I don't feel lucky at the moment. Sorry to hear of your situation. She made an unwise choice. I know it's only been a day but I can't get the image out of my head. Will it ever fully go away?

betrayed,

Having talked with your W abit, I can answer a few of the things you asked. You asked

You don't feel it now but you will in a few months. Her answers will be very liberating for you as well. And what you don't see but will see that is she will pay a very very high price for what she has done, especially if you decide to stay and love her. You have no idea, but you will see it soon enough. Her guilt will be a huge issue as time goes on. In fact it will be the one things you will have to address to really rebuild your marriage. Interesting isn't it?


Ok, let me express to you my understanding of what she has said here. I told her you would feel this way. In fact I just reiterated this on her thread not a half hour ago. You are very normal so don't let this get you down. I know, easier said than done.

But, please ask her about this and really really talk about it. She gave me and others the impression, that what she did was about her need or interest in other sexual activities (to keep this generic). Her problem was/is that she felt dirty doing these things. With OM that would be exciting since she was already making a mess of things. But, more importantly she did not worry about what HE would think about her. You on the other hand, she really worried about what you would think about her. She feared if she expressed some of her desires to you, that you would think less of her. Further in her mind a good W did NOT think or do these things.

Sound a bit messed up? Well, duh! It is. But, this does have certain logic to it. If you had expressed an interest in these activities she might not of done them because she did not want to diminish your opinion of her. If she expressed such interests, she feared what you would think of her. So she had an affair. Does this make sense? Not realy does it. But, talk to her about this. I think you will eventually find this had little to do with you, but more about her hangups and fears.

However, if some if not all of her actions are of interest to you, then I think you two need to openly talk about these things. It was something she was very unwilling to do before, and perhaps you were as well. But, the subject is on the floor now, so discuss these things. You two just might find, that you will learn something about each other that will lead to a better relationship with one another.

B38, remember this. Recovery is all about what you can learn and make use of in the future. Don't be afraid or embarrassed to ask and talk about this and be open with her.


I think your sentiments are very good. You should NEVER forget what has happened in your marriage, never. But, what you will find if you are of good heart is that the feelings that are now attactched to these memories will fade. You would be wise to not attack her with what she has done. She has a memory as well, and it will haunt her even if you never mention it again.

Don't forget, or you could be condemned to learn the lessons of this mess again. But, allow the feelings to fade. Now they are strong and they hurt, and you two do need to discuss them, look at them and allow them to heal. I know you are very early in this about as you can allow her to help you. Ask her to talk about what she felt and feels, and don't attack her for it. As she talks, you learn many things, but you will also allow her to heal. She needs to do the same thing for you.


Ah B38, the universal question and quandary. I think I have sort of answered this for you, but you need to hear it from her and talk about it. If my answer to you has merit with respect to her desires and her feelings about what is "dirty" and what is not, then as you talk with her, you BOTH will learn alot from each other, and you just may find she will now do these things with you, IF you want her to, AND she feels you will love and respect for doing them.

She was safe doing them with OM, she did NOT care about him, although she felt she did and she wanted to please him. Deep down she did not care, that is why she has been able to drop him. Your opinion of her counts for so much more, because deep down she needs YOUR approval.

This will be an area where a good Marriage counselor can help you, unravel all of this. But, do talk to her about this. And make sure you express to her your feelings of hurt and loss of self-confidence. She needs to see your soul B38.

God Bless,

JL

PS: The images will go away, but it will take many months.

Well it's been a couple of days and the shock is staring to wear off, but each bit of information I get the the more disgusted i get. I go from one extreme to another. The last couple of days she (W) has been walking around our house like everything is ok now that she told me. She told me yesterday that she had a great day which totally ticked me off. I realize that she is allowed to have good days and she has done nothing but think about what she has done 24/7. But for me, every day when I think i'm having a good day, I think about what she did to this om and I just fall deeper into a hole. People at my job don't know but they sense something is different. I so want to make this work out for us, and I'm in it for the long haul, but in a strange way I feel she hasn't suffered like i've been suffering. I can't help but think about what she did to the om the next time we make love (which won't be for a while, i assure you). I'm just confused as to why him and not me.

First you have to realize that no one can understand the terrible pain of betrayal until they have been through it. Your wife has no clue. I read her threads and see that she thinks she knows, but she has no idea at all.

As far as sex, I think I would ask her. See what she says.
Also, it is more healthy to resume the SF as long as she has been tested for STD's. You may think you don't feel like it, but getting back to intimacy will help you heal.

Betrayed,

Well, don't think too much about the "why him and not me". There is no logic to that one. She messed up plain and simple and she KNOWS it. As for her good days, let her enjoy them because they will be far and few between. You have no idea how much this will weigh on her mind. And my friend it will get worse for her as it gets better for you.

You said
This is a very very normal feeling and reaction and has been expressed here time and time again. So accept this is how you feel, OK? But, I will tell you this...there is NO WAY she will suffer like you do right now. It is simply impossible for her because she has NOT lost trust in you, she has not been lied to, and further she was not blindsided as you are/were. You are going to have to accept that she can never know what you feel, just as us guys can never understand what women feel when they are pregnant or giving birth.

Interestingly, if you decided on revenge, it still would not feel to her as it did to you, because your revenge would be in response to what she did and she would understand the reasoning you have. You don't understand her reasoning, and frankly a lot of it will remain a mystery, although both you and she should eventually come to understand a bit of the "WHY".

Here is something else you don't see now, but you will see later. She will ALWAYS know what she did. She will ALWAYS carry it with her. It will bother her sometimes when you are loving her soo much, and are sooo good to her. It will bother her when your children start to date and one of them gets dumped by a boy/girl friend, or their marriage is struggling. Betrayed I don't know much, but I do know this...YOU DO NOT WANT TO BE IN YOUR W'S SHOES.

Give this time, you are still sorting out your feelings, your hurts, you insecurities. This takes alot of time, but do let her help you. Answer her questions honestly, but with kindness and gentleness when she asks "how are you doing". She knows you are hurting and she has many fears as do you.

I know it is too soon for you to see, but eventually you will see that she hurt herself worse than she hurt you. She will NEED your help even more than you feel you need help right now. So accept your feelings, talk about your feelings, ask for help, and let time and knowledge heal you.



Nope you sure cannot help this. And you will think about it for a long time. It makes no difference if you decided to stay or go. Frankly you are too early into this to do too much right now. But, for future reference many years ago I read here about a strategy that seemed to help many posters here at that time. The strategy was for lack of a better description called "taking back".

Apparently, this fella had had an affair for a few years. His W wanted to recover the marriage and so did he, but the images were really getting to her. Her strategy was to go with her H and check into every hotel all over the country that her H and OW had been at, and spend the night and rebuild and create new memories. They ate at all of the restuarants as well.

Apart from having to watch their waistlines, <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> this seemed to work for her. When they drove by a hotel her H and OW had done it in, she could and did recall that she had as well. Several other posters tried this strategy and it seemed to work. Not overnight or really quickly, but gradually as they retraced things.

You might want to consider this with your W. You might want to discuss with her, that when you are ready you would like to "take back" these memories and visions and make them your own. Don't rush right out and do this, but consider it carefully. I think it might help you alot, and oddly it will help your W as well.

You don't know it yet, but your recovery of this depends alot on her, as does hers depend on you. You are a team no matter what you decide, so while there are times you may hate her or what she did, hang in there and work with her.

Given what she has posted here, I think you have an excellent opportunity to really recover your marriage and make it something you BOTH will truely cherish. It won't happen over night, and it will take awhile for YOUR healing to really set in. Have patience with yourself on this count.

Please also note that in Harley's experience it takes roughly two years to really recover a marriage. That doesn't mean that things stay the way you feel now, he means many of the triggers, alot of the self-consciousness, the pain, etc will work out of the system in this time, and it takes this long to learn how to relate to one another in better ways.

Please think about this. Your pain is normal. Your confusion is normal. Your doubts are normal, and now you know what the old military acronym SNAFU really means. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Hang in there, keep posting and asking LOTS of questions.

God Bless,

JL

B38 - good to hear from you again. I have been looking out for you. What you are feeling, as horrible as it is, is normal. It won't always be this way. I also had the hardest time at work, feeling shell shocked inside, but needing to pretend everything was ok on the outside. You need to know that you CAN recover. As unlikely as that seems right now. Don't worry too much about how it is all going to work out right now. You only need to get through this one day at a time. And we'll be here to help you every step of the way.

Betrayed...I am sorry you to have fallen a victim of an A. My H also was brave enough to tell me and I was devestated. I felt the same feelings as you. Please do not dwell on who is to blame right now. First you need to talk, talk, talk and have complete honesty. Also, ask your WS that in order to save your M, she must have no contact at all with OM. You cannot not work on rebuilding your M unless OM is completely out of the picture. My H has had no contact with OW since he told me, but she is still trying to contact him, so you will need to be strong and make sure that she is not contacting OM or visa versa. We had to file a RO to get her to leave us alone. Hopefully you will not have to worry about that. This is the best place for advise and support. If you ever feel like talking, just post and you will make friends. People really care about you on this site. They have helped me get through the rough times with their kindness and strength. Good luck, you can do it.

Thanks intention, that makes me feel better. Last night was actually an ok night. After putting the kids to bed my w and I just layed in bed and talked. We both got a lot of things off our chest, especially me. I know how upset she is at herself and is beating herself up. She just has to understand how it will take me longer to understand why she did it.

Beauty, thanks. All we did last night was talk, talk, talk. It's hard for her to have NC because she works with the om, not in the same bldg, but same company. I feel like calling him and let him know that all contact will cease and decist. My w did email him to let him know that FULL disclosure was made to me. Hopefully a RO won't be necessary. Thanks for the words of wisdom, this site has certainly help me vent my anger and find people to talk to.

Your wife needs to never have contact with the OM for any reason. If there is any possibility of contact, she needs to get another job right away. That is right out of the MB rules.

Has she written him a no contact letter? That is also a necessity. It needs to say that she made a terrible mistake, loves you, and will be working on your marriage. She needs to let him know that she wants no contact with him for any reason, forever.

I'm glad you had an ok night and were able to talk. Just remember, this will be a rollercoaster. The next time you are down - remember it won't always be that bad. But you must anticipate many hard times ahead. You mention that it will take you longer to understand why she did it. Allow for the possibility that you may never understand. At some point you might have to surrender your need for understanding to the need to begin recovery. The quest for understanding can sometimes be a very real impediment to recovery.

She has written a NC letter (via email) in which she states that she made a big mistake, loves me and her children and will never make contact with him and he is to never make contact with her for any reason.

Hello,

If the OM is married, it is extremely important that you contact the OM's wife and inform her of the situation. In addition, it is very important for the both of you to be tested for STD's. These are the consequences of having affairs. Please do not neglect the testing. I am guessing they had unprotected sex.

Only os not intercourse. Lucky me.

Hi B38...

Have you called and informed OMW yet? Also B38, how are you doing right now?

Mrs. W

b38, if there is any possibility of contact AT ALL at work, then she should leave that job. And she probably should anyway. She should NEVER EVER see this man again. This is such an important point that I cant begin to express how much grief it will cost you if you don't take this part seriously.

Recovery is impossible unless ALL contact ends because she will not withdraw from the OM. That is about like sending an alcoholic into the bar every day and making him look at a beer all day. The inevitable weak moment hits when no one is looking and he is back to binging again.

Dr. Harley is ADAMANT that all contact cease, even if it involves moving to another state or making a career change.

Secondly, the OM's wife must be told about the affair. She has a right to know so she can have the same opportunity to fix her marriage as you have had. She also needs to know so she can protect herself from your W and her H. Telling the OMW will greatly REDUCE the chances of a resumption with two people watching frm both ends. Resumptions are very common, so don't even play around with this.

Never see or communicate with a former lover

Once an affair is first revealed, whether it's discovered or admitted, the victimized spouse is usually in a state of shock. The first reaction is usually panic, but it's quickly followed by anger. Divorce and sometimes even murder are contemplated. But after some time passes (usually about three weeks), most couples decide that they will try to pull together and save their marriage.

The one having an affair is in no position to bargain, but he or she usually tries anyway. The bargaining effort usually boils down to somehow keeping the lover in the loop. You'd think that the unfaithful spouse would be so aware of his or her weaknesses, and so aware of the pain inflicted, that every effort would be made to avoid further contact with the lover as an act of thoughtfulness to the stunned spouse. But instead, the unfaithful spouse argues that the relationship was "only sexual" or was "emotional but not sexual" or some other peculiar description to prove that continued contact with the lover would be okay.

Most victimized spouses intuitively understand that all contact with a lover must end for life. Permanent separation not only helps prevent a renewal of the affair, but it is also a crucial gesture of consideration to someone who has been through ******. What victimized spouse would ever want to know that his or her spouse is seeing or communicating with a former lover at work or in some other activity?

In spite of career sacrifices, friendships, and issues relating to children's schooling, I am adamant in recommending that there be no contact with a former lover for life. For many, that means a move to another state. But to do otherwise fails to recognize the nature of addiction and its cure.

<snip>

We don't know if R.J. still sees his lover, but he says he has broken off all contact. In many cases where a person is still in town, that's hard to prove. But one thing's for sure, if he ever does see his lover, it will put him in a state of perpetual withdrawal from his addiction, and make the resolution of his marriage essentially impossible. In fact, one of the reasons he is not recovering after three months of separation may be that he is not being truthful about the separation.


entire article at: http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5060_qa.html

Is this possible if they still work together at the same company?

Betrayed,

It is absolutely essential that you both get tested. What in the world makes you think you cannot receive STD's from oral sex? A couple of years ago there was a woman who was forced to inform her husband that she had contacted gonorrhea of the mouth from engaging in oral sex only from her affair partner. Her husband sebsequently divorced her.
Please call you local health clinic and ask them how many STD's a woman can receive by giving oral sex. Herpes and warts are very common. I wish you luck.

Betrayed,

Oh as a follow-up it is never a good idea to accept anything a cheating spouse says as gospel. The majority of the time the cheating spouse will never admit all of the things they sexually engaged in. They will always if forced admit to the lesser of the sexual acts. It is common for them to say they never engaged in sexual intercourse but most of the time it comes out later that they did. You need to protect yourself. Get tested.