"I definitely need to talk to the kids and let them know what's going on. And let go of trying to control the kid situation! That's much easier said than done."

It may be in your best interest to let go of trying to control the situation. WH may find it alot more difficult to juggle the kids, you, work, and A. Especially if the kids are not happy with the situation and I can't see why they would be.

Please, please prepare for the worst and hope for the best. you can always come stay with me for a while if you have too! LOL

"I appreciate you sticking with me for so long!"

Your MY friend, I have too! MY code!

Thanks, GrownUp.

Yeah, I'm hurting, but it's ok to say things to me. I really appreciate the things I get from this board, even if they are not what I want to hear or believed before.... even if I disagree.

Yes, we lost a son to premature birth about two years ago. H had said that the affect on him was more about me than our son ... that he hadn't really bonded with our baby yet, so he didn't feel a huge loss like I did, but that he hated seeing me hurt so much. I don't know if it had more afect on him than that or not. He was right by my side and a great husband through all of that.



This makes SOOOO much sense .... on paper, I have this concept all figured out. In production .... not so much. It's hard for me to open my mouth....get those things out ... This is one of those things I just learned here, and have been working on for a while.

I really liked how you suggested putting it in your post.


LOL. My SIL just said the same thing today ... he told me to get a backbone, but gets mad at me when I do.

Mostly, now, when I think of the backbone thing, I just know that I really do not want to lay down and take this. I won't accept it. And I need to start showing that, because I don't think I did before. Maybe I should have been stronger in Plan A.



This makes a lot of sense .... thank you. I guess I was worried that I couldn't do this ... that it would murk up the Plan B ... etc.


Thanks for your help -- I really do appreciate it!

-AmI.

Just heard from H's work ... just one of them, the guy who used to teach our pre-marital class, and was one of H's bosses for a while.

He isn't really in a position to do anything, he just wanted to tell me he had gotten the letter. That they were praying for us ... etc. He said he had tried several times to talk to H, and that H is not receptive at all and won't listen.

He said "are you sure this is how you realy want to handle it? You're confident in your decision to do this?"

I said Yeah, that I needed help and I was going to get it from anywhere that I could.

He said not to expect anything from the department, that they "are not the moral police". And that they normally turn a blind eye on things like this. I said there is a difference between turning a blind eye to it and having it brought up and put in their face like I'm doing. They can't just ignore this.

He said why don't I just get a lawyer and force him out of the house that way. I told him that I have a lawyer, but that I can't live for months with him under the same roof flaunting his adultery in my face while I wait on the legal process. That I need people who can put pressure on H to do the right thing.

He said he'd see what he could do, but that he's not really in the chain to be able to do anything (which I already knew, I was wanting his help as a friend).


So, the letters have hit, but I haven't gotten any other feedback yet. I am guessing that they are waiting for H to come in tonight and talk to him first.

Alright, AmI, buckle down...get prepared...you CAN DO this!

I can say that I've never known you not to have a backbone and it's an honor to know you. I've been blessed with your perpective and have benefitted from it. I have faith that your perceptive will benefit you also.

It's bike night so I should be home tonight should you need to talk.

Do you think you can handle the detachment with him should he try to confront you? Can you remember to control your emotions?

How are you feeling now?

Well, I haven't heard anything else yet. I think they were waiting on him to get to the office, I guess. But he called and left a message about half an hour ago, and it was nothing, it was about getting a cell phone for DS.

So I don't think he's been talked to yet ....

I planned on leaving him a copy of the letter that I sent, but I wanted to make sure it was received, first. I also have a copy ready to send to OW ... along with a copy of the Plan B letter.... maybe I should hold off on sending that ... ?

Maybe all the key people haven't really gotten the letters yet, and they are sitting in in-boxes somewhere?

:::: letting go of control ... realizing what things I can control .... deep breaths ....

-AmI.

Hi, Rin.

I am still a little anxious about what's going to happen, but not as bad now.

I am certain I can keep my cool with him. And, really, I think he will keep his cool, too. I know he will be pissed, but the slightest hint of a physical threat or anything else will definitely cost him his career -- so I'm not worried about that at all.

Thanks for the comment about having perspective ... it helps to hear because sometimes I don't feel like I have much of that. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

-AmI.

(((AmI)))

I'm hugging a really strong, vibrantly alive person...even if it's on a two-dimensional screen.

Yes, you tell the children that you are protecting the marriage by asking their father to move out. This is an example of logical consequences...you are choosing to protect the marriage not the man. Tell them your greatest desire is for them to be with you five days a week...to keep the family intact while their father decides either to continue his affair and divorce, or to end his affair and come home.

When one of your letter recipients call (as one did), emphasize that you aren't looking to them for position or power...that you respect them, know they have influence by their very existence, and how much any honest word they speak to WH matters to you, regardless of the outcome.

This is your plan to save your marriage...sounds contradictory to say "use your influence" to influence the outcome...when you're letting that go. Let's try something you can repeat to yourself...

In truth...I am acting from my code, demonstrating to myself, that I matter, am valuable and worthy. My marriage is my highest priority. I am sharing truth, spreading it, living it.

Do not go on your IM. Leave it off. Do not repeat yourself. HE KNOWS. Enforce your boundary. Do not speak to WH at all. Look through him, past him...do not respond to him in any way...not in body language, face language...blank eyes, AmI. Your eyes meet your children's eyes and hold...and if they aren't around, then I'm sure you can have fascinating objects in each room to focus on as you move past and remove yourself from his presence.

You are annihilating the WH and loving the DH...you are not retaliating...you are protecting your marriage. Make each of those fascinating objects a symbol of your marriage...embodied and real.

Big call out to Grownup...what a great addition to the MB board...

I don't agree with your advice...and I heard loudly how compassionate and dear it really is...

it goes contrary to respect...

by repeating.

Do not repeat, AmI. He KNOWS. Your love is in the Plan B letter...he has that. Let it go. Would you apologize for saving your marriage? Do not apologize to him. Tell BIL that you realized you broke contact in the IM. Ask BIL to convey to WH that you don't address waywards...because WH is assaulting your children and marriage. You miss your DH dearly...and you will delete all emails directly to you from WH without reading them.

Then do it.

Do not repeat yourself.

Silence.

Blindness.

And when he's at work...practice your O&H statements to the mirror. Practice aloud your reality indicators...what you know and what you do not know. Respect both.

I want to hear you doing what I advised RogueX to do in my last post...for you, about you...and that you've spoken directly to the children, holding their hands, affirming their stuff...and listening more than talking. What you can't explain, don't. Stay present.

You are doing it as an act of honesty, openness and respect. You are not doing it to recruit or protect. Get set with your intent, AmI...you'll find relief and validation inside of you when you do.

Then pray with the children for God's aid in restoring your marriage, keeping this wonderful, blessed family together, and thank him for this opportunity to really know without doubt what love truly is.

LA

WOW! HI guys! I lost internet connection and just got it back.

AmI, I hope that you and the kids are doing well tonight! LA's post was pretty powerful to me I must admit! With that in mind, you are in a sitch I have no experience in; however, like you I am learning. I still shudder inside to think about the night that I stood up to H and said "I am not scare of you!" That was empowering and it was a matter of sticking to word and being consistent.

Consistent just like you are with children...no backing down...something I had grown accustom to...

It was a large internal complaint for me...I would beat myself up so often for saying no, I don't want to do this and then H wold come in and I would give myself away. It's not an easy task to stand your ground but every time I did it, I felt better. Is this something that you did? Backed down when you really didn't want to...allowing yourself to be the doormat...I did...

Well, I'm wishing you a good night and a wonderful day for you...knowing that you are strong, capable, loved, worthy of love, admiration and respect. You are a joy to know...pat yourself on the back, if you haven't for what you've accomplished so for...

It's all about progress...and you're making great headway!

Ami,

I hope that you're ok this morning.

I agree with LA that you need to stay calm and focused. What I don't know the answer to is what is best for your situation, which is quite different from others on this forum. It's difficult enough to Plan B with children at all, but your situation is obviously much more complicated.

What were the kids told the first time you separated when you moved out? Did they know that their dad was having an affair and that's why you left? It's important that they're not caught in the middle, but they must know that things are not going well and they must be scared about what will happen. They need to know what's going on. They also need to know how much you care about them.

Can you afford to speak with Steve Harley right now? I think that your particular situation may not fit with the typical Plan B advice. The danger of the biological mother getting wind of the problems and trying to take them is pretty serious.

The main thing is that you protect yourself -- not just financially and physically, but emotionally.

Last night, I gave my BIL a copy of the letter that I sent to H's work, to give to H. I also gave him some information for H about DS's birthday, and other things that he'd been asking me about. H had left me a voice mail about converting his old cell phone to an account for DS.


About 10:30 last night, H came to the house. I was already in bed, but could hear him walking around. Then he came in the bedroom and wanted to know if I got his voicemail about the cell phone.

I said "H, I've asked you not to contact me. BIL has that information."

Then I rolled over and laid back down.

He ranted about how stupid this was and that when he gets his own place, "things will be very different" with my relationship with the kids.

I just didn't answer. If he hadn't been standing in the door of the bedroom, I would have walked out.

I'm so worried that this Plan B thing isnt' the right thing ....

Maybe it's time for a lawyer?

Ugh!

One day at a time...you said that you needed to practice that...

Patience...did you read your OT and ORd.'s reply about child protective services?

Stick with this for a while...you're not going to see immediate results...you are doing great...

What are you doing for yourself? Do you still feel centered?

We cross-posted...

How do you feel about him right now? Do you think that you want to try to save this marriage?

No matter what you want to do, you NEED to get a lawyer as soon as you can. He obviously is not going to leave for at least a few more weeks. And it doesn't sound like he wants to play fair.

I guess you need to think about what end result you hope for and think about the best plan for trying to acheive the end result. That's why I think a conference with Harley might be good right now. I'm not a MB expert anyway, but your situation doesn't seem to have any easy solutions that I can see. Plan B seems to work great in some cases, but in others, it doesn't help. The main objective would seem to be protecting and healing yourself. Is it doing that for you? Your H has to expect you to be extremely angry and sick of him right now. So, I think that gives you time to continue as you're doing while you evaluate your options and try to figure out the best way to handle this.

No, I'm suddenly not feeling at all centered and strong anymore.

I was so certain this was the right thing to do, and I believe it is for our marriage, but now I'm worried that it's not the right thing for the kids.

There's a big part of me that's saying "suck it up and be nice and pretend everything's ok and you can get along and be friends -- for the kids sake."

My stomach is in knots!

The office of the lawyer I was using just informed me that she has a "conflict of interest" and can't take the case and can't advise me anymore.

Also, I usually use a shortened version of my name. The only person who uses my full name is my H. When the lawyer's office told me this, they used my full name.

So, I think that my H has hired her as a lawyer.

Guess I need to find another one ... and get them on retainer this time.


I went home for lunch today, thinking that H would be sleeping. He came upstairs while I was in the kitchen and started talking to me about schedules for the kids and their activities. I just didn't respond. He asked me about DS and what he was doing tonight, and I just didn't answer, went to my room and shut the door.

And bawled and bawled and bawled into the pillows and blankets so he wouldn't hear.

My heart hurts.
This sucks. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/teary.gif" alt="" />

-AmI.

Don't suck it up and be nice. You do need some help, though. You need a lawyer and you need to talk to someone like Steve Harley to guide you through this.

I really don't know... but I'm worried that Plan B is going to cause you more problems in your current situation. That doesn't mean you have to do the opposite and be nice to him and act like nothing is wrong. And if Plan B is the right course, I'm really worried that I'm making you second guess yourself. That's why I think you really need to talk to someone who's seen a lot of couples and has some idea of how to counsel you.

You have been incredible in this whole mess that he created. You should be proud of yourself. But now it's time to protect yourself from him, because he sure isn't going to consider your or anyone else's interests right now.

Maybe you should put a call out here and try to get some emergency help before the weekend starts. I don't know what to suggest. I would hope that appealing to his sense of decency would help, but obviously he doesn't have any left. Maybe if everyone here brainstorms, you can get some ideas that make sense.

No matter what he throws at you, you're going to be ok. You're a really good person who's stuck in this mess through no fault of your own. He has to live with the chaos he's created and all the repercussions. You have nothing to feel bad or guilty about. You can go on knowing that you did everything you could. So from that point of view, you do need to remain calm and quiet inside. It's early days too, so it's hard to predict what's going to happen.

((((((((((((((AmI)))))))))))))))))

I am soooooo sorry that you are hurting sooo bad right now...I just can't imagine that LA would stire you wrong...

I wish I had more to offer you right now...

Ami,

You can bet he hired the lawyer. It is the only way it can be a conflict of interest.

Second his sudden interest about the kids and their schedules came from a lawyer.

When I visited the lawyer he quized me about all of that stuff.

I knew the answers to all of his questions because I was involved.

Typical questions- age of kids, birthdates, teachers names, doctors names, how often do you pick up and drop off at school etc.

These will all go into custody arrangement. I wouldn't worry to much about him knowing but I would certainly start a log or journal.

Do not give him the answers to his questions. You will only be helping him out.

I can not help you with the pain but I can tell you PROTECT YOURSELF and your children.

The other thing is ask your lawyer about filing etc. I was asked if she would file. Who ever files pays most of the admin fees in my state and it also might hurt them in custody. Just an FYI.

Get prepared do not wait. As a matter of fact if you are in plan b next time he calls say "why don't you have your lawyer call mine." So he knows you know. I might even use his lawyers name.

AmI, I am so sorry, my thoughts and prayers are with you. You will make it, honey.

AmI...

I believe you are experiencing great pain from your WH's threats...and they are threats about the children...and you have feared this all along, in good times and in bad.

Please know your fear has not come true...believing this gives you the experience in your thoughts and feelings that it has come true.

AmI...you are home with your kids. You are. Each day, tell yourself that...it is the truth. The truth does set you free, woman...I swear by it.

You are experiencing reactions from being ritually abused with this threat...each time WH has said "MY CHILDREN" for the last eight months, that fear has risen up...you've tried to refute, retaliate and compensate...all along, knowing your limits.

Breathe, bawl LOUDLY...from your grieving soul...do not hide who you are, what you feel and think, or what you believe. To hide is to cause shame within yourself for what is not yours now.

Be mindful, AmI...do what HL says but do not believe this is over...know today for what it is...you are not divorced, legally separated...your marriage has NOT ended...

Know these truths...you are apt to believe what WH says, and take it for your own truth. It isn't. Not even close.

Did you talk to the children? Would you do it with SIL/BIL present? Would that help? Now is the time...now...

You don't have to feel centered to know you are.

Check your intent, your goal...do they remain what they were? Have you changed them?

You have a thousand hearts containing you in their prayers...you are not alone. You are precious. You were born that way.

LA

Yes, I am definitely experiencing pain from the threats. I am terrified of losing my kids.

My intent, my goal, is to save my family -- even my marriage -- but my fear is that I will sacrifice my kids by doing so. Because he does have the power to carry out that threat.

It's hard to not let that fear seem real. You're right, I feel like it's already come true. And that's where this panic is coming from about the kids.