http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...;gonew=1#UNREAD

I hope I did that right. Above is the link to my situation. If anyone has any advice/insight I would greatly appreciate it. My H and I have been separated since 1/16 and he has been in NC with MOW for 5 days now & says he knows in his heart that he never wants to see her again and is very happy about that - but now he doesn't know what to do about us - because he has no "in-love" feelings for me. No sexual attraction to me anymore & he just doesn't know what to do. I am so lost. Someone please help me. I don't know what to tell him...he says he doesn't want to hurt me anymore but does not know what to do.

Wanted to also add that he said "I don't want to hurt you anymore - you were my favorite person in the whole world - I will always love you - but those "feelings" are just not there - so what do we do?"

Is there any hope for us? Please someone help me. I am in tears right now.

You know it makes me so mad to see those words, those "in love words"

From what you say here and there ,his love for you has not in all probabilities changed, just his perception of what love is.

Show him.


I bet he is just as scared as you.

Max

Please get the book "his needs, her needs". It will help both of you regain the love you had for each other. The other book that is a must read is "surviving an affair". Both of you have experienced a lot of damage to your relationship. He is going through withdrawal now and his perception of things will change for the better once he has worked his way through it.

The good news is that he doesn't want to be with the OW. That is a huge hurdle that you have jumped. The bad news is that recovery is long, slow and a roller coaster of emotions. I would strongly suggest finding a counselor that is in sync with the MB plan. Also, encourage you husband with positive affirmations of how your love for each other can grow with care and time. I agree with the last post in that he is probably as scared as you are. He needs to know that marriages not only saved but can thrive after the trauma of an affair.

I am hopeful for you and your family. My own sitch isn't as rosy but I am praying for that and letting God handle it. My own H will eventually come to see that the OW isn't all that he thought and I pray that he returns a humbled man and helps to save our own marriage.

(((hugs)))
Loni

Thanks. I just went up to his work to see him, brought him some lunch and a copy of Surviving An Affair. After he saw the book he commented on how embarrassed he is at the book HE just bought. "Helping your kids cope with Divorce" - he just doesn't think that he is able to get his feelings back for me. He said he wishes he could get them back and that he wants to feel those things for me because I am the mother of his children and his wife, but those feelings are just not there. He was crying. Evidently he doesn't see any other way. I don't know what more to do.

I feel so hopeless and defeated.

Ugh, just talked to him again. He called, and I said "so I guess your mind is clear now and you aren't afraid of the decision to leave the marriage anymore?" He said "I guess I will be always be afraid of that decision, but I just think it is inevitable. I don't want to prolong this anymore than we have already - and the thoughts I have are that I just want you to be able to find someone new - someone who can make you happy since I was never able to"

My freaking world is crashing down in front of my very eyes. I just want my family together.

Those "IN LOVE" feelings you can't always put stock in those words. When I am angry with my children I don't feel too much love towards them, but let a stranger jump in the middle and try to harm them at that very moment every ounce of love I have surfaces to the top. There are times when you just don't feel love. And the times when you think you might not feel love, when your wife is sick, throwing up, ill as she can be, and you can't seem to do anything for her, that is when you love her, because you wish you could take her place.

Your husband needs to get out of his head the idealism of love an work on the issues. It's working together on each others emotional needs. It's learning to make each other happy. It's trying to move past the hurts and the blames.

I would stay as far away from comments like this one as possible. Your ONE AND ONLY focus is saving your marriage. Steve Harley told me once during counseling that the WS often can not see around that corner and it comes down to the BS to get them to even peek around it. He doesn't see how he can possibly get those feelings back.

You are going to need to be the one who is steadfast in the belief and resolve. When he talks of divorce tell him you aren't thinking of that because you can only focus on one goal.... a recovered marriage. Refuse to go there. Asking him if he is ready to walk away only gives him an open door to that discussion. CLOSE THE DOOR. Be a broken record... you are working towards a better marriage. Period.

Also, the "I just want you to be happy and I can't do that for you" stuff... that is more for HIM than you. Walking away from his wife and children is not going to make any of you happy.

Don't let him go down that road. Your recovered family and marriage is what will make you happy. Don't let him believe anything else.

Just my .02 <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

FIM

HE is saying the D is what he wants. That he wants us both off the roller coaster because the longer this goes on, the worse he feels about himself. He does not want to hurt me anymore. That I deserve to be happy and he cannot give me that. He wants to go thru with the divorce and is coming here this evening to go over the settlement agreement.

I had hope previously. Now I have none.

See, you should tell him not to even speak for you. What he is saying is not about you, it's about him. The whole affair was about him. And now he is pretending to make this feeling about dispair about you instead of him, where it actually rests.

Affairs don't just happen, they happen because of something going on emotionally on the inside. A person takes that step toward the other person because something just isn't right. It's why Marriage Builders works so hard on meeting emotional needs.

And now what is he trying to say, I'm hurting emotionally, so I want to place it back on you, by saying you must be hurting, so I want to let you out of the marriage. I WOULD TELL HIM JUST WAIT A MINUTE AND GET REAL. TELL HIM YOU AREN'T TAKING THE BLAME FOR HIS FEELINGS AND HE NEEDS TO GET HONEST WITH HIMSELF.

This man is going to walk out the door, find another relationship and still be hurting. He needs to come to grips with reality. You don't divorce and fix things. You work on relationships. You work on your emotional problem and fix things. You don't jump overboard and think, oh I just put out the fire on the ship with my splash.

Sample dialogue for Thankful:

My happiness is my problem. Sure a healthy marriage can make one happier but allow me to work on and be responsible for my own "happiness". I know I have struggled with that in the past and that is something I am working on. I know I have pressured you and it is quite common for a man to feel those words about his wife (i.e.- I can't make you happy). I am sorry if you have felt burdened with "my happiness" but such is no longer the case. I release you from that obligation. All I ask is that you walk with me. I am not in a hurry to find or seek happiness in another. I have hope that we can restore OUR marriage to a place of mutual happiness. Through repentence and forgiveness we can move beyond this mess. I have seen, heard about it, and read about it happening for others and I would love to share the experiences of others with you so you can SEE that recovery is possible.

But as far as "happiness" is concerned let me share with you a study which I picked up on the internet relating to just such question:

[color:"blue"] Link to American Values study on divorce and happiness [/color]


Thankful:

I also wanted to add: Remember the list of do's and don'ts. Hopefully you can encourage him to hold off filing any papers...it doesn't sound like he is rushing off to the courthouse. He's worried about his attraction to you and whatnot which is VERY typical fog-speak from WS's. Nearly all, if not all of us BS's have been there. You can't allow it to hurt you and effect your strategic thinking. He is at least speaking to you and relating his feelings and opening up his supposed heart to you...just listen. As you listen, you develope intimacy. Like I told you before tend to agree and move on. If you act hurt you paralyze the conversation and make him feel horrible...instead, acknowledge his feelings (though warped) and thank him for sharing. Make conversation with you SAFE. You are his haven, his safe harbor and you can guide him safely back into the family and eventually in love with you again.

He commented lack of desire for you. What are you doing in regards to your physical appearance? Are you excersing? Dieting? Eating right? New Haircut? New clothes? Tanning?. If physical attractiveness is a big emotional need of his then you MUST be improving your appearance. However, you do it for YOU and if he likes it so be it; but you still are doing Plan A for YOU.

BTW, where did he "say" he disappeared to for the 3 or 4 days he was absent and out of pocket last weekend?. I did suspect some "closure" contact and possible remorse, so he avoided you. I encourage you strongly to inspect what you expect. Just because he "tells" you he's done with MOW doesn't make it so. They both could very well be playing out the game in secret so they both can obtain a favorable divorce. Their addictions will not allow them to stay in "no contact" so be watchful for late night "secret" rendevous or other scheduled secret meetings like lunch breaks or something. He will be vulnerable to snooping or just the "surprise" innocent acting visits at work or his condo/apartment as he continues his potential line of bs. The more he actually believes he has you snowed the more likely he will be less careful with his actions. DO NOT TRUST A KNOWN LIAR.

Along those lines give up any questioning of him as what he says is irrelevant anyway cause you don't KNOW if it's the truth. Assume he's a liar and try to avoid questions that make him lie to you as it is really uncomfortable to the WS and non-condusive, at the moment, to recover conversation. Focus on today only and accept uncertainty about the past and future.

Good luck,
Mr. Wondering

Do not agree or even look at any settlement agreement. You don't do divorce. If he has an agreement he can forward it to your attorney, if you have one. Don't direct him to file or anything. Just leave it at that. Say, I am having a good day and don't want to be distracted by that stuff.

Again, he may very well be playing you for a easy divorce. He wants you to give up all hope and believe his wayward crap. Don't allow yourself to be sold. You have hope and will not give up on him, period.

He should not be under an illusion that you will make this quick nor easy for him (not that you tell him that but if and when you ever respond to his divorce petition he will KNOW then because you will be seeking everything, alimony, child support, debt relief, and full custody of all minor children with a restraining order versus MOW. If he is playing you he will be FURIOUS and the cat will be out of the bag. You will hide behind your lawyer by sympathizing with how harsh your filing sounds (i.e. - I'm sorry honey, my lawyer is such an a$$, I guess she/he is just looking out for my best interests, I didn't say all that stuff she/he wrote, I'll have to call him/her soon and see what can be done BUT right now I don't want to discuss it with you further...let's let the lawyers handle divorce...I'd like to talk about reconciliation....tell me about your day?).

DO NOT GIVE UP..IT AIN'T EVEN CLOSE TO OVER.

Mr. Wondering

Mr. W, not to sound conceited or anything but I am a beautiful girl. I used to model in my early twenties, if that is any indication. I'm 5'6" and 100 lbs. (Normally 110 or 115 but no appetite and nerves lately has caused the weight loss)It has nothing to do with my physical appearance. On the looks scale, I am better looking than he is but that never mattered to me - people always used to joke "what does SHE see in HIM?" But that never mattered to me obviously. I always thought he was beautiful, inside and out. Being attractive makes me feel even more worthless at this point.

He is still coming here this evening to go over the settlement stuff. We are going thru mediation, so no lawyers will be involved.

I give up.

You know I meant you NO offense.

The devil sure would like it if you gave up. Hopelessness is his middle name. I am truly sorry for your situation. Still think you shouldn't settle, even in mediation, you can drag things out and surely get more than your WH is willing to give you in some settlement HE PROPOSES.

As a tax attorney be very careful what you sign. Straight alimony is taxable income to you and a deduction to him. However, if you draft it so the payments continue to your estate in the event that you die then sometimes you can turn alimony payments into essentially a property division payment, despite how the agreement defines it. Make certain to have an accountant and/or attorney at least look it over. Crap, email it to me and I'll look at it (though I leave town for a week tomorrow)...I am not an expert on divorce settlement agreements but I'm better than NOTHING.

Don't sign anything yet. Tell him you need to think about it for at least a few days. Don't allow him to rush you into a decision....HE IS NOT TO BE TRUSTED.

Mr. Wondering

Thankful, you should not give up, nor should you participate in ANY discussions about divorce. You DON'T make it easy for him. Like MrW said, tell him you "don't do divorce and have no interest in any such talks." If he wants a divorce, he will have to do it the HARD WAY, you won't make it easy for him.

Further, all the things he is saying to you are typical statements coming from a WS who is STILL IN AN AFFAIR. He is trying to trick you into thinking the affair is over and that this D isn't all about the affair. TRUST ME, IT IS.

That leaves your #1 priority to do your best to bust up the affair. That is your ONLY CHANCE of saving your marriage. That is done TWO WAYS, via exposure and applying pressure to the affair AND attracting him back by doing your best to meet his needs.

How far have you exposed this affair? Does the OWH know? What about employers, pastors, parents, etc? Exposure is simply your MOST EFFECTIVE WEAPON against an affair as it is ruinous to affairs.

So, start there. And remember, you "don't do" divorce. DON'T help him destroy your marriage, Thankful.

The Carrot and the Stick of Plan A by Pepperband

The carrot of Plan A


Meeting your wandering spouse's emotional needs.

Making "home" a warm and inviting place to be.

Placing emphasis on what has worked in the marriage.

Showing consistent self improvement in areas where previously lacking.

Stop lovebusting behaviors.

Communicating with a calm reassuring voice and relaxed body language, even in the center of a verbal storm created by the infidel.

Becoming the person any reasonable spouse would want to come home to.

Remaining open to the possibility of recovery.

Offering forgiveness and understanding.



The stick of Plan A


Exposing adultery where it matters most. Exposure that takes the form of a swift and sudden unexpected tsunami of truth.

Not appologizing for exposure or speaking the truth in a kind yet direct way.

Directly communicating the hurt and devastation that the affair has caused.

Not accepting blame for the infidel's choice to become adulterous.

Let the consequences of adultery and infidelity fall freely upon the heads of the adulterous.

Establishing boundaries that disallow the affair to effect children of the marriage, financal security of the marriage, and otherwise ruin innocent bystanders.

Standing up to infidelity as a beast that must be slayed for the good of the family.

If you really want to save your marriage, please listen to the advice you are getting here.

Giving up, if that is really what YOU want and believe in, is certainly your right. If you have any desire to repair, reclaim and restore your family though you have to fight.

So he wants a divorce. So what? He wanted to get married. He wanted your family. He made a commitment and a promise to you and to each of your children. That is more important than what he wants to do at this second.

I agree that he is probably still in contact with that woman. His actions are right in line with the WS script.

Arm yourself with knowledge in regards to the script... it allows you to see what he is saying for what it is.

As I said before of course he wants a divorce right now. He has disgraced himself. He has become something he probably never thought he could have. He's ashamed and feels weak. He's confused. He's addicted and he doesn't have the tools to get through it or the belief that his world will ever be right without his drug - that woman.

That doesn't mean anything. Are you going to put the future and happiness of you and your children into the hands of a man whose one and only concern is himself? An addict? A wayward spouse?

If you feel there is any hope for your marriage to be recovered I would encourage you to at least try the program... take the advice you're getting here and have nothing to do with any talk of divorce.

If neither of you are willing to look around the corner you will never know what's waiting there for you.

If you don't do all you can to stop the destruction of your family I believe you will always regret it. If you try everything you can, even if you fail, you will never regret having done so.

FIM

PLEASE PLEASE Listen to Mr Wondering and MelodyLane.

There is HOPE here but not if you give up so easy.

Please, I beg you, read the FREE material on this site. Read Dr Harley's basic concepts. Try and get your husband here on this board.

One of Dr Harley's most BASIC premises is that ANY 2 people can fall in love under the right conditions. His current feelings CAN and WILL change if you only allow each other to meet each others EN's

Damn. It's only 5 days of NC?????? He will be feeling WRETCHED.

This is NO time to be discussing divorce and giving up. You are BOTH in a highly emotionally charged state right now. Do not make permanent decisions while you are like this.

I saw a TV program on divorce recently - 10 couples that were divorced. EVERY SINGLE couple said they wished with hindsight they had tried harder to reconcile.

PLEASE PLEASE listen.

If your husband felt attracted to you once then he can be attracted to you again. It is still early in this and I believe there is still hope.

Have you looked at the 180 list to see what you can incorporate?

1. Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or
implore!
2. No frequent phone calls
3. Do not point out good points in marriage
4. Do not follow him around the house
5. Do not encourage talk about the future
6. Do not ask for help from family members
7. Do not ask for reassurances
8. Do not buy gifts
9. Do not schedule dates together
10. Do not spy on spouse
11. Do not say "I Love You"
12. Act as if you are moving on with your life
13. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive
14. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get
busy, do things, go to church, go out with friends,
etc.
15. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start
the conversation) be scarce or short on words
16. If you are in the habit of asking your spouse his
whereabouts, ASK NOTHING
17. You need to make your partner think that you have
had an awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you
are going to move on with your life, with or without
your spouse
18. Do not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull
back and wait to see if spouse notices and, more
important, realize what he will be missing
19. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show
your spouse happiness and contentment. Show him
someone he would want to be around.
20. All questions about marriage should be put on
hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which
may be a while)
21. Never lose your cool
22. Don't be overly enthusiiastic
23. Do not argue about how he feels (it only makes
their feelings stronger)
24. Be patient
25. Listen carefully to what your spouse is really
saying to you
26. Learn to back off, shut up and walk away when you
want to speak out
27. Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh &
focus on all the other parts of your life that are not
in turmoil)
28. Be strong and confident and learn to speak softly
29. Know that if you can do 180, your smallest
CONSISTENT actions will be noticed much more than any
words you can say or write
30. Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you
are hurting more than ever and are desperate and needy
31. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with
your spouse
32. Do not believe any of what you hear and less than
50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in
absolute negatives because he is hurting and scared
33. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad
you feel
34. Do not backslide from your hardearned changes

You may want to read carolkh's story, that might inspire you a bit:

carolkh's story

Thank you all. Melody, the A was fully exposed. I KNOW it is over with MOW. You all can say that he is still in the A, but he is not. He just does not miss me. He just does not miss us. He doesn't want us back. He only misses his kids, not me. I am facing this and have to accept it. I can only change myself, I cannot change him or how he feels. He has fallen out of love with me. Maybe during this time he will find himself attracted to me again - you never know. But I have to let him go. I will continue to concentrate on Plan A & doing things for ME. I am moving on with my life and if it so happens that he changes his tune, then we will discuss it. What is meant to be, will be.

Mr W. I haven't signed anything yet. Truth is, we do not have the $$ to drag things out. If we did that, we would both end up with nothing. I don't want that.

thankfyl, they ALL fall out of love when they are in an affair. That is what is supposed to happen. But they fall back in love once they withdraw. This is why you should not help him with a D. If you don't make it easy for him and drag things out, he will most likely drop it. If you HELP HIM, then you will likely end up DIVORCED. So, it is a BAD IDEA to go along with his quick divorce scheme. If you make it hard, he will drop it.

Rather, you should try and save your marriage by using Plan A. It is also likely that he is hoping that MOW will leave her H for him. Have you spoken to her H?

And I find it doubtful the affair is over. How do you know this?