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#1638442 04/18/06 09:15 PM
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My wife told me the other day if I made her choose between me and her church it would be her church. First I would never make her choose between me and God. But that church she is going too is more like a cult than anything I have ever seen. I was raised very strict Holiness and I know what it is. That church is like a cult. Everyone answers to the preacher, he has to know everything. At one time I did attend that church, he the preacher got me put into the middle of some arguement he was having with a memeber for what that member said. The member said to me that he thought the preacher was trying to do to much and he should let the members help. That preacher told me how sorry i was for letting the man talk about the preacher like that, and that i should have been a man and stood up to him, the man didn't say anything wrong about the preacher. The preacher then proceded to talk to me and my wife like we were childern or dogs. His belief is the preacher has the say over what goes on in the lifes of the members. let me give a example, a member had a affair with a lady out there, he kicked the members( the mans wife) wife out for not telling him ( the preacher) about it, and she was the victim. That was a yr ago. This past sunday night I found out that my wife was going back out there, then she pretty much told me if i made her choose between that church and me then she would choose the church. So I told her I choose not to put gas in her car to go(its a 45 mile round trip). She is a stay at home mom. Now she is mad at me for that. what do i do? I feel strong enough about this i have concidered leaving, I do not want my kids around that crowd.

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Does anyone have any advise? I don't know what to do.

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Pardner, I don't have a clue what might help you in this situation. I'm very sorry, but I suspect other folks are similarly befuddled. Is this cult somehow involving your wife in adultery? Please remember this forum is dedicated to infidelity.

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The OP isn't God.....it's that preacher. The scary thing is she will probably choose the preacher over her family.

U need to protect yourself and your family, financially. In most cases that preacher type character is all about power, control and $$.

While you can't control her, you can control how much influence he has over you and your family, report the preacher so the police have a record. Expect something to erupt.

Make sure you protect your finances. Control over $$ is a big high with these types. If she is under the influence of someone who is telling her to NOT be responsible (taking care of herself and her family), but to give $$ to him, then he is an extortionist.

Does that sound too wild? C/b a reality. Be prepared and be careful.

take care,
L.

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Tell her to avoid the kool-aid.

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Quote
Tell her to avoid the kool-aid.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

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Very much like romantic infidelity, this is just another variation of being in a drug-like intoxication. Something she has "found" in this religion is satisfying some need - or serves as an escape from reality - and it makes her feel good. She's getting her brain treated with its reward feed back system.

This is no different than any other assembly of folks with a charismatic leader or agreed upon "group think." It's the Moonies, the "kool aid" in Guyana, the Applewaite "beam me up" steller travelers, etc. - all the way, some would argue, to mainstream "accepted" faiths. What's the real difference?

You may find useful info by researching the "de-programming" stuff people have applied to individuals "captured" by whacko organizations. Pretty scarry stuff.

It may also be helpful to at least become aware of the Marriage Builders principles dealing with infidelity and apply them as appropriate - because the emotional mechanisms at play are probably very, very similar.

Fort example - exposure. Have you exposed your wife's actions to those who would likely disagree and could be influential in her life? This staple of infidelity response could similarly be effective for you.

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The CHURCH is something completely different from having a relationship with God. Asking your wife to leave that Church is NOT asking her to abandon God. From what you've written, it doesn't sound like God is very involved in that "church" anyway.

I believe God does ask that we put HIM before our spouses, but I DON'T beleive he asks us to put any church before them. Family comes before the church in my book. When I was a deacon, I saw many women become so involved in church that they neglected the needs of their family. Men did it too, but to a lesser extent. We instituted a policy that limited any one individual to no more than two roles and in some cases to only one to try and prevent this.

If this still didn't work, we would ask some of the "wiser" older women to approach her discreetly and discuss the issue with her.

I once had to speak with a mother who pulled her teenage son out of a sport he loved so she could spend more time at church. That sport gave him focus and direction. Afterwards, his grades dropped and he started getting into trouble.

Just some thoughts.

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Our MC described an "affair" as a situation where any outside influence was given more consideration and value than the marriage; ie, golf, fishing, church, online activities, etc. This is a Marriage Builders site, and I think many of the principles do apply.

POJA...Policy of Joint Agreement certainly comes into play here. So does Selfish Demands.

Purchase and read "Surviving an Affair", but until you get the book, start at the "home" page of this site and read about infidelity, and I think you'll find a host of similarities.

You may even want to set an appointment with the Harley's by phone, and get their professional help, as I'm sure they've probably dealt with this phenomenon before...

Best wishes,
SD


BH - me 53, ONS 1979
FWW - 51, 2 EA's, 1 PA
Last D-Day, Sep. 30, 2003
Last Contact/recovery began 2-26-04

***You can do anything with time and money...but remember...money won't buy you time!***
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No church that places supreme emphasis on a person rather than God, has a spirit of truth moving it. In addition to protecting your assets, continue to lift your wife up in prayer. This battle is a spiritual one, and your strongest weapons are spiritual also.


A smooth sea never made a skilled mariner.
~ English proverb



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Ask her to find scriptures to back up her decision to abandon her family for this so called "preacher." This is a classic example of a cult.

Have your own set of scriptures to counter hers because those who know the Word very little or wish to use it to rationalize their behavior, will manipulate the Word to say whatever they want.

Seek the help of your former pastor or ask a friend who is a member of a well grounded church to suggest a pastor/counselor who could assist you.

Jesus was our example of using scripture when confronted with the manipulations of satan. Noone can successfully argue against the Truth.

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This situation hits home. My husband of almost twenty-five years has replaced his family with "ministering to another family". This has been going on for several years now but has recently reached a new level I can hardly bare.

Quick Recap: We've been married for almost 24 yrs, two sons 20 & 24 yrs old. Always have been involved in church, family, and helping others (as a family). My husband and I have attended the same church for 24 yrs. He always made time and believed in family time. The last few years he seems to be disillusioned with the church. He says it is lukewarm and not meeting the needs of people. To a degree I agree. But he has isolated himself (he's always been somewhat of a quiet loner person, but loving to his family) from the church people. He taught sundayschool for 15 years but was recently "asked to give up his class" due to his "inappropriate behavior". He was not accused of anything,but I guess "some" parents felt uncomfortable. He would take up a lot of time with the kids, swing them around and through them over his shoulders etc..He would take them out to lunch,(by himself). I would get upset and say he should not go alone. That is not appropriate, especially with young girls (6-8th grade). He called it hearing their needs and taking time with them. He didn't want me to go with him...I was a "stiff shirt" he said. At the present time he is not attending church at all.

We own a martial arts school, and he now spends late evenings with kids (out ot 11:00 pm) taking them home from class and out to dinner. He also goes to a particular families home on Sundays for 6-8 hours every week. He never misses, not even on Holidays, birthdays etc....He says he is treated like family. This is a strange family anyway, in my eyes. Who would let their daughters go off with a grown man for hours...I know my husband isn't doing anything..but he could be accused easily. We separated for a while and he is now back home. I am trying to give it to God. I tell my husband what about your own family..He says
"who is my family, the bible says whosoever will hear the word of God is your family". I said what about your marriage? He said "You don't want to know what the bible says about marriage, it would only hurt you." I quote scripture about loving your wife as God loved the church..He says "But God deciplined the church too."
He says he is "feeding his sheep" and I will chase them away. I almost lost my mind last year, battling breast cancer and dealing with this rejection. My son (20yr old)now sees that his Dad is "going through something". He admits he doesn't sound right. My 24 yr son is in the Navy, but when he comes in for a visit, he says Dad is disconnected with his own family.
What do I do? I have seen counselors, talked to pastors..no one has an answer. I have had to give it to God, but it is so hard to live in this everyday. My son told him "Dad you are miserable around your own family, you would rather be with the other family." The little girl calls him "Daddy #2".
I can totally identify with "the other person is God". But what do you do? I continue trying to go to church by myself.
But it is killing me inside. Oh, also, he has had numerous complaints at the martial arts school for the same behavior and favoritism. There have been formal complaints issued and letters written against him. He thinks that you will come against these things, when you are doing the right thing for God. He is manipulative with the word, because he is so intelligent and well informed with the scripture.
Help..


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You say you know your husband isn't doing "anything"...how can you know that? What you have described sent chills up my spine. Why would he not want you around if what he was doing was appropriate?


Me, the BS - 35 FWH - 35 M - 1992 Children- 2 and 4 PA - ONS's 4x over past 6 years Post that tells my story... http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...rue#Post2986620 D-Day - March 27, 2006
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I think he doesn't want me around because he doesn't get the full attention. The children love me too and want my attention and I notice he doesn't like that.
I just find it odd that he won't talk about Jesus to them while I am around. I offered for him to have the Sunday school lessons at our home.I said we could have a cook out or order in pizza each Sunday. I suggested we have games or volleyball etc...like we use to when our kids were young and had friends over. We always had children in our home and he didn't have to be "in charge". In fact, he didn't want to be in charge. He stayed and played a while and then would go watch TV or take a nap etc...he seemed relaxed about it back then.
As far as me knowing he is not doing anything, he always seems to go to public places with the children. I know that doesn't mean much..but I really think it is a spiritual warfare going on in our home. My son agrees. We both feel that Satan is trying to lead my H into a bad situation where he could be accused. But what is sad is that his reputation has already been jepardized. I feel most people don't feel comfortable with all this. The martial arts school is usally a place of discipline and order. He has lost quite a few students over this. They call it a daycare.
Kids(especiallly this particular group) are just running around playing. He gives them food and drinks etc...They treat his truck with so much disrespect. My son told him
"Dad you never let us act like that". My Husband said" I was wrong for being so strict". You see my husband was beaten as a child. He makes comments about that when he was little his Dad beat him l time for every minute he was late coming home from school. He said he had to stand in a little tile on the floor during the beatings and would bleed. He said no one cared about him. I thought he had dealt with this. He has talked about it before, he always seemed level , secure and okay with his past. He was a great father and husband for years. Something happened.....


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I'm no expert but I think he needs to see a Christian counselor. There are just too many red flags.


Me, the BS - 35 FWH - 35 M - 1992 Children- 2 and 4 PA - ONS's 4x over past 6 years Post that tells my story... http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...rue#Post2986620 D-Day - March 27, 2006
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We have seen two different christian counselors We went as a couple trying to save our marriage regarding this behavior. For a long time I thought I was just jealous, or unattractive or something was wrong with me. I acted out in hurt and anger. I now realize that this is not normal behavior. I have talked to friends, counselors, pastors etc..They say his view is distorted.

My H says no one is meeting the needs of the people. And you know I understand that. Sometimes churched people may overlook the needs. They come and go to church and only worry about what they are going to wear and where they will go eat after church. I know that could be true for some people. But we have never acted that way. And I know there are others they reach out too. But the idea of staying 8-10 hours with this family on Sundays makes me crazy.
Yesterday was Mothers Day. He was dressed and ready to go to their house and the phone rang. They always start calling on Sunday early. But this time they said they wouldn't be home, they were going off with their mother. I was shocked. They have never told him "not" to come. But I am sure he will be right back next week. He also stays out late after his martial arts class. Class is over at 8:30. He doesn't get home till about 10:45-11:00. We live 15-20 minutes from the school. His truck is full of toys, kids clothes, crayons, happy meal toys....I blame the parents mostly I guess. I figure if they didn't let him, he couldn't do it. But truth is he would find someone to let him take over. He likes the attention and the "need to be needed". How can I compete with that? I have tried believe me. It is like an earlier post said: anything that replaces your companion, golf, fishing, "other people", feels like an affair. It really hurts. My son is hurting too.


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Do you know what the term "pedophile" means?

If not, I recommend you find out and compare your H's behavior to it. Very serious stuff.

JMHO

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I agree with WAT.

Scary stuff.


BW-34 FWH-35 Married 12yrs 4 children DD 8 DD 6 DD 4 DD 2 d-day 7/03 Beautiful Recovery
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Some good advice here for the author of this thread. I would add one more thing:

Start getting smart on Scripture. I am assuming this church is a "Christian" cult. So here's the rub....

You are your wife's pastor and your kids' pastor. This "pastor" is not a Christian. Nor is that church following Christ. You must rebut what this pastor is doing and saying with what is true...with the Word of God. You cannot fight this battle by jsut saying he is wrong. You have to be able to say why.

If you need help, many of us can help you here with gettign a head start on the parts of Scripture that will help you immediately. Your wife needs to hear the truth. She may not be receptive at first...but the truth is the truth. And she cannot run forever from the truth.

Protect your family and the finances from this very dangerous individual. You may not be able to protect your wife.

Stand your ground against thsi evil. The Lord will take care of this "pastor" and will take care of your wife. You MUST get smart now and you must stand your ground.

In His arms.


Standing in His Presence

FBS (me) (48)
FWW (41)
Married April 1993...
4 kids (19(B), 17(G), 14(B), 4(B))
Blessed by God more than I deserve
"If Jesus is your co-pilot...you need to change seats!"

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One quick thought: you say your wife is a stay-at-home mom. Never been completely in that sitch, but if I were, the boredom would drive me bonkers.

She's hooked on this preacher, okay, but don't forget to provide alternative interests for her -- ones that will not put her in open conflict with the church, so that she would reject them (x-rated movies, for example), but ones that will give her a broader view of life.

Films, books, hobbies, sports, other people -- anything that will help leverage her into other points of view.

This is a long-term solution, not an instant one.


"Virtue -- even attempted virtue -- brings light; indulgence brings fog." -- C.S. Lewis
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