Hello all. This is my first post, and for my own sanity, hopefully a place for people to listen.

BACKGROUND: I have been married for 10 years and have two children. My parents are divorced and I am aware of the emotional damage it can do to young children. I am into female domination and encouraged my wife to have an affair. I was blinded by my love (worship) of her to think that our marriage was strong enough to pursue this fantasy.
I am dense and I have never learned how to love a woman or how to love a spouse (no role models). I treated my wife like crap and took her for granted for 13 years.
She has fallen "in love" with him and always wants to be with him. During the 1st week of the affair we had the most exciting sex ever. Now, she only wants him.
The affair is taking an emotional toll on me. I can't stand to think of her with him. Our sex life consisted mostly of my fantasies, so I wasn't making love to a wonderful woman, I was having sex with my goddess and therefore never fulfilled her bedroom desires.
Every day is an eternity. I hurt and hurt. I would rather have my back broken and confined to a wheelchair for the rest of my life than endure this.
I have been in therapy and started to pay attention to her emotional needs that I neglected for so long. She feels guilty about being with him. We have discussed separating but neither of us has taken that first step. She is willing to go to therapy with me, though I think she just wants to help me. I think she needs to go to therapy because she was miserable before the affair and the affair is almost like prozac for her. How do I ask her to give that up and come back to the man who made her miserable to begin with?

Ironically, the affair has woken me up to what I neglected and took for granted for sooo long. I am not so sure that she is completely over our marriage. Sometimes it sounds as if she is and other times she talks about the future as if we will still be together - that a good sign, right?

I asked her out today and expected her to say no. She said maybe. I want to take her on a date (I looked at the date thread) and really get to know the woman I married. I also want her to see the part of me that is slowly emerging, the man I have been inside but have rarely shown.

Thanks for listening.

Brian

thank you for your advice to me but i got to tell you it looks like we both have a bit of hope so we shouldnt quit just yet for the women to even talk to us after verbal abuse means theres something there.we should both try to figure out how they fell in love with us in the first place and try to get a plan going

thorstein,

Sorry that you have found yourself in this situation, and I hope that you are serious about getting help for yourself. There is no excuse for an affair, but there is also no excuse for abusing your spouse verbally or physically.

I read on another thread that you had discussed Plan A and Plan B with your spouse. This is not something you should or can discuss with your spouse... otherwise it won't be effective.

A true Plan A is not primarily to just win your spouse back... if you look at it this way, then it is just a temporary manipulation and nothing has changed. Plan A is about becoming a better person yourself. Meeting your spouses emotional needs is about you doing it because it makes you a better person. Not because you want to coax her back... that is controlling and manipulation. Going to therapy is about learning about yourself and how you can be a better person... as a result, you may become a better and more attractive husband.

Plan B is a strategy that is used to a)again become a better person, b)set personal boundaries which includes no contact or assistance with your spouse as long as they are continuing in an A. If you discuss it, then the effect is gone. Even if you are trying to manipulate the situation... which a good strategy may do... you would not let the opposing team know what your game plan is. If it is a strategy to manipulate a situation, then it is only to bust up the A...which is wrong regardless of the situation and to give a chance for recovery. But recovery will not happen with controlling behaviours or manipulative strategys.

The whole idea is to change yourself... you cannot change your spouse. When you change yourself other things may happen. You become happier with who you are... alone or married. Your spouse may see that you are making real changes and may become attracted again.

Read up some more and others will also offer some advice. I have probably missed important details about the plans as I am not an expert... these are my opions about the basis of the plans.

Patience.

Shaden

I think I am pretty much on par with all you say. It might have been manipulative at first, but I felt good doing it. I will keep fulfilling her emotional needs. It makes me feel better and I am growing in ways I never knew.
I talked of Plan A with her (only as far as fulfilling her emotional needs) so we could focus on what was wrong with the marriage. Right now her OM is fulfilling the sexual need which I think was paramount for her. I never treated her like a woman in bed.
I think that though many of these situations are similar, I think with her, Plan B (because of children, finances, and family) would be hurtful. I don't want resentment. I don't want her coming back due to guilt (that is manipulation right?) I want her to come back because she wants our marriage to work.
Not that it matters, it was emotional abuse/ neglect (not fulfilling her needs). My dad kicked the crap out of my mom and my brothers, I definately do not want to do that.

Is B about presonal boundaries, like drawing a line in the sand? We still are friends- we have had emotional discussions but we have remained civil to each other.

I appreciate the advice and will definately read more.
Thanks
Brian

do

NOT

"discuss"

Plan A & Plan B with a wayward spouse !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

these plans are for the betrayed spouse to impliment single-handedly ....

again

do NOT discuss these plans

do you need a better understanding of what Plan A & Plan B are???

Pep

Thanks. It is the stick I need to work on. Great thread. I guess I am rationalizing my behavior (telling her I did not meet her emotional needs led to her unhappiness led to her affair.)

I do have a rather unique q though. I encouraged the affair because it turned me on (big whoops). She now knows I no longer approve of it but she says that it is partly my fault because I encouraged it.

If exposure were to work, what is the etiquette in contacting her employer and ask them not to schedule the two together because of the affair?

All righty then. I am still having trouble and I will tell you my plan. Questions to follow.

I want to tell (ask?) her to end the affair. I must tell her that it is hurting me. All of this is to be done non-confrontationally. I already have started meeting Emotional Needs that I failed to before the affair.
I wish to give her a week to end the affair. We have been open and honest about everything (including the affair: she told me the day after it began (see above)). If she ended it, I would believe her and I would help her through withdrawal.

At the end of that week, I plan to expose the affair to her family, my family, friends, co-workers, her boss, etc. As you can see by my sig. the affair is fairly young and much of the information on the site makes sense but I am afraid to implement it.

Is success possible without having to go through everything that is outlined?
Is plan B inevitable? (It seems so much like divorce.)
I get the recovery plan but would marriage counseling be a better idea? (My shrink does couples and singles. WS is open to coming to my sessions and shrink is too. I have really connected with shrink: doing lots of good and we work on solutions to my problems, not just airing it all out. Her approach to counseling (by the looks of the boards) is atypical because she doesn't see the problem we are having as a breakdown in communication. On the contrary, WS and I converse quite frequently about all manner of topics.
Can an affair end after exposing and then move us into withdrawal and eventually recovery?

I am running long,

Thanks,
Brian

"big whoops"

this requires a little more thought than "big whoops"

let me explain the message you have given your wife by your actions .... (I am not saying this is what you meant to convey to her ... but I am saying this is the message received)

ready? .... here it is

wife, you are something I use for my own pleasure
I value my own pleasure more than your welfare
I don't expect intimacy with you wife, just sex is enough


you owe her a huge apology

start with

"I was terribly selfish. I was wrong. I used you wrongly. I will spend the rest of our married life proving to you I want intimacy with you. I promise I will never misuse you again for my own selfish pleasure."

This is not the first time we've heard this story in this forum, sadly.

Admit that your wife is a rare precious gift from God ... and you enjoyed watching another man misuse and foul the gift ... for an erection

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

by the way ... did you encourage an "open marriage" arrangement? Did you have sexual intimacies with others outside the marriage also?

Pep

tell them your hand in this as well .... if you are going to expose her affair (that you allowed) .... you must be honest & admit that you allowed it

really sucks, doesn't it?

Pep

how ya doing kiddo?

here are some random thoughts

you fear intimacy

so you play sexual games with your wife

the "female domination" stuff is your arrangement in order to avoid being emotionally vulnerable to your wife

so you make yourself physically vulnerable instead

this is similar to men having a porn addiction ... a replacement non-intimate partner is much easier for the emotionally unavailable

time to grow up & be real with yourself first

no more "pretending" games ... why?
because for you they are a way to get needs met without offering your real self to your wife

I'm tough on you because I think there is much inside you just ready to burst out and be free

Pep

Brian, you said



yes... but in your case

I think exposure needs to be done with great delicacy because of the way you have conducted yourself throughout your marriage

before exposure

be 100% certain
your wife fully understands your heartfelt apology is sincere & you are committed to becoming emotionally married to HER ... not to the fantasy you created in your mind

Pep

Dr Harley writes on the subject of RESENTMENT:

[color:"blue"] This topic is one of the most difficult topics to address in marriage. On the one hand, resentment is a normal reaction to someone who has caused you to go through unbearable pain. It is your emotion's way of warning you to avoid people who have hurt you in the past -- they may hurt you again in the future! But, on the other hand, resentment can also be an irrational reaction to something that is no longer a real threat. In fact, resentment itself may become a greater threat to your happiness than what it is you fear.

Those who have written me understand how damaging their feeling of resentment is to their happiness and to the future of their marriage. But they seem unable to stop it. It's a great subject for a psychologist, who is supposed to know how to help people control their emotions. But, I must admit, this is a tough one.

I have answers to some parts of the problem, but not all of them. So to help you as much as I can, I will lay the problem out to you and give my advice wherever I can.

The more there is to resent, the more difficult it is to overcome resentment.[/color]

I bring you this as a way of saying...

be careful how you expose ... you have given your wife years of reasons to resent you .... expose in the most loving gentle way possible if you want her to have less resentment to recover from !!!

Pep

I really appreciate all of the advice and I am taking it to heart. Thanks for putting it into perspective from a 3rd person, Pepperband. I copied and saved that statement. It will remind me.

I have asked for her to forgive me for treating her terribly during the marriage. I never thought about the message I was sending in such a way.

I asked her out and we are going on a date on Wednesday. No pressure or expectations. I still need to convey how much the affair has hurt me though.

I really appreciate you guys being hard on me - it helps!!!

I read on another sight Divorce BUsters or some such about sending the OM a letter that simply states:

"I know that you are involved with XXXXXXX. I love her very much and want to save my marriage and keep my family together. Your relationship with her is not okay. It is coming between us and is making it impossible for us to heal our marriage. Please respect our marriage and end all contact with her forever."

The site says that the OM may laugh in my face but it will cause disruption in the affair. I was thinking that I might talk to her friend (who is also a coworker and aware of the sitch) if she could convey this to the OM as if it were coming from her. Or I could talk to the friend/ coworker's husband and have it conveyed that way.

What do you guys think?

Brian

BTW: I have not had any relationships outside of the marriage.

in reality

OM is not such a huge issue ....

I think this about your situation:

if you make your home/life/self a welcoming & loving & safe place

and if your wife knows she can depend on YOU not ever hurting her with such foolishness ever again....

she will run back to you

I think you have not entirely killed off her love for you

so FILL her love bank
pour yourself into meeting her needs without smothering her

this could work out

so ... if you have X amount of energy ... spend it attracting your wife back to you

just one woman's opinion

Pep

Thanks. I bought some Armani cologne and I have been working out. Keeping the home safe is a good idea. The intimacy can't be fulfilled until she allows me into that. She keeps talking about trying to figure out what she wants.

I heard that WS often cheat down. She has told me alot about him and most of the things are things she always said she can't stand such as smoking.

Fingers crossed, love the advice!!!

I forgot ... you're a guy <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

by intimacy I do NOT mean sex

I mean

YOU showing your real self to HER

intimacy as in letting your walls down
showing her your soft underbelly
becoming "real"

Pep