Hi All,

We had a nice weekend. I'm bumping this up - almost didn't find our thread. Hope all went well with everyone.

I've got a lot of things to do. This Friday I'll be out - have to go to my old boss' Memorial Service. Poor woman died of Pancreatic Cancer - always fatal. I worked for her for 11 years. She went to the doctor cause she was having stomach aches - found out she had 6 months to live!

We should all enjoy life while we can - you never know what tomorrow will bring. Very gloomy here today - raining "cats and dogs". We had nice weather on the weekend - except yesterday afternoon we had a downpour - but by night time it cleared up.

Afternoon everyone!

Okay, this is so odd! There are June posts on here that I didn't see when I posted last week--and I posted on the 6th before I went to Idaho for the weekend to see my parents, and that post isn't on here. Strange . . .

HF- I completely agree with the others here on the MC issue. To say there are no "core" issues and just dismiss the A because "he's here now" is ludicrous. A's don't materialize out of nothing! And, from the BS point of view, the most pro-active thing any of us can do is to figure out what the core issues are so we can address them. Otherwise, we have bailed out the sinking ship without bothering to plug up the hole. Pointless.

And forgiveness is a process, I think, not an event. I will always have memories of what has happened to my marriage, but one day I will look back and not feel the hurt. I think that's part of the journey to forgiving our WH's. It seems like a long way off, but at the beginning, I couldn't imagine not being angry. Yet at some point, I realized that I'm not angry anymore. Just disappointed. And very, very hurt. But as F&L says--time is a great healer.

Anyhow, I promised a review of my "Kama Sutra" book, and I finished it last night, so here it goes: The full title is "The Complete Idiot's Guide to the Kama Sutra" (should anyone wish to find it on Amazon. . .). It is very interesting, and goes way beyond just a discussion about SF. It has some philisophy in comparing the Hindu view of sex as compared to the Western view. It talks about relationship building, and romance. And, SF, of course. I thought it had lots of good ideas that would probably be healthy for any couple to look at. Much of it ran parallel to the MB principles, which I thought was interesting. Although it did talk about maintaining your individuality as part of your relationship--while MB focuses more on encouraging a partnerhsip in as many activities as possible. Personally, I think I come out more on the "Kama Sutra" side. I have always believed that maintaining an activity or interest that is completely separate from my M is a healthy thing--party of retaining who I am. But I do see Dr. Harley's point that you are opening yourself up to sparking a relationship with another person by doing this. I guess there needs to be some sort of balance there.

Anyway, I highly recommend the book. Just remember, it is not just a dirty picture book--you do need to actually read it! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I hope all had a good holiday!

-C

CSJ
But it does have dirty pictures right? Just kidding!!!! It sounds interesting I may have to check it out.

Thanks for your input on the MC. We actually just cancelled tomorrows ssession which I am glad about. I just dont see it going anywhere. We are having the same fights we have had for years and I realize it all has to do with him putting himself first. He has always done this...always. The A happpened because of this. He is this way I believe because his mother was over indulgent trying to make up for her not being able to have children (he is adopted). He feels like he was abandoned and has to grab all the fun he can fit into his life because of it....not that there are any core issues.

We NEVER EVER talk about him being adopted and have not talked about it in MC for sure. He never even told me about it until we were about to get engaged and we had known each other for 5 years! Not that he has an issue with that or anything. He said then he thought I knew since all his friends knew. It is just not discussed. He feels funny or ashamed I guess.

I do feel there are core issues and I resent the MC acting like I should just get on with it. One thing I do know is that when I look back on what he did and how he acted for that period of time surrounding the A it was like he was sick. I know...I mean I feel it that he is better now but I cant trust my feeling because clearly I have been wrong in the past.

We have been fighting since the weekend. It just doesnt seem to me that we get enough time together. He is always over committed to volunteer stuff and I really feel hurt by it. I know its stuff for the kids but I need him to be with me. I keep telling him this and he keeps saying he will find time but then he comes home and says oh the guys are going out here are the kids and can I go? Sometimes I really dont mind but when we havent spent time together for a while I do. It hurts and I am sick of being hurt.

Well I hope everyone is ok. I need to go make dinner now since I have been procrastinating. Take care!
HF

You're darn tootin' it does!

I'm glad you're not going back to that counselor--what kind of rotten advice is that, anyway? Just get over it. If it were that easy, then I guess none of us would need counseling in the first place!

I think the selfishness thing is a core issue for all of our husbands. I have hit against that many, many times. There just isn't much compromise with my H. And this personality trait of his didn't really bother me before, because we are both very independant people. But it really seems like it has gotten worse since his A. I think that year he spent messing around on me did a real number on him. I think he really did convince himself that he can do what he wants, when he wants. And I am NOT going to stomp and cry and beg for him to spend time with me! I want him to WANT to be with me--not schedule some time so I'll stop nagging.

And I agree with what F&L has pointed out before--to a certain extent, people are who they are. I think my H is always going to be a little selfish. He was raised by a very controlling, dominant mother (who I get along with just fine--she's always been great to me) and so his "independance" is a big issue for him. I am not going to change that, and I don't think MC would change it either. But I think it can be softened--it's just going to take some work. And some time. And it will have to happen because he makes that choice.

Anyway, that's the way I'm approaching it. Gradual changes, little by little.

I hope all is well--I'll check back later!

-C.

Hoping For,

I mentioned before that if you were going to the MC all this time, you should have seen some kind of positive results - if not - the MC is not right for you. Also, him being adopted may have some bearing on his actions. I'm surprised this was not brought out in your MC sessions. Are you going to another MC?

Believe it or not, it's still only 7 months since your D-Day - my husband and I were still fighting like cats and dogs at that time. So, you are not being abnormal. Some couples just take more time than others and some couples just can't help but have fights - boy, do I know. Everyone always says you aren't supposed to argue, but sometimes it's just too hard to avoid it.

The husbands just don't understand how we feel when we are left alone at this point in time. But, you too have to understand you want your husband so close to you all the time because of what happened. Normally, you probably wouldn't care if he left and went and did other things. This is the way he feels - he feels things are back to normal - why shouldn't he go back to doing what he did before. You can tell him this till your blue in the face - but, they won't/can't understand how you feel.

Don't be upset.....things will get better.....this weekend was just a "down point". You'll get back up again.

Take care....

HF-

I agree with F&L about the "down point." There are so many ups and downs! I feel like my H and I go for a week or two and are doing really well--I start patting myself on the back feeling like we are on the right track. And then we get in a funk again. That's how I've been feeling for the past few days. H hasn't been very talkative--rather withdrawn. I think he may be in his Mars/Venus cave. I get so frustrated. But I can see why Dr. H says it takes at least 2 years to really heal. We;ve all got to just keep at it--pace ourselves.

I'll check back later!

-C.

Hi everyone
Well our rough spots continue here. I caught H deceiving me on something he promised he would not do (non sex related) and I left in my pjs the night before last. I drove around for an hour or so with no where to go stopping every now and then to write him nasty letters in my notebook. All the while he was texting me saying he was ashamed of himself and please come home yada yada yada.

Finally I calmed down pulled over and wrote a list of demands to him if we are going to work thing that are non negotioable. Like no friendships with women, no lies/white lies/half truths/deception, I want a new MC, I want him to be unselfish and put me first before himself...like if there is something he wants to do he needs to consider me and how much time we have been able to spend together before he takes off again. Something I have been fighting for since we ahve been together.

That night he says ok we will get a new MC no problem. I promise I will never deceive you again ever (ya right but at least he thinks he wont) but I have always been selfish and a leopard cant change his spots. Last night he had dinner with an older woman he used to work for. She was specifically named in my no friendship list. Not because I am suspicious I am just not keen on him hanging with other women no matter how old or unattractive to him they may be.

I am just disgusted and sad and at the end of my rope. One side of me thinks if I could just forgive him we could have it all but I dont want to let him off so easily. I am still really pi$$ed! He told me yesterday I am pushing him away and I know from the way he is acting he is rebeling against me but I cant stop. I just want him to beg forgiveness 24/7 and he has been under this microscope for 7 months.

I know he has valid points. Ugh! How is everyone else? Has anyone heard from Mama? I will check back later hope everyone is doing well.
HF

Hoping For,

I know I haven't posted in a while, but I've been busy and this darn internet doesn't work half of the time.

I'm sorry you are having such a difficult time. I told you once before, you can't change these guys completely - thus a leapard can't changed his spots. I've learned to bite my tongue on certaing things, because I realize it's a loosing battle. I could rant and rave, fight, yell till I'm blue in the face and my husband will not change. I'm trying to lean to accept that - or else we will not survive.

Was this other older woman a work associate? If so, you can't stop him from seeing her. There comes a point where you have to try and trust him. My husband has been working late so many nights on his new job - I don't like it - I am suspicious, but I have to stop at some point and accept that he is telling me the truth. I do not want to go thru what I went before, but if I get any inkling of something wrong - this time I will react.

I know it's hard, but you have to give your husband some slack or he will go the opposite way. Believe me I was the same way as you. Your mind works overtime - you say things you don't mean - you don't think clearly - if you want this to work out - you have to give also. Go to a new MC - I think your old one did nothing - in my opinion. Couples have worked out in much worse situations than yours. Be patient - I know that's hard - but it pays off.

Hoping For.....CSJ and MamaFish and I have been e-mailing each other personally. We've built up a wonderful friendship and converse almost daily. I'd like you to join me - I know you'd like to remain discrete - but if you'd like - just post back and we could. If not I will understand. I get more satisfaction talking to CSJ and MamaFish than anyone else on MB, and I think you would too.
I don't post to anything else but the CSJ thread - too depressing to look at other threads.

I've been having so much trouble with the internet. I think it's just the 3 of us that really talk to each other. I'm the only one that doesn't work so I'm home most of the time. Just post me and we can talk.

Yes let me know how we can exchange emails

Hoping For,

Talk to you tomorrow...Got your e-mail