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OK-
I've been here and there on the board with my story. I have an unhappy H, who has admitted to a ONS that happened a year ago. He voluntarily confessed as part of the "love you but not in-love with you" speech and said he wants to split. Denies there is anyone else right now. Says he's willing to go to MC. But refused to go the the counselor I found.

I'm suspicious. He has lots of opportunity to engage in an EA or PA. He works with several women who he finds much to talk about with.

From conversation I know these womens first names, but not much else. I did snoop his cellphone address book and I have their cellphone#s.

Things are very tense at home. We've been fighting a lot over the past year or more, and I have threatened to leave the M too, but would much prefer to resolve the problems, and trust and enjoy one another again. In service of that goal, I have been presenting a calm and cheerful attitude, and avoided conflict, pressure, direct questions etc. He has done the same. Smokescreen.

I would like reassurance that the relationships are professional friendships, not EAs or PAs. I would like to have conversations with these ladies myself. I don't know how to bring this up without tipping the delicate balance and causing him withdraw further.

I have discovered that I can reverse lookup these cellphone #s and learn a bit more. (last name, address, possibly marital status, But there is a fee. And I've never liked doing that sort of thing.

Advice?

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Snoop.... just don't get caught. A wayward spouse will not be transparent... they'll lie, evade, smokescreen, manipulate, excuse their way out of any self incrimination.

If there are a lot of calls, be even more suspicious. If you don't know his password to his computer, purchase and install a keylogger, which will enable you to see any and all of what he does there, including secret e-mail acounts. If you "ask" him to become transparent, it will alert him to your suspicions and drive him deeper underground, making him harder to catch.

Scrutinize all his credit card purchases, note where he made those purchases, and see if they make sense. Lunch? For one or two? Search his car and his sports bags, anywhere you think he might have stashed any evidence. Just don't get caught.

In the mean time, purchase and read Surviving an Affair, by Willard Harley, founder of this website. It will give you the dynamics of an affair and a plan to save your marriage if one is taking place.

Remain cool, calm and collected and try to fill your H's lovebank until you prove or disprove his actions. One other suggestion, get a voice activated recorder and stash it under the seat in his car or truck, and see if you can catch clandistine conversations there.

If your gut still tells you somethings wrong (and your gut is seldom wrong) hire a PI to get what you need. Come back and get coached on how to expose, once you get the goods on him..... and you will.

Best wishes,
SD


BH - me 53, ONS 1979
FWW - 51, 2 EA's, 1 PA
Last D-Day, Sep. 30, 2003
Last Contact/recovery began 2-26-04

***You can do anything with time and money...but remember...money won't buy you time!***
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I got a strange phone call. H was out, (not mysteriously 'out', but taking Son for haircut) and the home phone rang. Lady on the other end asked for H, I said he wasn't in. Then she says "is this (goldenapple)?" I say yes, she says "Oh hello, this is .........., (One of his co-workers that I wonder about) I've heard your name so often but I've never talked to you!" I said "yeah, same here."

Then she said that H had told her that his M was in trouble, and that she was hoping that things would work out for us.

I wasn't sure what to say, so I just thanked her and indicated that both of us were feeling sad and confused.

Then she sorta laughed and said that men just STAY confused, and also that she had "jumped in his -----" when he told her he wanted out of his M, and for me to hang-in, and she would send some "white light" my way. Then we said goodbye.

I'm not sure what to make of this conversation...She hasn't called the home phone before that I know about. Could this have been a set-up? Or am I just so paranoid that I'm seeing bogeymen (or bogeyladies) everywhere?

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If the phone call you received was sincere, then she must not have known he was out of the house. I would be looking into if you H had contact with this woman while he was out getting your son's haircut.

If you find evidence of contact with this woman after your H left the house, I think you have some snooping to do.

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His cell was at home on the charger. I gave him the message that she had called, and said that I was surprised because she had not called the home phone before.

He said yes she has, you just didn't answer it. Which could be true, I work on the phone, so when I'm home I'm tired of the phone and let other people get it.

He did call her back, l heard him leave a message...."I'll be in the office Monday...can't do anything about it until then."

I wanted to pry, "Can't do anything about what?" but I'm playing it cool so I didn't. I just tortured myself with suspicious imaginings.

I HATE feeling like I do right now! I'm reading everything into anything all the time. Or am I?

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you're not paranoid, if they really are out to get you.

I never thought my wife would do what she did before she moved out. saw her plans for it. confronted her. asked her about it at least twice. claimed she had changed her mind.
but when she was out, she went ahead and did it anyway.

WS's seem to have no problems lieing about anything and everything. It seems prudent, then, to not believe them about ANYTHING, unless you personally know that it is true by other means.


ME: H, 35, married 9 years. 3 young sons W:32, series of online "friendships" 1st D-day: some time 2004 (online EA) OM broke off, NC june 2005, but no recovery plan 2nd D-day: june 20th, 2006("ILY" to "friend"). W moved out next day. Oct 2006, starts being around a 3rd guy instead. Mar 2007, stopped? Current status: Separated. W filed D. in July 2006, served Dec 11th, my response filed Jan 8th Most recent thread
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New development...
There is a work/social event coming up. H says we should go and carpool with this lady and some other people from his office. He's never included me in one of these before, (There haven't been many and he doesn't go to all of them and the last one he attended, I couldn't make anyway)

I'm actually delighted. But my suspicions are poisoning my pleasurable anticipation. Is he offering transparency? or lulling me into a false sense of security?

Now I'm trying to figure out how to make "small talk" with this lady to see if I can get a better read on the sitch.

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Your husband does not have proper fences & boundaries up if he is talking to women at work about the state of his marriage. Poisonously dangerous territory, and how most A's start.

I find the call extremely odd -- could she be "feeling you out" on your commitment to the M, since she wants him? Was she just calling to say Hi? To check in out of concern? Honestly, I don't think he would want you in the same car as her if he was having an affair with her. But that doesn't mean their Friendship isn't dangerous.

Whether he is involved with her or anyone else or not, his communication with her is very dangerous for your marriage. He should not be crying on her shoulder about his marriage. Boy, I told my H that before his A started, that OW shouldn't be crying on my H's shoulder... I wish I had stated it with MUCH more conviction and a back up plan!

By all means, don't reveal to your H that you have suspicions until you can investigate.

If the ladies are involved with your H in an EA or PA, they won't be honest with you in many cases. Find out your information by other means I think.

MSA


BW 43 me
FWH 39
M 1992; DD 18. 13
OC 8-05 - no contact
In recovery 8 years
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I agree STOWaway!
He's got no business talking to a friend of the opposite sex about his M troubles.
In our conversation she did say she found his talking about it to her a little TMI...(Too Much Information) that's when she "jumped in his ______" But then she tells ME about it. (?)
Her voice didn't sound like the voice of a "younger woman" either. From that and her job title and responsibilities I would guess she is closer to my age.

So maybe she is just a nice lady, but something of a busybody. I would like to believe that.

Wonder what will happen at the "event". Anyone got hints on what to look for?

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At the "event" and car-ride, if it were me I would just have all eyes open for anyone he is talking to, and perhaps more importantly who he distinctly ISN'T talking to... I dunno, I would think he would only bring you to such an event if OW wasn't going to be around, but stranger things have happened...

Don't rule out any woman because she's older than him, unattractive, weird, unsociable, self-centered... my FWH had called his OW all of these things (well, not older...) at one point or another but affair/addiction is about how OW makes him FEEL, not how she looks, contrary to conventional wisdom.

Any other snooping or fishing you can do with regard to cell phones, or putting a digital voice recorder under the seat of his car, or confirming his whereabouts, etc?

MSA


BW 43 me
FWH 39
M 1992; DD 18. 13
OC 8-05 - no contact
In recovery 8 years
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I'm trying to figure out ways of low tech snooping, don't have the finacial resources to buy snooping gear. I need to find out how he gets his cellphone bill, so I can sneak a peek sometime. I haven't seen it come in the mail or the home inbox. He gets some mail at his work.

He does spend a lot of time on the phone, always has... H and his love of the telephone has long been a source of amusement among our friends, so even if I look at his phone records I might not be able to figure anything out.

I have 3 prime suspects for a possible OW.

1. The lady of the phone call. They work together and share an interest in the same sport. He once took a "day trip" with her to participate in a sporting event. Left early, was back before dark. I did find out she is married.

2. A twentysomething lady who was his student, and is now an intern at his employment. He reccomended her for the position. (Harrummph! is this classic A bait or what.)

3. Another twentysomething who is his teaching assistant, I did see an email exchange from her, didn't see anything that looked "flirty" or personal. But he does talk to her a lot, and if he's babbling to one female co-worker, he's likely babbling to her too.

Not a good thing at all.

I would like to ask that he invite the intern and the teaching assistant to visit us socially at home.

I have their cellphone #'s . Maybe I should call all of them and make an invite for a surprise party for H! (Now wouldn't THAT be a fine thing for him to come home to!)

The "surprise party" thing was actually done by a college friend of mine, not with a husband, but a two-timing boyfriend. He was dating her and her room-mate, telling both of them that it was all over with the other. The two girls compared notes....Bam! he was so busted...they meet him in the dorm lobby and banished him loudly and publicly from their lives.

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Got another call from the coworker! This time she asked for me by name. (Son answered the phone) She asked if we were planning to attend the event. I said yes and I was looking forward to it. She said that was great, and that she had told H to make sure I came along.

We chatted just a bit...who else would be there...what to wear etc. I said nothing about the state of our M, and neither did she.

So maybe she is genuinely concerned, and doing what she can do on her side to provide transparency about her friendship with H.

Last night I was able to tell H that I was worried that he was talking over his troubles with a co-worker. Didn't say anything about an EA or PA with opposite sex, just mentioned that workplace gossip might impact his chances for promotion or better assignments. Didn't make a big deal of it, just mentioned as part of a conversation about office politics in general.

I think it made an impression...he got very quiet and changed the subject.

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My immediate thought at the first mention of this lady was that she was trying to tell you something.

Remember she doesn't know about MB and so wouldn't know it was OK to just tell you her observations and/or fears. She is now trying to make sure you are seen at the function - by whom? OW?.

I wouldn't call her a busybody. I would call her a guardian angel. Maybe your husband said the bit about "I can't do anything about until Monday" because she did not tell him the true reason for that 'phone call. She is snooping for you and letting you know.

I know this is how I might have dealt with an observed EA or PA before I knew MB. Now I would call and identify myself and give all info and offer to get more. I know to make it clear now.

I could be totally wrong about this ... but wanted to run it by you for your consideration.

SP


Me BSx2 63

1st M 13yrs WS Multiple As.

DD45 DD43 DS41 first marriage.

Him WS 56 P/A. PA + Multiple EAs from day one.

Current M. 26years

D Days 10/02, 11/02, 01/03, right up to 03/06

NC since 03/2006

Me Stage IV Breast Cancer since 36months,

Let us run with endurance the race that is set before us (Hebrews 12:1).Titus wife, Linda
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I am hoping exactly that! But I am still "playing it cool ." I am waiting for the right opportunity to call her, perhaps to discuss the carpool arrangements etc. When we do meet, I'll see if she's open to exchanging some "girl giggles" and confidences. I'd love to have a girl buddy who's not a co-worker, and I think it would be good if H and I had friends in common.

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Quote
I'd love to have a girl buddy who's not a co-worker, and I think it would be good if H and I had friends in common.

I agree, although you have to keep how close you are with her away from husband, do not give him a clue that you are getting pally. I wouldn't even go the giggly girl route, I would just quietly tell her I was concerned about my husband's relatioships that were not mutal to us both, and would appreciate any inconspicuous support from someone who felt the same.

We all need a good woman friend where our husbands work. You both seem to be edging around each other, if she is not an angel and is somehow duplicitous, your instinct will start beeping in your chest.

Don't ignore it or confuse it with excitement if she further opens up to you.

Linda


Me BSx2 63

1st M 13yrs WS Multiple As.

DD45 DD43 DS41 first marriage.

Him WS 56 P/A. PA + Multiple EAs from day one.

Current M. 26years

D Days 10/02, 11/02, 01/03, right up to 03/06

NC since 03/2006

Me Stage IV Breast Cancer since 36months,

Let us run with endurance the race that is set before us (Hebrews 12:1).Titus wife, Linda
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I would tend to agree that she is getting involved to try to straighten your H out. If so, what a fab gal. It seems too conincidental that she would do this at the same time that you are suspicious - I would view it as no coincidence at all.


Still, be cautious of her. We've all seen Fatal Atraction and she could be blackmailing your H or trying to insinuate herself into your marriage or spying for the OW, etc. Just keep your eyes open.

I would invest in a keylogger ASAP. An older version of online recorder (Original Programs) would work great and this should be cheap. Google it or search eBay for an older copy that someone is selling. You will have to set your virus software to ignore it, too, when it scans. If you find anything, you will be tempted to expose right away - try to get as much documentation as you can first, though, and fight tooth and nail to not let him know HOW you found out. For example, don't say "I read the email you typed and have access to your hotmail account" because he will then change all of his passwords from another computer, avoid using the home computer, and you will have no way left to spy.

(((goldenapple2)))


FBW 36 Best help: www.aftertheaffair.net ebook for WS Moving forward with hope!
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When is the event? Any new word from her?

And Linda, thanks for the comment about every woman needing to have a good woman friend at her H's work... I'm adding it to my "to do list"!!


BW 43 me
FWH 39
M 1992; DD 18. 13
OC 8-05 - no contact
In recovery 8 years
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The event is in 3 weeks. It's a dinner/awards ceremony at a hotel. I get to dress up!

No new word directly to me from Phone Lady. But H told me that she said that a flirty prank I played on H at work was hilarious. (I posted the details and an update in Romantic Experiences.)
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...ge=0#Post347164

I do need a friend, but as Silverpool and allforone said, I need to be cautious. At the event I want to be very charming, but reserved, and try to gather information without revealing much about myself. I've known people who do this very well, and I'm wondering if I can bring it off. Social gatherings like this have always seemed more work than fun to me.

I am looking forward to dressing up. I want to present a very sophisticated, elegant look. Mysteriously sexy, not bare and brazen, more like a cool dish of vanilla ice cream, but with candy redhots hiding at the bottom of the bowl.

Think of a prim and proper English professor, who did her Master's Thesis on erotic literature, but her students never know it, unless they know her very well.

I know I can manage this visual presentation, I've worked as a stylist. It's my own behavior and self-control while wearing the presentation gear that I'm not sure of. Acting is hard work.


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