I find that a good thing, I use to step back alot and think things thru before I make a decision. It gives you time to process what you have heard or learned, and sometimes maybe you dont agree with right away after thinking about it you realize that maybe what was side was the truth, or I never thought of that and maybe it will work. etc.....

When me and my H use to have alot of serious talks, I use to tell him right off the bat, dont answer me now, listen to what I am suggesting, or this is how I feel, or this bothers me so maybe we could do this to make us both happy... think about it for a bit and lets talk about it later. It really gave my H time to think and rationalize

Hey TH, we give you A LOT to think about!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> I'm glad you're doing the right thing now. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Thumbs up!


I want to ditto something said: Do Not introduce your sons to DD without POJA.


Our counselor explained how some families he saw told their kids in front of HIM for support. He explained how differently aged children react, that younger ones are likely to blame themselves for anything that goes wrong (if they hear fighting or sense the marriage is in trouble) but generally see OC as a playmate, while tweens and teens focus on trying to make sense of the (im)moral aspects and explaining to their peers. Kids have to be taught how to handle inevitable awkward questions or nasty comments; not that you place those things in their mind, but it DOES happen, especially when one of the children of the marriage and the OC are the same age! (Yep ours were born the same month! GRR)

Most importantly, kids often reflect whatever MOM's feeling or projecting! So, if you really want your sons to accept their half-sister, you would do well to walk that road with your spouse all the way first.

From nearly 2 years of visitation, I can tell you most of the HARD questions my kids ask about the OC situation, they ask ME, Mom, not Dad. Their questions have been gradual as their age/understanding increased. Ditto most everyone else who meets OC asks ME questions; so you really have to have Wife not only onboard but fully prepared for the experience. That takes time, support, counseling, and maybe friends here. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Here to help,
J

THIS is HUGE <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> BTW, I have had my H reading this thread. It has been very good for him to hear someone from his side of this dilemna post and read the responses of those on my side.

Yes, please do have your W join OR have her email one of us as we have offered prior.

Post deleted by TroubledH

Post deleted by TroubledH

TroubledH, please give your wife my email address or ask her to visit the web address listed on my signature.

I certainly understand and commend you for seeing both sides. See Carolyn's post. We can support your W and you in this process.

Good Morning EVERYONE! It's gonna rain here! I'm so happy I could dance!

'Kay. Got it outta my system.



Love that your mom is helping you. But I'm wary because of what you wrote earlier about your parents "just wanting you to be happy." Does your mom back you 150% regarding your wish to save your family? I'm not trying to be critical of your mom, but I just want you to be surrounded by people that will do what it takes to help you reach your goal - without second thoughts on their part. Moms are nifty critters, tho....they can shake their heads (and fingers) at you and lift you up in the next breath. I hope your mom is that kind of critter.

Of course OW has a way of overfilling the Love Bank. That's all she had to do. She didn't have to make certain your boys had bathed USING WATER (instead of just standing in the tub - "yeah mom, I got in..."), she didn't have to make certain your chonies had enough starch in them (or not)...she had to be there, for you....no one but you and her. It was EASY for her to fill the LB...you can see that, right...you weren't there leaving the seat up or not refilling the ice trays or squeezing the toothpaste from the middle....at least not on a regular enough basis to get annoying yet....the same goes for her. Realize that. It'll help...a little right now ....more as time goes on...



Then do....there are others out there, too. She needs to know that people and marriages survive this. Right now she's thinking, "Who understands this? NO ONE." There wasn't even a therapist - and I talked to a few - that "got it." It was so far beyond anything they'd dealt with that they gave me little or no relief when I'd talk to them.



Very good padawan. You might make Jedi someday.



Score one for the home team. You realized that....to talk to her is to feed the addiction. To feed the monster is to never have it die.



Oh OH OH! That's one of the best things you've written. You're not excusing it...you're trying to understand it. Do you realize how far you've come from your first post with that simple realization??????? Keep learning about you.

Look. You're worried about your wife not feeding your ENs, right? Lemme tell you...CHANGE YOURSELF. You cannot change her. I could not change the Wookie...but he saw the changes I made in me...and his changes took root from that soil. I don't even think it was concious on his part. I tended what I wanted to grow in our relationship...and it BLOOMED. It took time...all gardens take time...but it's still blooming...he's still evolving and so am I...but I changed ME first.

Lead by example.



Once she comes here...if she does, there is an EN questionairre on this site. You both fill it out together...it's a tool to help you both know what you can do to help tend your marriage. I'll give you that your W doesn't fill the ENs...does she KNOW - like black and white - does she KNOW what is lacking for you. Do you KNOW what she needs? I'd lay odds that you might think you know some, but you don't know all of it...either one of you.



You know what I told Ann? About the trying??? This goes for you too. Sometimes it's not about the progress it's about what you learn about YOU by trying....sometimes, that's all God wants, imho (that's an h in there for humble...snort...lil ole me conjecturing about what God wants).



Please don't say these things lightly. My bio father shot himself. It is something I am most vehement about. DO NOT JOKE ABOUT THIS...even if you feel it a smidge.

Also, please take care of your health...and that means mental health. Read what I wrote to you about depression. Those feelings go double for the wayward....and they are hard to turn off so you can get the real work done. If you continue to feel like you wrote above, talk to your MD. Don't worry about judging you...only one Guy can do that for real...and if you believe, then He has your back no matter what the world says or does.



I know. The Wookie knows. It was 3 years here. You have any ? for him? Also, I'm pretty certain he'd talk to you on the phone....you need to know YOU are not alone, and that guys like you have saved their marriages even tho... I'll ask him if you want.



I think this is an excellent idea. I'd go to mush over it...but I'm mushy like that. Oh...and maybe a non romantic flower or something....like a daisy. You can't be unhappy when someone gives you a white daisy with a bright, yellow center, imo.



Dangitol...dude, you keep looking down....look up! There's always a good side...sometimes it slaps you in the face, and sometimes it's hidden....SHE MIGHT SEE THIS AS YOU TRYING TO GET YOUR [censored] TOGETHER.



IOW: You don't want to hurt her b/c you wrote your feelings...but you want to help her at the same time. You cannot sheild her forever. Radical honesty demands that you show her the warts as well as the Prince Charming. It's both or not at all...but not at all is going to kill your marriage.

- Kimmy

I understand that part.... been there my self many times



I am so glad that you called her instead, you do need support too. Try to turn to your wife too, no not about how much you miss the OW but like last night about the book.


there is no excuse good enough for why. I do understand what was happening within in my husband and the why, it still is no excuse but it did help me in my emotional closure. The insight will help both of you so that it wont be repeated and that you can get over this and repair the damage.


During your A, without maybe realizing it, you withdrew part of yourself from your wife. A part of your wife felt this, she didnt feel the bond that she should of, and in returned built a wall around herself to help her deal with the pain. Now it is time to start bring the things that you need out of your wife. It wont come fast, that wall will need to be slowly chipped away to get there. but you need to try and give her a chance to fill your needs. She also will need to let you chip away at it. She will be on her gaurd but needs to take a deep breath and let you try to gain her trust back.

After she reads it do you wonder what kind of score you will recieve on being her husband???? How many needs did you not fill???

When she tells you, dont get defensive, dont make excuses... like if you would of done this I would of done this.... listen.... step away and think about it, when you do as the same dont make excuses to yourself, be totally honest with yourself.... if you find the answer is right then go back and say I am sorry and I will do better. then stick to your word, maybe in the beginning it will have to be forced but in the end it will come naturally. That advice is for both of you,.


I know this is not what you meant, but you did.... emtionally you let the best thing get away from you, your wife.

But what you really meant, I wished I had kept them sites about withdraws and such maybe later I will find them again to pass on to you.


I strongly suggest that you go get some anti depressant. Many of us had to get them while we was dealing with the pain. And I do think you need them too. You might not realize it now but after starting on them you will wished you did it ealier. You dont have to go see a counslor any more for them and bear your soul..... just go to your regular doctor and tell him your not sleeping and feeling depressed, he may ask what is happening but you do not have to go into it. but he will give you meds. Please go get some. They will help you think more clearly


YES IT WILL!!!!!!!!!! My H started with little things, like the notes, calling me from work just to say hi and that he was thinking of me and cant wait to get home, at first when he called i was suspicous, I kept asking him what what...... but of course I was worried that he was preparing me to tell me something else. Dont be surprised if she does that, understand why and kept at it. Also start making physical contact, when you walk by her reach out and give her a soft touch. Put your hand on her knee when you sit next to her. Stand closer to her when guys. One of the favorite time of the day is when my husband comes home from work, I am usually dishing up supper and he comes in and helps and we talk about our day. In the morning my H leaves for work 45 minutes before I get up, but I do know and tho I dont completely wake up I do realize that he is kissing me on the cheek every morning and say I love you. In exchange I greet him with a hug and kiss when he comes home.

Those little things DO MATTER like the note. Dont be shocked or defensive if she thinks your up to something, cause right now she is waiting for the other shoe to drop, and tho she will be thrilled at first she is afraid to hope and get hurt again. But stay at it, you will be rewarded in the end.


I have wondered about that too, that and if she will be willing to open up knowing that you are reading her posts. These things do need to be shared with each other (well minus that you are missing the OW) but we do need a place to put our fears and feelings without worry. I love having a place to go that I can vent and go most of the emotions out so that way the volcano has erupted and I can calmly talk to my H .... lol it stops me from saying mean things actually lol


well this thread I am sure one of the people that run it can delete it.

She does need support, and I would love to help her.... but I want to help YOU too. That is a toughy. Maybe some one else can come up with a good suggestion with that.

I will post my addie and my yahoo id for im too..... actually i wouldnt mind if you even used it too to help rebuild your marriage, but not sure if that would be wise, cause right now your wife dont need you talking to any woman privately. But I will ask my H tonight if he will be willing to help you.... I know he will be but let me give him a heads up first.

thunderstorm@bis.midco.net
yahoo id is thunderstom0208 (yes I forgot the r lol)

or if she dont have yahoo let me know I also have icq or msn that I can post

Mr T said:



know what?

feelings are neither fair nor unfair

feelings have no morality either

but you also need to understand that if you make only "feelings based" decisions about actions that will effect you & your family and OW & OC ... all of you are screwed ! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

accept your feelings as is and know this ~~~> ALL feelings are temporary

they have to be

that is why we say to you ~~~> real love requires action

because love solely as a feeling can lead to heII on earth

you're doing well

hang in there

((( hugs )))

Pep

That Pep is a brilliant woman. I hope you listen to her. I sure did.

TH,

I will not lie to you, maintaining no contact with the OW is very difficult and it will be painful.

You will think about the OW a lot. Especially as you two have a child. There is no light switch that you can turn off and make the feeling you have/had for her go away. My A has been over for a few years and I still think about the OW almost daily. I don't pine for her anymore though and that makes a world of difference. I'm not a Zen monk and haven't yet trained my mind to the point that I can control every fleeting thought that enters my brain. It would have made the recovery thing so much easier if I could have just banished her from my thoughts . . .

I just want to let you know what you are feeling is pretty normal stuff. Even pondering suicide is, sadly, pretty common. You just want the mess to go away and you want to stop hurting yourself and everyone else. Suicide isn't a rational option. You just can't imagine what devastation it will visit on the lives of all these people. If the thought of escaping this way becomes a common thread for you inner musing, it is time to visit the Dr. and get a script. You seem like a fairly rational guy . . . suicide isn’t' rational at all. It is a permanent solution to temporary distress. It is a disproportionate response to this situation.

Give your marriage another chance. If you want your wife to be the kind of wife you feel you need then begin treating her in a way that fills her needs. I know this sounds backwards, but people generally respond with love to the person meeting their needs, this is why being with the OW felt so good to you. She was meeting your needs. If I had to condense the main message from this site it would be to find out what makes your spouse feel loved and do those things. . . even when you don't much feel like it. This willingness to meet needs establishes and maintains loving feelings.

1. "You get what you give. When you give better, you get better."

2. "If you want to have a good partner, be a good partner. Put 100 percent into your marriage"


I will never forget the late night that my H uttered them very words. I have a feeling that most of the WS have at one time or another have felt that way, for whatever there reasons, torn between knowing what to do, or from the guilt they brought on to their family. I just thank god that my H realized what he said was asking for help and we had him to the DR bright and early in the morning. He was not on them for long just for a bit but it helped him while he dealt with the guilt he was going thru.

Post deleted by TroubledH

I have everyone's addys but Peps.

Pep, niosgirlatyahoodotcom....

I'm glad you told her about us.

Quit being scared. I can practically SMELL it coming off the screen. Dang guy. This is a good thing.

- Kimmy

Post deleted by TroubledH

Hey. You can be low some other day...today you're saving your family.

Emailed your wife.

Fixin ta go home...tell her not to worry, I only check email and stuff M-F. Home time is for home stuff.

- Kimmy

Kimmy

you've got Pepper in your box!

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

LOL

BWHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

TroubledH~~

I've read some of what you and everyone else has posted
here, and want to put my 2 cents in.

I can understand your feelings of depression, feeling so low to the point that you just want to "end it" so that you stop feeling so bad. Believe me, I have been there many days, done that~~as you and many here can relate.

The thing I want to get across to you is this: no matter what happens, how things end up with your W and yourself (i.e. whether you stick it out and make things work and be happy or part ways) YOUR CHILDREN ARE GOING TO NEED YOU....PERIOD. You can get the help you need through med's (and that would only be on a temporary basis), there's no shame in wanting to help yourself but the main thing is to keep REACHING OUT....to your FRIENDS, your FAMILY, and yes, to your W.

As hard as that is to do, as awkward as it will be, if you give it your best shot then you can say that you TRIED to repair what was broken. The key, of course, will be if your W is willing to try as well. You BOTH have to be willing to give it your all; you can't MAKE her want to give it HER all, that's something she will have to decide if she's willing to do or not. To your credit, you haven't stolen family funds (as what happened to me and my family), you've provided a home and food on the table for your family....i.e., you haven't gambled away the paycheck. YOU HAVE ALOT OF WONDERFUL QUALITIES, anyone here can see that. I am guessing that she doesn't work outside of the home (you have not mentioned anything here either way, so I'm guessing) and that too, is to your credit. There are soooo many families where both parents work full-time outside the home (as was the case with me), your W is very fortunate to be able to be home with your C. Hopefully the two of you can focus on each other's good quailities and rebuild from there, rather than focusing so hard on the not-so-great things.

There are alot of well-intentioned people posting in this forum with alot of good advice. I'm glad to see that alot of people, as well as myself, are rooting for you vs. tearing you down. Negative comments are such a waste of energy! I'm praying that you and your W can reach a conclusion that works best for you both.

Remember, reach out to those WHO ARE THERE FOR YOU when you are down....and hug your children tight! They are going to be going through alot as well, they can sense when M and D are having troubles....and they'll need to be constantly reminded that they are LOVED. ALL THREE OF THEM.

Here for you anytime.....

CalifWoman

You have a butterfly in yours.