MEDC, I appreciate what Bob is doing and his advice. I know he means me no harm. Nothing I say at the moment is going to make a blind bit of difference to anyone which is why I'm not replying.

You see I'm going to say I would NOT be betraying my H right now because when Mel rang I hadn't seen hide nor hair of the OM since the day I posted on MB to tell the story, which included the part about where I told the OM I wanted no part of another A. But I know this will be taken as some sort of rationalisation or justification or SOMETHING not right. I'm in a no win situation with all of you right now and NOTHING I say will make a difference.

I've just been talking to Rob about all this and he said "it's like we're being set up by everyone to fail."

OMG - I can't believe this stuff. Why is there any comment about the naked guy??????? i thought it was hilarious.

I greatly admire Bob, but think that men are quite crazy about infidelity. I've posted that before, and got lots of 2X4's. There is almost a territorial/property slant to it.

Pio, you don't have a 25 year old daughter yet. I'm so happy because she is having a once in a lifetime, never to be repeated experience with the person she is totally in love with. Of course I'm envious, who wouldn't be. Rob wants to travel again, he did the overland trail in his early 20s. He just wants to do it in his own time and not at the whim of his daughter and his wife. He hasn't been back to England (he's English) for 40 years and he certainly intends to go back before he dies.

The implication is certainly not that they're happy and I'm not. It's become a family joke that whenever DD rings I say "how lovely for you" in a sarcastic voice. I mean a real family joke - she laughs, I laugh, we all laugh.

Oh, just saw it was a rhetorical question but I answered anyway.

Jen... you are not being set up in my eyes at all... I gave you a hard time... a very hard time when you were lying to Rob (and that is what I mean by betrayal). You said it yourself that you didn't think you would find the strength to tell Rob. I have expressed support and prayers from the moment Rob found out about this contact. Until that time... he was being betrayed.
I do not mean to speak for Bob P and he is much more eloquent that me... but you DID say a lot of things in the not to distant past that would amke anyone... ioncluding you... wonder how your M is so wonderful yet again. I sincerely hope that it is... I was concerned for you both (Rob because of the hurt he would endure and you because of your renewed contact and drinking).
I can tell you that your replies do matter... they do make a difference... but if you do not feel that way, it is certainly understandable that you withold comment. I will merely end my part in this wishing you and Rob continued blessings.

That is one of the most ridiculous things I have heard on this baord. Thanks for the chuckle!

Now, let me get back to reading posts from all the women on these boards that have handled their H's infidelity so very well.

Hey Jen, hang in there, remember it's Rob whose thoughts are most important, NOT the MB forum. KB

MEDC, you did give me a hard time but you were also very gracious to me.

I IMed with FF the weekend after I had seen the OM. She nearly puked with the fog babble that was coming out of my mouth (fingers).

It was a very tough month after Mel called but when I say lightbulb moment it was like a blinding flash.

My drinking is under control again. It becomes disgusting when I'm in the state I was in, holding in my ghastly secret. Rob is right, it is a certain giveaway to my mental state.

I have it KB. Thanks.

I've had moments like that in my life as well... even though we have gone years with the same old struggles... sometimes it is just one shining moment that brings change about in our lives. It is that first baby step that gets us off and running towards that which we always knew should and could be our future. It sounds like you experienced just that type of awakening. I am happy for both you and Rob that it happened in time to save your M.
Best of luck and prayers to you both.

In all kindness, I would like to recommend some counseling for the drinking problem. It definitely appears you admit using it to 'medicate' yourself when there is something awry in your life.

Then, I think some counseling to help you seek the cause of your extra-marital 'forays' would be appropriate.

I agree Cinders.

TT

Bob, I think that there is probably nothing that Jen could do or say right now that could satisfy your enquiring mind. I believe that Rob loves her dearly and doesn't want to lose her. Maybe he is a CA and scared by what goes on in her head, but has decided he wants her 'warts and all'! Perhaps SF is his no. 1 EN and Jen provides that happily and willingly.

And that is what happened after d-day and after jenny's first "closure' NC violation with OM. I feel enough special compassion for Jen and Rob to have them deal with the clearly unresolved issues this time rather than avow themselves 'recovered' and sail on to the next time. I do think that Rob is CA and values a peaceful life over conflict. Who doesn;t ? Its just that it isn't a recipe for sustained marriage success. My own continuing issues are a testament to that. If you do what you always did, you get what you always got, which in Jen's case is a cycle of stuffing, a vulnerable slide into contact, heavy drinking and fear then desperate gratitude that Rob hasn't made her face any uncomfortable consequences. It is far easier for me to never raise these issues, but I care very much about jen and Rob. In the past my loving confrontation has been helpful. Perhaps not this time.

It's his call and who are we to question his motivation (or Jen's) for that matter on remaining in their marriage. I hear what you say, but did it really warrant a whole new thread? I can't be the only one thinking OMG, here we go again!

If noone had questioned me over the years on here I would be divirced or dead by now. Jen herself would not have let a FWS go without self examination and resolution at one time. Its because sustained recoveries involve fixing the broken stuff, not just being grateful that the worst possible consequences have not come to pass IMO.

I couldn't care less who is annoyed by my starting another thread. You were annoyed but visited anyway right ? I felt a responsibility to speak to Jenny and I can't so so through the Minis. Now I have said what I felt burdened to say I can retire.

And don't you think it entirely possible that if Squid now met OM, accidentally or deliberately, she might also see him as the dirtbag he truly is? One would hope so. TT

Squid related a story to me last week that a friend of ours, Dawn, saw an ex boyfriend while driving and she had to stop the car because her heart was aflutter and she started palpitating. He had been abusive and controlling but the passion of that relationship made her current marriage seem dull. I suggest that Jenny, Suzet and all the other very well intentioned FWS who COULD HARDLY HELP responding to contact with OP demonstrate why NC for life is so important. Not just our of respect for the BS feelings, but because FWS will ALWAYS carry some of the attraction they felt for OP because OP usually doesn't get the chance to dash the fantasy persona the FWS created for them.

I suspect Squid would go ga ga if she met OM, just like Jenny did. Maybe worse.

Because you see to BS the OP is usually scum, but to people whose spouses they haven't screwed OPs are just ordinary people, no horns or sulphur breath. My OM is popular in the sport community. "a nice funny guy". Presumably only me and the trail of BHs behind him think he's a dirtbag.

I posted this because I care and I have many alarm bells ringing here because this seems to be dealt with like Jenny's last NC violation was, with the same words about seeing him for what he is afterwards. And that clearly didn;t work.

think that men are quite crazy about infidelity. I've posted that before, and got lots of 2X4's. There is almost a territorial/property slant to it.

B

You said this before and I thought you were having a bad day. That you now use this in a way that dismisses my opinion ( and the opinion of all BHs apparrently) AGAIN in this situation and I am greatly offended by it.

As I recall you were pretty annoyed about your WH's infidelity too but If I were to write that "all BWs overreact - it must be menstrual" I'd rightly be slaughtered on the boards. Yet you offer this horsepoop as if its a sage and certain fact ?

Your own H might have behaved like a [email]b@stard[/email] to you Believer, but do not project your Hs inadequacies onto all men.

I just went back to bed and decided I was sick of me and everybody else probably was too so I came back down to delete what I'd just written.

So there you go.

“It’s not all about me.”

“I am going to find out what is wrong inside of me to mitigate ANY future harm that I could do to my husband and demonstrate how much I love him expressed through loyal, faithful, unwavering compassion to him only for the rest of my life.”

“I will seek out and quash the emotional Ebola virus in my mind that has reeked complete destruction on myself and the person that I have loved the most in my life; my husband.”

“Now and always I choose to live a conscious life based upon goodness that my H can learn over time to TRUST in so he can believe in me like I believe in him.”

“These are thoughts that I will have to deliberate daily until my last breaths because I have found inside of me, a way to subvert those things which hurt the greatest of my treasures; my family.”

“The pages of my life read a story of pain and suffering that should not be there. I will fix that inside of me which enables misery, at my hand, to befall my family.

“Enough of the talking already. My goal this next week is to get an appointment with a psychologist to better myself for me and my loved ones.”

“I do not deserve to be spoiled.”

“It’s not all about me.”

Kiwi/Jen.

EMN.

Hello KiwiJ,

I dont believe we have formally met, aside from passing in idiotville. Hello <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />.

You have not asked for advice, but you said something that raised questions in my FWS head....since this is a discussion board...I'm discussing....



Have you made the clear break from the A being about HIM to deeply understanding the A being about you?



You mention that this is your WS brain. Could this be a need not being addressed head-on?

Jen, you made me LOL over that! It is true and I had just read your first thread on MB during that time as well. I had to stop reading your old thread cuz your tone sounded very similar and it scared me.

Bob, I know you care very much for Jen and Rob's M recovery. I think the fact that Jen is not spending as much time on the computer is a good indicator that she is spending much more time with Rob. Jen, I do hope that you will continue to work on your personal recovery. Remember it has taken me years post A to really find myself and the defect that led to my A. I have very large boundaries around myself because even with self discovery (thanks pep <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> ) I still fear temptation.

Oh and Jen, knowing Rob is a reader.. has he read "Co-dependent No More" by Melody Beattie? If not, it may be helpful for him.

Ahuman has some really good points.

I know how fast for some FWW's like myself the fog got turned on and off. While you were in contact and shortly after - you had fog.

I am sure Rob is hurting, but happy you are being honest with him and still love him.

I also understand the things you said about your husband while in the fog...The fog starts to shift your whole belief system to work with what you are trying to do.

In order for you to be a part of OM's life, you had to tarnish the life you had...in order to be a part of your H's life, you shift back.

BUT there are some major underlying things here that need to be resolved for you and Rob as you move foward, happy or not!

1. I know from iville, etc that you had some major things happening in your life pre-OM seeing you in the supermarket. Like an alcoholic who used to cope using alcohol when things got tough - the temptation was right in front of you...and you couldn't resist that feeling of being wanted by OM...that feeling of the persuit gives you a self inflated sense of confidence that is very false but enough to get through the day...

SO....how are your coping skills? Have you looked at other ways to dig down deep in you to find that REAL confidence that is in there somewhere to handle stressful times?

2. Pursuing comment ahuman made. VERY VERY VERY good point. Goes with what I am saying above. The pursuing thing makes you feel good, wanted and confident...things that maybe you aren't feeling and why OM was a choice you made when you KNOW no contact is essential... Om's persuing you - leaves you a false confidence...

AND without fixing this - let me tell you - right now- Rob is persuing you as he felt threatened again - but what happens when things settle down again, and Rob is showing you he loves you, but not in the pursuing way he is now, and things get stressful again???? How are you going to cope? Dig deep this time around Jen - dig deep...this is something inside YOU that has to change! Perhaps also Ahuman's point about it being a need is something you can present to Rob...maybe when things settle down, like we all do - we fall into what we know...perhaps he lets go of the persuing when it may be something he may always need to keep up?

You can stay happy ya know - 2, 3 years down the road when thing are normal again....when stress hits...you can still get through it.

I haven't read the latest and I'll go back but I just wanted to say I've reread EMN's post and that is what I was wanting. EMN has finally given me what Rob and MB have all been looking for from me and a plan and a glimpse into how I've been sounding.

EMN, you are proving to be a real friend. Thank you. I mean that, no sarcasm or being petty. I don't know about the shrink though, definitely some IC.

More later, I'm getting ready for work.