One of Star*s best messages

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[color:"blue"]Betrayed Spouse! It is the FEAR......
03/29/06 01:21 PM


It is the fear that paralyzes you, sends blood rushing through your veins, sours your stomach, and interupts your sleep. It is the fear that gives away your power, your hope, and your forgiveness. It is fear that robs you of the active self and traps you in the role of patronizing enabler who will take them back at ANY cost...even if the price is too high. It is fear that keeps you from confronting and exposing. And fear that prevents you from enforcing your boundaries and having compassion for yourself.

Fear of abandonment.
Fear of rejection.
Fear of reaction....yours, theirs.
Fear of future...the unknown.
Fear of destitution and want.
Fear of failure.
Fear of losing.
Fear of loss.
Fear of solitude.
Fear of settling.
Fear of change.
Fear of lack of change.
Fear
Fear

Infidelity creates FEAR....and fear is crippling. Research shows us what we already know in our hearts....when we are fearful....we are unable to fire up the parts of our brains that "process" information on a logical, rational, spirtual level and create solutions that increase the odds for success in crises. When we are fearful....we don't use our neocortex....but instead, it is our limpic system which lights up our MRIs....our animal brains wired for "fight or flight".

There is no HOPE in our animal brains....because our indentity, our souls, our compassion....don't reside there. You are only capable of conflict or escape when you are there....so you must find a quiet place to deal with your fears so that you can confront, expose, do all the things that overcoming infidelity entails....all the things that happiness entails. You must value yourself as well as protect yourself, without fear of losing your WS or enforcing boundaries.....because if you don't....all your fears will be realized anyway.

MB is not designed to trap you in a marriage where your feelings are crushed and disrespected or the vows of marriage are meaningless. It's designed to help you overcome fear and give you hope that marriages CAN recover from infidelity....but you must be brave and be willing to risk losing your WS in order to regain trust, fidelity, security.

You must be willing to see beyond your pain and take logical and systematic steps to undermine the affair and increase the stability and security of your marriage. That takes courage above pain. It takes the peacefulness of knowing you are strong enough to lose a self indulgent and unrepentant spouse or recover with a flawed, but motivated one.

Don't let your fear take back a spouse who isn't ready to do the hard work recovery after infidelity entails. It is an invitation for misery.

If you don't believe you CAN survive without your WS....you cannot do what you must do to ensure success.

Stop being fearful of their threats...they are just excuses to leave or be selfish.

Stop being fearful of their reactions....their reactions arise from their guilt...not your boundaries.

Stop being fearful of taking a stand....it's the only way to gain respect or trust.

Stop being fearful of being alone.....until you can stand on your own and risk losing them, you will NEVER know if they remain with you by choice. And you will never know if you want them or you NEED them.

And if you need them....even if they return....you are in trouble chere.
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And if you need them....even if they return....you are in trouble chere.


do you understand this important comment?

when love changes from "You're the one I desire, stay with me"

>>> to >>> "I need you, don't leave me"

love becomes less of a joy

and less attractive

get yourself back into

"I desire you, husband of mine"

and not so much

"I will break apart if you leave me"

one is attractive & draws your WS home

and the other is about as sexy as bug repellant

Pep

NO

you do not pretend things are "the same"

what was/is so great about "the same" anyway? ... "the same" marriage got him into an affair!

HE IS HAVING AN AFFAIR
THINGS ARE NEVER GOING TO BE THE SAME
EVER AGAIN

but ... things can be different in a BETTER than EVER way ... transmit that hope to him !

here is how you ~behave~

you desire him (not need)
you offer hope
you show him a strong woman who does not dine on lies and like it

show him you are cute/sexy/fun ... when the situation allows

and show him you are not immune to the hurt he is delivering ... if HE brings up "our trouble" you say "I am very hurt by your choices to make our marriage a triangle"

that's about it!

Pep

Thanks for all the posts Pep.

I do feel better after reading it all.

Sometimes I feel OK, like I can handle all of this and whatever may come and then other times (like this morning) I go into "panic-mode".

I'm going to do my best to let go of all my fears and my pastor and family and friends are going to help me with that.

To answer your questions, yes I am taking anti-depressants (for 2 weeks now, so they haven't fully kicked in), I am exercising, although not enough, and I am not getting as much sleep as I probably need (the fears and panic wake me up very early in the mornings).

Talk to me more about the in love question. My guess is I'm not going to be able to answer that until the A is over.

The thing that bothers me the most, and I know its been addressed, so I'm kind of starting to believe it, although it still doesn't make sense to me, is that HE's the one who is having the A, yet HE's the one who wants the divorce. I would think as much as he messed up he should be begging me for forgiveness (and I do forgive him, I just don't trust him). But he hasn't even apologized for it. He's not blaming me either. He was just unhappy enough in our marriage to do it, and didn't feel like talking to me. I don't understand how he cannot feel guilty or sorry or BAD about doing this to me.

And if this works out, its that trust issue that is going to be the hardest to overcome, if it's even possible.

I checked his cell again this morning while he was sleeping. He has deleted her # from his recent calls list. I find that interesting, but scary b/c if he keeps thinking about and deleting the # every time they talk, I'll never know about it.

you need to snoop (have you read the snooping threads?)

you need to NOT trust HIM

but instead

you need to trust YOURSELF

that YOU will be OK if this M does fail

and

you will also be OK if this M goes into recovery

when do you see your MD again to check the dose/effectiveness of the med?

this I know ... and you may not believe ~~~> recovery is HARDER than what you are currently doing

so it is imperative that you become strong NOW & not waste your energy on stuff that does not work ... like endless "what if" anxiety

whatever the "what if" ... you will handle it !

Pep

This is an old post of mine ... written in 2002... I was trying to put the "doormat of Plan A" issue to rest .... in my own mind. Now you can look at what I came up with, back then.

Looking back ... I can see I worked myself through a very awkward "plan A" ....
although I never heard of plan A until years into recovery and I started poking around this site.

Looking back ... I can see my efforts to become differentiated ... although I did not read Schnarch's Passionate Marriage until years into recovery.

Plan A is very much complementary to Schnarch's ideas of differentiation.

Developing a positive identity within the context of a marriage struggling to overcome infidelity.

Developing a strong sense of self-worth that is valid both within and outside the boundaries of the marriage.

I can NOW see plan A as a path to greater self worth and NOT necessarily as a plan to "win back" the heart and mind of the infidel ... although that might happen.

It is a plan to differentiate myself and identify myself as a worthy person apart from the circumstances of the marriage relationship.

Plan A'ers are not like doormats to wipe your feet upon and to mis-use .... more like a *welcome home* sign... if both persons choose to re-inter the marriage!

Plan A says : "I can hold onto my better self under the worst of circumstances".

Schnarch says: "We develop a contingent identity based on a 'self-in-relationship'. Because our identity depends on the relationship, we may demand that our partner doesn't change so that our identity won't either."

Then ... comes the grenade of infidelity tossed into the marriage and the entire fusion of identities is blown apart!

The aftermath of the grenade then boils down to this question ....

WHO THE HECK AM I ... AND ... WHO THE HECK ARE YOU?

And, asking this question to the *fogged-in* infidel is pointless. They got INTO the affair because they were lost to themselves, and went searching for a new self .... and, INSTEAD of differentiating themselves ... they fused identity to yet another relationship ... actually moving away from a healthy differentiated view of their self-worth ----> I am wonderful because my affair partner thinks so.

Plan A says and demonstrates to OURSELVES: I am not some weak pathetic person deserving to be abandoned or cheated. I am demonstrating decent and loving behaviour. I am worthy of love and devotion. ... If the infidel notices .... double bonus points. If not, I become better differentiated along the way ... and I can see my strengths despite terrible and hurtful circumstances.

Once I become more fully differentiated and have stable and accurate self-worth (after the grenade) ... I am then in the position to identify
healthy choices.

I can honestly say that I will be a sensational woman within this marriage... or after this marriage terminates.

I think I finally understand what I went through. I understand that I am the better woman for it. I understand my spouse is the better man for it.

That is a powerful message to myself.

The anxiety that floods the betrayed spouse is the perceived loss of identity .

Self worth and a differentiated identity is the harvest of plan A .

I think I get it now.

Best to all of you travelers on this journey!

It seems every time I start to feel down and panicky I come here and read posts and post myself and I feel better and stronger. I feel like I'm getting stronger every day. I'm starting to live my life more for myself and not my M and H. And it does feel good. I didn't realize what I've been missing. I've been like an ostrich with my head in the sand for 7 years. I'm rising up finally and taking control. I don't want my M to fail, but if it does, I think I'll be OK (not 100% sure yet, but I'll get there!).

I see my MD 10/10 for my check-up.

I'll read the snooping threads and see what I can do.

You're awesome Pep.

Stph,

Just here to share a belief I have...you are now doing self-care...coming here, being honest and open with yourself and others...reaping the rewards from the inside, not the outside...which is the real payoff, not in resentment you've created before, out of habit, for a false payoff.

Plan A is about authentic self care...and I think that's why you're going from surviving to thriving. Taking control of what was always yours...in yourself...the only things you do control...is like a homecoming you're welcoming yourself to...way to go.

Glad you're here, Stph.

LA

Thank you so much for the support LA (and everyone else). It's been hard (obviously) and I'm far from being "over it" and I know there's a long, hard road ahead, but I think I'm ready to take it, whatever the outcome. And if this M fails, at least this self-discovery and learning process will make me a better wife next time round. But right now, I'm finally ready to fight for this M, no matter what it takes. I've got a lot of learning to do, but I'm open to it, and I know it'll hurt worse before it gets better and I know I'll have moments of panic and doubt, but I'm ready for it b/c I now know I'm worth it and my M is worth it, which was not the case 6 weeks ago.

I'm so glad I found you guys. I'm so grateful that I have a safe place where everyone knows exactly what I'm going through and I don't have to feel alone. I only wish I had found this site sooner. My M could have been in a better place by now.

I'm calling the BF tomorrow. Wish me luck and those that do so, please pray for me. That's when I'm going to need the most strength thus far.

This quickly I have a doubt!

How do I handle my H if he keeps talking about divorce? I don't want to keep telling him I'm not ready and want to work on our M first. He just gets angry and frustrated. But he asked me earlier if I was still filing tomorrow b/c that's what I told him the other night when I was angry (total LB, I know, but I'm working on it). I told him I wasn't filing tomorrow, because I never made an appointment with an attorney, nor have I found one to go to and I have to work, so I don't have time to go.

He thinks he's really ready for this and I don't know how to stop it yet.

load your brain with "stock answers" so you can pull one out without much effort when you are caught off guard

Orchid is excellent at this (and hers are the funniest)

examples:

>I don't do divorce

>I'm working on things

>we'll see

>what makes you say that?

>who knows about tomorrow anyway?

>what are you planning?

>something smells funny when we discuss divorce & I just want to gag

>nevertheless I need time to mull this over

>what's your hurry?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

here's the deal-ee-o about fog-heads ... they are L A Z Y when it comes to putting their feet to work ~ending~ the marriage

know why?

coz they are, in their deepest less crazy self ~~~> conflicted

and Plan A <~~~ a real one .... increases their conflict ... which is what it is designed to do

"home" and "spouse" and "marriage" start to feel less like a trap and sort of comfy after all

but the affair still courses through their veins like heroin

and they can't decide if they can make a choice

so they sit in the middle

and this is the beauty of Plan A

they get more confused as you get confident & stronger ... because you have a PLAN

infidels have FEELINGS .... and not much else

Pep

PS ...

if WH asks YOU to file for divorce

tell him you need money to do that

get him to hand over some $$$

then put cash in a safety deposit box for future emergencies

but don't file


>"Things take time & money" .... is a good reply ... just don't say what things you are talking about

USE their impatience & their nonsense against them

WH asks, "What did you do with the money I gave you?" .... you say "It was not enough, I need more."

in fact

do this as often as possible ... ask him for cash & hoard it

watch your finances ... the fog-head can/will/do spend $$$ like there is no tomorrow .... YOUR money !

if he's acting squirrley, cash out half of all shared accounts & lock it away

Pep

GPS info <~~~ click here

We had a pretty good day today. Then tonight he made a couple of comments about being divorced and I'm panicking inside (I didn't let him know it).

The first thing he said was "If things go right and we're not together, it won't matter, but I'm going to a concert in November."

And the 2nd thing was, I was teasing him and tried to kiss him and he pulled away and (jokingly) said, "divorcing people don't kiss."

I did tell him though that divorcing people don't live together either, but he was still here.

I'm really running out of time for plan A to work for me.
I need to speed this process up and NOW!!

He's got one foot out the door and I feel powerless!

How can I convince him to stay and give us another chance??

I'm not going to mention anything more about either of us moving out and I'm trying really hard not to go in the other room right now and start another R talk.

This is probably a very stupid question, but I'm going to ask it anyway...if WH has "fog" in his head, does he realize it?

I mean do all "fog-heads" feel confused, or do they seem as sure about divorce as my WH? How do I know if this is really what he wants if it's what he keeps talking about? How am I so sure that he is confused? If I could even get him to admit he was confused, I could handle that a whole lot better than him telling me he's absolutely sure he wants a divorce.

Orchid: Pray for a clear mind and a calm heart. Then cultivate lots of patience. Read up on plans A & B in Surviving an Affair. This will reduce the panic attacks. You need to get a plan going. Call Steve H @ MB for some phone counselng.


Orchid: I survived because I developed a plan, identified my personal and M boundaries and implemented them. I allowed my mind and heart to get in sync so I could think clearer and amke emotional and life changing decisions with out being emotional.

I created my support group, secured my finances and I let the WS basically ruin himself as a WS. I learned what reverse babble means and mastered the skill. This allowed me to give the WS back his guilt and I learned how NOT to take crap for the OW. In my case, the OW wanted to even control me. I disarmed her quickly and it infuriated her.

I worked with my MC and even had a session with Steve H. I prayed and leaned on God for direction. Bonded with my son and he became part of my support group and I a part of his. I posted here, read the books (Surviving an Affair, Giver/Taker, His Need/Her Needs, Love must be Tough), listened, learned and implemented what would help me. Sometimes MB got tough, I knew I needed it and paid careful attention to what was being said. Learned to take the good and discard what would not work in my sitch. I learned a lot about myself.

As a result, I have litte regrets over my actions both then and now.


Orchid: 3 ONS in summer of 99. The final A started in August 2000 and ended in August 2003. Went to court for RO charges (false ones by OW) in Sept 2003.


Orchid: I understand. When your mind and heart get in sync, it will get over sooner.

You have a lot more questions, Breathe..... slow down a bit. Make sure you know what you are doing before you jump in.

L.

This would be easier if I knew I some more time, but he's about out the door! That's where some of the panic comes in.

I tried calling the BF, but no one was home. I also got his father's # and tried calling him, but he wasn't home either. I'm going to keep trying today until I reach someone. It's a little scary, but I'm feeling braver.

Could someone address my earlier post about WH being fog-headed? He's so absolute about divorce and its scaring me. I want to know if he's for real or not or if there's a chance of him changing his mind once the A is over.

Orchid: how do I get my mind and heart in sync??? I'd like to try it, but don't know where to start.

U have lots of time. If he wants t/b out the door, let him. That world out there has less care than his family does.

Mine left for almost 5 months. Then he begged to come home, then false recoveries started. Guees I'd better give you the entire story so you can see how it is possible to survive through all that babble.

I have to go to work right now, so I will post later.

Don't panic. I will write later this evening and others may also.

For now, go get the books I suggested. You've got lots of reading t/d.

L.

You have time ... he's making lots of noise ... but you have time

Pep