Hiker, by all means don't go if you think you would sock him. I could not meet with the OP, in your type situation, without punching her out, so I fully understand.

But what if you brought a friend with you who would be coached in advance to halt any physical altercation? I just think this OM is a classic wussyboy who might be easily scared off with a little pressure.

I understand, but I bet you can do it.

If you don't, send him a letter with a copy of the recording indicating you'll name him in whatever legal means at your disposal you have to initiate.

WAT

Here's an idea that might make him panic more:

Have a friend make the call so he doesn't recognize the voice, block any caller id, and have them say OM is being watched and he should consider the following very carefully as they have it on good information that, if he continues to interfere in Hiker's marriage, Hiker intends to name OM in any legal actions he chooses to take - then play the tape. This way, when he tells your wife and she gets all nasty accusing you of making the call, you can emphatically deny it. Also, if she demands the tape recording, you can say "what tape recording?" and tell her maybe OM made that up as an excuse to be rid of her.

A word of caution, though - be careful using that tape recording as there are laws around electronically (i.e., tape recording) intercepting conversations to which you are not a party. Seek advice from a lawyer.

Regards,

BB

Post deleted by Hiker45

Do not GIVE either of them a copy of the recording. Maybe play it for OM, but DON"T GIVE him a copy.

BB

"Her debts are now well over the equity in our house, but in this state, all debts incurred by one spouse are the responsibility of both partners."

Hiker I do not know where you live but this may be untrue. Where I live if a M is in trouble and it is clear the money was spent on her alone or even the OM then it is not your responsibility.

I live in a no fault state and like you all debts and assets incurred during our M our community property. After the A was exposed my wife spent a lot of money on herself on clothes. They were for her and her alone. I asked the lawyer and he said since the debt was incurred for only her benefit I would not be responsible. Even though it was on a credit card with both of our names. I even asked about the trip she took back east that cost us over 3k where she had the A. He said I could even make her incur the cost of that as a debt on her side. Problem with it was in my case it would have cost me more in lawyers then accepting half the debt.

It will actually make her look really bad in D court.

This is one of the only things that I feel conflicted about on this site. You need to get legally separated to protect yourself but once you do isn't that a LB. LOL.

I honestly wish I would have separated from my FWW three years ago because she is now entitled to more from me if we get a D because I wanted to stay married.

I'll concur with Brit on providing a copy.


Hiker - we're trying to pump you up to fight for your family and you're grasping for excuses.

He doesn't have to know that this is the only recording you have. Your goal in this is to make it uncomfortable for the affairee to continue the affair. Affairees will bail out in a heartbeat as soon as the downsides of continuing it start to add up.

Heck, if your buds were ready to pay him a visit, one of them would likely call him up and let him know the types of consequences he may be facing - legal muckraking in which he gets named and linked to the breakup of a family. You described how it's identifiable from the tape his place of business.

You have some weapons yet to use. Don't go down without a fight.

WAT

Seems you found the right button to nuke this thing.

If it were me, I'd act like I had nothing left to to lose and make his life so miserable he'd treat her like poison.

You need to show him you are the opposite of the lies she is feeding him. Some men will back off from a confrontation while others will thrive on it. You need to see which one he is and a phone call will give you an idea.

There is the you and me aginst the world type of fantasy that thrives on the conflict inflicted. These die when the exictement is over. Believe me, back in my single younger days I shamefully was an OM.

Post deleted by Hiker45

Looking ahead, she may eventually leave because she "can't stand being with you anymore!" <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

I recommend you be prepared to immediately go to Plan B if that happens.

WAT

Well, hopefully that won't happen anytime soon since I haven't had a chance to restore the home atmosphere to a "safe and welcome" place for her.

Right now the atmosphere is strictly War of the Roses.

You;ll have time.

Please remind me about whatever legal separation documents that were in progress before you decided not to leave.

Reason: If/when she decides to leave, it'll probably be on a whim and no legal separation will have yet been signed. Good. She abandoned the home and family. But, you would need to be prepared to immediately offer a separation document to nail down home access, child custody, etc. SO THAT you can go straight to Plan B. You end up squarely in control.

WAT

"A friend of mine has recently surpassed the $20,000 mark in legal fees just trying to get shared custody of his son."

Each case is different. Another reason to keep everything documented. I live in a no fault state for a D but in child custody her A will effect her ability to get cutody. Her spending will actually effect that too. It was a detriment to our children.

The more you document the easier it is. Just the facts.

Now that is the worst case scenario that you have to use this.

As far as your M is concerned keep turning up the heat. It is not for you to worry about the consequences for him or her if everyone knows.

In the long run if it works your FWW will see how hard you worked just to keep her. That has to show her how much she means to you.

The separation agreement is restricted to our financial responsibilities. It states that each spouse will be solely responsible for his or her credit card debts and loans after the date of signing. It lists all the current debts and basically freezes them for the prupose of divorce.

Gotcha - I recommend you be prepared to have a modified one ready in addition to the financial stuff that specifies no house access for her without your consent, specifies child custody, and whatever else might be needed to minimize communication between you in Plan B and prevents her from willy nilly changing her mind and moving home.

WAT

One other thing to change in the separation document - make it clear that you are not interested in divorce and agreed to this separation document solely to establish financial responsibilities, child custody, and home access.

WAT

Post deleted by Hiker45

By all means, ask your lawyer about all this legal stuff.

You may not be able to restrict her access to the house, but a separation agreement is an agreement. She has to abide by what she agrees to. Of course, this means getting her to agree to it.

In my Plan B letter I specified that my WS was not to enter "my" home even though she was still on the mortgage. She abided by this - maybe because the separation document also directed that I have her removed from the mortgage. Maybe you could have that built into the separation.

Of course, your other scheme that we already mentioned was to sell the house. Hopefully this drastic step won't have to happen, but it's an option to keep her away.

In Plan B you just gotta have complete control over her access to you.

WAT

You know, I read this stuff and I still can't help thinking about how this all started. If I could only have known about the affair in the beginning, before it took such a stranglehold on my wife.

I see others going through the same pain and I feel so badly for them, because it is almost unbearable at times.

We did not have a bad marriage. Cards and letters from my wife up to the time of the affair make me sound like the best husband in the world, with my wife telling me these were the happiest years of her life. So why the affair? Why does she now say things had been bad for a long time? Why couldn't she have told me then, before the affair, what she is so willing to say now?

My answer to that is simply that she has re-written our history to fit her crime, and worst of all she believes every word. Can you believe that this affair is somehow the result of me not allowing her to put a dish strainer in the sink, or that I chose the color of the hall carpet without consulting her? (Both clever variations of the actual facts.)

And the reasons change from week to week. The first week after discovery it was because I was too focused on my son. The next week it was because I didn't love her. Then it went into "you don't respect me" and "I let you control me" etc., ad nauseum.

But I can get nowhere by saying, "Alright, these are issues that we can work on if we get help. So stop the affair and let's work on our marriage."

Wife: "It's too late. I put up with it for so long I just can't do it anymore. I don't love you in that way"

Me: "You only think these things because you are emotionally tied up with this guy and can't think objectively anymore"

Wife: "That's your perspective. Maybe I'm finally thinking clearly for the first time. And anyway he [OM] has nothing to do with our problems; that's separate."

Me: "Then why didn't you talk about all these issues before you started the affair? Why did you engage in lying, cheating, and deceiving me for months until I discovered your affair, and then read me a laundry list of everything wrong with me?"

Wife: No answer. Walks away. Comes back. "You wouldn't have listened to me. You never listened to me."

Me: "I'm listening now. Stop the affair and let's save our family."

Wife: "It's too late."

So you don't buy the alien abduction theory?

Got a better explanation? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Longtime poster Chris (or was it K?) gives an example of one of the reasons stated by his wife that he always brought home Pepsi - never Coke. (or vice versa)

So hallway carpet color is no surprise. How could you? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Consider looking up some examples of reverse babble by poster Orchid. In fact, paste your example dialog above into a new thread specifically asking for Orchid to help you come up with reverse babble responses for the next such discussion. You'll split your sides.

WAT