Papa,

If I were you I would not engage her at all regarding visitation. That is what you have a lawyer for.

She has had her chance to work out an amicable agreement and she blew it.

I'll try and see.

I find it a bit odd that she specifically requested IM. My guess is that she wants me to say something on IM that she can try to use against me later.

I'll play it very carefully, as if I was being interrogated by an enemy.

Papaof3,

I would NOT discuss these topics on IM with her. YOu do realize that IM is not private? You do realize you could get trapped into something even worse than you have now? As has been pointed out YOU have a lawyer for this job, let the lawyer deal with it now.

For a man as well trained as you seem to be, you really don't seem to get the picture. It amazes me. The picture is simple. She is gone. YOU gave her full custody. She will fight for that as well as the child support because she uses it for her own benefit.

She does NOT want you.
She does NOT want your lawyer in this.
She does NOT want you involved with the children UNLESS it is convenient to her.
She DOES want your money.

Until you tactically get this through your head, you have NO business talking to this woman. You have given away far too much already. It is time to face reality or you won't be able to make the correct decisions.

It really is that simple. The person who posted to you about using your strengths (I cannot recall exactly who at the moment and don't want to offend by misnaming them), is dead on right. Listen to them. Listen to your lawyer. Don't listen to your EXw.

God Bless,

JL

You really are in deep enough. Why don't you leave it for the professionals to handle?

Your confidence is less than zero and your XW is clearly the boss of you. It might be best not to have these continued interactions with her.

It sounds like you had divorced quickly and never allowed yourself to actually get accustomed to the fact that she is not in your life anymore.
You need to give yourself time to get over her.
The best way for this is NO contact.
Get busy with your new job, make new friends, join the gym, do things with your kids.
When you go to get them wait in the car for them to come out.

Do not have any conversations with her about anything anymore.
Best of luck and hang in there, your heart will heal in time.

SKB.

Papa,

DO NOT DISCUSS VISITATION WITH HER TONIGHT. Tell her that you are not available or make something up - you're sick, you've been called by a friend who has an emergency, your computer crashed, whatever...THEN, first thing tomorrow morning, you get on the phone and call your attorney and tell him XW is trying to negotiate visitation via IM AND GET HIM TO DO IT. That is why you hired him. DO NOT DO THIS YOURSELF.

That's an order!

BB

my opinion is that you are still in DENIAL and have not come to grips with your D...

this is all very normal and no two are alike...sometimes it may take you longer than others...

this has to be handled as a "business deal gone bad"...

think of it in that term and try to remove your emotions...i know, easier said than done...but, IT MUST BE DONE and takes discipline...

tell her to "email" you her arrangemnts, and you will consider them....

this will create some space and give you time to fully consider your options...

DO NOT engage in face to face conversation...IM conversation or and back and forth communication...

keep it short, civil and keep your emotions "cold"...

she is not your friend...

she is not your lover....

she is your "ememy" and does not care about you....

NEVER forget this....

keep it simple, civil, short and to the point...

remember..........its "GAME ON"!!

Thanks again to everyone.

It seems that many are understanding about the sudden nature of my divorce. I was married Feb 17th. It was the day I was coming home after being depolyed. I was excited to be coming home. Excited that I was going to see my kids and my wife that I had been missing so much. I was very much looking forward to getting home and falling asleep in my wife's arms again. That was Feb 17th.

We divorced March 24th. It was a no contest divorce that took only 45 minutes. I signed over physical custody of the kids, but have full legal custody.

That was just 4 months ago. Yes, it has taken me a while to accept that I'm really divorced. I still feel stung at her going out with other men. Still feel it when I think she may not be staying at her own place on weekends I have the kids and might be at another man's house. That's an assumption. I have no idea if she is or not.

But things have progressed. I no longer cry when I see evidence of her dating when guys leave comments on her page about her such as, "Yes, I deffinitely think about you." or she leaves blink.you's that say things like, "treat me like an angel and I'll be your little devil."

I have started to see when she is manipulating. I saw it very evidently when she had fits that I hired a lawyer because she said she was consulting one to draft a visitation arangement. I know that she bluffs and threatens and has fits when I ask for things that I want.

If all she wants me to do is settle for the standard, I have nothing to lose by going to court. One night a week and every other weekend is what she wants. I want more time with the kids. I've had every single weekend since we divorced. This would be nice to continue, but I would also like some time to myself every once in a while on the weekends. If a court granted me this, however, I'd be happy with it. An arangement like MM has would be good.

My lawyer is a trained mediator and is an advocate of the 2,2,5. Mon and Tues with me, Wed, Thurs with her, then alternating weekends. She says that kids adjust well to this vs every other week scenario. Says they learn to associate TV shows or events in their lives with the parent that they're with for that day, i.e. "I watch CSI at mommy's house, I stay at daddy's after baseball practice."

This arangement lets me see the kids very often and allows for both her and I to have a social life as well. She'll never accept it and has stated so.

I would be extremely happy to have this arangement, though.

At a minimum, I would be happy with taking them to dinner twice a week and then having them every other weekend plus a few weeks for vacation time in the summer. That's the minimum. I really believe I'd be granted more than this by a court and don't think I have bad chances.

I don't even have to say anything negative about her in court if it comes to going to that. All I have to do is show that I'm a capable, loving father who is back on his feet after being knocked down. I can show how I have been involved with my children since day one of their lives and can give proof of this in video form. I video taped A LOT while married. This was to send to family back in States and keep the kids in their lives. I never thought I'd use the tapes and video to show how much involvement I've had in their lives.

My daughter's first steps were caught this way. I was there when she took them. Was the first to witness them, and grabbed a camera to tape her. My w taped while I encouraged her to move about the room. I taped me reading a book to her, the way I did every single night. I taped the birth of my boys, taped me going to get them out of their cribs after sleeping all night.

Now I've been taping them playing at my house, sleeping in their rooms, eating, and feeding the ducks at the park. I can actually show the activities I do with my kids. I also have precedent, since I've been watching them every single weekend when I've been here. The only exception was my stay in the hospital and two weekends when I was in California. Outside of that, I've had them every weekend since April.

I think I would have a good chance in court and I'm not afraid of it or her anymore.

Again, Papa...do not try and work this out directly with her.

She doesn't want you to use a lawyer or mediator because she knows that it is easier to manipulate you directly. Please let a professional handle this.

A spouse that would carry on while her husband was at combat tells me everything that I would need to know about her character. She is completely self-centered. She IS the enemy, treat her as such. Take all of the above information, develop your plan of attack and execute. See her for what she is.

I am so terribly sorry that you have been treated this way and that you are going through such heart break.

AMEN

A woman or man that would have an affair on a partner while in combat is weak of character and has no self esteem and needed someone else to stroke it. This woman will never be happy no matter who she is seeing, count on it.

USE your lawyer and use them often. Knowing your situation if you play your hand right and collect information and document you may be able to get full custody over time given her bent towards self destruction.

Thanks to everyone.

I made myself available for a brief moment on messenger, but put on a movie on my computer and started cleaning my house and ironing my clothes for the work week. I worked till about 1030PM and never got a message from her, even though I saw she was logged in. I was planning on being very evasive and general if she did try to contact me.

I made a deposit for CS into the account setup for that. Now that I got a job and got paid I'm caught up in our unofficial CS agreement. Again, I'm not obligated to pay her a dime, but do so because it will only help me and she is taking care of the kids.

MB has grown to be a huge source of support for me. I really do try to heed the advice on this forum. I wish I had done so much earlier when I first found out and everyone was telling me to take a harder line than I did.

She told me the other day that her mother is not happy in her marriage to her father. Her father has no clue. She told me she made her mother promise her she wouldn't leave her father when she was 18. She says that she doesn't want to be like her mother.

I know her parents and never got this impression. I've been tempted to say something to ex FIL but have held back.

Should I? I like the man, despite the fact that they have supported my ex WW through all her craziness. They've done what they could to stay neutral but in the end they take their daughter's side.

Anyways, thanks again to everyone's very kind words of support. I'm going to continue to avoid her and concentrate on getting my house unpacked and decorated for the children.