Arkie

I agree

NBII picked up on something VERY important

the title of this thread says it all

it is a critical thinking error

"POJA vs exposure"

If Suzet*s conscience was functioning in regards to OM's W ... she'd be telling her H

"My conscience is killing me. Let's POJA how to expose once and for all."

BUT

she's not

because she does not want to hurt OM & look bad in his eyes

Suzet* KNOWS this will make her very UNattractive to OM



Pep

If I was a WS...
and my BS was denying me the opportunity to tell...

NOT based on realistic fear of harm to the OP's spouse or
harm to ME/BS...

I would be very very wary of BS that would not want the right to know to be offered to the OP's spouse...

ESPECIALLY in this situation.....

where there is opportunity for the OP to stop his own chaos before it crosses deeper and deeper lines...

this is NOT black and whit knee jerking response to inform...at all costs...

I have heard the 'reasons' for not telling the OP wife..
I'm weighing them..

and I'm just not buying them...

ARK

Katie Mae, actually, a few days ago I’ve brought up the above topic and my concerns to my H (about the OM living in a fantasy and destroying himself and his M by his continuous belief that I’m his “soulmate”). My H’s words were more or less the following:

“I understand what you're saying, but if he wants to keep pining over you and believe you are his “soulmate”, it’s his problem – he’s responsible for his own feelings and you’ve already taken responsibility by breaking contact with him. We can’t take the risk of informing his W since this might lead to the breakup of their M and what then about those 2 innocent children? No, it can lead to too much drama and we don't need that in our lifes right now.”

I didn’t know what to say and since I could see my H was a bit irritated about me bringing up the subject again, I left it at that. Yesterday I have brought up the topic again during dinner and my H have asked me to stop obsessing about this and stop being influenced by the opinions on this board - that we've already reached a decision. He stand by his opinion that we should only expose if it really becomes necessary in future. That's why I think it will be good to get Dr Harley's opinion on this too.

then stop posting about the situation

.... and stop discussing your marriage infidelity on an infidelity board

2Bnormal, yes I remember that thread. Actually I've done a search on that thread earlier today and have read through it again.

I will appreciate it you can send me Dr Harley's e-mail address. Did you had to pay a consultation fee to Dr Harley before he responded on your e-mail?

Exposure to the OP's spouse is NOT a "POJA" issue, it is a moral obligation. Dr Harley has never said this was POJA issue and told me this on his radio show.

He told 2BNormal, who still has never told her victim, that the "BS should always be told." He told her that her H should be the one to do the telling, not her since that might result in contact. She didn't like that advice, so she wrote back that her husband adamantly refused to allow her to do this. What was Dr. Harley supposed to say to that? He replied something to the effect that he was ok with that then, but perhaps her h should get some recovery help. [he also told 2BNormal she should never be on the computer, which she ignored, but that is another matter]

The point is that exposure to the OMW is the best thing for the OMW and for Suzet. To NOT tell her is detrimental to their marriage, AS WE HAVE SEEN. Matters that are destructive to the marriage are NOT matters for POJA.

I find it very amusing that Suzet doesn't need her husband's "permission" to do bad things, but somehow needs it to do good things. She has a moral obligation to her marriage and to this woman and fear of her husband's anger does not supercede that. If she has to sacrifice her morals to make her H happy, then she has bigger problems than this.

Agree very much with Pepperband's suggestion:

"I am going to tell (confess) to THE UNKNOWING BETRAYED SPOUSE that there was an affair so he/she may protect his/her self . This is my moral obligation that my conscience demands. Let's discuss this, and agree to a plan that fulfills my moral obligation."

Suzet,
Do you have a way that I could email you that email address?

I wanted to say I understand where you are at. My H felt very similar and no matter how much I brought it up or showed him posts from this board, he would not change his mind about not exposing to the OM's W.

I also wanted to add, we BOTH had discussed earlier this year that should the OM contact me again, we would expose to his wife. Well...OM did try to contact me again and my H still did not want to expose to the OM's W. My H did leave a message on their answering machine for the OM to call him (and other stuff), and we don't know whether the OM's W heard that message. OM did return the call to my H and my H made it very clear for the OM to NEVER contact me again. I wanted to let you know this, because I really thought my H would expose to the OM's W IF the OM contacted me again. I really feel that if you don't expose now, your H never may.

.... except I mis-spelled

CONSCIENCE

The email address is jharley@marriagebuilders.com

No, that is his wife's email

I have Dr. Harley's email.

Here is the correct email address:

bharley@marriagebuilders.com

Yes, they share this email. He has responded to me with that address. Their email addresses are not secret.

See my post above. He responded to me from that email address.

No, I did not have to pay a fee. I originally wrote to the email address that MelodyLane posted, and that email was replied to over their radio program. However, when Dr. Harley replied to me directly, he wrote from the email address I posted above.

Mel, the only bad thing I did since the EA ended a few years ago was my recent "slip-up" during the exchanges with OM. As I've already explained on my thread - I received it at a vulnerable moment and was caught "off-guard" (a terrible choice and mistake I know and I take full responsibility for what I did). As you have probably read on my thread - I felt very guilty and disappointed in myself…I felt (and still feel) like a "failure"... However, I took immediate steps to try and correct the situation by confessing here and to my H and sending an approved NC-letter. But now I'm caught up between a "moral obligation" I feel towards the OMW but at the same time I have a need and obligation to not disappoint and disrespect my H’s feelings again. I’m afraid if I continue with exposure without my H’s full support he might resent me afterwards should there be any bad consequences which might affect us directly... That's why I need Dr Harley's own "out of the horse's mouth" opinion on my situation.

Your H wants to use the potential of exposure to OMW exposure as a punishment or a threat.

That is not its purpose.

If it is not his responsibility that OM pines..then it is also not his responsibility that OM marraige may end as a result of OMs own actions [and yours].

If I were you..I would tell him that it IS his problem that OM pines..because you are quite inclined to pine right back and escalate the affair.

You went from what was essentially a crush..to a full out admission of feelings of love within the space of a few emails..and after several years of active marriage building.

Please do not be arrogant..I think that we both know that *in* the moment..you can not trust yourself..which is why you would be well advised to do anything and everything to KILL all traces of the affair..to burn bridges...scorch the earth. Make the affair have an end not an intermission.

The fact that your H is not taking the depth of your attachment [addiction] and attraction seriously is very concerning..will it actually have to become a PA before it *counts* for him? It could very easily you know. All you need is time, opportunity..and just the right nudge.

So thems the perks from your end.

Not the real reason that you expose though.

The real reason is purely and simply..that OMW is being decieved..she does not know what is the truth in her own life..this prevents her from making decisions about a wide variety of issues that are affecting her..but secretly.

This woman *is* the victim of your advances on her husband and your intrusion in her marriage [don't bother arguing that it was him to do the advancing..I'm not going to argue semantics..you were involved and participated..that's good enough for me] which means that you are in her debt..and I hope that it weighs heavily on you..if it doesn't it says things about you to me that are pretty unattractive.

You..more than anyone..KNOW the truth and you owe it to her to give back as much as you are able..this is a big gift..a big step.

In my opinion..your H getting in the way for any reason is just wrong..and no..I don't agree that it is or should be open to negotiation at all save perhaps for the hows and details.

Would you negotiate whether or not to douse yourself with water if you were on fire?

Would you be willing to forego IC if you came to the conclusion that you really needed it to be able to function in a manner that you feel proud of rather than remain in sickness because your H was more comfortable with the sickness than with the idea of change?

I certainly hope not.

This is one of those issues.

It's about who you are going to be..for ANY reason..everyone has reasons..no gets to hide behind them.

Suzet you'd find a reson to do the convenient thing even if Jesus HIMSELF told you directly to expose. " Lord, my H didn;t want to".

Calling Harley is a waste of time. You KNOW exposing to OMW is the right thing to do. You KNOW It.

One day in Glory you will use those same excuses to God himself why you didn't do the right thing. Think He will buy it, 'cos I don't. It the lamest cowardice and I suspect you know it.

But "whatever" its you that needs to see your reflection in the mirror, not me.

Suzet, I would recommend that you ask him to write a response back to you. They will read your email on the radio and Joyce will probably let you know the time beforehand so you can listen. If you can't listen, let some of the others know so we can listen and take notes for you.

2Bnormal, thanks for the address. Thanks for your words of support and understanding.