Sounds like it was a productive first session. Your husband probably won't say much about it, but I doubt he missed much of what you said. He'll be thinking about it from now until the next session and things will begin to percolate in his mind.

Isn't it about time for that bike riding class?

Leslie,

IMO, you are focusing a lot on him.

It's going to be helpful to think about what you need to change in yourself..

I say this because you will feel helpless and hopeless if you focus on what your H needs to change...

He needs to make his own decision about what he needs to change..

Same for you...

MiMi


I know most of post so far sound like gripes. You are right because this is the ONLY support sounding place I have. My sons have their own problems to deal with, we have no family here for support so you and everyone else is it for me.

I know that the only one that change H is himself. Where I come into the picture is I get to decide if the changes he makes or doesn't make are things I can live with.

I have done a lot of soul searching and have taken accountability and responsbility for my actions that helped our marriage get to this point. I have also apologized for my mistakes.

I am also beginning to realize that "life" is a journey that I am in charge of. I am ultimatly the one the responsbile for making myself happy or unhappy. I can choose in life my actions and reactions.

I guess what it boils down to is I am finally growing up. I am making daily commitments and promises to myself. I know that RESPECT starts within each of us. We can't expect others to respect us when we don't do it for ourselves.

My thoughts are "I've only just begun Baby". <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Use us to vent any time you want to, Leslie. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Just a little news. H is wearing his wedding ring again. Another step taken by him. He's now spending some time in the house, like tonight he's playing his guitar.

However here is the best part. I feel like I'm at peace right now. I guess the best way to explain it is I'm focusing on school right now so that takes up quite a bit of my time.

Yes I'm still here for H, but I'm also doing things I enjoy. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Excellent. Glad to hear it, Leslie.

Where are you, Leslie? Don't go silent on us, okay?

Leslie,

I have followed your story closely on this board. You have stopped posting so often.
I am anxious to know how things are going for you now with your H.

Soft hugs,

SunKissedBeach.

Hi Sun, thanks for asking. I guess I had gotten to the point where it felt every post was a complaint about H so I wasn't posting as much. I will try to do better because I am sure there were at least a few that are following my story.

H moved back home and we are in MC. We have only gone to one session so far. While H has taken a few baby steps we have a long way to go. So far he has done the following: written a NC letter to OW, answers the phone at work when I call, going to MC with me, put his wedding ring back on, has returned to sleeping in our bed, talks to me about everyday type of things (non issue things). He still shows no remorse, has not talked about the affair, has not removed password from cell phone, has not given up P.O. Box, no kisses, no hugs, has not said anything about the future (like vacations, or anything). We have not gone out to eat or done anything together outside the house (eating out, walks, etc)

Since we only had the one MC session, and that was really just a get to know the counselor one, we haven't tackled any issues yet. As you can probably guess, I have a ton of questions for him but I want to ask him under controlled circumstances (as in MC).

We are in a "holding status" for lack of a better word. I don't feel that he is "all here" yet. I'm afraid to push for more then he's ready to give. I have to admit honestly though, I wonder if we will make it. We have so much baggage to clean up and since I can't tell if H is committed it still leaves me in a state of limbo.

I am trying to keep my faith that with MC H and I will learn how to talk to each other and can finally have a marriage that both of us are happy in. I can honestly say, I love him but at the same time I wonder if it's worth it. There have been a couple of times that I felt like telling him that if he doesn't want to be here he just needs to go. (I bite my toungue when I want to say that) and count the number of days to the next MC session.

To some degree the "emotional shutdown" we had before was more comfortable because at least then I knew how he felt about me. Now I just have to wonder. One of the hardest things for me to mentally deal with is the "unknown". I can't let go of some of the things I want to know until I have some answers (ex: how long affair was going on, why he answered her ad to begin with, etc).

I am slowly learning to stop focusing exclusivily on H (hence the lesser number of posts) and am trying to do the things I need to do for myself. I wonder though if things will ever get to the point where I feel we will make it.

School started this past week so that is taking up a lot of my time, then I'm also studying for my learn to ride motorcycle class (that is next weekend) and then my younger son had inured himself and had to have emergency surgery early this morning. (will post about that seperatly).

Emergency Surgery for our 21 year old son.

It seems our son thought he was much stronger then he actually was and injured himself in the process. He was lifting some weights and a friend was spotting him (whatever that means) and son told friend I've got it, so the friend let go of the weights and it was to heavy for my son (was told it was about 130 pounds in weights) and he dropped the weights.

He woke us up in the middle of the night Thursday night saying he needed to go to the hospital. So up H and I get, rush and get dressed and take him to the hospital. Son was in a lot of pain in the lower part of his abdomin and was semi conscious (not talking a lot, moaning, etc).

They take some X-rays at the hospital and discover he has air in his lungs in a location there shouldn't be any. The also run a drug test (which came back positive) and he had Zanix, Cocaine and Marijuana in his system. This came as no surprise to H or I since it's an issue we've been dealing with him now for about 7 years. The also wanted to run a CT scan and inserted a tube in his nose, also had to run a catheter (spelliing?) on him.

So test are run, and about this time I guess son's drugs were wearing off and he became mouthy to the staff at the hospital and told them they were not going to operate on him that he had a friend that went to that hospital for simple foot surgery and wound up dying. (not completly true but that was his perception, and so to him that was his truth). He wound up pulling out the tube that was in his nose and checked himself out (much to our dismay) against medical advice.

We drove him to another hospital since he agreed to get a second opinion and once we got there he wouldn't get out of the truck. (again our hands are tied because he's a legal adult) A pretty stupid one I will admit but never the less we can't admit him.

So at that point, H and I were pretty disgusted with son and brought him home. He went upstairs to bed and I stayed home from work to keep an eye on him. He slept until about 6 p.m. Friday night. (They had given him pain meds at the hospital). Once he got up I was able to talk him into going to a different hospital and getting another opinion.

So off we go Friday night. We got to the hospital about 7:00 p.m. and they redid the x-rays and did more blood work and came up with the same diagnosis. He had to have exploratory surgery. Son agreed to it and was in a much calmer mood. (H and I think basically he had come down off the high he had self induced).

Son had the surgery and it turned out he had a hole in his bladder. It took the Dr. a while to find it since he had to manipulate a few organs around to discover the hole. (Sorry so graphic). As of right now S is in the hospital, has a tube in his nose and will be in the hospital for 5 - 7 days.

Hi, Leslie. Thanks for coming back and posting. Don't be concerned about the tone of your posts. If you need to vent, MB is a great place to get it out of your system so it doesn't get in your way.

I have to read your husband through your eyes, but I don't see him as being "all there" either. Part of that is fallout from the adultery. I think part of it is also just reversion to a "comfortable" lifestyle of emotional withdrawal in which you two lived for too long. I think he's also a conflict avoider. I believe he'll stay detached as long as he can, and one of the big tasks your counselor faces is getting your husband to engage in a dialogue with you about your relationship.

You're doing what you can to reverse these things. I believe your realization you cannot do it all yourself is healthy, as is the understanding that this might fail in spite of everything you can do. If that turns out to be the case, though, you will know you did everything a woman could do to make this work and you'll have no lingering doubts about whether you could have done more.

That having been said, your WH has shown progress in coming to a real commitment to the marriage. It’s just that it’s glacially slow, huh? He’s not going to move very fast on any of the important issues without some good prodding from your counselor, and you too. It’ll come with time.

I’m glad that class has started. Be sure to tell us about it from time to time, okay? And by all means, let us know how the bike riding experience is going.

I’m so sorry your son was injured. I hope he gets well quickly.

I agree with Longhorn.

Also want to share that it took a full 6 months for my FWH to be out of withdrawal and it has taken almost 3 years of Recovery for there to be absolutely no trace of foggy thinking..

I understand your need to vent about him Leslie.

My concern about you focusing on him was my awareness of how SLOW his changes may be..you've already sensed this..

Sorry to say though, this will take TIME AND PATIENCE.

Recovery has been the most difficult part of this for me.

Hang in there.

ETA..so sorry to hear about your son.

Confused about Policy of Joint Agreement:

Here is the situation:

H and I agreed to let our son move in for 3 months to get on his feet. He has now been here about 1 year. In additon two months ago he was given temporary custody of his son (our grandson)who is also now living with us. Son goes to court later this month for Full Custody.

I watch grandson at night while son works. Son will be transferring to day shift as soon as they find a replacement to cover the shift he is currently working. This is very exhausting to me watching him at night. I'm running out ofo energy and H never helps out with watching him

Son needs help finanacially right now to move out and afford a place of his own. He has applied for Rental Assistance with the state. He is on their list and waiting to hear if he qualifies.

I ask H if he thought we could contribute $200 a month (we can afford it) to help pay son's rent until son finds out how much he can qualify for with housing assistance. This was two days ago. His reply was I don't know. I asked H this morning if he has thought about it any more and his reply was "no".

H has helped out our youngest son financially many times (paying for attorney numerous times) works on his car, etc. However he doesn't do anything to help the oldest son.

My goal is to get both of our sons out of the house but help them to be able to stand on their own feet and be successful.

I know H and I have many rocky roads ahead of us and I feel that we need time alone to work on these things.

Based on the policy of joint agreement:


What to do in this case? I don't see H ever agreeing to help our son, yet he agrees that son should be moving out. I'm to tired to continue to watch grandson at night. Grandson is in pre-school while I'm at work. Son can't afford additional day care cost plus grandson doesn't need to be in day care any more time then he already is. There are NO daycares in the area that are open beyond 6 p.m.

It's hard to decide on difficult issues like this at this time when you are working on your marital issues. I know.

It's hard to know if your H is being difficult with you because of his withdrawal from the A..because of his fogginess..He has not reached the level of being a normal, functioning H yet.

Maybe your counselor can help you two with coming up with a decision that you both can live with..agree to..

This seems like an excellent starting point to work on your H's avoidance issues...and to get him to talk about his present thoughts and feelings...

Thanks mimi. I never thought of bringing it up in MC. I will do that on Thursday.

Leslie, your husband apparently does not like to make decisions on topics uncomfortable to him--it's part of being a conflict avoider. He probably was entirely truthful when he said he hadn't thought any more about it. Thinking about such a problem is not what a conflict avoider would do. Additionally, I just don't know how to jar a conflict avoider out of their routine and get a POJ agreement.

I don’t see any quick solution to the issue of getting your son and grandson set up in an apartment of their own except by bringing it up in MC as an example of your husband’s reluctance to confront decisions. Make sure the counselor and your husband understand this particular problem needs to be solved in the very near term…like the day after tomorrow, or something like that. The point needs to be made to both of them that your health is beginning to suffer, in addition to the adverse effects on your son and grandson.

When I saw your post, I went back to SAA (pages 96 to 108 in the hardbound version) to read up again on POJA. The thing that struck me most immediately is that POJA assumes both spouses will engage freely in negotiations. I'm not sure your husband will. It's hard to get a POJA on anything if the other party will not advance an opinion one way or the other. I don’t think your husband is ready for POJA and I feel he won't be for some time down the road in the recovery process.

If your husband won’t discuss the situation, I suspect a decision will have to be presented to him for his disapproval if he feels strongly enough about it. To me, this preserves the intent of POJA in that it isn’t an arbitrary decision made without the other’s knowledge. Also, I don’t see this as a decision that has much potential to hurt him one way or the other. The lack of a decision, on the other hand, has great potential to hurt you…and your hurt will eventually also have an impact on him.

I hope this helps. I’m very much afraid it only muddies the water more. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Will your son be getting child support from the mother?

Believer,

Currently he is not getting anything from the mother. She just got out of jail. My son did go to the child support department and let them know he now has is son. He recently got a letter from then giving him a case number and as far as I know my son has not pursued anything else. (Sometimes it feels like I have to hold his hand or give him a road map) on what he needs to do.

I will encourage my son to go back to the Child Support Department tomorrow and let them know that the mother is out of jail. Granted she's not working but that's her problem. She can get a job and pay or go to jail for not paying. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but when she had my grandson, my son was paying child support every week and she was still hounding him for more. She wasn't working then either.

My son goes to court the end of this month and will hopefully get full custody of his son. At that time we are hoping the judge will set an amount that the mother is to pay in child support.

Setting a goal for myself here, (learn to answer a question that is asked with a yes or no) instead of a long drawn out answer. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

LH, I have no doubt that my H hadn't given it anymore thought. This is typical of him, if it's not relevent to him he sweeps it under the carpet.

I came up with the same conclusion that you did in reference to the POJA assuming both spouses are willing to work on it together. That was my quandry. I'm trying to think of us as a "couple" when making decisions and H is still thinking as an individual.

We still have seperate banking accounts, not ready to combine mine yet. He hasn't mentioned it and neither have I yet. Right now my bank account is my "safety net". I have to admit though it's quickly dwindling.

I'm trying to hold on until counseling but I tell you I have so many things to bring up to counselor that it's tough to pick a few to work our way through. I know the only way I will get answers though is to bring it up in MC.

I could pay the $200 a month out of my account, yes it will have a big "impact" on my finances if I'm doing it on my own.

Leslie:

This is no doubt part of the problem. There is a big difference in helping a person get "set up"...but sadly, I think you are doing an awful lot of enabling for your sons behaviors and decisions. I know this will sound rude and unsympathetic...but your biys are MEN, and MEN have to make decisions for themselves and live with the consequences. It almost sounds like YOU are the only responsible adult in your family of four. That is a heavy burden to always carry.

I wish you luck.

Lem