I am creating a specific thread for this topic but I have another thread that Longhorn has been giving me advice on about my overall sitch....

I have a question because you guys are in a position that counter's mine. I am husband that wants custody or atleast 50/50 custody of my 3 girls (6/8/11) So I am fully engaged in their lives and when I realized that my wife was just going along with parenting, the only time they have breakfast before school is when I fix it and I fix eggs or pancakes. If they are hungary they usually fix themselves a bag of dry cereal to take in the car. So I work 60 hours a week and my wife works 15 hours a week

I come home / before we separated and would do things like vaccum or laundry or clean the toilets.

Now I am a service oriented person I like doing things for people so that is how I was trying to show that I cared..

So our girls are in private school that we both agree on but we are moving to another school - again we agree - now we have been talking about me taking the girls and picking them from school each day - its on my way to and from work and she is taking a new "her dream job" but it goes from 3:30 to 8PM almost every night. She also will work 1 weekend a month...

I am the primary breadwinner - which doesn't matter over custody but it matters since we have been sepearated for 2 months and she had said she would get a job that provide 40 hours a week so she could have her indepenence. We were also to put our house on the market - she has the paper weeks for 4 weeks never signed it.

So my question is if your H was a caring father and would do good things for you kids even if you were separated/divorcing what would you think of that?

I have issues with some of her actions and how she does mothering for herself and will let the kids operate on their own for a lot of the time.

So I have consulted a lawyer and he actuall says I am in a very good position to get 50/50 or sole custody... I am also not wanting the divorce so I am only doing the custody thing to get back into the home so I can be with the family on a day and night basis... Even separated I see the kids almost every day.

I just wanted to applaud you~for being active in the lives of your daughters.

I can't answer your question in full, because the WS in my sitch is not being active in parenting (though if you'd talk to him, you'd think the world was his kids). For me, it would kill me if he had sole custody. Because he is not actively seeking their best interest right now. One day, though, if he ever came back to earth and wanted to be a more active parent, I would more than welcome him into their lives. Not full custody, but as much as he'd like to see them.

But if he was a good parent and really there for the boys--something that is hard when he is all about OW--then I would want what is best for the boys--both parents in their lives--so joint might be okay. But the mama bear inside me would still have a lot to swallow and a lot to cry about--I'd miss having them around all the time.

But I am not your wife, and I don't have a spouse who would even desire full or 50/50 custody.

I have come to look at parenting as what is in the best interests of the child and their rights.

A child has a right to know both parents equally. As long as there are no safety issues involved with either parent.

50/50 I have seen work very well.


I must congratulate you on being an active parent. I dont know in the States , but do you attempt mediation before the court?

Max

During our previous separation, H and I had a pretty even parenting plan (as even as possible seeing as I homeschool my children). At first, H stayed in the house with the kids, I came everyday and stayed with them 10-12 hours a day, until H came home from work or wherever. Then I would leave, and he kept the kids at night.

Later, when his GF didn't like our house sharing, H had the kids 3.5 nights and I had them 3.5 nights (we alternated Wednesdays). On weekdays, he brought them to me on his way to work and picked them up on his way home. I did have more time with the kids since I had 3.5 nights plus all the schoolday hours. But if the kids had gone to school, I would have been very comfortable staying in the same school district and doing a true 50/50 split with no money changing hands.

Now that we are separated again, WH does not spend nearly as much time with the kids. He has them every Sat-Sun and every other Friday.

With your wife working those hours, I can't imagine that she would rather the girls be alone or with a sitter than with you. Document everyday about the times you are with the kids and best of luck to you and your family.

It wouldn't matter to me in terms of primary custody. My husband could be Mr. Rogers straight out of PBS... and he'd still have to step over my stone cold, dead body to take my kids away from me.

I carried them within my body, nurtured them at my breast. I've got the scars and stretchmarks that go along with all that. My body will never be the same, and that's okay with me. It was a good trade.

I gave up a promising career in order to care for them through their early development. Currently, I make about a fourth of what my husband makes. My career will never recover. Again, I consider it a good trade.

I made my sacrifices, and because I did, I'm 'in tune' with my children. I know their moods, when they're tired, when they're hungry, what makes them happy or sad. I know EXACTLY when they're ready for new developmental challenges. I know them intuitively with the innate skill of 'Mother'. Their heads could be made of glass... because I SEE the hamster on the wheel at all times. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />
They are the light of my life, my purpose for being...here in a sea of chaos.

It's possible that you might be able to force your wife to accept you back by threatening to take her children from her. If I thought somebody could do that to me.... heck yeah, I'd play the game. But I'd never truly love or trust a person who would do that. I'd never accept that person into my life in any meaningful way. I'd just be stalling for time until I could extricate myself from the situation and still keep my babies with me.

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make her drink. Who knows? You might be able to MAKE your wife remain in the marriage. But you can't make her love you and you can't make her forgive you.

viking...

We have a pretty lengthy document(e-book) regarding fathers winning custody that we purchased a while back for another poster, we would be glad to pass along to you if you would like...just email Mr. W and I at the addy in my signature...

Mrs. W

viking, it sounds very good to me. Fathers are just as capable as mothers of raising children. Mothers are not entitled to sole custody anymore than are fathers.

I wouldn't use that as a "threat," but I most certainly would follow through and seek primary custody. After all, you are better able to take care of them financially. Many fathers today do get primary custody and do an excellent job raising their children.

Well that is a very good question. I have gone through this very heart breaking and terrible thing. I was very young when I married my first H. When we split up, WE decided that HE would have physical custody. We had joint custody and joint guardianship. BUt he had physical custody. It killed me to do it.

BUT, I was also realistic. I thought of the children FIRST! NOt my own needs. Hey that's what Moms do. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
It was NOT a scarfice. Becasue when you sacrifice, it can build resentment. Sacrifice according to Dr Harley is NOT a good action to use. (Can you tell I just finished re-reading negotiations and Freelaoders, etc. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

My XH was and is a VERY loving father. He was a workaholic to some extent BUT the kids KNEW he was there for them. He had the means to have a live-in housekeeper AND me when He was on business trips etc.

My XH and I made a MUTUAL decison that we would ALWAYS present a unified front to the kids. And that IF and when we disagreed, we would work it out away from the children. No playing one against the other, etc.

THat was over 20 years ago. And MY XH and I are still great friends.

That being said. I am in the midst of a terrible D from a serial adulterer whose actions are alwasy for himself only. While he used to be a great Dad. NOw? Under no circcumstances would I even allow him to be alone with DD. He is not trustworthy. So in this sitch over my dead body would he get custody. He has no say in any of this. I have sole custody with DD14. I am her sole guardian. In this very different sitch, he has shown himself to be nothing but a sperm donor. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />.

BUt I must ask, WHY are you going for custody ? IF it is the best interests of the child, go for it. If it is just part of your plan to FORCE your wife to stay married. FOrget it. The children should NEVER be used as pawns or go betweens in your problems with your W. And THEY will FEEL it.

Please make sure you think of the children outside of your R problems.

So my wife was having an EA and wants her cake and eat it too and is fence sitting.

So I am living out of the house because I was asked to leave for her space and time... found out later it was so she could continue her EA. Now I can't move back in because of the laws... So I have to pay for two households and still pay all her bills... So I have explained to her that because I am paying for two households we are going to start missing bills and eventually we will have serious financial problems... so I asked her if she would swap with me, allow me in the house and she would move into her parents until we figure out what we are doing... I also offered to co-habitate with her but all suggestion to protec the family assets have been rejected...

Now I have been plan a it for a while, I am good guy. But my wife is in a fog and has done a lot of rewriting of history and is very angery at me for exposing her EA.

So I have been an equal parent but she has a real selfish streak and she plays the kids as pawns in her attacks on me.

So the only way I can get into the house and get our finances straight is takeing custody and have a court order for me to move back in.

If I had custody she would have 100% access to the kids..

Also I have made a promise to myself that I will not have any relationship while the girls are young, so I am going to committ to years of focusing on the girls so I don't mess up again.

I am a father that now has full legal and custodial custody. My son is thriving in this stable environment..
Do what is best for the children and fight. When it comes to the courts, dads are up against the odds... I have been there... but you can come out on top if the judge sees it is in the kids best interests. One way to find out, if the children are old enough... ask them how they feel about your wishes. they should have some say.

Well VikingRulers's wife mads a pretty bad trade when she elected to screw around wouldn't you say. She's an unfit mother wouldn't you say?

Why would being an unfit wife/husband automatically make an unfit mother/father?


Unless there is a physical or psychological danger to the child, a child has the right to know both parents equally.

Max

LJ, I think there must be some things you missed in Viking's other threads. Did you not see he's been doing the overwhelming amount of parenting for a long time? Does that not make a slight difference? If you read between the lines in Viking's posts, you'll also see a WW who wants only to do the fun things with her daughters but doesn't do needful things for them like cooking them breakfast. That's boring. She doesn't like it.

Also, there are any number of threads out here where WW's have absolutely abandoned their children in order to be with the OM, and vice versa. Not every woman has the same feelings toward her children you do. That you would fight tooth and nail for your children is commendable.

However, that you interpret what Viking is doing as a malicious “threat” is inexplicable to me and insulting to Viking. Frankly, I don’t understand that attitude. What evidence do you have Viking is not the more nurturing parent in that marriage? Lady, I think you owe the man an apology. I hope you wrote your words in haste and did not see the negativity in them because they sure seem to be ill considered and unfortunate.

Mad1, it’s because when a spouse values a relationship with an extra person in the marriage so highly, that wayward spouse is taking time, affection, energy, and love due the children and spouse and giving them to another person. The wayward spouse sets up a climate of stress, anger, lies, deceit, indescribable pain, and betrayal. Occasionally, the children become exposed to situations involving contact with thoroughly unsavory OPs. How about the health problems generated in the home because wayward spouses think nothing of exposing themselves...and their families...to STDs of all kinds.

Such a person is a terrible role model for children, don’t you think? Children learn from what they see and they see so much. You bet. A wayward spouse is most definitely a bad mother or father, simply because of what they are.

Any parent in an affair lies and sacrifices everything including their children to feed their addiction. Nuff said.

Wow, Ladyjane...

I am a FWW who will readily admit that I was a completely unfit mother while I was in my affair...no question about it...I could tell you what I consider horror stories about just how very unfit that I was...my head was elsewhere, and that was neither fair or safe for my DD...And YES, it would have killed me to lose custody of her, but if I am 100% honest, it was Mr. W that had her best interests at heart, certainly not me, at the time. At that time, I planned on moving myself and my DD 750 miles away from Mr. W...how would that have been fair to him? What in the world did he do to have to lose custody of his daughter? Just because I was the pregnant one who gave birth to her, does NOT make her any more mine than his...she is half him and half me...but you seem to imply that because we are the ones that bare the physical scars of childbirth that that somehow automatically entitles us to be the custodial parent...that simply is NOT the case as I see it...Last spring Mr. W fully intended to fight for sole custody, and it is my opinion that he should have and would have be awarded that if it would have come to it...

I will also tell you that when I was full of fog that we had a conversation about this, and he told me then that he would not allow me to move that far away with our daughter...and I shot Foggy Venom his way, by saying something to the effect of, "Well fine then, I guess I am just trapped, but I will HATE you forever, if I am forced to stay married to you!" Mr. W then stated his boundary to me, which was, and is, "I refuse to be in a loveless marriage." Ladyjane, when my fog lifted I was able to see what an incredibly amazing man that I am married to...one that despite societal norms would have done everything in his power to make certain of the well being of OUR daughter...Do you know what that further tells me? That he truly loves me...our daughter is a part of both of us-him loving her the way he does is him loving me...There was NOTHING he could do if I chose to continue to destroy myself, even though it was killing him to watch, but he would have fought til his very last breath to make sure that I didn't take our daughter down with me...I see that as nothing short of heroic...what a great daddy, what a great husband, what a great MAN!!!

Ladyjane, perhaps your perspective is a bit off here, because you are taking this too personally... If I remember correctly you are a BS, right? Think for a moment if you were a male BS...one, such as viking that has been a wonderful father...WHY, should he be deprived of his children based on a very poor life choice that his WW has made? Especially when she isn't even do basic things like cooking breakfast for them...Why should he be forced to suffer more? I don't know viking's whole story, but from what I gather, he made the decision to move out BEFORE he fully understood the anatomy of an affair and had gotten MB advice...so when you look at it that way he was pretty much forced out of his own home through the manipulation of his FOGGED OUT WW...He wouldn't be in the position to seemingly have to "force" himself back in if it weren't for her actions...I do NOT think he should be torn apart for doing what I most definitely feel is the right thing here...Can you honestly tell me that it is fair for him to be paying for 2 households, putting himself under immense financial strain and also not to get to see his children as often as he possibly can??? All the while she is carrying on an adulterous affair in the marital home and getting to be the custodial parent...HOW IS THAT FAIR??? And you think it's unfair of viking to FORCE her to do anything??? REALLY??? To me it is glaringly clear that she is the one that has FORCED all this unpleasantness on everyone in the first place-and hey, she's free to go, just without the marital home or the children, and those are what you call CONSEQUENCES!!!

VIKING, YOU GO GOOD SIR, YOU ARE MOST DEFINITELY DOING THE RIGHT THING...No question about it!

Lastly, Dr. Harley suggests using children as magnets to attract a spouse back to the marriage...I know that he has a good reason for suggesting that...I am a prime example of that, in fact...

Mrs. W

yup longhorn.. I know the cruelty adultery inflicts on all...all too well.

I am more concerned about the blanket statement.

Not all wayward spouses are bad parents.

They do, do a lot of nasty creepy things...but not all of them.


People have affairs for many reasons, some even include finding an exit( affair) to protect their kids.

Max

ah. but if they were protecting their kids they wouldn't be having an affair. Are you seriously suggesting the only way out of an abusive relationship is adultery?

nope didnt day that at all

I said people have affiars for many reasons.

one was an exit affair.


I am now studying again to enter a hopefull career in child protection.

I do not want to enter that arena biased.

Basing my future findings on emotions is something I can not afford.

Max

OK Very good Max, but like I said, there are other less cruel and heartless ways out of a bad marriage than an affair. An affair is the most selfish act of betrayal a parent can perpetrate on their spouse and their children. The affect on all is devastating. A person in an affair is not a fit parent by definition. Hope that's not too biased and unobjective for you.

I agree bigK that affairs are cruel.

Lets just agree to disagree eh?, coz I ain't budging on my opinion.

Max