whom you are thinking of exposing (close family, in-laws, workplace, full-page ad in the local paper) exposure might still be a good thang.

Added: Almost always, expose to OP's spouse.

The above considerations are just some of the indicators MB marriage coaches use to recommend exposure, or not, even if it looks like the A is over. The A might indeed be over - for now.

After all, you never really know for sure, do you?

I would like to point out oodles of A’s have restarted after a long hiatus. There are threads galore in the archives about unexposed A’s restarting years later after inadvertent contact.

Even if the A appears to be over, exposure can be looked upon as an insurance policy. It forces least some FWS to look at the A in the cold light of day. It helps hasten withdrawal, it helps prevents accidental recurrence and, not least adds some measure of emotional assurance for the BS.

This last benefit should not be discounted out of hand. If the BS is at all concerned the A could restart, exposure is a good thing for the BS’s personal recovery, period.


Owl: “Exposing when your spouse is NOT in contact and the affair has ended will end up being seen by your spouse as a major LB...especially if they know that they HAVE been sticking to what they're supposed to be doing.”

Again, what if the Bs does not “know” this, even if it’s true?

As an aside, and not to start an argument - IMO, there are way too many posts lately that imply the BS must be perfect. They cannot make any LB mistakes at all, for some weird reason. I get the impression lately around here WS and FWS can make all the mistakes they want in the A and in recovery, from having unprotected SF and even an OC to nearly endless withdrawal and LB 'till the horses do come home, but the BS must step ever so carefully through the minefield of recovery no matter what, or failure is his fault alone. Even exposure is denied the BS when it would benefit their personal recovery.

All benefits of all actions and inactions to the FWS. None whatsoever to the BS. That’s what some recient threads seems to be saying to me.

Something to think about: Sometimes exposure, even if the A seems to be ended and NC seems to be in place, just plain helps the BS feel safer. Yet that seems to carry little weight around here lately.

IMO, it is mildly disrespectful to the FWS on MB who do get it to universally claim the BS is LB’ing if they expose after the A has ended if it’s something the BS needs to start recovery. FWS who get it seem to know this.

The whole truth always sets everyone free. Always.

With prayers,

You're right...you might not 'KNOW' that it's over. And I probably should amend what I said to read "if you have any reason to suspect that the affair is still ongoing, expose".

From my perspective, exposing an affair when the WS ISN'T in contact and has truly taken active measures to reconcile and end the affair could very likely set the stage for a lot of bitterness and resentment and anger...and it's hard to counter-balance that with the benefits of exposing. Again, exposing should always be done with the intent to end the affair and build the marriage. The communication to the people exposed to should be clearly explaining that this is not in revenge or anger, but in an effort to assist the WS in reconciling the marriage.

How do you get that same message across if the WS is NOT engaged in an affair?

And if the BS needs exposure to feel safe? BS wanting/needing to feel safe is no more irrational than WS having an A in the first place, isn't it?

I am trying to get newbies to see exposure can prevent even an already ended A's recurrance just as well as it can end an ongoing one.

And, so sorry, but I can't pass this up: "...exposing an affair when the WS ISN'T in contact and has truly taken active measures to reconcile and end the affair could very likely set the stage for a lot of bitterness and resentment and anger..."

And what about the BS's personal recovery? What anger and bitterness has the BS? None? Why is the BS the one who must act with total perfection in all things recovery?

If exposure eases BS anger and bitterness, the truly repentant FWS should welcome it. It's a litmus test, of a sort, for FWS who actually get it.

With prayers,

Added: It could be strongly argued the truly 100% remorseful and repentant FWS would totally expose one’s self.

Well, no one welcomes pain and anguish and embarassment. I cannot possibly imagine ANY circumstance where a WS/FWS would WANT to have their indiscretions aired in front of the people who matter to them. This is one reason why you never reason with a WS about exposure...you just do it.

And realize that I AM in favor of exposure...for the reasons cited here on this site.

Why does H say to expose? To end the affair.

I've not seen anything else on there about it making the BS feel better. And the BS had better way the benefits and consequences very carefully in exposing a spouse who HAS ended the affair.

I'm an ex BS, as I'm sure that you can tell from my signature. My wife actually didn't get crazy with me when I exposed, like I've seen happen with other posters here. BUT...had I exposed AFTER the affair had ended, there would have been no convincing her that it was done out of love, out of an effort to protect our marriage. It would have ONLY been taken as an attack, as retaliation, and would have solved nothing but set the recovery process back massively.

I see your point...but this coin has two sides, totally unlike truly exposing to END the affair. That is clear cut and up front. Exposing for any other reason doesn't appear to be covered anywhere on the material site that I've seen. Yes, it can prevent a relapse, and that's mentioned...but I don't see anything indicating that you should expose for that reason solely.

You keep saying if the A is over.

A drunken ONS, hadn’t happened in 20 years of M and will most likely never happen again – I agree no exposure beyond OP's spouse is probably sufficient.

LTA with previous D-Days - but A looks to be ended, yet again? Serial philanderer - begging for another chance? How do you not know it’s all just dormant? It may be simply an expedient WS?

Exposing widely is one way to find out.

If BS feels safer exposing – I say go for it. And if FWS can't handle it, they aren't really ready for recovery anyway. IMO.

Again, I point you to the archives. You will run across countless A's that ended, were never exposed, and restarted later. Sometimes years later. Bottom line: there were no serious consequences to the FWS.

Lack of exposure is interpreted in part as getting away with it by some FWS.

With prayers,

Well, we'll chalk this one up to agreeing to disagree. We've both made our point, and hopefully haven't confused anyone else with our discussion. Thanks for sharing your viewpoint, and allowing me to share mine.

Owl,

One last observation, from RL – perhaps it may explain where I am coming from. (I am not trying to get the last word in.)

My thesis for JFO’s is: It is better to expose, even if by all indications the A is over, except in rare situations where it is clear beyond the shadow of a doubt serious personal damage to the FWS would occur. (And embarrassment is not serious personal damage. Loss of their job is not serious personal damage, either. Strong suicidal tendencies are, though.)

Notice I did not say damage to the M. A restarted A, or a new A, even years later causes much worse M damage than any exposure will ever cause.

Exposure and degree of exposure is a complicated cost-benefit analysis. But since a JFO is hardly in a position to learn linear algebra and decision theory over night the next best thing is to learn from the successes and mistakes of those of us who have been through it.

After D-Day 1 FWW and I went through the typical wild recovery ride. This was before I read SAA/HNHN. Long before I found MB.

I did not expose. Partly out of concern for her reputation, her very strong desire for me not to, and my own reputation. Partly out of fear of the backlash if I did. And partly to protect DS.

As you write, I was absolutely positive the A was over. I searched. I asked. I prayed. I put my spousal radar on high gain. Nothing. I judged FWW’s rivers of tears of remorse to be genuine.

So I did not expose. It really, really did look like it ended cold turkey right after D-Day. I was totally convinced. MC was even convinced, eventually, and said I needed to let it go. So I did. I literally bet my life and future happiness on not exposing.

Well, you already know the rest of the story. Her A had just gone further underground. It went on for another five years, in fact.

Owl, I should have exposed on general principles! OM even told me after D-Day 2 he would have ended it way back then, had I exposed.

There are strong, proven reasons with long track records exposure is recommended as the normal course of treatment unless specifically contraindicated. Only one of these reasons is to end the A, as you agree. Another is to prevent another A. To shine light on the entire WS lifestyle.

And it also serves as a very good insurance premium for the BS, no matter what FWS appears to be doing or not doing. It helps the BS feel safer.

It also teaches consequences for WS actions. It helps FWS learn!

IMO, if everyone knows the truth about everything all the time, there will be very few A’s in the first place. Absolute transparency in our lives is a well proven ethical concept, Owl.

And I repeat: The truly 100% remorseful FWS would out themselves, to the world if need be, anyway.

I refuse to live with anyone’s, anyone’s at all, dirty secrets any more. Hiding a spouse’s A from friends and family is a barrier to true intimacy with everyone involved. Just imagine the continual fear of a slip-up. Knowing something dirty about your spouse they don’t. It is a barrier to intimacy with your children, your friends and your extended family - and it is a barrier to intimacy between you and your spouse as well. It’s almost as bad for your marital health as hiding a long ago A from one’s spouse in the first place.

From now on, I will shine the light of total transparent truth not just on the fungus, but on the places where fungus grows.

With prayers,

I exposed to my WHs family, my family, the OW's friends and even her minister( a very close personal friend of her parents). I really think that the exposure and the pressure from her kids and ours finally forced her to give up on my H. Possibly, a little bit of dealing with my H fence sitting marathon did a lot to ease her ardor.

The backlash... a few people who think I am nuts for wanting to work on my M. One extremely pissed off WH. And I am still dealing with some of the backlash with a foggy, withdrawing addict, guilt ridden FWS. He is having such a hard time with the whole trust issue and the loss of respect from his kids and friends that he doesn't know if he can work on the marriage. Hence, we are seperated, again.

Loni