Hi everyone! - Along the lines of Greengables, I'm sitting here stewing, and I can feel the "childishness" boiling up inside me - so I turn to you all, my wise, dear friends to help me and give me sage advice. I've been in a semi-serious relationship for almost the last year. I say semi-serious because there is no talk of marriage, cohabitating, etc., so it's all good for now.

There is one EN of mine that was not getting met in this relationship from the beginning - and I didn't think that it would be a problem for me now. Apparently it is though. I'll explain. I work full-time and have lots of outside social commitments, activities, etc., as does he. So, the casual seeing of one another on the weekends suited us both just fine. At the beginning, it didn't bother me that he might call me on Friday to see what I was doing on the weekend, and we'd try to fit something in. As time has gone on, and I've gotten a bit more attached to him, this "last minute" stuff was starting to bother me. I'm not the best communicator, so I started playing a "game" - if he waited until Friday to call me to do something, I would say I was "busy" - hoping that he'd get the hint and call me earlier in the week (I know, I know, childish - and I admit it). OK fast forward. A group of his pals was going away for the week, and invited all other friends to join them on the weekend. Well, he and I both went back and forth about going or not going - and the subject was not brought up again. The Friday night before the weekend get-a-way, he and I spoke and he made no mention of going or not going - and so I just assumed (yes, I made an "[censored] out of you and me") that he had no plans to go either. Well, Saturday night rolled around, he called and informed me "I'm on my way to the weekend getaway".......no invitation to come along, no asking me if I would mind if he went, etc., he was going, with or without me, and without any consideration for me. I was not the most pleasant on the phone, wishing him a sarcastic "have a good time" and the conversation ended. We haven't spoken in a week - and I'm absolutely fighting the urge to call and start a fight. I'm 45 years old, for goodness sake - grow up and move on, right??? Talk me out of making a jerk out of myself!!!

THtoB,

Sounds like you'll need to put on your big girl communicator hat <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> & have a talk with your BF. Hard I know. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Does he know you would prefer to be called earlier in the week for plans on the weekend? When you discussed the weekend away with friends were definitive decisions made? Were you "hoping" he wouldn't want to go? Did you not want him to go & spend the weekend with you? Did you tell him that if you did?

It sounds like the unwritten rules of this relationship are changing. You know it does he? Maybe the way you go about your relationship with him ought to more open & clearer to all.

My suggestion: Know what you want from him/this relationship. Tell him you like to talk to him, an apology for being nasty on the phone probably wouldn't hurt. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" /> Explain what you want & why. Use I'd like... instead of you need to... kinds of statements.

Let us know what happens. It certainly helps me to see others in relationship handle these issues that come up.

Good luck!

Well, it sounds like you know the answer, but are not willing to deal with it. That's right, you're 45, so it's time to grow up - and "playing games" is not the answer. Recognizing the fact that you are playing games is a good first step, but it is not enough; you need to actually change your behavior, which, based on the most recent conversation, has not happened.

These "unwritten rules" that you have need to start being discussed. You need to tell him in a very clear way what you expect, e.g a 3 day notice. Not play "busy" hoping he'd get a hint, not saying sarcastically "have a good time", but tell him what you want.

Now, if after you tell him your expectations you still have the same issue, then it'd be time to start questioning things. But so far, you have set him up for failure by not being honest with him, and it's little surprise that he is failing your hidden tests <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.

AGG

Ah yes, the "hidden test" so popular with my gender. Sigh... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

AGG, Do you think men have some od these same hidden tests? Now that you've said it I'm wondering...perhaps for men it's the initail test of a "spark". If a woman fails to ignite a spark shortly after meeting does she fail a test she wasn't aware of. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

I'm not being critical, just wondering...

I'm going to start a thread on spark. I'm quite interested in this topic from a male perspective. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Oh, of course, I don't think that it's unique to one gender or the other <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.

It's the usual thing we see here, people posting saying "well, if s/he doesn't call me in two days, then I'll get furious". Hullo... why not call the other person yourself, right? Or at least tell the other person that you expect a call every two days, instead of expecting them to guess. That's the stuff I am talking about.

I am sure I do it too, even though I try not to <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />. But every time we expect the other person to read our minds, or the usual "if s/he loved me enough s/he would know what to do" we are setting ourselves up for failure <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.

AGG

Thanks AGG - You are right. I must confess, in my 12-year major dysfunctional marriage, communication was never, ever my strong point - my ex-husband's and my way of "communicating" was ignoring one another, so it's soooooo stinking hard for me to put feelings into acceptable words. And, I have this big "wall of pride" around me like a coat of armor which makes things not any easier. I think I'll down a quick shot of bourbon when I get home from work and pick up the phone to apologize for my not so nice behavior on the phone, and take it from there.....why oh why can't men read our minds??????

Boy, am I glad they can't! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Update --- Mr. Wonderful called last night, and after a long day's work, and an evening out with some friends, I decided that during that phone conversation, I wouldn't bring up any reference of last weekend and the miscommunication between the two of us. Not a good conversation to start over the phone after a long day I decided. We talked a bit, and he said that he would see me this weekend. I was firm, yet pleasant when I mentioned that I had plans for several days during this holiday weekend, and that hopefully we could find some time to get together - and that's where we left it. If we do see one another, I plan to start the discussion and make my apologies for my immature response - and hopefully it will go OK and we can get the issues resolved.

THtoB, Miscommunication? Are you sure that's what this is about?

To me it appears this is more about you having expectaions you have not shared with your BF. He is in the dark as to what you want from him. So you got a bit nasty on the phone, played some games, hoping he'll catch on.

If there's one thing I've heard the men on this site say over & over it's to be direct, they can't read our minds! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I do think you made the right choice in not bringing it up during your first post nasty conversation. But aren't you still playing games, hoping he will "get it" when you say you have plans during the holiday? Why not just nail down some plans while you had him on the phone instead of waiting for him to come back with something? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Yup, you are still doing the hidden test stuff. You are saying one thing but saying another.

You are saying this:


But you are thinking this:


So, you are still setting yourself up for failure, because both you and I know that when he does the usual, i.e. call and say "hey, how about dinner today", you'll say, indignantly "sorry, I am busy". And then you'll consider it as just another sign of how selfish or insensitive he is, despite the fact that you still will not have expressed your expectations to him.

AGG

Nams - No, this time I'm not playing any games when I did say I had plans - because since we hadn't spoken in over a week, I did make some plans - so it's not a lie. I don't expect him to "get it" this time, and I do hope that between his schedules for the holiday (he's got his daughter) and mine (BBQs and a graduation party) I am hoping that we can get together and discuss this. And, I do plan to come right out and talk about this in black and white, because you are soooooo right - beating around the bush certainly doesn't work, and I really need some work on my communication skills.

Noooooo - as I mentioned earlier, since we had not spoken since the original fiasco on MY part (I 100% admit my immaturity in this incident) I did make plans for the weekend already.....so no game playing this time.

Why in the world should he stop doing things with his friends because of you? Aren't you being a bit arrogant thinking he needs your approval to do things with his friends? It appears you had the option, but did not take it, Instead choosing to "go back and forth" and deciding nothing.

So, now you expect him to be a mind reader and know what you want him to do. And, if he can't read your mind, he should change his plans to please you.

You don't want a boyfriend. You want a wimpy guy who walks on eggshells to keep his woman happy.

Now, I will put down my 2x4 and wish you good luck in communicating accuratly with him, and patching up this problem.

Yeesh, I guess I really DO stink at communication - I do NOT expect him to cancel any plans he has for this weekend, and I do NOT expect him to get my approval before he makes any plans - I'm just saying that since I was such a nerd last weekend, it's my fault that we are both booked this weekend - my pride got in the way - and as such I'm not sure that I will see him this weekend - which is my loss. And, in no way, shape or form do I want a wimp who walks on eggshells, I had one of those for 12 years of marriage - not fun!

Well, you may not see it as "game playing", but the behavior is still essentially that - you (plural) are doing a dance, a dance that you have already seen does not work for you. So, he calls and says he would like to see you (but does not suggest when), and you say that you are busy but "hopefully we could find some time to get together" - but also do not tell him your schedule and when he might find the time to see you. So you intentionally leave him clueless.

When you say "hopefully we'll find time to see each other" but don't tell him your schedule, you are putting him in a position of not knowing how to see you - you are sort of saying "hey, you are a big boy, figure it out, but don't expect any help from me".

AGG

Perhaps the conversation could have gone like this:

BF says: I'll see you this weekend.

THtoB says: I'd like that. Let's make plans now because I've already got some commitments.

Do you want to see him? If yes why not just say so. In fact call him back & tell him you'd like to make plans now for the weekend.

It appears you want him to call you back to nail things down. Is this fair when you've not said as much to him?

What if he doesn't call back? Will you feel some hurt? Will you think he doesn't care enough to make plans to spend time with you?

I agree with AGG, you are leaving him clueless. Intentionally? I don't know...but that's the outcome. Maybe your words are very clear to you. But when you tell us what you've said they aren't telling your BF what you want. Try this: Write down what you want to say. Show us or friends you trust & we can tell what the words say to us.

Speak up, tell him what you want & what makes you feel unimportant.

OK friends - here's my evidence that I have been listening to all of your advice - and I thank you!

Mr. Wonderful called - he asked if I wanted to "grab something to eat" - the instant I had just walked in the door from work. I instead offered that he come over, I'll grill some burgers...........he agreed.

I'm tired from working this week - so I'm not sure if I'm going to get into all of the "relationship discussion" this evening - but we'll see. I'm just looking forward to seeing him (it's been a while) and I will use this opportunity to apologize for my behavior on the phone. And, I WILL (even if it kills me, tee hee) make sure that I let him know that I missed him, and that we should both make more of an effort to plan time together (although spontaneous is OK every now and then) since we both have pretty full schedules. I will point out that he IS important to me, and I will also acknowledge that I'm NOT the best in communicating my feelings but that I will really try from now on.

Sound good?

i dunno know about anyone else but that sounds like a start! i know i hate trying to read minds! and i know no one can read mine. my next relationship must have communication back and forth and honesty of what one wants, needs, and is feeling, and tell me at the time it happens, and i will do the same. i think that is just the way it's gotta be. my ex and i... NO COMMUNICATION... never knew what he was thinking, what he wanted, what bugged him, NOTHING. geez, give me something to work with! where as i was always trying to get him to talk and want to talk, and i would say how i was feeling and all i got was a blank stare and no response. yea, that was reallll fun. never ever again.
mlhb

That is so true for me - but I must learn to practice what I preach - I too had a 13 year marriage that was sorely lacking in the communication department. Our "communicating" was me yelling and him ignoring me. So, as this is my first sort of serious relationship since divorce, I've GOT to learn all over again, and man it's not easy to start from scratch!

Mr. Wonderful just left - he's got to work tomorrow. The evening went fine - at first we danced around the subject of last weekend until (and are you all proud?) I was the one who started with an apology, and the conversation just went from there. In the end, no one was declared "right" or "wrong" but we both got out of our systems our feelings about what had happened. We grilled our burgers, watched some TV and caught up on some make-out sessions we missed! I learned a few valuable lessons here - I must learn to chill out about unimportant stuff, AND I must learn to speak up about the important stuff. So, hopefully no major damage done - and we left the evening on a great note!

sounds like a good evening! i have been getting to know someone for about 3 months now.. we both agree on communication being huge and i will say he is very good at communicating and stating his wants and needs. quite a change from what i am used to but i appreciate his openness and honesty and straightfowardness, there is no guessing so far for the most part. so believe me, it does make a difference.
mlhb