What can be really helpfull if you work the tools is to have a bit of a selfish routine.

Routines allow your body and mind to coast on autopilot and while you will obsess to some degree [how could you not] having tools to pull you up when the slump is getting too low or lasting too long and to just generally sustain you is a good thing.

Think of recovery as a REAL thing.

If you were recovering from an illness or accident..what changes would you make?

Would you need to pay attention to your diet..what fuel you are giving your body to work with?

How about excercise...could you make a place in your day to go for a walk or a swim...personally I prefered a moderate paced venture as EXTREME exertion seemed to make me MORE focussed on things like fear, anger etc [strong emotions] whereas smoothly paced things that were pleasant helped me balance my mood...YMMV of course.

How are you sleeping? If you aren't getting enough rest or your rest is of poor quality it will affect every aspect of your life from your general sense of well being to your perceptions and self discipline/control.

I would let your employer know what is going on because it WILL affect their judgement to know that you are under tremendous stress...no differently than if a person had experienced a death in the family or some other trauma.

I suggest that you seek IC [individual counseling] but make sure that your counselor is aware and on board with PROmarriage agenda.

Antidepressants are very helpfull for some people and may be something to consider and discuss with your doctor.

This is one of those situations where give..Give..GIVE!..just isn't an option...you have people depending on you and you have to take care of yourself ...keep YOUR head above the water line so that you are ABLE to help others.

Let's see....uh..social contact...make sure you are getting it. Go out with friends...go to church...do not allow yourself to become isolated.

Read..listen to music...watch movies and write scathing reviews right here of any that contain affair elements..and just invest in LIVING.

Believe it or not this is ALL a part of plan A and serves to make you MORE attractive to your wife. It isn't the purpose..but it's gravy, no doubt.

check your email!

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...&PHPSESSID=

Try this.

I have been exercising by lifting weights to try to keep some muscle mass. Admittedly, I have lost over 10 lbs. this month and do not get enough sleep. I am slowly regaining my appetite and sleeping a little more. On average I eat 2 small meals a day and sleep about 4 hours.

I have a counseling session tomorrow. My intention for that session is not to focus on trying to find ways to resolve my marriage, but to focus on me.

My work is aware and is very supportive. I have not told my wife that I have taken more time off, primarily because she will not rely on me to pick up the kids from school. This makes her come home immediately following work rather than having the opportunity to spend time with OM.

Melody, I will call my sister-in-law regarding the e-mail. Thanks guys.

Be sure to get some aerobic excercise as well...releases those endorphins.

Also..make sure to get enough fat in your diet...fat is a mood stabilizer AND since you haven't got a lot of appetite..try to eat foods that are calorie dense.

It may sound completely gross...but those shakes that are intended as supplements...not the diet version...are a GREAT option for when your body really NEEDS fuel..but your emotional state just isn't playing along.

Noodle,

I'll try what you are suggesting.

I have some preliminary information that is somewhat encouraging. It looks like this guy might still be married. Again, it is preliminary. I'm guessing that the 3 year girlfriend that he left for my wife is actually a 3 year wife. It's just a guess though. We have found his parents, I am just waiting for a phone number to contact them all to investigate.

I'll keep you posted on the progress.

Feeling much better, but still hurting. She'll be home soon, and I'll see if there are icicles (I'm sure there will be).

bgtg1, you're in!

Melody,

I say that we don't worry about the private forum. If she is reading the newest info., it might be helpful.

I just got done working out (cardio and muscle) and my wife was with our kids while they swam. I walked over and sat on the lounge chair she was in, and she acted like she couldn't touch me. I had plenty of room to sit, yet she still moved her feet. I told her "God forbid you touch me". She said that she was just making room for me to sit.

She seems to be finding some way to see the OM tomorrow. I took the rest of the week off of work. She asked if I was going to get fired. I of course said "no". She asked a friend if our kids could go to her house tomorrow around the time she gets off of work. I told her that I have a counseling appt, and asked if she could pick up the kids after she got off of work. No answer.

She is starting to infuriate me at times. I looked at her and said "I'd like to contact the alien ship that stole my wife and have them return the woman I married". Not sure she liked that.

How old are your kids, bgtg? Because if they are old enough to understand the concept of affair and right and wrong, they should be told about her affair. They need to know what is happening here and desperately need your moral guidance. You also have to be concernd with your W introducing them to the OM and make sure they are NEVER to be dragged into her sleazy affair.

What in the world would you be fired for?

She has this twisted sense that if you take a day off, you get in trouble. I have plenty of time on the books, and it's mine to use. So, I'm using some of it for me.

My children are 7 and 10. They are both really struggling with things. I have already told them that their mom doesn't love me anymore and wants a divorce. I am being protective of the affair part because I don't think they could handle it. I want to wait until they are older, regardless of the outcome.

I told her that I don't want him anywhere near my children. She knows that things will get really messy if he does.

Dear bgtg1,

I have been following your situation and am so glad that you are taking counsel from Melodylane et al. I have seen a change in your tenor and feel you are doing really great. I feel your pain and also see that you have a great opportunity to beat this affair. keep going. You have my full support and best wishes. May G-d bless you and yours.
Lake

bgtg, I would strongly reconsider talking to the kids and telling them the truth. It really is much better for them to know the truth. Lest they grow up very morally confused and possibly even angry at you. Dr. Harley strongly recommends telling children because they do much better with the truth than they do with lies.

Also, if they know, your W is much less likely to attempt to drag them into her affair. And this is a VERY COMMON tactic of a fogged out WS. They introduce the kids to the OP in order to normalize the affair and give it a false air of respectibility.

I know you told her to keep the kids away from him, but you have no control over that at all. She was not afraid of losing it all for this sleazebag, believe me, she won't be scared into keeping your kids away either.

Thanks for the vote of confidence, lake. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Dear bgtg,
I agree with Mel. Just make sure that you use language and concepts that are at their developmental level:
Mom thinks that she loves another man. But I think she is just confused. I think that she can still love me. I am doing everything I can to show her that I love her and that she can still love me. I am doing everything I can to keep her here with us and to help her to see that she can love me.

This kind of statement is accurate and is targeted at their developmental level.
Lake

Agree with lake. And be SURE and tell them that affairs are wrong and immoral. Married people are not supposed to have relationships like this. When they get married, they promise to stay faithful to their spouse. This is IMPERATIVE that you validate their instincts of right and wrong, lest they become even more confused and begin to think there is something wrong WITH THEM.

They sense this is BAD, they just need an adult to validate WHY it is wrong and to help them understand that adultery is immoral and destructive. If you dont, they will grow up morally confused and will have affairs themselves.

Thank you Mel,
This is a crucial point and very much needed. Children of 7 and 10 can understand this.
Lake

Mel and Lake,

She baited me into a semi-heated discussion (mostly her yelling and me trying to calm her down). She completely believes that I am doing the things I am doing to hurt her. I know that she won't listen to rational thought, but she is getting so angry and hurt that she is starting to despise me. I am still continuing with the PI, because I know this guy is lying to her. She asked me questions about what I know, (she saw the money withdrawal from our checking) which I admitted it was for the PI). I told her that I needed to verify information before I would disclose anything to her, and that I wanted to make sure it was accurate. She was literally screaming at me. I calmed her down, but I allowed the conversation to go on to long. I also suggested that she ask some questions to the OM about his ex. It's a lost cause though because she will believe every word he says. I need the information verified fast.

I'm assuming that her reaction is normal. She refuses to understand that I am doing this to protect/help her, and insists that I am being vendictive. She says we are done regardless. Is this normal WW fogtalk?

I turned off her cell phone, but the phone company re-activated it without my approval. I told her to control her minutes and that I can't condone her calling him with it. She gave me the phone and yelled that she would get another one. My plan was just to have it transferred into her name (it was setup that way, but the service rep messed everything up).

She left to get clothes for childhood friends who are spending the night, and groceries. I was an [censored] and asked her if she was going to see him. Lost a bunch of love tank credits there. She said that I can't stay with her because I will obviously never be able to trust her again. I responded by saying that right now I can't trust her because of her cell phone usage to call him and because she is still involved with him. I also told her that when all is said and done, I will trust her again. She then left.

I need serious guidance here. I know it's fogtalk, but she is completely serious about the divorce. I told her that a divorce could get messy. Was this wrong to say?

Also, I told her that the kids need to be told that it is not my decision to get a divorce, and that it is unfair of her to ask me to accept her responsibility. She said that we will sit down with the kids together to tell them about her wanting a divorce. I still will not agree to one though. I can't get myself to tell them what she has done. I know I should, and you both give excellent reasons, but I can't do that to them or her. I just believe it would be too much given the current level of intensity and my overwhelming need to shelter the kids from that much truth right now.

She is also cancelling the trip that her parents were planning to make. I told her that it would be helpful to all of us, but she insisted that it would be uncomfortable for everybody.

I see papers in my future from her.

Please HELP!!!!

bgtg... I think Mel and Lake are right on this one with the kids... but it is important that the kids are not used as weapons. Tell them the truth... your truth, that you love their Mom and love them. Don't put your W down to them in any time after.

A couple of experiences my W had as a 12/13 yr. old. Her Mom had an A and divorced her 1st H. My W found out the truth about the A from a friend at the church. She was devastated to find out this way. You don't want your kids to find out by accident.

Also, her Father, after the separation, would rip apart her Mom whenever he was with her and her sister... until one day she insisted he not talk about her Mom like that or she would not see him anymore... He stopped the car and told her to get out. They have not had a good relationship since.

I am guessing that this extreme behaviour is not in your nature... but any way of pitting the kids against your spouse will backfire. They want to know the truth and to be treated with maturity and respect. They do not want to find out about it from someone else. They want you to answer their questions truthfully. Don't make any false promises you are not sure can be kept.

I will admit that we have not told our kids about the A as it is over. We did tell them that we were having difficulty and was going to counselling to sort it out. We have discussed a couple of times still telling the truth to them as we want them to hear it from us rather than someone else. We'll get to that point soon enough. We didn't have divorce discussion at all unlike your sich. Your kids have heard some of this and should be told the truth.

The truth is sometimes hard. Any lies (including ommission) can come back to haunt years later. My W found out just a few years ago that her and her sister (twins) have a different biological father. Their Mother still has not told their Father this truth and their older sister. Both my W and I are trying to move towards this being told. It will create a new huge mess, but the truth has to get out. One stumbling block has been the biological father refusing to acknowledge or take a blood test.

Sorry... got off on a tangent there.

You are doing well. Stick to the plan, but it is also important to be you.

Shaden

If you took the drink out of hands of a falling down drunk do you think they would be angry? Just think of it like that and you will understand her perfectly. Don't even TRY to reason with her.

And PLEASE stop telling her you are spying on her! If you do this, you greatly HAMPER your ability to kill this affair. Forewarned is forearmed!


No, you were not being as [censored]. You should always ask. You are HER HUSBAND and have a right to know if she is going to see another man. Tell her often how very much this hurts you and the kids. Don't pretend like she has a RIGHT to run off and see some OM! She is a married woman in a sleazy affair. Don't forget that.


Trust has to be earned. You can't trust her BECAUSE SHE IS HAVING A SLEAZY AFFAIR. That is the most untrustworthy behavior a spouse can commit.



Nope, you did the right thing. Just be sure and ask her when she has unaccounted time if she seeing her affair partner because you and the kids have a right to know this. Tell her how very disrespectful and hurtful it is of her to carry on her affair while she still lives there right in front of her own family. And they are ALL "serious" about divorce. But how serious is a falling down drunk about anything?

I hope you carried through on the plans we discussed yesterday and sent off that little letter.


Do not talk to those kids about divorce, bg, there is no divorce. Don't even say that to them unless you are served.[this may NEVER get to that!] But don't lie to those kids, bg. And DO NOT ALLOW her to lie to them. TELL THEM THE TRUTH. Simply tell them that mommy is having an affair and there is trouble right now but you are working hard to correct the situation and will do everything in your power to protect their family.

Do not expect her to do this, this should come from the only sane person in the family right now, and that is you. I would not tell them about any divorce, though. There is no divorce! A threat does not equal a divorce. There is only an affair. And they very much have a right and a need to know about it.

OK...first thing...calm down.

Yes..you did allow this to get out of control and work against you...no one is perfect...relax.

Your first mistake was taking the bait.

In future when you see that you are being baited..walk away.

She wants to use you as a target/human shield..don't let her.

Did you realize during the conversation..or in retrospect?

Your second mistake was trying to calm her down.

She's angrry...that is HER emotion..it is about her..and it is hers to own..so don't take responsiblity for it. She is allowed to feel angry..she is allowed to feel upset...she is a big girl and it is *OK* for her choices to feel bad.

This is what happened you realize?

SHE FEELS BAD. She isn't willing yet to do the work of introspection..so she decided to project at you and see if you would take the blame. You did. Now you have a working model for how not to handle this in the future...don't be strung along and dragged into her feelings of urgency and crisis...you will panic and be rendered ineffective.

Your mission is to learn to exit when exit is the best option regardless of her goading.

Next item.

She wants to have your participation in moving towards divorce...simply don't give it.

Tell her that while you can not stop her from telling the children that she wants a divorce..you are not going to sit with her or support her or back her up. That you will speak to your children honestly and in accordance to YOUR perceptions..not her wishes.

She wants a family sit down to make it "official" and to make sure she comes out smelling like a rose...she is STILL looking for your compliance here...I hope you see that.

If you have agreed to a sit down..unagree..just like that.

Just say..I changed my mind..I am not willing.

Tell her that if she wants a divorce..she will be the one to work for it..and that you will neither play nice nor be cooperative. "I don't *do* divorce."

She gave you the phone..great...shut it off.

Whether you tell the children is up to you..but I caution you that you CAN not protect them from what IS true as much as you may wish to...this is sadly not an option on your personal menu...your choices are allow for distorted perceptions or not because they are old enough that they ARE perceiving and you just can't get around that.

As for whether her parents come THIS weekend or not..meh..think big picture here..in 50 years who is going to care whether they come this weekend or some other weekend?

Remember..do not be drawn into this sense of *urgency* that she is creating...it doesn't really exist.

Take a shower..take a walk...have an ice cream bar...shoot ruber bands at squirrels...you had a bad night and that is all.