I see the "wearing sexy clothes" post has gotten a lot of views. The reason I seemed not willing, is because it was more of a demand/control thing with him. When someone says to you "I told you a year ago you needed to do something about your weight, and you did! You gained 10 more lbs. You really need to do something, I'm not going to have a 200lb wife!" Or "You know how unattractive it is to see your belly hanging down when you are on top riding me?" No kidding, he actually said these things to me. Then there are other things that were said and done but won't go into detail. These really attacked me sense of being and I am just not getting past the hurt. My therapist said these are very legitimate reasons to get divorced. He has made progess, but still there are issues and my tollerance level is zero. It's getting to were I feel like nothing he does will make me love him again. To much has been said and done. All he has to do is raise his voice and the hair on my neck starts to rise.

Anyone have their marriage come back after having this abuse go on for 16yrs?

I'm sorry you're having to listen to such hateful comments from someone who is supposed to love you. He sounds very selfish. Unfortunately, I don't know if I can offer more than sympathy. If he is trying, then I would say give him a window of time to make a certain amount of improvement. If he hasn't improved, then more seriously consider divorce. I believe that with time, you do stand a chance of finding love and trust again, but he really has to stop the verbal abuse before either stands a chance. And you definitely deserve better!

My sister endured this kind of abuse from her husband for 23 years. Her husband finally left her for another woman, to which we all said, "Good riddance!"

Good luck to you.

Kay,

I'm concerned about you. Since last August, you've begun threads relating to your marriage--about his abuse, use of porn webcams, your inappropriate discussions and online which you stopped, your H's pledge to make you eat crow, DJs, leaving your children for a trial seperation, and now, that your IC supports your decision to leave. This has been a long seven months for you.

And you're back...but I don't see what changes you implemented, how much you read up on this website about Lovebusters (LBs), The Love Bank, Emotional Needs (ENs)...nor on each thread did you come back to it, answering, asking, as each poster gave you their opinion...each time, I believe, you trailed off...no one was telling you what you wanted to hear...they were wasting their time. Diamond told you what the path ahead would look like. Seemed to really get your attention.

You did not begin any thread with the VE Abuse before. You mentioned the sexy clothing requirement, along with the porn issue, which Jaye Mathisen advised you to study and read up on Sexual Addiction so that you could have choices and know what you were facing in your marriage.

Did you do that? How about from Worthatry (WAT)...he asked you some really serious questions...I would like to see your answers. He asked you how long you were in an affair and you said that wasn't the case...he said he believed you, but you didn't respond to his last post.

You and I were married the same year...I'm older, but that was my year, also. I know what it is to abuse and be abused. Ours led to affairs...and my FWH is an SA...it encompasses a lot more than sex...it really is about secrets, pain distraction, addiction and needs as much understanding and attention as an alcoholic. You would be a part of that.

Back to where your power is...you say your H has made progress but that your tolerance level is zero. I take that to mean you know this is about you, not him. When he says hurtful statements, are you taking them as the truth or his truth?

Have you been reading books on VE Abuse? Finding out the dance within your marriage, that you have a part and he has a part...defining your boundaries and committing to enforcing them, lovingly, for both yourself and your marriage.

Too much has been said and done...by both of you. You only can control you...no one else. Your obligation to yourself is to look at your resentments, you chose to create them and hold onto them...this is pile over your love, joy, and being able to feel loved. Clearing off this part within you would be essential to have a thriving marriage.

I hope you continue to post to this thread. To stay here and learn...so many others are in your shoes, know your pain, and many have found their answers and have great marriages now. They know a lot more than when they came here.

LA

I have read the previous posts but some seemed to directed to others who posted replies. I'll have to re-read them because I didn't notice any particular questions that really stood out to me.

Progress I've made, after reading the book The Verbally Abusive Relationship, I saw a lot of what was happening to me in that book. It put into words how I feel and that it is a result of verbal abuse.

I do tend to get a litte lost by so many abbreviations that people use. I would assume IC means my therapist that I've been seeing?

You're right, I feel like it's the same crap just different month. We'll go a few weeks even a month now before things rise to the surface again.

Thank you for replying here. And for not taking my post as a bash against you...support can look like that when you feel bashed all over.

Yes, the book you read was the one I was thinking of. Were you surprised by some of it? What else did you learn from it? Did your H read it?

There's an abbreviations list in the Infidelity Just Found Out forum...first post. Our acronyms really work on a variety of levels, and yes, were difficult to get used to in the beginning. I was wondering if you read when you weren't posting?

I have something useful, I believe, to share with you. Your statement "It put into words how I feel and that it is a result of verbal abuse" brought this to mind.

What you feel is not a result of verbal abuse directly. Our emotions are information given to us from our beliefs. Each time your H has stated something that didn't meet your expectation or crossed your boundary of consideration, you've felt pain. It came from your belief that you were the cause of what he felt...that if you were different, he wouldn't feel or think that way. You have beliefs that say you're the cause, control and cure of others. We were raised this way...statements from our parents, "Oh! You make me so mad!" Sad, disappointed, happy, proud...etc.

God didn't make humans with super powers. That's why they're called super powers. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> He only gave us control over ourselves and no one else. We cannot make anyone anything. They have choice; we have choice. You can believe and live that belief, if you choose, but then you wouldn't know you were choosing it, right?

You are. You choose your beliefs. An important part of the pain from V&E is our self-betrayal...if we believe we can stop it, change the other person, make them feel or think differently...and we don't...then we are betraying ourselves. When we get what our limits are as human beings, well, that portion of the pain stops.

When you have no part in the abuse, then you have no power. Have you found out what your part is? Where your choices are/were? Breaking the cycle only takes one person...not two. "Dance of Anger" would be a great one on your list.

Is your IC (yes, individual counselor) having you read these books? What others has he/she recommended? What do you think of a counselor saying you have legitimate reasons to divorce? Was that what you were looking for? What are you looking for?

Would you like to be free of your resentments? Show yourself all of your power and change your beliefs? You've had these beliefs long before H...they are deep and a lot of them are hidden. Changing our actions will not change our lives unless we see our expectations and resentments and begin not choosing to create them. You keep experiencing the past over and over again in your present. Like reicing a white cake doesn't make it chocolate.

I'm having a bad analogy day. Great news...same crap different month doesn't have to keep happening. First, you stop adding to the crap! LOL

You can do this, Kay. You have an amazing life ahead if you do.

LA
LA

Yes the councelor told me to read the book and I did have him read the parts I tagged that applied to how I felt and what I was going to discuss with the IC. He said it was hard to read, brought tears to his eyes and said that he has been really bad.

After reading the book, I realized I don't want to learn to ignore or how to respond to his attacks. It's just emotionally draining. Plus he has said I need to change also. I say "no" there is nothing wrong with me. I felt he had to change because the way he talked to me, no one should behave that way.

I think I'm going to get splinters pretty soon from sitting on the fence for so long!! Deep down inside I know what I have to do, that's leave. I'm selling my self esteem for money security that he offers.

Other tough questions in the book that shed some light for me was:

What does he bring to the relationship? money&security were at the top of the list

Is there a best-friend like quality to your relationship? A big NO there, That was an eye opening question there.

What would be missing if he was gone? Money, someone to fix things around the house, etc.

Sorry to hear that, Kay. If there is nothing you own in your marriage, your part, then there is no help.

I'm sorry for your life ahead of you, too. So sorry.

And when you are in another abusive relationship in a year, or two, and your children feel abandoned...because no VE abuser only abuses his wife...he does his children...and you can't believe you threw away a marriage where you were only the victim but now realize how much power you had...my heart will break again for you.

Now it breaks for your H...your children...his tears and the rivers that will be theirs because you have no part, no choice but to sacrifice and suffer.

Did you do the EN questionnaires? Financial Security is an emotional need...not anything to scoff at. It is YOUR need and you aren't imprisoned by your own needs. They are yours. Family Commitment? Acts of Service as your love language? Any of these hitting a bell inside of you?

Your ignorance is costly. Your H owned his part. He asked you to own yours. You won't. You are not in a very adult place right now. You are in a punishing, withdrawing, demanding, entitled place right now...

which is why WAT asked if you were having an affair...I believe you are...with a figment of your imagination. There's a would-be guy in your head...you believe you picked the wrong person at this point...and this would-be guy is waiting for you to meet all your expectations, would think nothing of meeting your needs, cherishing you, protecting you...but even him, this would-be guy, can't protect you from your choices.

They're yours. He doesn't exist. Just your belief that he does remains. Replacing your H won't fix the problem. And you don't want to learn how to respond to VE, or to own your boundaries, enforce them or live respectfully.

Which means you aren't willing to love or cherish yourself.

Such a shame. Darn shame. Love is a choice. From your resentment, nay, hatred, you are choosing to destroy so many lives and call it what you deserve.

Best friend quality...are you a best friend to H? I don't think so. I think you were...and he has remorse and wants to be your best friend again, with the woman you were. Not now, though. This is an entitled woman, a wayward woman, being owed when she chose it herself...

Best friends do not comfort or condone destructive behaviors...they call each other on them...they are open, honest, loyal, believe the best, stay in the worst and continue to love through it. They hurt each other, amend the past and live in the present. Best friends bring out the best in you.

Do yourself a favor and get a REAL IC...

LA

Apology for my last post.

On the drive home after work, I realized that I was listening to your words, not your actions.

You didn't come to MarriageBuilders to get permission to leave your marriage. You didn't go to IC to get permission, either. Part of you very much wants to know why you're unhappy, abused, dead emotionally and want to leave. It was the other part my previous post targeted.

You have your internal struggle...and the other part blames FS and FC...twisting those needs into chains. To own that your H does meet your ENs would give the other part of you a reason to look within.

I couldn't see that because my own experience of finding MB was shaking, in tears, typing into a search engine "save my marriage." There were days after I struggled, with those same two parts of myself...but what brought me here, God's guidance, wasn't what brought you. My bad.

I'm sorry.

LA

I am married 22 years to my husband, and almost within first 6 months I probably should have left, and gotten a divorce. For some unknown reason, I am still with him. And the thing is it is now too late for me, or I feel it is. !!!!!!!!!!!!!! Our first few years, he was extremely verbal abusive. Calling me names, saying I was repulsive to look at. I started withdrawing into a shell. He was in the army, went overseas, and would call me on the phone and curse me out for whatever went wrong. We retired, and within a few months, he told me he thought he was in love with a long time family friend of the family, did not what he wanted me to do, except cry. She was in her 30's as we were in our 40's. Finally, after all this, I continue with draw into myself, until we exploded. We started going to marriage counselor, and within a few months from there, he found someone to have an affair with, she is 38,married with 3 small children, he is 54. We have a 16 year old daughter together. The affair is over, she asked for no contact, and within 10 days he called her again, just to see how she is doing as they are just friends. So, I went to verbal abuse to mental, and verbal abuse. If he continues my advice is leave. I am 56, If I was 36 or just 40 or so, I would leave, especially if I could take care of myself financially. I depend on his income, it is really a sad situation, I stay for security, the trust, love and caring is somewhere, lost, we are going to counselor, but who knows? Good luck. But just remember you are a good person, and no one deserves to be put down.

I felt really attacked by your post. I am really confused as to why I don't feel happy about him trying to change his ways. I think because when he does become VA again, he means what he says at the time. It keeps happening and I get all upset again, and say this is the last straw (to myself)

I feel bad for what it would put the kids through, but I've spoke with couselors here at work and they say kids are not "doomed" to a bad life if their parents divorce.

That is very sad. I don't understand why anyone would stay in such a relationship. My dad treated my mom this way, and I remember as a child praying that they would get a divorce. I put up with stuff from my husband that I'd rather not put up with, but I'd never put up with being treated like that. Security is one important element of a strong marital foundation, but it cannot hold it all on its own. What you describe sounds more like blackmail. Surely there are other options? 56 is nowhere near the end of the road. Whether it be with your WS or without him, you deserve some happiness!

I am feeling like 40 is to old to start over again. It gets really confusing when after a blow up, he is all nicey nice again until something else comes up. I'm having such a hard time deciding when is enough, enough. The therapist says it takes time to rebuild, but it's been 2 yrs.

Two years is a long time, but only you can decide when enough is enough. He's nice after a blow-up because he feels guilty, but you know that. Has he ever taken an anger management class? That can help short-circuit blow-ups. But it sounds to me like his problem runs deeper than that. At any rate, 40 is not too late to make a better life. It's never too late! VL