I've been reading on this forum for a few weeks now. I haven't posted anything but I feel like I have to because I have no were else to turn. I found out about my wifes affair in December. I have read Dr. Harley's books and understand the theory. My wife has too read the books. She has been in NC since a week after the first Dday. I love my wife and have expressed my love for her. I'm not sure why, after having my heart torn out. I question my own sanity for even being able to say those words after what has happened. She is working very hard at improving our marriage. She use to work nights but we are now both working days so it makes spending time together easier. 4 months after Dday she still can't say she loves me. Is this normal while in recovery? She had no problem saying she loved the [censored] she was with. Most things are going ok but how long can someone put up with not feeling loved? What would the Harley's say about this? I've been on this rollercoaster of emotions for so long and wish it would stop. Aaaarrgghh

Welcome here, sorry you have to be here.

I assume if you've read the books then you are working on meeting your wive's needs and spending time with her.

How do you know she's in NC? Because she tells you? Sorry to say it's a big mistake to take her word for it. You need to monitor her actions and snoop. If you find contact, you know why things aren't going so well.

How did they contact each other before? You should look into cell phone statements, email accounts, etc.

2AZ-

Your WW sounds like she's still in contact w/OM.

I suggest taking drastic measures into your own hands like implementing plan A & B.

My WH lied, lied and lied. He had a 2 yr A. D-day was 2/1/06. Kicked him out that night. Found his email password and read OW's desperate, emotionally deranged emails to WH for a month until WH changed password. Her stupidy, my gain. He said he cut off contacts w/OW. He lied. So, don't take your WW's word. WS perfected the art of lying. WH even went to IC, and he still managed to lie.

Implemented plan B 3/19, sent copies to his family and friends. A week later and receiving blocked ID/hang up calls, I sent OW's "fatal attraction" emails she sent H, to her co-workers, family, including WH's family and friends. At that point, I didn't give a s**** anymore. I took a calculated risk that we would be filing for D. Lord and behold, both these sinners (WH and OW) were humilited beyond belief that any WS would be embarrased and shamed for life for even being associated with someone as emotionally delusional and deranged. OW ran crying to WH who in turn got p***** at me. In return, I blasted him and said, "If your mistress is going to throw a punch in my direction, she better damn well be prepared I'll punch her back! And when I do, she can't come crying to you and have you fight her battle against me, that blankety-blank-blank!" Of course, said a few more bleep, bleep.

I asked for D a week later. We talked the next day and H asked if I would reconsider and seek MC. We have our 2nd MC today. H sent a NC email to OW with CC to me.

I suggest start making plans and snooping. You W needs to miss you and experience the thought of losing you. As long as you continue to be the loving and accomodating H, she has nothing to worry and continue the having and eating her cake mode. Did that (meeting his ENs) and all it did was it stroked his ego even more. You may have to kick her out. My logic behind that is this, your wife is using you and the OM while you are financially supporting her. People who have A are insecure to begin with. So having two people vying for them gives them no reason to stop the A.

THe OM has her physically and emotionally. Let the OM financially support her too. Let them live the realities of their A. But expose the A if you haven't yet.

Is the OM married? Have you exposed the A to anyone? If not, do it now. The longer you wait, the less impact it will have.

Good luck.

2AZ

I am sorry to repeat what has been said but taken a WS's word for no contact is dangerous. That needs to be followed up by your own confirmation and just plain old gut feelings and time.


The above is just all part of the ride and fog brother. It is my story and many others repeated over and over and over and over again. Only the names and places change. I truely feel for you. I really do. My D-day was 9/11/2005. No ILY's from my wife since then either.

How long can you go? It depends. Everyone is different. My energy level is my low, but my resolve is still there. I refuse at this point to give up. Almost on a stubborness issue. Yes I still love her, but there are other driving forces as well.

You are in for a very rough time. This is the place to be.

Hang in there. Someone once told me on the boards the following:

Regarding WS's. Only believe half of what you see and none of what you hear.

Rememeber, at recovery or some other time they no longer are WS's, they are FWS's so that cliche' does not hold true for a FWS. At the moment you have to decide. Do you believe her?

In the words of Ronald Reagan regarding the USSR. "Trust but verify"

WOL

Whoa, whoa, whoa....

Assuming she's still in contact because she hasn't said ILY??

That's a bit of a leap, IMO.

My affair ended six months ago. I broke NC once several weeks ago, only by going to see OM's band, didn't even speak to him or make eye contact... and told my H about it the next day.

But I haven't been able to utter those "ILY" words either. And I can't even say for sure why. Many factors: I said it too many times when I didn't mean it prior to my affair, and I never want to be that phony again.... I don't trust my own feelings... I do feel, uhm, SOMETHING, for my H now, but not sure what... and on and on. But I too am working hard to be loving to him and improve the marriage and all that.

2AZ, I understand that BS's long to hear those words again. I've seen it here before. But the old cliche that "actions speak louder than words" may very well apply here. If she's "loving you, the verb"... in other words trying hard to meet you EN's and all that... try to focus on that rather than those three words. I'm guessing those words will come in time.

--SC

(not suggesting you shouldn't try to verify that your W is still in NC... just saying the absence of those specific words don't necessarily mean much. I'd pay more attention to what she's doing and how she's acting that whether she says anything in particular.)

Hey SC,

Good to hear from you.

2AZ and SC. My mistake if I left the impression the no ILY's mean NC has been broken. I re read my thread and I really answered/commented on the ILY's in the middle of other stuff about the trust and verify.

2AZ, SC is exactly right. The lack of ILY's does not mean NC is broken. That is just part of the "ride", I was mainly addressing the need to verify and only he can determine if he trusts her or not and to what level to verify.

SC, not to thread jack but I hope you are doing well.

Thanks for the clarifation on my post.

WOL

I think my FWW like SC will not say those words until she is certian. It's been 2 years since D-day and I have not heard those words since days she actually didn't have those feelings. I guess it was more of a habit thing back then. Now that we are recovering "No ILY's".

Go figure

Hi everyone,

Thanks for the posts, it is very appreciated. I'm not having a very good day today. I am quit certain that my wife has made no contact since December. I've done all the phone lookups, spying, ect. I'm tired of that and am asking myself so many questions today.

1) Why am I doing this? She says she doesn't love me. Am I kidding myself and just delaying the inevitable D?

2) Even if D isn't inevitable, why the f' should I stay? She scr#'s someone else and then comes home.

3) I have kids, don't you think that's enough right there?

4) Yea you have kids. But, can you go through life thinking that your wife will always think this jkass was so much better than you.

5) Will you ever really trust her again?

6) Will I seek out another person? Sure sounds tempting right now even though I can't see myself as an adulterer.

7) Does she realize how worried I was the nights she was late coming home? She was having sex with him not worried in the least about you.

8) What a sweet guy. He is willing to have sex with someones wife, will tear the guys life apart, doesn't give a ****** less about her kids. She can honestly say she loves someone like that? Maybe they were meant for each other.

9) Would love to change the lyrics of Garth Brooks song around.... In my instance replace "she" for "he".

He followed her to work this morning
He’d never seen that dress before
She seemed to sail right through
Those dark clouds forming
That he knows he’s headed for

After seven years of marriage
He wanted out
Now after seven months of freedom
It’s clear that there’s no doubt

She’s gonna make it
And he never will
He’s at the foot of the mountain
And she’s over that hill
He’s sinkin’ at sea
And her sails are filled
She’s gonna make it
And he never will

And you know it’s not like she’s forgot about him
She’s just dealing with the pain
And the fact that she’s survived so well without him
You know it’s driving him insane

And the craze thing about it
Is she’d take him back
But the fool in him that walked out
Is the fool who just won’t ask

She’s gonna make it
And he never will
He’s at the foot of the mountain
And she’s over that hill
He’s sinkin’ at sea
And her sails are filled
She’s gonna make it
And he never will

...Sorry for the long rant but I have no one else to rant to. I would love to tell them both that there ship will sink at sea. In the mean time I'll be the good BS and follow the plan. Aarrrgghh

Man, All I can say is "Been there done that".

Alot of what your feeling will pass. As long as your FWW doesn't make contact.

In my case, I know she's had NC. Yes I still keep my eye's open, and remain sensitive to the potential. But she no longer goes out with that crowd, works at home, 3 kids, etc..

The issues of the no ILY's is for the most part the last remaining hurdle. That alone keeps me from letting my guard down. It keeps me from completely trusting and showing how I feel.

Maybe someday.

JKT,

How long did it take to pass? It just seems like its starting to be honest, after 5 months. The first few months I think I was in denial that the whole thing happened. Do you feel like you are going through life as 2nd best? How do you handle the no ILY's? How do you perceive her love for you? Do you think she loves you? Do you care if she does/doesn't?

I definately care if she does or doesn't love me. Honestly, as you mentioned, if it wasn't for the kids, I doubt we would be together. At a minimum I would have left for awhile. I still have those feeling occasionally that "maybe if I leave for awhile, she would appreciate me more".

As for the paranoia surrounding "Is she hiding something". I guess around the 6/8 month point I figured if something was going on I will find out. No sense worrying myself over it, and just let go of it. Every once and awhile I get nervous. She has an "again" single friend that over the past 2 years was in a relationship. During that period did not call my W much, and when she did, it was "lets go out to lunch" That didn't bother me. When she became single again. The calls became "lets go to the club". Needless to say, I wasn't having that. My W never needed to hear from me that I did not approve. She would tell her friend "We can go to the Mall, or out to dinner" but not out to the clubs.

I have no issues with her shows of affection. She's always hugging me, kissing, has to fall asleep on me at night, etc... She just can't say ILY.

I don't say anything to her about it. I would hate for her to feel she need to say it for my benefit. Especially if she doesn't mean it.

2 things I have been waiting patiently for is the ILY's and a new wedding band. I lost my original band while in the military as a flier. "not allowed to have them on or around the jet". Lost the chain the ring was on, and the ring. She mentioned buying another, but I told her I didn't want the ring until she was sure, and it had true meaning. That was 2 years ago.

Anyway enough of my rambling. Yes I think she loves me, but I also feel she is still not happy with "where we are" in the relationship, and I can understand that I'm not either. So I try to focus on making myself a better person, and not the things that bother me about her.

As for being 2nd best. No, I don't feel that way. I know better. Her A was a result of the way I treated her. She meet a scumbag that told her what she needed to hear, because I wasn't. Not knowing about her A, she asked me for a D. It was then I realized how stupid I had been, how important she was to me, and how badly I had treated her. A few months later, she saw the change in me, and decided to end her A, and give us a chance. Fast forward a few more months, a jealous, dumped, and betrayed OM decided it was in my best interest to know about my WW A "over the phone of course", probably for the best.

Down side to finding out of her A. Was my attitude toward her changed obviously.

Its a work in progress, and I can't see giving up now.

JKT,

Your story and mine sound a lot alike in some ways. I'm having so many questions running through my head and my answers seem polar opposites on different days. Do you love her? Don't you feel alone sometimes, that you are just living with a person who is more a friend than a wife? I look at my kids and I can't imagine tearing away their mom and dad, they are way too innocent. They, we, shouldn't have to deal with this bs. Some days I just want to say f-it. Other days not. I just wish I would wake up from a bad dream. On the other hand we have talked more than we had in years. Who knows. I love my wife, why I don't know after this but I really feel second best. I'm really trying but will anybody tell me I did a bad thing if sometime in the future I just say I can't do it anymore, even if she's trying? Questions, questions, questions....So few answers.