August 1st: MTV's birthday and the day I got divorced. That sounded so cool in the brochure. Well, it didn't happen. Her attorney Doug Flutie'd one into the hands of Gerald Phelan and got the case continued until Sept 5th. The obvious answer to why this divorce is still going on is my stbx will lose almost a thousand dollars a month in monies I am currently paying. She will also have to make her own decisions about her life. I would like to say she is also CRAZY but I will decsribe my sitch and you all can tell me if and how much she is crazy.

In September of 1996 I met this cool, hip chick who smoked cigs in really sexy way and played drums like a guy. She was living out of her car and looking for her next gig as a rock drummer, while waiting to move in with a stripper. She came from a broken family full of divorce and abuse. I was a pretty sheltered dude with a good family but poor taste in women. We married a year a half later. She went from Courtney Love to Martha Stewart during that time and we both got addicted to the upwardly mobile lifestyle. Things were bad starting in 2001. On my birthday in 2002 I was in a lawyer's office having separation papers drawn up. We stayed together and made my daughter in December of that year. after her creation total physical and emotional abandonment set in on her part. I became angry, and emotional. I worried more about money and bills than anything. I got into better shape than I had been in high school - nothing changed. I tried a lot of the things marriage builders suggests now to save the marriage, nothing worked. Finally in January, after talking divorce for a a year, I left and filed. since then she has treated me a blood would treat a crip in Crenshaw on a saturday night after drinking a few forties. My atty and I decided to take the good guy high road and pay a lot of money up front and do things by the book. In return I had to force her into court in early March to see my daughter on a regular basis. She tapes every phone call. She copies and forwards very email. After 8 months we can not even conversate about my daughter. For the record I did not cheat, beat, gamble, or drink. I went 34 days in January and Feb without a dime to my name. We have offered five settlements to their one. They have now delayed the final hearing three times. CUrrently they are hung on on financial interrogotories So here's are my questions?

1) why is she so angry/resentful?
2) is she crazy?
3) Will she ever "get over it"?
4) my daughter turns three Aug 30th. Will she realize who the crazy unreasonable one is when she;s 10 years old?
5) How do I deal with this stress and delay?

Be pithy if you like. Be honest as well. female input is needed.

my female input...

first off, i am surprised i am reading this this late at night (for me) but my lovely daughter (and i do love her to death) is driving me to need a good stiff cranberry and vodka right about now with not going back to sleep. she agreed to hang on the couch and fall asleep there, and now i am wide the heck awake... thus i am here reading this.

anyway,
she is angry and resentful because you screwed up her whole life by leaving. she had a good thing going and she knows it. she did not have to change or look at herself at all while you were married and living together. it was status quo. you left, and now she is going to start realizing exactly what she is losing. part of her may regret not being a better wife. deep down anyway. i think she is really angry at herself but it is easier to take it out on you and blame you then take any of the blame herself. it is much easier to focus her energy on hating you and making you pay for ending the marriage than it is for her to get her a** to a counselor and get the help she needs. she is pissed gekko, you ruined everything for you. she could have her cake and eat it to with you. you provided the lifestyle and she didn't have to do anything for it. she could live comfortably, but cold and unsupportive, be controlling, physically and emotionally abandon you. you weren't supposed to fight back and say this is enough! i will not be treated this way. you were supposed to go along with it forever.

is she crazy? clinically i do not know. she is crazy angry and pissed. now she has to start over and find someone else she can control and someone else who will take care of her and someone else who will put up with her bs of no physical and emotional contact. good luck to her search on that. she knows what buttons to push with you. your finances and your daughter. she wants u as mad as she is. she wants to make you pay. it is sad really, for when does the nonsense end? i get being mad, and hurt, and pissed. i get that. but geez, it is time to move on. you were mad and hurt too. but you moved on. she needs to stop letting this consume her life. but no one knows how long it is going to take her to do that. bitterness, anger, it is all so sad really. she is wasting that precious energy on that when she could be doing some good with that energy. it is WASTED ENERGY.

prolonging the divorce is another way for her to be in control. you want a divorce and to move on with your life? ha! she is going to make you wait and wait as long as she can before you get that. sad, but her last ditch effort to control you and control the outcome. it is all just to dig the knife deeper, make sure you realize just how mad she is.

unfortunately u are NEVER going to figure her out. you two are on 2 different planets at this point. my ex is not much different than yours really. they think the universe revolves around them. they don't like having their cake taken away and when it is they throw a tantrum. your ex is just throwing the world record of tantrums gekko. be glad u are away from that insanity. be glad you got away after 10 years and not 20 years down the road. you are still young enough to start over and live your life as you want to live it. now, it can be exactly how YOU want it. you deserve better than that. you deserve the utmost in happiness and enjoyment. you are better off to be away from the insanity.

and rest assured, i know it doesn't feel like it, but there is an end in site thank god. this CANNOT go on forever. keep handling it with the dignity you have, keep taking the high road, you will be rewarded for it. and know the bottom line is, your daughter is the most important in all this, and you have become an award winning daddy out of all this mess, one lyla can be proud of. you did this for her, to have the life she deserves, and because of that she will have it.

in the mean time, i'll give the guys with the little white jackets and the padded whacko mobile a call and see what they can do for ya ok gekko... i'll slip em her address... what was it again? lol

mlhb

btw, yes,when your daughter gets older she will know who the sane one is .... and who the sane one is not...kids are VERY intuitive.

mlhb

mlhb.



You just took my breath away. Described my STBXW like you knew Cyndy all her miserable life!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

gekko~~

Not knowing your x-to-be, I will give it a shot.

Based on her childhood and into her adult life, I say you saved her from distruction. Instead of being thankful, she seems to have taken her anger out on you and is continuing to do so.
It appears she doesn't know how to love, and I'm sure that is from whatever has went on in her childhood. She then entered a wild/hard lifestyle which I'm sure was not all that pleasant either.
My best guess would be, she's had it hard and she has become a hard person.
Most likely she knows where she's been and how hard it was and she is scared knowing she could be back on the street.
She should have thought about her actions over the past several years.
I would say she feels that she is owed. My guess is, she would have treated anyone this way. I'd say, she does feel like you should have continued to save her and provide. Not so. She was every bit as responsible to the marriage as you were, and she chose not to be.

I'm sorry for you that this is being drug out and that she is being so difficult.
She sounds as if she has some growing up to do and in need of some anger management.

Better years lie ahead. You will be happy again, I'm sure of it!

Karona

cymanca

i can write it like i know it because i do know the anger she is feeling, but NOT for the same reasons. I don't feel her reasons are valid enuff. I was damn angry too that my ex had affairs, refused to work on the marriage, decided harbor his own anger and resentments and get help. i was very angry that he ruined the life we could have had, the life we were supposed to have, marriage to me is serious and supposed to be forever. i do NOT take commitment lightly. i was so angry (and anger is motivated by hurt and fear btw, straight from my counselors mouth when i went for a year due to my ex's treatment) i wanted him to pay. i wanted him to feel what he did to me. BUT, the big difference here also is that i let go of a lot of that anger over time, and it was not that long of a time that it took. i could have nailed my ex's [censored] to the proverbial wall for his affairs and treatment of me and chose not to, i chose the high road as well. the road of lets be civil and do what is best for the kids. in my case, as in gekkos, that is not working for us yet either. he is still in anger/revenge mode, and HE'S THE ONE WHO HAD THE AFFAIRS. geez, now that is a narcissist whack job. i saw how much better my life was without him and that helped to elleviate a lot of the anger. i no longer walk on eggshells, i have my life to live as i see fit now. i can breathe again, i can be happy now. i may not have all the 'STUFF' materially we had together, but i could care less about that. i am not materialisitc. i love nice things and i know my rewards are coming. but i am good now. but i think that is how i can pinpoint at least the anger she is feeling, albeit unjustified anger (but she thinks it is justified in her world), because i have felt anger and i sure know how we women think! mlhb

I can relate to much of what MLHB has written, but to answer your questions:
1) why is she so angry/resentful? BECAUSE IT'S EASIER TO BLAME YOU THAN TO LOOK AT HER OWN ROLE
2) is she crazy? WHO KNOWS
3) Will she ever "get over it"? SOME PEOPLE NEVER DO. MY X IS ONE OF THESE, AND HE'S THE ONE WHO LEFT.
4) my daughter turns three Aug 30th. Will she realize who the crazy unreasonable one is when she;s 10 years old?
ARE YOU TAKING STEPS TO BECOME THE BEST PERSON YOU CAN BE? THE MB PRINCIPLES WORK OUTSIDE A MARRIAGE TOO. AVOIDING LOVEBUSTERS HELPS ALL RELATIONSHIPS.
5) How do I deal with this stress and delay?
DAILY, AND EVEN AFTER THE DIVORCE. IT'S A CONTROL ISSUE, AND MY D KEPT GETTING DELAYED TOO, AND X TAKES ME BACK TO COURT WHEN HE'S NOT HAPPY. BUT, I CAN SEE THAT HE'LL NEVER BE HAPPY, AND THAT'S HIS CHOICE.
DO YOU HAVE A COUNSELOR? THEY ARE HELPFUL DURING THIS PERIOD, AND A DIVORCE SUPPORT GROUPIS ALSO A GREAT GROUP TO HAVE - PEOPLE WHO CAN TALK YOU DOWN FROM THE STRESS.

Sadly, this is all "normal" for divorce. Be the best person you can be and you will be able to move on in a healthy way.

see my therapy posts. i did two months and it helped me.

not only therapy but i went back to church and i take my daughter as well. i have a tight circle of friends and family who have been great.

i haven;t tried a divorce support group unless you call talking to mlhb, karon and duk online as a support group.

thank you karona, you continue to impress me and make me amazed by your strength.

Hey Gek,

You are very lucky to have these intelligent and in most cases well adjusted people to help you here. mlhb I'm not too sure about yet! All of this your stbx is doing as Cy said is following a familiar script. My 24yr old daughter is letting EX and EXMIL push her buttons now too. All of it is their way of rationalizing the behavior of someone they love and trust doing something that does not equate with their perceptions of that person.

Facing closure such as a D will push them to new heights of rationalizing. Your daughter being as young as she is is only thinking about what will happen to her in all of this. She needs you to be patient, rational and calm. She needs your stability to feel safe. Imagine her world right now not being able to comprehend all that is swirling around her. Focus on her and the time between now and the D will be gone before you realize it.

mlhb,

As an aside , my STBXW just refused to sign off on my purchase of our jointly owned condo. No explanation other than she feels "I am cheating her". She also goes around telling anyone who will listen( and also anyone that does not know the truth about her A's) that she can not understand why I do not want the D to go through. I was ready to go to court 11-05, 5-06, 6-06 and now rescheduled for 11-06.

i didn't mention a lot but here's some more irrationality from my stbx.

my grandmother died in novemeber, before i left. i had to beg the ex to come to the funeral. then after i left, i moved into my granparents house to take care of my grandfther who had cancer. i was with him the last six months of his life as he died June 5th. my ex nor her family sent a card, made a phone call, sent flowers, came to the funeral home or funeral, and refused to make my daughter available to me and my family during that time. last week, i lost another family member, a cousin my ex knew, and again, no phone call, card, flowers, etc. i did have my daughte last weekend so i could take her around the family.

its this kind of behavior i don't understand.

no answer for you on this except that these people are cold and heartless and selfish. my ex is the same way. lost my grandmother, my dearest closest love, last year. nothing from my ex, not an "i'm sorry" nothing... no card, no sympathy no nothing. oh, wait, he did do something. i was strapped for cash that week that she died since it was within weeks of when he walked out and he threw me 20 bucks for gas to drive the hour and half where my grandmother was. so thoughtful. i don't take scraps from satan, he got the money back the next day when i got paid and the selfish ****** actually took it! not even a "don't worry about it, it was so you could get to your grandmother.." he just gladly stuck it back in his pocket. when HIS grandfather died, someone near and dear to him, he flew to the funeral, would not take me and the kids even tho we WANTED TO BE THERE to support him and his family, so i sent a huge floral arrangement to the family and a card from me and my kids. his family was my family too at that time, and i loved his grandfather.

so, gekko, i think we are just cut from a different cloth, the cloth of caring and real human emotion. these people, our exes, are not, and thus we will NEVER understand them.
mlhb

Interesting correlations here, as with my X who kept dragging out the D, I had the same funeral issue. He refused to allow me to take the kids to a funeral saying kids didn't belong. Then, months later the kids said they went to a funeral for GF's relative.

My kids are still upset they didn't attend the funeral of the only grandfather they knew on my side (my uncle) and my youngest - his godchild- gets upset if we say his name. It came up again on our vacation when she saw tons of pictures of him everywhere.

There are people who are programmed differently than others. Their behavior is not what we would describe as normal. For short periods, they can act normally, but can't sustain it long term. After interactions with my X, I refer to a website for narcissitic personality disorder and can read down the checklist to make sure I'm not crazy. Perhaps your STBX could be the same.

gekko~~
The best thing I think for you to do is try, try to detach.
There is no figuring out your x-to-be, or any other x's for that matter. You will make yourself crazy trying to understand her and why she ticks the way she does.

I'm much better than I used to be, but believe me, my x still gets me at times too.

I honestly believe, this time will pass. It will get better, but, there are no short cuts. It's stuff and pain that you will have to endure for the time being.

Karona

In many ways your ex's anger is much like my ex-wife's perpetual anger. We communicate only through e-mail because she refuses to talk to me on the phone.

I too cannot explain the anger. I mean we are divorced/divorcing (almost done), so we should work to finalize it. Nope, she wants to squabble over day to day issues through the attorneys.

Your ex isn't crazy. She's irrational with a sense of righteousness. She wants what she thinks she deserves, whatever it may be.

She won't get over it. As long as you have something in common, in this case a daughter, you will see a tug-of-war over her. Your ex wants to control you. She wants to see you suffer. She wants to win every battle and the war. She wants to see you on the street penniless and alone and then spit on you.

If you live sensibly and responsibly, your daughter will know who the sensible parent is. The way to ensure that your daughter knows you as a person is to give her lots of attention and praise.

As for the stress and delay, just keep your life in order and don't give your ex any ammunition against you. She'll make issues out of irrelevent things to slander your character only to upset you.

good luck....i'm going on year 3 of my divorce...hope to end it by year-end

http://www.halcyon.com/jmashmun/npd/dsm-iv.html

http://members.aol.com/AngriesOut/teach9.htm


just some interesting descriptions for understanding. . . what you don't currently understand.

OK, Gekko. You've got it. NO CANDY COATING. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


Did she emotionally abandon your daughter? Or "just" you, in the pursuit of being a good mother? Perhaps she overcompensated for what she didn't have growing up by creating it in her new family. I don't know your story, Gekko, so this is all just a guess.

You changed. You weren't the guy who was into Courtney Love.


You changed.



You left your daughter.



You left. You left her and you left your daughter. Leading up to that, did your W believe there were problems?



About your daughter, probably.



Did she get over the abuse and abandonment in her FOO?




Probably, but don't expect to get off scott free. You left her.


The stress is a tough one, but having been there, I recommend counselling, excersise, avoiding alcohol and making promises to other women you can't uphold yet. Surround yourself with friends and family.


You left your wife and child. In your STBX's mind, the two of them were your priority. You left them. Why would they care what you were doing instead?


I'm playing devil's advocate here, since I assume your STBX has a side of the story that I don't know.



Mrs. W8ing

nice devil's advocacy, i did tell you my story but i'll add some thing

on my BIRTHDAY in 2002 I was in a lawyer's office having separation papers drawn up. we spent that winter trying to patch things up and during a rare night of dating like behavior my daughter was made. it was 21 months before we even kissed each other again. want me to continue? well i do. i we separated a total of three times. we spent the months of november and december fighting like COPS episode couple and talking divorce. i didn't just pop up January 8th and say you know, you're s frigid, controlling ****** who really doesn't like me i think i'll leave. my grandmother, also my biggest fan and best friend, died in November of last year while me the ex were still together. i had to beg my ex to come to the funeral. she never sent flowers (i did that) nor went to the funeral home. she never acknowledged my grandfather dying and did not make my daughter availabel to te family during that week. for three weeks in february she backed on visitations for me and thus i didn't see my daughter during those three weeks except when i would go to her school for lunch. she tried to turn my alive grandmother against me by lying about our divorce proceedings. i literally has my atty call my grandmother to set the record straight. she refused to let me have my daughter overnight from january, when i left till march 9th when a judge forced her. when my daughter was born she was sick w toxemia. i took a leave of abscence from work to care for my infant daughter while my ex was in the hospital or at home unable to. for my daughter first two and a half years of life i took her to 95 percent of her dr's appts.

now, i see her more than i did when i was with my ex. thursdays through sundays every two weeks we are with each other 24/7. i don't go out, if we hang with friends i;m there. on the thursday overnights on my off week, same thing.

i live two miles from her school, which is one mile from my office. my schedule is actually better than my ex's. i live in a house that is better than the one we lived in when i was with my ex yet i had to spend over 300 dollars to childproof the house.

you're right i prolly should have stuck arund and has her watch her mommy and daddy hate each other.

Hey Gekko,

Sounds like your post should be the "nigtmare that never ends".

You've gotten pretty good inputs from both sides of the fence. So here's my take on your 5th question on "how do you deal with the stress."

You just do. There are days when it feels like you are living your life on an auto pilot. The routines you've established are what keeps you moving. But then those routines sometime cause dull moments, makes you want to cry. And when you do, you just gotta let it go. It's a test of strength and courage. And when you find that glimmer of strength, you talk yourself out of those dull moments. This is normal. Then you start doing something else to occupy your time and mind. ANd this is the KEY ingredients to moving forward.

For me, I volunteered for an animal organization in my community. I would not have done it had it not been for a dog who chose me a year ago after having an ankle surgery due to work injury in Jan 2005. This dog wondered into our former neighborhood injured. My neighbor took her in and was given to her next door neighbor, but who was gone most of the day every day. When I met my neighbor who happens to be a flight attendant for United, we clicked right away. She's been caring for this dog for her neighbor while he was at work. Since she has two other dogs I offered to sit for Gracie (the dog) for a few hours. After all, where else could I go after a surgery. On the 4th day, I get a call from my girlfirend to tell me Gracie had run away and they couln't find her. She walked the neighborhood and Lord and behold, the dog was on my doorstep waiting. WH was in Detroit for a GM meeting when he was deep in his 2 yr A with a flight attendant for Northwest. I fly for the largest carrier. By the way, there is this unwritten rule that you just don't f*** w/another flight attendant's spouse regardless which airline. But the OW didn't care because she was doing her neighbor in exchange for home repairs. Yep, my WH and the OW are quite a pair! Anyway, that day I called to tell him we have a dog. The dog saved me from going insane. AND she helped get back on my feet quicker than expected that the docs were amazed. I've met many of our neighbors on our long walks and have been invited in their family and gatherings.

Volunteering ocuupied my time and mind. I chair the organization's corporate sponsors. This has also allowed me to refine my corporate skills.

I've also been doing things and going to places I've always wanted to do and see which my WH seemed quick to want to do as well, but never put into action. He's always been a dreamer, but NOT a doer. He's passive agressive and I'm assertive. He's always had problems w/my assertiveness and telling it like it is. He doesn't say anything, but he complains to people about it and then to me months and years down the road! He grew up in southern CA (ya think he would be more assertive, right? Nope!) while I, in Hawaii. He's talked about volunteering to a worthy cause in our community, but hasn't done it while I've already given up my Thanksgiving to help feed the homeless in downtown LA. I've seen and done more things since we moved here in socal 5 years agofrom Northen Cal where he moved in with me, than he's done living here. For instance, I took my dog to the Dog Zone beach for the first time yesterday where dogs are allowed to roam the beach and in the water. My WH never even knew this place existed!

My point is START doing things and going to places either by yourself or with your daughter. Imagine the things that there are out there beyond your neighborhood block and outside the walls of your house.

Rediscover your passion and find new meaning in them. It's like reinventing yourself. Learn new things for yourself and your daughter. Teach and show her the things you learn. It is the things you do for yourself and with her that will stay in her mind forever. Make each time with her memorable. Years down, and it will go fast, and it will happen, she'll tell you a story that will go something like this..."Hey Dad, remember the time when you...." And she will. Then, you'll know you have done your job as a parent. This will be your legacy as a parent that she will in turn teach and show her own children. Even when you are gone, she will tell her kids the same story that will go something like this..."You know, when I was a little girl, your grandpa and I...." THIS will be YOUR legacy! Not your XWTB.

Remember, you CANNOT change your wife. But you can change yours and your child.

Good luck

thank you

i started going back to church in march and involve my daughter. i have a close, tight circle of friends. i reconnected with my family. i volunteer through the church. i work out a lot. i have several hobbies including, possibly going into business with my friends who manage bands. i love music, exp live music, so i am doing those things.

thx