My wh came over for memorial day to see the kids. He saw on the table my son's autograph book (8th grade graduation) and he wrote on the page in big letters- Im sorry- proud dad. No congrats or words of encouragement. My son looked at it and handed it to me and said Mom sign my book I left the first page for you.
My daughter signed it and saw it and said it looks like a cry for help. I dont know ... but why in world would he write that in his book?

Winter:

You haven't filled us in on what's going on between you and WH...

We are still seperated. He is I believe still with Vanessa- not in the way it was at the beginning. She is suppose to lose her home (foreclosed) this month, due to her not being able to find job and continue with Bankruptcy.
He I believe is going to move with his mom or nephew. He said he wants to move in low income housing and be by himself. He dosent want to be with anyone right now. He says he feels he needs to get himself together- then he can work on us. In the middle of all this mess he was saying im coming home soon, ect. now its i dont want to be with anyone- ive got to think about me. I found out yesterday that he has added lights and stuff to his car to make it light up at night (he is 43 yrs old for g-- sake')
and he told the boys im going to come by and let them see.
I talk to him and i am feeling more and more like the grown-up here. He wants to have the fun but not be here with the kids and me for the adult part of this.
I even said to him - what happened? It seemed for a while like you were really trying and wanted to work on us? (he came and told me he wanted to) and now your going back like the beginning. He says: I didnt know - goes into this whole thing about trust:
1. If you ask me to do something- know I am going to do it. ex. I will come over and barbeque. what time? in morning......leave off with that
2. Im going to pick up kids and take them out for a while. What time? 10 am- shows up 1:30? why didnt you call and say running late? again: If i say im coming you dont have to keep calling to see if i am or remind me- im coming- response: Its fine that you are coming over for boys but if you say 10 be herenot at 1:30. How long do you think a person should wait? an half hour, hour? Its called consideration. He says your right.
3. Money: He does pay Mortgage - but is crying broke. I cant get a place if I am paying mortgage- I have no money after that. Ok.
Then he says My family comes first and I told Vanessa that - that's why she cant look to me for help andIm not trying to help her save the house.
If I didnt care I would come around or anything.
4.
My wh came over for memorial day to see the kids. He saw on the table my son's autograph book (8th grade graduation) and he wrote on the page in big letters- Im sorry- proud dad. No congrats or words of encouragement. My son looked at it and handed it to me and said Mom sign my book I left the first page for you.
My daughter signed it and saw it and said it looks like a cry for help. I dont know ... but why in world would he write that in his book?
That's where we are now.
I am starting to feel pity for him more than love. Its been a long 10 months- rollarcoaster- one day hes positive , next not.
I dont call him unless I have to- try to keep it brief, He said he did go to counseling once and the psych told him he needs to go home and work on our marraige. That he is still attached to me and he can take small steps and work on this. Now he wants to go to school for Automotive (he already got that certificate but ok or xray technition) he said yesterday. He looks lost, he fell asleep on the deck and he hurrys up and leaves from the house when he comes bye- he looks around and stuff, cleans yard, garage, and says he will always take care of me and kids, be here for us, never abandon but that he is messed up in the mind and is trying to find out why he did what he did to us, left me, and why he's doing the things he is doing......He said this yesterday.

winter--good to hear from you, sorry it isn't better news. My WW said and did the same, I just moved on, as I couldn't be brought into her mess anymore. She has moved 6 times in the past 10 months. God has it been thatlong.
My DD said at the last moment I don't want to go visit WW over the holiday weekend . She went to see her Grandmother instead. DD said it's always something when I go see mom.
Yes "we" are the adults and have to be for us and the kids sake. Believe me it's hard to be the disciplinarian and when our wayward spouses choose to make themselves available to the children , it seems to be all fun and games for them. But in reality I think the children know where they are better off(mine is 17 and chose to stay with me, despite WW pleeds)

If your WH hasn't hit bottom , he will soon itsounds. I wouldn't really believe anything from him , actions speak louder than words. and right now they cant think straight anyway.
Hang in there girl..... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

should I rip the page out of the book though?
Big wave- happy to hear from you! Mimi also!

bump up

It's your son's book, right? Wouldn't book-ripping rights be his?

Maybe he's ready to crack, maybe he isn't. Maybe he's had a moment of reflective lucidity, maybe he's just wanting company at his pity party. Don't be a party to the drama. Let him crack.

And let your son decide what to do with the book. He's a teenager and they're a little touchy about stuff like that.

Hello WK. I don't remember your sitch, but presumably you are in Plan B?

If you are in Plan B, you sent him a PBL outlining terms for return.

If he is "still with Vanessa," your terms have not been met.

That's what I love about Plan B. The clarity of it all.

He can be sorry all he wants -- but will he make an effort? Some people go through their whole lives being "sorry" -- so what?

You want a man, a husband -- not a spineless mess.

He can scratch all the "help" messages in the sand he wants. What you need to see is a NC letter to Vanessa, and a man who is committed to recovery.

After what you've been through, it's the very least you deserve. Don't sell for a lower price.

AM:

Winter has not actually used any of the MB Plans.

Right, Winter?

She was sort of doing it her way, I think.

I'm not sure how to advise her right now.

Do I have this correct, Winter?

The A has been going on about a year. You've remained separated. You've been hot and cold with each other. He has maintained contact with Vanessa and contact with you.

What has been your reaction towards him been during the past few months? What have your interactions been like? Has he spent the night?

Still thinking....

Anybody else have ideas on how to help, Winter?

I think it's hard to do a firm plan b, when you have children involved. But thats me personally vebalizing.
From the sound of things Winter it doesn't appear that he even knows whats he wants, him, you and family. It seems that the only reason his relationship with Vanessa is disolving is due to her inabilty to maintain a place to leave his hat at. As it doesn't sound as if she is doing much more for him.
Let him go and fend for himself alone. Maybe he will wake up, but it will be up to you if he is the man you want to let back into your life and the kids. It sounds as if you have been doing well, until he contacts and reals you into his drama.
Take care of winter.
Hang in there Winter!!!!!

Bigwave- Thanks
A.M. Martin- I did try Plan A/B - it is hard when there are kids involved and in all honesty.... when you truly loved someone and he has been the only one you were evr with since your teens. Your in a situation you didnt ask for (as we all are) and not only grieving from my mom's death, this seperation and discovery, and 3 kids and trying evryday not to get up and wanting to kill yourself because it hurts so much.
But that was 10 mos ago and to be honest not everyone heals as fast as some.
Mimi:
I know I didnt do a good plan because yes Im still seperated and yes hes there with Vanessa. Yes I did try it my way (as Im sure others have also).
Now Im here:
I am asking for direction and help with Plan A.
I dont understand it and am asking for help with it and direction.
My reaction to him has always been open, honest, havent ever closed the door for him coming back.
He hasnt spent the night, we were physical up until a couple months ago. I wasnt cold to him- he was cold to me at the beginning, middle we got along, now hes opened up about his feelings and why he did it. Before he just said he didnt know why he left, he didnt know why he doesnt love me, ect.
Now it's I made a mistake- I do love you- shouldnt have said it, comes around, we went to the show a couple times, He says he sees in my eyes the hurt, or he feels I have anger in me, or I dont trust him, or believe in him, ect.
This is not true- during this time I still went to take kids to see him, went to his job to talk to him, beg to come home, listen when he said the hurtful stuff to me, and still said I loved him - come home lets work on it.
Now....Ive stopped pleading, begging, asking, I dont call him unless its about the kids, I dont hang around when he comes to see them, I gave him the space hes asked for. I even told him everything you asked/told me to do Ive done. I havent been ugly with him- and have been inviting. I used to ask him to stay but now no im not.
So if this is cold towards him- no i dont want to be rejected again.
I have prayed for our marraige and havent said a bad word about him even when others have said let him go. I have endured.
So....
Will you help me Mimi with advice or the oithers on the board. If your not comfortable with that I understand and I can just ask to have my profile deleated and wont bother anymore.
Thanks

bump up please

I'll help you..

Still thinking...

Needed for you to catch me up on things with you...

Thanks.

hey winter how are you today??

Winter:

I am saying this out of care...not to beat up on you. Your situation is NO DIFFERENT than most others. DO NOT THINK OF REASONS OR JUSTIFICATIONS NOT TO DO THESE PLANS. I have been with my husband for over 30 years of my life..since age 18..never been with any other man intimately..lost both of my grandparents in one year and I was their primary caretaker..I could go on and on...I am one who fully understands and believes that folks have different healing patterns...

That being said..JUST DO THIS..if you want to do as much as YOU possibly can to recover your marriage...

I think it's time for PLAN B..

I think you actually have been doing PLAN A..and it's been effective..now time for PLAN B...

Read up on PLAN B and let me know what you think..

Are you ready for it?

It will mean going DARK and having absolutely NO CONTACT with him UNTIL he commits to breaking up with V. forever...

ok im ready... how do i do this?

ok im ready... what do i do now....

I am afraid I don't know a lot about your situation.
Have you read Surviving an Affair?
If so....you should start by reading up, again, on Plan B.
You need to start getting all your plans in order. Will one of you move out? If so, where to? If not, how will you handle plan B? Do you have a friend in mind, that you could use to handle all messages between you and your H?

I am no Plan B expert. I am sure Mimi will be here soon to help you out. But I wanted to give you a few things to think about in the meantime.
One thing to really think about:Are you truly ready for Plan B?
You need to mentally prepare yourself. Plan B could possibly be the wake up call your H needs, and may lead to reconciling. But it also could carry on for a long time, and it could potentially lead to a D. Plan B will help you to prepare for YOUR future. If you use the time wisely, and work on building a good life for yourself, then it will prepare you for a life that may include your WH, if he gets his act together, or may not include him.

You're on a roll, Mimi. Couldn't agree more. I hesitated to say this after my last post, but you've said it all for me.

WK, if you were in a solid plan -- A or B -- you wouldn't be feeling so lost at sea, as you are now. Your stranded, and you don't really have a plan of action. That's what MB does.

By now, you probably should be in Plan B. Then you wouldn't have to listen to his justifications and dithering. Then you would already be moving forward in life without him. Which is a much better place than you are now ... wondering ... not being able to move forward or backwards. Hoping ... wondering what he's feeling ...

You wouldn't be listening to him until he starts to shape up.

I can have him pick up the kids at the front of the house, relay messages thru his mom, ect. Ive already started withdrawing from him. Tonight I have school- he called work and said he would bring mortgage by tonight- I said fine- leave it at the house with kids- i wont be there. Then he said well ill bring it in the morning- I said ok leave it w/ daughter. I explained a week ago I will not be going to the movies and hanging with him anymore until he ready to work on us without Vanessa. He said ok- then he said well it 's your choice. You are making this a bad situation. Then he tells me I dont have to leave the house when he comes over, he still wants to be my friend, not burn his bridges, ect. I told him you made it this way. I want to reconcile and make this work but you wont do what you need to do. He says im working on it, getting my finances back straight, and you need to stop bringing vanessa into this because it's not what you think anymore and we need to get past this. I cant while you are there. You cant work on us and keep her too.
H says i dont want to lose you- im like an alcholic and enjoy the drink and dont have the power to stop. yet.
I said well im like in Al- Anon and i have to break the cycle and get out.
It was the hardest thing to do and say. I did give him the letter and he didnt read it and threw it away- said he already knows what's in it.
How do you try to keep loving someone- when you look in their eyes and they dont love you?