My wife and I have been married for over 13 years. Prior to that, we lived together for 7. We've been together for over 20 years, and I've considered them to be the best years of my life.

The last year or so, hasn't been as good, however. We've drifted apart, and although I knew we had problems, I was constantly reassured that 'everything's ok'. Recently I discovered, however, that my wife has been having an online relationship with a man 16 years her junior. They met playing an online game together, in which I used to participate with her. We've grown apart there too, she going her way, and I going mine.

I discovered e-mail correspondence between her and this man, quite by accident (I was setting up a new computer for my wife, and she had left the e-mails in her 'sent items' folder). In the particular e-mail, she sent a cartoon of a woman chatting online with a man who then rushed over and they kissed passionately, right in front of the woman's husband. The text that she had written was, 'For you my love'. Another similar e-mail simply had '*kisses*' written.

My heart stopped when I saw these. I knew things were strained, but this just floored me. I found that the mails had been sent some four months previous, and she had continued corresponding and calling this man on a regular basis. I confronted her immediately about the situation, and when asked, she told me 'I do love him, he's my best friend'. When I asked if she loved me, I got 'I'm not sure'.

This hurt even more. I asked if she wanted to work on the relationship, and she told me, 'I don't know - I think so'.

This occurred almost 4 weeks ago, right after my birthday. Since then, things amongst us have been strained to say the least. I have tried to talk with her to find the source of her unhappiness, and I get a lot of 'I don't know's. When I try to get more specific, she closes down and looks at me as if she hates me.

We have made some progress on why she has been so unhappy though, I have found that I have made a lot of Selfish Demands, and I have several annoying habits that irritate her. She believes that I should have known these things all along without being told. She also, apparently has told me about some of them, but has given up on trying after I wasn't in a place to listen.

Well, believe me, I have received a wakeup call. I have tried to correct the negative behaviors as best I can, and I believe that she is recognizing that fact. I have tried to do many of the things I know she likes, in the hopes that she'll notice those as well.

My big problem now is that she is still uncomfortable talking to me, and letting me know just how she feels, and what is still bothering her. She also wants to spend very little time giving me her undivided attention, preferring to run off and play on the computer, without me. She still is in contact with this other man, but I don't think it's nearly as much as it was.

I have started seeing a MC myself, although she refuses to accompany me. She has always had a problem expressing her feelings, and it makes her very uncomfortable to talk about them. I am still hurting from these events, but have taken it upon myself to correct the behaviors that drove her away in the first place.

I just need a way to open up the communication barriers that we have so I can continue to find ways to make her happier.

Any advice you can provide would be much appreciated.

Prophet, an on-line affair is just as hurtful as any other emotional affair and just as dangerous. They can turn physical in a heartbeat. If you do not already have them, I suggest you get copies of Surviving An Affair by Dr. Willard Harley, and Not "Just Friends" by Shirley P. Glass, Ph.D.

Your wife is involved in an inappropriate relationship and it has to be broken up. There are ways to do it and you will have MB folks ready to help you through the process.

If I could, may I suggest you take a look at a post I made on another thread the other day. I know you're confused about what you should do next and I put together a sample strategic plan to help people organize themselves to apply MarriageBoard principles to recover their marriage. That post can be found here:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...0&fpart=all

Please scroll down until you find my screen name and take a look at what is there.

For right now, you need to secure those "incriminating" emails so they don't get lost some how. Emails like those have a habit of doing that. You can print them if you want, or forward them to an email account or a computer to which your wife does not have access.

Then please tell us a little more about your circumstances. Does your wife work or is she a stay at home mom (SAHM)? What do you know of this other man (OM)? When is your wife usually on line with him, etc., etc. You have complete anonymity out here. Please use it to your advantage and give us more details rather than fewer.

Hang in there, Prophet. Things seem overwhelming right now but others have gotten through this and come out the other side with stronger marriages than before.

Yes! Details and action. Inaction always makes things worse. Do what people here say- we've all been throught the EXACT same thing.

People think their situation is somehow "different," but, fundamentaly, it's not. They are all textbook to a point.

Details-Plan-Action-Determination

Do it.

Thank you for the replies.

It's been almost 4 weeks since D-Day, and the OM lives 3000 miles away (and is in college). I don't think they'll be seeing each other, ever. She agreed to almost NC when the EA was discovered. At this point, they only talk to each other in-game with 40 other people around, and I am frequently in the room with her.

Last night we had a long talk, and while I did almost all the talking, she did open up a bit. This is rare for her. She said that she is trying to let go of the anger she has built up over the past year, and is making an effort to communicate better.

She, unfortunately, expects me to know everything I have done to hurt her, and I haven't been listening as well as I should have over this time. On the other hand, I tend to be pretty clear on what bothers me.

She gets angry when we talk about the M because she feels the changes I'm making are transitory, and when happiness returns, I'll let them all go and return to my old habits.

She's let me know about a few of the LB's that I have demonstrated, and I am working hard on addressing the habits and mindset that lead to those things. I guess you would say I'm in Plan 'A'.

I did request NC, and reiterated that again last night, but I'm not quite ready for full exposure. The only people to expose to would be the guild that she belongs to in the game, and her mother. Most of her guildmates are kids, and really wouldn't understand, but I think I may talk to her mother soon.

Hope this isn't too scattered, but last night was actually a good night for us :-)

Sounds more like appeasement than progress. You've been discussing her having "no contact" with this OM so instead of getting angry she's trying to give you some crumbs so you'll stop complaining or forcing the issue.

Want to know how bad her "addiction" to OM is? Try going home tonight, boxing up the computers and having a computer free household for awhile (or forever). It is a fact, it is impossible for your wife to work on "her issues" and your marriage until she has completely removed herself from her crackpipe.

I suggest you employ other snooping techniques as well to see and confirm whether or not they've merely taken their "friendship" underground. Secret cell phone, instant messaging, text messages, whatever. You must inspect what you inspect. Sitting in the "game" with OM and WW is merely allowing continued contact. How long you gonna do that? It's straight up disrespectful. Get a voice activated digital recorder and hide it in the house or her car. Keylog her computer if you can. Information is power and you'll use it for the benefit of your marriage, to save it...so it's not bad for you to do it. Your wife has a problem and you are the only sane person around to help her address it and overcome it. Get the information you need to do so for HER and you.

From what I read I am guessing you both take this game seriously; however, for the sake of your marriage you both need to get out of it. Neither one of you can be healthy, individually and as a married couple AND stay in the game. The fantasy world of the game no longer exists, its real now with real life consequences. You can't put the genie back in the bottle. Get out now. (If you keep the computer I suggest trying the Marriage Builders game...my wife and I both post here religiously and together find it great for our marriage and a great recreational companionship opportunity, albeit a serious one)

I wish you well. I think this a more serious issue than you are willing to believe. If OM had been more age appropriate and local...you can bet it would have gone to a physical affair and your wife just told you she's not sure she loves you. Your marriage is in serious trouble. Drastic action is needed on your part. Get involved. Read the books. Post. Expose to her mother.

You will make it.

Mr. Wondering

Quote:
She agreed to almost NC when the EA was discovered. At this point, they only talk to each other in-game with 40 other people around, and I am frequently in the room with her
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I don't know which game but I am almost sure most have chat and she can be talking to him in /tell or /wisper, etc right? Not really with 40 people around.

She needs to quit playing that game:( I know how hard this will be for her... but you know there will never be a NC till she quits the game... And change servers wont work he might just follow her there. Same for new chars or whatever she tells you.

Alright friend...so has your wife agreed to work on your marriage with you?

I have been EXACTLY where you are...the online game was Everquest. My wife met XOM in game, the 'friendship' escalated from spending all her time with him in game to IM'ing and emailing out of game...to include sending 'e-cards' like you described. They also were calling each other...convinced that they were in love with each other, even though they had never met in person.

You need to remove her contact with him...COMPLETELY. Yes, that means leaving the game...at least until HE leaves it as well. Again, remember I've been where you're at.

Get a keylogger installed on her computer now...and depending on the game, you should be able to go into your prefs and enable automatic logging of all the characters in game.

Tell her now that she needs to take a break from the game. This isn't optional. She needs to end ALL contact of ANY kind with him...period. Go cancel the game accounts...consider removing internet from your home for a while too.

She's addicted...recognize that.

Be ready to spend weeks/months dealing with her withdrawl from the end of the affair. Read up here what that can be like.

At the same time, you need to become a broken record on a few things with her. Make it clear to her that this has been that 'wake up call' for you...I used the exact same phrase. Let her know that your changes are NOT transitory...this has been THAT big of a wake up call.

And when you're sure that NC has been enforced for real...get the both of you into counseling...both MC and IC. BUT...make darn sure that all the counselors involved are PRO marriage and understand infidelity and how to recover a marriage from the damage that causes.

Take a look over on the recovery board for my story...look for another older thread on GQII here for a post by CARDSONLY talking about recovering from online affairs.

KEEP POSTING. Read up and learn plan A and B.

Prophet, Mr. Wondering has given you some very important advice and outlined the beginning of a path out of this mess. The addiction of the game is as bad as an addiction to drugs in many respects. Even if she gave up this man without a struggle, she'll drift into a relationship with another on-line "friend" sooner or later.

If you want your wife back, you have to understand it is SHE who made the choice to indulge herself in a cruel, selfish on-line relationship...one that would have grown into something else eventually. She blames you for not seeing her pain over the last year...but can't find any fault with herself for being unable to make that pain clear to you. See what I mean? If you were unable to understand, your wife was also unable to get it through to you. She's just as responsible for any legitimate pain she's endured. No sir, you didn't cause this affair. You might not have done all you could to keep it from beginning in the first place, but you are not the cause.

Prophet, I first lurked on this board for a year or so and I've been actively posting for a little more than eight months. In that time, I've seen any number of betrayed spouses hesitate to expose their spouse's adulterous relationships. Invariably, they come back later and sorrowfully explain how stupid they were to not take MB advice and expose, expose, expose. Now it's too late, they say. They've lost it all because they couldn't understand how vital it was to shine the light of day onto a sordid, squalid adultery.

Now I see you hesitating also. Mister, if you do not expose to people who can put pressure on this relationship, even if by no more than a disapproving glance, you are refusing to use your strongest tool. If you don't do it, there is little hope you can salvage your marriage.

Now, Mr. Wondering gave you a challange. Prophet, are you man enough to go home and get that computer out of your life? Do as Mr. Wondering described. Box the thing up and throw it up in the attic for a while. I dare you.

I will demand the NC be enforced, I am not ready to box up the computers, as playing on them is currently one of the RA's we can do together for some UA that both of us enjoy.

I put the bug in her head last night about the NC - I asked her to think about how she feels after contact, does it just increase her anger and frustration with me for asking that it stop.

I will ask for the contract of NC tomorrow night when we have our M talk. I'll let you know how it goes :-)

I'm curious...what game are the two of you playing? Everquest, or WoW? EVERY online affair I've seen that had anything to do with games was one of these.

So...there are no other possible recreational opportunies in the world EXCEPT that game? You know, if I had that monkey on my back, I'd do everything I could to get it off.

As for NC, take a look at MelodyLane's thread on just that subject. "Read My Lips" is the partial name.

OWL - We've been playing WoW. It's a very social game, but many times the two of us just run around and play together. I fact that's how our playing started, but we drifted apart about 6 months ago when she started spending all her time with OM rather than me.

LH - There are plenty of RA's that we can try, but right now, the game is a comfortable place for us to open up to one another. We play in the same room and talk a lot, and when we do, she is more open and communicative that others. Right now, it's a primary source of UA and I don't know that we're willing to give that up just yet. However, we are playing on a different server than OM, and not telling anyone we know in-game where we are when we do so.

So you're always at home with her and you know she absolutely never plays the game if you're not there...so there isn't any danger? I think you're playing with fire, Prophet, but good luck.

Those kind of games are very addicting. Because the internet makes things so annonymous, you can spend hours each day, and share things you'd never tell someone in person. (Kind of JUST LIKE WE TELL OUR KIDS TO AVOID DOING!) Anyway, having an addictive personality myself, I can tell you this connection will likely not fade while you are still in the game. Is it possible to try to take a physical vacation away from the computer? Go outside, go for a hike, start training to run in a 5K, heck, go out to a movie together. Anything to get that habit of logging on every hour out of the way. The other thing to remember is that when you play a fantasy game, you have a tough time separating it from your regular life (ever have dreams about WoW?--Betch the wife does.) It's almost like quitting smoking while working in a cigarette factory--while the game continues, so will the memories of the EA, and then true withdrawl will never begin. If you've followed this board, you've seen where folks have had to pick up their homes and physically MOVE, just to get the memories and potential for contact out of the way. All you need to do is unplug from the game. As difficult as it may seem, count your blessings that at least you don't have to quit your job, or disown your best friend, as others here have learned. Good luck!

OK, we've had a few posters come on with similar issues like this, and one of the biggest problems I've seen is the focus on the game, not on helping them deal with the affair.

I, like many others here, play online games. I was addicted...and broke the addiction. I can't remember the last time I logged in. Not worried about it.

The issue here is NOT the game...the issue is helping our friend deal with the affair.

Now...the game is the main form of contact for his WW...so yes, the game does need to be dropped out of their life for as long as it takes to get OM out of the picture...

My wife and I play EQ today, even though her EA started as a result of her meeting him in game...we've made massive changes so that there's pretty much NO more chance of meeting her former OM in game than there would be in meeting him in his home city if we were just walking the streets...less really, since we're avoiding the 'streets' we know he used to haunt.

Make sense?

The game was the introduction to the OM. It has since moved to IM, E-Mail, and phone conversations. She has cut out the IM and phone as far as I know, and has cut out most other contact with him. She still participates (although much less frequently) in the game to visit with her other friends there. I have talked to her about this, and am waiting for her reactions.

She is angry with me that I have made her give up her 'friend', but I can live with that anger (of course). I just need to concentrate on the NC at all thing.

Thanks for all your help so far.

The big thing I'm looking for, however, is how to open up the lines of communication so that I can get more that one word responses from her when I talk about the M. Suggestions on how to make conversations safe for both participants so she doesn't feel trapped and harassed (I'm completely avoinding DJ's, SD's, and AO's - and only talk about the R when I'm in a calm mood).

Until she totally goes to NC with him, it's still and ongoing affair. You can do Plan A. If you don't have Dr. Willard Harley's Surviving An Affair, get it and study it thoroughly. That book is where Plan A comes from. In the meantime, you can read up on Plan A from here:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html

Here are some tips and musings about Plan A:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html

And here is Pepperband's view of Plan A's "Carrot and Stick" approach:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...=&PHPSESSID

hi Prophet,

I am a FWW, i too had a online-affair. Please please be very careful. These online affairs can very very quickly become very addicting. Does she stay at home? Do you work? Is she alone at home at times? The reason that i ask these... i am a SAHM and when my husband wasnt home, i was on the computer playing games with OM (it all started with the sims, went on to DAOC, SWG and in the end we played WoW). I made seperate email accounts and made new login names for messengers. I went into the history after we had talked for hours on end, and went through the conversations to edit them, because i knew my husband would check them.

Please, please be very careful, i dont know how far she is involved, but with me it was pretty deep, pretty fast, only took 2 months of knowing him to be completely hooked on him. I did all sorts of things to hide it from my Husband.

When i played games with my husband (when he was home), i would think of the things that i did with OM in that game, its a trigger for the emotions, she will not get over him staying in that game.. even if she has absolutely no contact to him, it will play with her emotions, it will be some sort of connection to him, in her mind..

My husband installed a keylogger and another program on my computer after i told him that i "loved" that other guy. The other program took screenshots ever so often. I knew that, he told me, and since i was afraid that my husband might actually kick me out or get severely p*****d off at me, i didnt contact the OM anymore, but i stayed in the last game that we had been in, just roaming the world, hoping OM would cross my path somewhere.

And after about 4 weeks of that, there was an avatar that came around my char pretty often, and i had a feeling that it was him, and my suspicions were right. I freaked out when he im'd me. I closed the window and instead of letting it go... i used a calling card to call him.

Please, dont believe what she says.. be very careful. She has been close with this man for months. Just protect yourself, do what it takes to make sure there is no contact. If need be, get rid of the game.. get rid of the computers.

I had a female friend in those games as well, and she was completely hooked in an EA as well, she said she would never leave her husband for OM, cause she knew it was only a fantasy, but she also said, if her husband would ever make her choose between computer and Husband, she would choose the computer!!! As far as i know, she is still in her EA, going on 3 years now.

Keep your eyes wide open Prophet, you dont really know this person that is your wife right now. She might do things you wouldnt expect of her. I am not saying she is doing all the things that i did. I just want you to be able to see that there are ways around it if she was/is hooked on that guy.

The OM in my case (13 years younger than me), has had quite a few women online like me, last game he was in was in WoW, couldnt help but wonder if its the same guy ~shiver~. She didnt happen to play on the destromath server, did she?

I would suggest plan Aing your little heart out


ummm I would suggest your drop expectations of commitment to reconcilliation or the marriage RIGHT now...those are futile power struggling conversations of familiar territory where the WS gets to play victim to their own affair...


NO relationship talk...no point right now...

do you understand plan A......
do you ?

ARK^^

Ark is on the money here....

You need to focus on starting plan A.

Read the steps of this...

1. Exposure
2. Work on identifying her EN's and meeting them.
3. Improve yourself
4. Continue to work to end the affair.

In your case, exposure might also extend to her (and your) online/in-game friends as well.

Work on meeting her EN's...read up about those on this site.

Work on improving things for yourself too.

END THE AFFAIR. Start by ending the online gaming for now. Make it clear to her that she needs to get out of game and back into her LIFE...with you and the rest of the world. I had to get my wife into his mode as well. It will likely take some extreme measures...and it WILL end up with her being angry at first. Brace yourself for that.

Once you've got contact ended...give her some time to get through the worst of the withdrawl. THEN worry about communication, counseling, etc...