This is a letter I gave to my WW. I actually slipped it into her mail pile when she came over the other night. It's from a website that does a Q & A on problems people are facing in their lives.

After I gave this letter to my WW she told me it made her angry and that I am trying to tell her she's a sinner and that she's going to ******. She told me I don't realize how I come across to people.

I've had issues in the past with some disrespectful judgments with her and now I feel like I'm walking on eggshells anytime I try to point out the damage her affair may do to her.

So what do you think? Is this a DJ or not?


Question (to the host): Our marriage was on the rocks for years, and finally I packed up and left a few months ago. Now I've gotten involved with a man I know I'll never love, but I can't seem to walk away. I don't know why I'm writing, but maybe you can pray for me. I don't know how I got into this mess. — Mrs. K.K.


Answer: Dear Mrs. K.K.,
I don't know how you got into it either—but I do know this: The longer you continue this relationship, the less likely you are to find happiness.

Both human experience and the Bible teach us a very important truth: Bad decisions always lead to bad results. The Bible puts it this way: "Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction" (Galatians 6:7-8). Those are sobering words&mdahs;but they are true.

Perhaps your life has been marked by bad decisions in the past—but that's no reason for you to keep making them! Right now, you may feel lonely and unloved, and perhaps this is why you've gotten into the relationship. But it will never provide the love and emotional security you crave—so why keep going down this road? The Bible says, "A prudent man (or woman) sees danger and takes refuge, but the simple keep going and suffer for it" (Proverbs 22:3).

The most important thing I can urge you to do, however, is to turn to Christ and open your heart and life to Him. He loves you, and He wants to forgive your sins and give you the stability and peace you need. Commit your life to Him today, and then ask Him to give you the wisdom and courage to do what is right.

I think I answered this on your other thread...but telling your WW how the affair will damage her is a DJ...

Respect is knowing your own truth and speaking it about yourself...not others.

Look to your true intent in giving her this letter...be abjectly honest with yourself...do not fear how you will look...and share that here.

If you WW asks you, "How do you think this A will change my future, myself?" Then you can state your opinion. Remember that Jesus did not indiscriminately heal...you had to ask...you had to want...he could have healed entire cities, countries...the world...and he didn't. He was respectful.

I have learned to go by a signal...if I am into someone else's spirituality, then I am not in my own.

If I dwell on someone else's possible feelings, then exclude my own.

If I dwell in another's possible thoughts, beliefs or perceptions...well, you get the idea.

We can share, we cannot direct. That's not respectful. God's design has pure choice...

If I go on, I think I'll duplicate my other post.

Sorry 'bout that...

You are on a fabulous journey of self, Corinth...you have asked God for this and what you are experiencing is your heart's desire to understand and know with certainty, where you end and the world begins...and to experience the freedom, responsibility and love that is in reality, and in abundance.

That's what I believe. I prayed the same thing.

LA

P.S. To educate others when they have not asked is like telling them they are ignorant.

My thoughts were to strike a chord, possibly help along, a notion she may be feeling inside of her. This is me assuming she has some remorse inside her over this affair.

I am hoping for a conviction of her sins so she will humble herself and come back to God.

My IC told me tonight, after I shared this letter with him, that it is not for me to try to convict her, but let the Holy Spirit and God do that. Not for me to do. Not my position right now.

I believed that even if the letter didn't make a difference now, maybe down the road she will read it and it will make some sense.

I think at my core, I want the scales to just drop from her eyes and she'll suddenly realize how destructive her affair will be on her life. To preserve her. So she can heal.

The more I try, the further she runs and the more disdain she has for me. It's like I have this great ambition to help her, this sincere desire to reach out to her, and then it turns out to be just another "attack" from me.

I can't win for losing on this it seems. I am perplexed.


This is a great point. I never thought about Jesus like this before. He shows respect even when healing people. That's amazing when I think about it. The more I understand about Him, the more apparent His glory and grace, the more brilliant I understand Him to be.

I have so much to learn. And yes, I want my WW to see that I am not what she believes me to be, but that I have tried, however ineffectively, to love her. I just don't want love to be a fantasy I concoct in my own head, but a reality I can stretch my arms around.

That is why I am here.

Thanks LA

Hi Corinth - Do not beat yourself up for confronting sin - Jesus did confront sin and boy did it p.o. some people. Remember, God is holy and this offends. It is true that the Holy Spirit's role is to convict her heart such that she repents, however, the Holy Spirit often works through the words or actions of other people. Her reaction shows that she was convicted by this (see, the Holy Spirit is working in this) - the letter offened her, and it offended her because she knows she is guilty. Keep praying. She will not repent until she accepts that she is in willful sin. One good way to hold her accountable without giving your opinion (or quoting scripture, which is making her sqirm without repentance) is to ask her questions that make her reason on her own. i.e.: What do you think God thinks about this? What is your Scriptural support for this belief/position? Then, after you ask the questions, do not comment, be quiet and let her keep talking, if she will, then ask gentle, nonacusitory follow-up questions: Why do you belive this? Could this scripture be refering to anything else? etc. Then, after she has talked for a while, if she has erred, just say, "well, I diagree" or "Well, I do not see this Scripture the smae way" etc. Then wait for her to ask you why. If she doesn't, keep waitng and keep letting her talk, and keep asking pointed questions to make HER think. Remember, the enemy doesn't usually come at us with blazen lies, the enemy comes with half-truths. Make her defend her positon without appearing to be her enemy (though you are not, her offense suggests that she sees you that way). Also, it is good to pray for the Lord to guard your mouth, such that you say nothing He would not have you say, and to touch her ears so that she hears what God would have her hear when you speak. And BELIEVE that God has granted this to you. Pause before speaking to her, and allow God to temper your conversations and touch your heart so that you can hear God when He prompts you to speak or be quiet. And do not forget that God is BIG. He can use anything to accomplish His will, He is even big enough to use your having put your foot in your mouth. Give Him credit and let Him work. He is the one who brings beauty from ashes - and remember, the long lost son did not return until he ate with the swine. Give God the room to bring her to the bottom of herself.

all my love
allforone

Corin,

"My thoughts were to strike a chord, possibly help along, a notion she may be feeling inside of her. This is me assuming she has some remorse inside her over this affair."

What do you call taking an action or making a statement to get a desired response?

"I think at my core, I want the scales to just drop from her eyes and she'll suddenly realize how destructive her affair will be on her life. To preserve her. So she can heal."

If you continue to focus on what she is thinking, feeling, believing, then you continue to betray yourself...your own thoughts, feelings and beliefs. You do not have the ability to preserve or heal her. She does. What if you focused on your own healing, getting to what is inside you which makes focusing on her, her responses and reactions, so desirable?

"The more I try, the further she runs and the more disdain she has for me. It's like I have this great ambition to help her, this sincere desire to reach out to her, and then it turns out to be just another "attack" from me."

Honestly, Corinth...I would run, also. I run from someone changing me, defining me, DJing me...because only I have that power. You are seeing all these choices you are making as attempting to connect, when I'm begging you to respect, first.

"I can't win for losing on this it seems. I am perplexed."

Again, can you look to the premise you live your life and state it? Can you control, heal, cure, cause, preserve, fix others? Is that in God's design?

I don't hold with DJing...especially God. He loves your WW wholly, completely, as he does you...and he made us separate and equal, without control over anyone else but us...for a reason. Stay in the power God gave you...know your own LBs, where you are causing a lot of grief to self, in your pursuit to help someone who sees your help as control, judgment and being told not that they are doing wrong, but that they ARE wrong.

Have you read "Facing Love Addiction"? Do you understand you are lovable and whole in just being, not doing? Is it your deepest truth that if only she would wake up and behave, you would have the marriage you desire?

LA

No, I can't do these things. But if there is no one planting seeds, if I don't plant seeds, am I doing what I can to help her in the long run? Can't I help?

Part of that is recognition of what is being done wrong. I know I relate to her the way I would have others relate to me, not necessarily how she would like to be related to. Not the way she wants to be treated because she doesn't want to know the TRUTH. (I also think she won't face it because it would mean me winning)

I am open to people telling me exactly how it should be. I value that, because I can take from it what measures up to God's standards and then I can look at myself, apply what is legitimate, and try to make adjustments, try to grow.

My WW doesn't want to hear anything about what or where she's making poor choices. It's like dealing with a teenager who gets mad when being disciplined.

I need discipline, I also need love. My WW needs discipline, but also isn't seeing my love, or I am not showing it in a way she can understand it. God disciplines when he loves us.

If I pull back from telling her she's wrong, then she may believe what she's doing is acceptable. Then again, she already thinks that, or at least enough to justify leaving me and fleeing my disrespect.

These are all very good questions. I am honored to have people on this site showing the patience and love required to make great changes.


In some ways, yes. This is also a completely unfair way of thinking. I've often thought that if only my W were doing X,Y,Z our marriage would work better, but then, very shortly before d-day I changed my attitude (or was trying) to instead make it ME who, if I changed and did X,Y,Z our marriage would begin to repair. Too late.

I kept complaining to my brother about my W. How this and that were not right. I asked him what my job was. He said, "your job is to love your wife." Very plainly.

I finally understood what it was I was supposed to be doing. Understanding this and practicing it are two different things, but I finally got it. It was simple. Stop trying to change her around and just love her as she is. Put off the disgruntled husband garbage and just love her. Adore her. Treat her with respect. Be her man. Be the first to introduce her at the party. Walk next to her and not in front of her.

Then came D-day. And so many other things against me have come out. I don't know if anything I could've done would've changed the outcome. My WW has many, many things going on inside her head. Things I also have issues with. Those things I am working on now. She has her walls, her fears, but she would never tell me any of them. Now she blames me for all of this.

Hey, I take my blame. Now I want to get past it.

I am willing to learn.

But let me get something straight, how can I respect my WW when she is doing this to herself and me? If I don't confront her about it, I feel like I'm condoning it. LA, how can I show respect when I don't?

Also, I feel like I can't even say anything anymore to WW. Is this how this works? Don't offend the offender? Make her feel good about herself because, deep down, she feels bad about herself?

According to her, she's happy! She loves her decision. She makes sure I know she's "at the beach" and I hear her boyfriend talking in the background while she talks to her husband (still me) about divorce papers! Who the h##l are these people and how did I get involved with them? These are the kind of people that literally make me sick. Is that a DJ? It should be a matter of common decency and respect for other human beings.

I'm having a tough time understanding where my ability to do anything begins and ends. The whole idea that anything I say to WW now is a DJ limits my responses to only what makes her feel good and what inhibits me.

Thanks Allforone,



I keep praying for WW. We are getting desperately close to a D now. Where we are and with our circumstances, we could be within the next two or three weeks. I have people telling me to hurry up, but I keep stalling so WW has a chance to understand. I'm not at all confident she will.


My counselor brought up that I keep trying to solve the problem with the same failed approach. Even though WW claims to be Christian, she reacts negatively to scripture.



This is a good idea. Problem is when I get in front of her, I lack a plan, and I get lost in the arguing and say things that set her off. I basically revert to tactics that have never worked with WW.


She doesn't talk much, unless she's angry or she's pointing out all my flaws. I'm about tired of talking to her. It's really like talking to a bratty teenager even though in reality she is a smart woman.


This is a good prayer for me. I need this for when I do talk to her. Another problem I have is I try to be so nice and kind to her, I end up being hesitant and come off weak and clumsy. It's like, while I'm thinking of how to put something so nice and tender, I actually instead choke up and feel like a pansy when the conversation is over.


I pray she will come to the bottom of herself just as I have a few times in my life. She sees this A as a way to move past the pain and on with her life and career.

To be quite honest, I have no idea what she's thinking, I just pray God will intervene sometime soon.

I hate to say this, but I think you need to hear it.
you need to first fix yourself, before trying to fix your neighbour. or in this case, your wife. In many ways, she is RIGHT to not come back to you yet. Seems like you dont deserve it. You have been hitting her with scripture, but you are not following it yourself.

this is right in line with basic MB principles. You have to stop doing LoveBusters yourself, before you have any chance of attracting her back.


Then you have a serious problem with yourself. You have not truely accepted that to show her love or express it... selfless love... is acceptible to yourself. Maybe she senses that, which is why she doesnt believe you when you try to be that way with her.

May God grant you humility, and a servant's heart, I pray for you.

techie,

Well, I guess I have serious problems then. You probably understand the great amount of confusion I'm under right now.

I know I'm supposed to love unconditionally, I'm trying. I'm trying to reach out to her. I have virtually nobody advising me on how to do this with her. 95% of people I know tell me to kick her to the curb, treat her like a disease and just move on.

A small number tell me to learn from this, better myself, pray for her healing and try to love her through this whole thing. I know I have many, many things to work on. I know I'm failing left and right, I seek God over and over and nothing changes with my wife. It is insane. The same pathetic attempts with the same outcome.

I agree I shouldn't focus my energies on my WW, but she also has no justification or right whatsoever to do what she is doing. I know you're saying she won't come back to a harsh, judgmental person (me) and I understand that. I don't want to be that person. I want to be whole again.

I'm just trying to navigate, my friend.


By the time I'm fixed, WW will be long gone. Part of this is, not having a chance to prove I'm not the ****** she thinks I am. I know, wrong answer...

I'm no expert.. I'm just starting in on this ****** myself. But from what I have read... wouldnt it be better if you concentrate on fixing you first.. so that even if she DOES leave before you succeed... maybe someday she would come back, and stay back?

rather than attempting to force things now, having a false recovery, and then having her leave forever, since "she tried to make things better once, but you proved it couldnt work between you" ?

I'm sure you'll make mistakes now and then. we're all human. But keep trying. From everything I've read on here and elsewhere, the best way to make her stay in the long term, is to focus on your own behaviour.

As someone recently said on here, roughly speaking: you cant pull her back; you have to help her WANT to come back.

Corinth13 -

I've just skimmed your thread, so I'm not 100% familiar with your story, but I wanted to share some thoughts with you.


Stop. Get out of the pilot's seat, and let God in it. I'm not trying to make a joke, or make fun of your situation.

Ask yourself this - have any of your plans to fix your marriage and win your wife back worked? It doesn't sound like it - in fact, it sounds like you're pushing her away, even though that's not your intent.

Your faith comes through loud and clear - now lean on it. You are not in this alone, even if you feel like it. Even if there is absolutely nobody else in your corner, God is.

Sure, I understand. We can't see God directly. We can't have a chat with Him in person at the local coffee shop. But He is there, and you can see the effects of His presence.


And you know this (that she'll be long gone) how? Again, I'm not trying to make fun of you. Let her face the consequences of her actions - she may come back to you. But the only way she'll come back to you (if you want her when she does) is if you're on attractive spouse - that's the whole theory behind Plan A.

I see a lot of you in me - I understand where you're coming from. I'll try and catch up on your threads tonight so I can speak more articulately, but I just wanted to jump in and contribute something that I hope is helpful.

You might want to look at Dobson's Love Must Be Tough book. Sometimes the way to win the wayward back is to open the "cage door", as he calls it.

She's too enmeshed in her own world and desires right now. The last person she's going to listen to is the husband that she thinks is such a jerk. You can talk until your blue in the face, and she won't hear a word you say.

She will notice your actions. It sounds like you've identified the problems you have - take some time and focus on you.

I apologize if I sound like I'm attacking you. Not my intention. I just see you going down a path that I tried (though not in an impending divorce situation) and want to share my experiences there. Sometimes backing off is the best thing to do, even when every fiber in our body screams "Do Something!".

As the saying goes - Let go, and let GOD. I'll write more if I get a chance (and I haven't upset you <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />).

techie, brokenbird,

thanks both of you. I'm trying to let this go to God as I've learned it is the best way and I've said as much many times on my previous threads.

I'm at a hard place right now, the stress of our D approaching quickly and not seeing the changes in myself, or my WW, that I have been praying for. Divorce in our situation could take only two weeks. I'm not sure I want to save my M, but I'm also just stressing over the reality of a divorce and watching my W do what she's doing.

I don't want to walk away from this without a true and noticeable change in the way I approach relationships. Some of that is through prayer, some of it is identifying and practicing change.

I invite all comments.

Hi Corinth,

As you well know, I am in a similar sitch with my WH. I'm afraid I don't have anything new to offer you except that I am learning to relinquish my WH and M to God.

I will be praying for you, Corinth.

For I am the Lord, your God, who takes hold of your right hand and says to you, "Do not fear, I will help you." Isaiah 41:13

Take care of yourself.

Corinth,

You were changing before DDay...why does DDay stop that?

"If I pull back from telling her she's wrong, then she may believe what she's doing is acceptable. Then again, she already thinks that, or at least enough to justify leaving me and fleeing my disrespect."

This is where DJs hurt you...and your WW. You told your WW she's sinning, doing wrong, injuring and destroying...yet you do not respect she knows. She Knows. You can choose to believe that or not...and keep repeating, like training an employee or raising a child...and she is neither. You do not accept her choice to have an A...she can't make anything acceptable to you...only her herself...and you can't make it unacceptable to her...this is where you're trying to give it over to God, what you can't control, by his design, and holding HER behind your back, saying, "Oh, you can have the rest, but I'll handle this, 'k?"

Been there, Corinth. I know this...until I found out about ME, I couldn't bring what was behind my back, in my own hand, around to my eyes...and SEE it.

You're not wrong or defective...you're not made to win, lose, be right or be wrong...you were made to BE. To exist. Whole, complete...marvelous creation...

You are choosing to your thoughts, feelings and beliefs from fear. Trapped by your own choices...please choose differently. Choose from love. Stay present. Focus on you...because you are valuable and worth the focus.

Plan A isn't about judging others...it isn't about getting them to come out of the fog...it truly is understanding thoroughly the difference between what you can control (only you) and what you cannot (any other human being on the planet).

Try loving by choice, rather than unconditionally. Truth is, God designed us not to love against our will...we do nothing against our will...it's ours...including choosing to love others. You are choosing to love your wife...like your brother said...adore her, love her, choosing your acts of love not for their effect...to get love in return...but in being you, a being of love, and knowing you are not trapped, you are choosing to love, anyway.

Sit quietly and think on this...would God, our creator, have designed us to earn love? To make us and then make us earn his love? What point would be in there? Did he make us with an automatic gene to love him? Can't help it? No. He respected us when he gave us choice and limits...so he can be chosen, free will, which IS loving...not earning love.

Know your power, Corinth...sit and be loved--You Are. Sit and love...you do...by choice. Own what is already yours...it is a lot harder than it sounds...it is simple, not easy.

Like BB said for cage door...I don't believe you can set someone free...you can, however, acknowledge and live in the reality, they already are...and share that reality.

Emphasize choice, not blame...you are not her parent...DJs certainly make us appear the parent to our partner...living disrespectfully, believing we can cause, control or cure someone...well, that's parental. Can't parent an equal, can you? Only children...and even then, we mostly do that, disrespectfully. That's why we are, as adults, believing what isn't real...like love being earned.

You're not alone and you're not broken, Corinth. You had a big revelation before DDay...go back, sit in it...DDay doesn't change your truth...it remains. Truth endures all things...it is What Is...sit with it. Know it.

Would it help at all if I said that your focus on WW is abusive? It is...to yourself...and to her. It is where you have no control...and you know God's mysterious works? Well, they work better when you get out of the way of them...and stay in what you do control...so he can work in others...and in you...with you home, 100%, in there, and not living in your WW's head.

You can do this, Corinth. You are in the middle of the biggest event of your life...takes both hands, an open heart, and questing faith to be right where you are and get all that is being offered...the abundance...and you can walk right past if all you can see is your WW and her stuff...please, stand still.

LA

Corinth - I don't see where you posted a Plan B letter. Did you do it?

If you haven't, it's not too late - get some input from here - include that you will not participate in the destruction of your covenants that you made with God as witness on your wedding day; then get it delivered, then go dark - no e-mails, no text messages, no contact, period.

Let her process-server deliver the divorce papers, but do not fill them out until you are legally required to deliver them up. Make certain that you are contesting the divorce. Do not allow her to see you, hear from you - let OM completely and entirely meet her needs.

Do it today!

Thank you Kayla, thanks LA,

LA, your posts are good to read and ponder, I read them often. This is what I need to work on, being me. I bought the book, "Facing Love Addiction," so much in that book has myself and my WW in the crosshairs that it's scary. I can't hardly digest it all.

This whole experience so far is a crash course on love, marriage, infidelity, relationship, the self, God in our midst, vulnerability, trust, respect, agape, the eros, my ego and all of it has my head spinning... how to absorb it all I do not know. But keep the posts coming. They help part the seas a little every day.

Kayla, the only thing WW and I really talk about are finances and the d. By now, I know the d is going to happen. I believe my WW will not stop until she gets it. I need to get myself healed up at this point. It's shaking the defeatist spirit that needs attention.

Bump

This is for Brokenbird, LA, Kayla... thought I'd send this to the top. BB, have you had a chance to look at the thread, yet?

Thanks to all

Corin,

I'm very glad you got the book and are finding you're not alone, not even unusual, eh? As you get through it, you'll find that to end this addiction within you...only part you control...is a process...have faith in the process when you can't in others, 'k? Knowing that you no longer pursue or withdraw...that will help you out...stand still...which goes to what you're working on, also...

"It's shaking the defeatist spirit that needs attention." Staying present...not going into the future, even a day, is the key to maintaing your real spirit...staying present, knowing you're in the right now...not the forever, always, never, ever place...what comes has to come into the present...don't run out to meet it up the road...because that's not real, is it?

I do remember the all at once feeling of learning so much...and I spent some fruitless time wondering why I didn't learn some of it before...don't waste your time...stay respectful and present. Do those open and honest (O&H) statements...today you are not divorced. Today you can share yourself for yourself...be safe by listening and repeating...respectful...this was the path to my own healing. You'll find your own...have faith in yourself...because you only have today, the right now...and you know this, though your emotions feel endless, your expectations, bottomless...and your beliefs in conflict.

I found acceptance in those books, Corinth...that I wasn't nuts or wrong or broken...I pray you will, also.

Stand still and stay present.

LA

Thanks LA for telling me about the book "FLA." Lights are turning on in my head when I'm reading it. I can see this is the beginning of a time of understanding for me. I believe out of all tragedy comes wisdom if we're willing, and wisdom is more precious than anything.

God Bless,
Corinth

Corin,

I read your new thread post...and caught a couple of DJs...this isn't me pointing out errors...my intent is to help you see them, what they are, and how they hurt you, affect your choices and emotions.

And I wanted to suggest a response to your WW when she says she tried for a year..."I am going to try for one year, too. I am willing to try for many years to recover our marriage."

Nothing you say to her will crack her fog...everything you say affects you and changes you.

To get all the wisdom out of your life events, I believe we must get to the root of ourselves...and by doing so, you really do gain when you feel like you've lost the most. Eliminating DJs would give you a freedom and a real power in place of the prison and false strength you're getting right now.

LA