Still not the same situation, not morally and not legally.

editted to add - this is not a woman who ran away from a legitimate marriage to bust apart her family out of lust for another man - instead, she ran from the OM back to her family. THERE IS A DIFFERENCE. Please acknowledge that!

The harm to your child being separated from you is different because your wife's actions were motivated out of contempt for her family, not protection of it - by the results.

I acknowledge the differnces you have pointed out.

We will need to agree to disagree here though. I still feel the childs best interests are served by getting to know his bio dad.

And BTW, we did not have a legitimate marriage. She goit pregnant and I asked her to marry me... she told me she had an abortion and led me to believe for three months that she did so against my strong desire. She acted out of contempt... yep, she did and did so for many more years until the courts said, enough. Now, she's on the outside looking in.

MEDC - Destruction of McBecca's family through contact is in no-one's interest here. It is a tragedy if McBeccas family disintergrates because of this. OC is NOT the only child affected by this.

MEDC your passion about this is understandable given your situation but this situation IS different.

Dang - I typed up a much nicer reply and lost it. DOH!

MEDC,

Being a male I too think that men get shafted in the courts when it comes to things matrimonial and biological. However, you said something that bothered me.
So if you win this arguement, the OM should take HIS child, and Mr. McB should take HIS children and the adulteress, Mrs. McB, gets to visit the kids on alternate weekends right? So who wins here? Not the kids. They are separated from their other parent, AND they are completely separated from their siblings, because I don't foresee a scenario where Mr. McB would want OM NEAR his children. Further, a marriage ends. If OM is in the picture the odds are high the McB marriage ends, thus hurting even more people.

You cannot craft a scenario where the innocent are not wronged. The only one that comes close is OM is out of the picture. Yes he is screwed, but then he should NOT have been screwing around with a married woman. However, with OM out of the picture the marriage has a chance, the kids have their siblings and the ALL of the kids have two parents that want them and love them. Mr. McB has been given a choice about this third child unlike the first two and he has choosen to be the Father to this child.

So while I follow your sentiments, I think OM being out of the picture is best for the kids...ALL of the kids. The case of divorce and one spouse preventing the other from seeing the kids is something the courts seem to be very lax about especially of the other spouse is a male, but given that I think the kids come first.

Just some thoughts.

God Bless,

JL

I would talk to an attorney, ask about childsupport and have him contact OM with the prospect of paying CS for the child's first 18 yrs AND then college.

I bet OM would run away like the dog he is.

What a mess!

There are so many unknowns here, and so many assumptions, it is difficult to give sound advice without more information.

First of all, does the rest of the family know about the affair? If not, I can understand her reluctance to "let the cat out of the bag" by having the babies biological father in the child's life....but, that alone should not be the deciding factor.

Did this MW play games and lead the MM on, letting him thing that there was a possibility of a future with him??....and even if so, that alone should not be the deciding factor.

This MW cheated on her husband...and because this resulted in a child being brought into the world (and all this mess that has now ensued) the cheating was on more than just her H, it was on her family (does she have other children, I haven't read all the thread?). She cannot expect all the cards to fall into her lap because she is the Mom.

I think it goes unsaid that her H is showing himself to be very unselfish, in offering to raise this child as his own. And, if the bio father chooses to "let it go", that would probably be the best thing...BUT (there is always a but)...When this child eventually finds out the whole story (and it is a very good bet that he will, at some point in time), then the deception perpetrated upon him may come back to bite the mother and her H in the butt.

There is NO easy answer. I don't even think there is one RIGHT answer.

But, what is best for the baby is absolutely the most important thing, that is clear. What is not clear is "what is the best thing for the baby?"

As for the OM, I am unsure of the LEGAL issues here, but I would suspect that if he fought in the courts he would have some rights. And, I think he should, IF he chooses to exercise those rights (assuming he is a fit parent).

If the child is deceived as to his origins, and finds out later in life, there is a potential hurricane of issues that will come up. Is that fair? to anybody?

I think what is done is done. Blaming the adulterer, blaming the OM, is to no benefit as it relates to how to proceed from here.

It's a huge mess. It's up to the adults to listen to each other thoughtfully, to think about it long and hard, to pray, and come up with the best solution to this awful awful situation.

Personally, I think it would be good if those here who are reading this story take a moment to pray (if they do so) and ask for the best resolution...WHATEVER IT MIGHT BE.

I remember a programme on Dr Phil regarding a similar situation last year…

An OC was produced where both OP’s/WS’s were married. The OM wanted access to the child (his BW agreed) whereas the other couple doubt if this would be in the best interest of the OC and their M and especially to ensure NC between the former A partners. They didn’t know what would be the right thing to do for everyone involved under the circumstances (especially the OC) and seek Dr Phil’s advice. Especially the mother of the child was very resistant of the idea to give OM any access to the child and stated that (in her opinion) the OM and his family would be bad influence on the OC. On their turn, the OM and his BW would be willing to take full custody of the OC should it ever come to that.

Long story short: Dr Phil had much the same arguments and viewpoints than MEDC on this issue. He said the right thing to do would indeed be to give OM access to the child...that especially the OC (who is one of the innocent victims in all of this) have the RIGHT to know both biological parents and to have a personal relationship with both of them...that such a situation can be workable if ALL grown parties involved act unselfish and like adults, do the right thing for the OC (e.g. give OC access to both parents) and don’t let the court make a decision about such an emotional issue and by going to court let the issue explode in a "war game"...

HOWEVER, at the same time Dr Phil also stated the importance of NC between the two former A partners. Therefore, as a solution, Dr Phil suggested that a person be used/appointed who can act as an intermediate between the two families in handling the OC…to ensure NC between the former A partners, but at the same time allow OC to form a bond and get to know both biological parents (and vica versa).

I happen to agree with MEDC and Dr Phil’s viewpoints on this…

Dreaded double post! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

I think that Mr. McBecca should handle all communications with the OM. McBecca, I hope you've already told your H about the email and have not responded to OM in any way.

As far as allowing contact between OM and the child, I think that consideration should be given to the character and motivation of the OM. Character meaning other than his lack of character in having an affair with a married woman.

I think that McBecca has said that he is a great deal younger than she is. That, in itself, does not mean that he would not be a good father. Consideration should be given to what kind of lifestyle does he prefer? Is he a party animal...liking to go out often and into the wee hours? Would he willingly give up the partying for visitation?

Would he insist on contact with McBecca? BTW, that should not happen. Like Dr. Phil says, an intermediary would be necessary. If he does insist on contact with McBecca, that would tell me that he is only using the child to get to her.

MEDC, I have to tell you that I really admire and respect you for being a father who will fight for what is best for his son. You and your son are very lucky to have each other.

That being said, biology does not make a father. What makes a father is love and committment. Sadly, there are too many men out there who aren't interested in really loving their children and being committed to raising them. The same is true of many women, too, as a lot of them seem to foist their kids off onto Grandma to raise.

Some of these men I'm talking about may profess love for their child, but don't back it up with action. They may come around to see their kids...maybe out of curiosity or guilt (or to get it on with their baby's mama)...but they never STAY around. Too many other things are important to them...that flashy car, hanging out with their buddies, seeing how many notches they can put on their bedposts, or alcohol/drugs...whatever appeals to them most. They do NOT want to be tied down with a child. If they do have regular visitation, that often means that the child is staying with the paternal grandparents while dad is off doing his thing.

McBecca's OM may or may not be like this. I guess she's the only one who knows what OM's lifestyle may be like...or where his interests really are. She should discuss this with her H...NOT the OM.

The best interests of the child do not always lie with the bio-dad.

I have a grandson whose father is currently in jail for not paying child support. Our exSiL has no parental rights to two more of his sons, my grandson's half-siblings. He currently has two more children with his current wife, who is on medication for schizophrenia, and he doesn't support those kids, either. In fact, his wife's parents has had their oldest child for most of the time, and now, most likely have the new baby (born after he went to jail), too, due to his wife's mental illness. When his child support was paid up, he exercised his visitation rights, but chafed mghtily because he only had supervised visitation. The last time he was in court for non-payment of child support, he complained about this, and the judge suggested that our D try letting Grandson visit his dad. Well, it didn't work out. Yes, sometimes he came and picked up Grandson, but he was just as likely to not even show up. Too busy hunting down some drugs, I imagine. Grandson told his mom that Dad would leave him at home with Stepmom, saying that he would be back in a few minutes, and show up hours later...and be acting "funny".

I am not saying that McBecca's OM is this way at ALL, but just pointing out that in some cases, the child is much better off without the bio-father in his life.

I think that if the OM REALLY wanted his child, he would have insisted on being there from DAY ONE...even if it meant absolutely NO CONTACT with McBecca.

His proper avenue of contact, IMHO, would have been to contact Mr. McBecca, starting out with a sincere apology for interfering in their marriage and expressing appreciation for Mr. McBecca's willingness to love and care for the baby.

In the end, though, the OM's personality, lifestyle and actual committment toward his child's wellbeing are probably what should determine his presence in the baby's life.

This is insane -- this man is the father of a child and he has the right to see it and the responsibility to support it, no matter how much pain that causes you and your husband.

You all need to speak to some lawyers before this gets really ugly 10 years down the road when this guy sues for custody and wins because you refused to give him access to his child. He has legal options. And so do you. And they really have nothing to do with some marriage-building no-contact advice your husband discovered on MB.

Hoopsie, 10 years down the road, the OM will have absolutely NO LEGAL RIGHT to sue for custody. McBecca's H is the legal father of this child at the moment, and if there is only a small window of time where OM can be established as the legal father. And, IMHO, that could only be done with full agreement between McBecca and her H, after careful consideration of the OM's lifestyle, parenting ability, and real motivation for wanting to see the child (for example, it should NOT be so he can restart the affair with McBecca).

And, IMHO, the right of some man to see a child that he illigitmately fathered does not take precedence over the well-being of that child.

And NC is the ONLY WAY that McBecca and her H can even begin to rebuild their marriage, which also includes two more children. Their well-being must also be considered.

Please listen to Pep on this one.

I am so sorry I didn't open this thread sooner.

Trust me in that he is attempting to contact your daughter ONLY because he wants contact with YOU. TRUST ME!

Look at my sig line...2 OC...TWO...because the lines of communication were kept open.

These kids are mine by LOVE, DNA has not factor in it.

And it's been a nightmare...a nightmare dealing with the egg donor.

If you need me, you can email me at niosgirlatyahoodotcom.

- Kimmy

no doubt

all this talk about OM's "rights" ... he has taken ZERO steps to do what is right ... and until he does that, he remains a OM sperm donor

IF OM really wanted to parent this baby, he's have his ATTORNEY file papers and do it legally, instead, he breaks NC to contact his infidelity partner to push her buttons

this OM is an interloper parasite ~~~>not "daddy"

Pep <~~~ mother to 2 siblings with two separate sperm-donor bio-dads and one egg-donor bio-mom ... kids having a "right" to know their bio-parents is true >>> after age 18

Your opinion is nice. However, unless you are a family law attorney -- or, more importantly, a family law judge -- in her state, your opinion has absolutely nothing to do with the situation.

She needs to speak to an attorney. And the sooner the better. I am not an attorney either. However, I strongly suspect that he has rights. The right to insist on a DNA test, the right to get a court order to get a DNA test if the poster refuses to do it, and the right to have a visitation schedule if he is proved to be the father. If he is a convicted felon or a child molester or some other demonstrably unfit person, that can also be addressed via the proper channels.

What the poster should NOT do is simply ignore him and hopes he goes away, unless that is the advice she receives from at least a couple of attorneys.

YES! Egg-zactly!

He is attempting CONTACT only....for the sake of CONTACT with McB, from what I can see. He has done NOTHING to prove daddy worthy yet. Until he daddys-up and goes through legal channels to establish contact with the wee one, he IS NOT WORTHY!

Words are nothing but air and sound waves traveling right now. Actions truly speak.

- Kimmy

edited to fix a foobar

[color:"blue"]YES! [/color]

[color:"red"] and since Sperm-donor has done NONE of this, he is showing ZERO intent to legitimately become this baby's Daddy, again, he is trying to do things the lazy way ~~~> slipping in the back door, secretly

he's too lazy to hire an attorney ... and yet, he wants what he wants, which is to break up another man's family

OM = parasite

Pep[/color]

Dead wrong. I sat back and tried the nice approach for several months while I was being denied access. I was letting her get used to the idea of him spending weekends with me...big mistake on my part... but you are making assumptions about this man who might turn out to be a very good father.



Agreed. And nor do they always reside with a bio-mom.



Happens all the time. Wonder why all we here about are dead beat dads when moms that are ordered to pay are 7 times less likely to do so.



So, now you can see into their minds and motivations. Hmmm, I remember my motivations being questioned by my sons grandmom who helped keep him from me. She was shocked when her daughter finally told her that SHE ended things between us and that I had asked her to marry me. But guess what... when the truth came out 17 months later... my son was already named, baptized, walking and talking. Imagine what it is like to see your child walk to the front door... when the last time you saw him, he was 8 pounds and two weeks old! There are a lot of fathers that give up because the mother makes life ****** for them.

I have slept on this and gave it more thought. My feelings have been fully expressed here and frankly, I don't need to defend my views to anyone on this board. I have lived through the ****** of not seeing my child. I have shown myself time and again to stand up for M's and families... I just have a difference of opinion than others on this board. I think a father has a right to see his child. You all are right, sperm does not make a daddy... but that is what you all are doing here... reducing him to a sperm donor and giving him no chance to be a father.

(As far as the woman that has 2 OC... well, you have surely shown yourself to be someone that will protect your family. You didn't learn after the first devastation that you heeped on your family and went back and did it again... what you did is very sad.)

Read again MEDC. I didn't heap anything. The OC are my husband's progeny...MINE by choice and love...not MINE by DNA.

hmmm, what was it Solomon wanted to do with the child in the case brought before him?

Personally, IMO, this particular OM should take a flying leap.