Hi Gang, haven't been around for a while but here's an update for those intrested.<P>We finally had "the talk" this morning. Yes, the dreaded what do you want to do with the marriage chat. I had such a good feeling about today, it must have been too much Niquil.<P>Val sites during our conversation and all of this is out of context, of course, but, some key statements were "I don't want a divorce". "I don't think it would work if we got back together". "Please don't give up on us" "You don't have to file for divorce yet". "I don't know what to do". "Brian's nice".<P>What do you do with this stuff? Is it like the pythagorian theorum where A2+B2=C2? Am I on the dope or is she? <P>Once again I commited a major love buster by imposing a deadline. Tuesday at 14:00 I will be signing the divorce papers. I though we might have had an eleventh hour power meeting to avoid this just like the teamsters do.<P>I can't and won't take this crap any longer. She said nothing about dropping the OM. I told her last week that she would only have one man pining after her come this week.<P>Looks like it's Brian.<P>I have a very calm feeling inside as if I am on the right path. <P>Babbled on long egnough.<P>Wishing us all the Best<P>Medic

Medic,<BR>Its never over till its over.<BR>I too thought I would be signing the divorce papers when all of a sudden, om dumped w. <P>While she didn't exactly come running back to me, I am trying to accept her with open arms.<P>Only you can decide if you have had enough.<P>Best wishes!

Medica!!!<P>OUCH!!! I know how that "waffling" statements hurt!!! Can you just hang on a little longer? Go to plan B at your deadline or something? <P>Waffling is good! It's better than the dreaded word NEVER NEVER NEVER, PERIOD. (Which we can choose not to buy as well.)<P>Please! Hang in there, and get back to this forum more often!!!<P>

Hey RWD and MRS M4B [I don't know who you are, yet],<P>Thanks for replying,<P>I'm trying to get ready for the "signing" tomorrow. I can only believe this will suck worse than life itself. Alot of tears were shed by both of us this morning. I believe she is really torn because of our not so perfect past. I was not a very good husband, but, she was not a very good wife either.<P>Dr. H says to utilize Plan A to separate the lover [addiction] from the spouse. Been there, done that, have the Tee shirt. I understand that Plan B is to be used until all contact with the addiction has died a natural death.<P>RWD, she said that it's probably over. I said it's not over until one of us is dead and buried for two years. Being in the medical field it was apparent that both of us still had a pulse.<P>MRS M4B, I told her that I would not be accepting her calls after the signing as I felt that was closure of the marriage for me. She was very concerned that we could not be friends after. HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO BE FRIEND WITH SOMEONE WHO LIED TO ME FOR TWO YEARS.<P>I don't know, maybe I'm hoping that seeing the papers will bring her back to reality. Maybe I just need to end this. I feel serenity right now, no matter the out come.<P>Wishing us all the Best.<P>Medic

Ahhh,<P>You can still have that serenity without signing the papers, if you choose.<P>Please Medica!!! Go to full swing plan B!<P>It is exactly the same thing as you are deadlining for - without mixed messages!!!!<P>You can simply do this:<P>Don't talk, Don't listen, No Lovebusters, and no dating. <P>It is very very simple, and you can have your serenity too.<P>AND..... if that feels good, and she still says "no way, just friends"*, when you come to the next deadline time limit, you can automatically go to plan "D" without all the tears... You WILL BE READY then. <P>- - - My name used to have a hint of dynomite for initials.<P>*(well actually, you give her no chance to say anything in a no talk no listen no contact situation...but...)

It sounds as though some of us/you, all can do this so simply with out fret.. I find it amazing, because giving advise, is easier said then done... my situation, like medic`s, seems/is over... and although no paper work has been even started yet.. (very soon though) it is my stbx, that has closed me out completely, won`t let me in any more, won`t even talk small talk at all any more, won`t listen or reason, (both of us havn`t even tried for a very long time) and won`t even *give* me, (never did) his reasons of loss of love for me... my stbx, has no back bone/idea how to even approach me about the paper work, now, he is so uncomfortable, knowing deep in his heart I still love him... (having and OW, around, even though she is still married, doesn`t help him think clearly either) he has always had a hard time with confrontations of any kind. this kind of talk is just too hard for him to deal with.. he has always been an avoider.. from day one... how does one deal with that kind of personality???<P>AV

Is there any reason the papers HAVE to be signed? Is there any reason that things HAVE to be done right now? If your still "waffeling" in your feelings regarding this isn't it better to just wait and sign them when your absolutely positive about your course? I don't know whats right for you nor do I pretend to but if your not sure about what your signing, why sign it now? why not wait until you really are sure? God Bless!<P>------------------<BR>Chick's<P>You won't see things until your ready to not be blind!<BR>

Which way is up?<P>Right now Val has no real reason to make a choice between OM and me. She is living with parents scott free and gets love and attention from both of us.<P>She tells me they are just "friends" , secret friends, but I have found cards and other things that indicate more. Says she tried to break up with him before I found out and he was very upset. Who breaks up with a friend? He also asked her to move in when we split up. Our relationship needs a kick in the butt.<P>She just called at noon and asked if I was still going to the lawyer to get things started. You could tell she was crying.<P>We both thought this would last forever. I have to do something or this will perpetuate forever.<P>This has got to be the worst day in my life. Way to many thoughts going thru my little head.<P>But, Still wishing us all the Best<P>Medic<P>

not for nothing, but, couldn`t, shouldn`t mean wouldn`t or won`t...<P>Metic,<P>I do not know your story, only what I`ve read on this thread.. If your W is willing to take attention from you, (even though OM, as well..) take advantage of that.. <P>you say you found cards, from OM... find one better that, one that relates to what is happening.. throw her off, confuse her mind.. make her think past, present, and future..!! romance never dies... we all really want the same... to be happy again.. to be loved again.. to be the most important thing to each other.. always.. this may be what she is looking for.. wants, needs... find out her needs.... ask her from the cards you go to look for... and let them say it for you, if you have a hard time doing it or saying it, or maybe she won`t let you go there with her.. do it in some form, of showing her, JUST how much you are willing to try... never give up if she is what you want back..<P>Like I said I do not know your story.. but I do know having your SO, have another M around, (mine being OW around..) is the hardest thing... My stbx has kept very private, very away, and I did all I could do for us, at this point in our lives.. I feel it is up to him now, knowing I am the overly willing party... but I am seperated almost a yr now.. no signs of him regretting, changing his mind, nothing.. so I did give up.. <P>I feel that the man has a bit more control as to the chase, of it all.. woman can be forceful as well, don`t get me wrong.. but I did chase for 6 mths.. it grows wiery if the SO, doesn`t budge.. you metioned your W, at least is listening, likes the attention... and at least you have that uppper hand, I did not.. <P>Being a woman my self... and a big time lover of romance... it is truely what I feel we all miss.. as time goes by in our lives... so much is taken for granted... make the time up to her.. make her melt.. think of things you never have done before, and always wanted to do for her, or that she wanted you to do for her, but didn`t, and do them.. <P>I hope I have not over stepped my boundaires with my suggestions... I would love nothing more for my self, as well in my situation.. and would grab it in an instant... I think if my stbx let his stubborn guard down, he just could see that too...<P>good luck, if you dare to try...<P>AV

Medic stay on course with filing the divorce papers. You are waking her up to the fact that her behaviour will result in a divorce.It is during moments of crisis such as a divorce that people understand the consequences of their behaviour. The fact is that unless she wants to come back to you the marriage is already dead.

Well, I just got back from the lawyers office. The papers should be ready by Friday for me to sign.<P>He asked me if I wanted a sheriff or constable to deliver the papers to Val at work for her to sign. I thanked him for his concern and suggestion but told him this is hard enough without adding humiliation to the situation for either one of us. I'm not happy about going to this extreme [divorce] but feel it is necessary to make a move on a stagnat realationship. <P>To DZRT and ANSTER,<P>I have tried everything in my power to get my W back. Brief history. I tapped the phones and found she had been seeing someon for a while and made a date back in March and promptly threw her out of the house. I know bad move. Emotions took over.<P>We had problems before and they were never worked out completely. I finally saw the light in late March and have been sorry for my poor husbandtry skills ever since.<P>I have sent her more roses and cards in the last months than I have in the last year we were together. Got her a tennis bracelet for her birthday. Shows how bad a H I really was.<P>She called right before I left for the appointment and begged me not to "do it". She is still unwilling to let him go.<BR>At my wits end. See you in the funny papers.<P>Wishing us all the Best<P>Medic

Max,<P>Must have posted at the same time. This is my current train of thought. I have read and practiced more marriage saving techniques than I can remember. If she comes back to really work on the marriage I will give it my best shot. If she signs the papers and the divorce goes thru I will at least be a much better person in the future and can look back and say I tried.

Medic,<P>I don`t get it.. if she called and begged not to do it... then why..? if you feel you would be willing if she is willing, then why...? <P>I`m sorry, but this sounds to me like you can not let what happen go.. As I said I didn`t know your story, and giving me the short version, only leads me to these assumptions... If I am wrong, again, I appologize.. I am no one to give advise... I am not a profewssional.. but I wish I was in your shoes.. beleive you, me.. I would give any thing to have my ex, call and beg, to not do this.. <P>it is never too late.. you can stop this, if you really want to.. there is nothing that can`t be worked out.. nothing.. life is too short, to start to get to know some one else all over again.. and new family, and so on, and so on... <P>sorry again, I am babaling.. but I am a beleiver.. was/am the faithful one.. but my SO, is unfortunatly not... it sounds to me as though she is now willing, if she called..<P>do not sign any thing, unless you are completely sure.. that is my opinion, and suggestion.. <P>Lots of luck to you what ever you do.. your destiny is in your own hands now.. make what is going to be your future, the right dicission.. it is for the rest of your life.. and singlehood, is not everything it is cracked up to be.. think very hard and long, before any signature.. my freind... <P>sincerely AV

ANSTER,<P>I would take her back in a heartbeat if she agreed to some of the terms as Dr. H describes. I feel more than reponsible for the situation that we are in. The last thing she said to me was "I love You"<P>BUT, She is unwilling/unable to let go of her "friend" of over two years. She doesn't know what to do. Whom to choose. I'm sorry but even with the new millenium coming I am not willing to have my W have a boyfriend on the side.<P>It would almost seem easier if she wouldn't talk to me. Tell me she hated me. Never wanted to see me again. That I never loved you. This is just too hard to swallow. Trying to win a contest for your W.<P>I was the betrayer in my first marriage. I now know both sides. They both are extremely difficult.<P>Wishing us all the Best<P>Medic

medic,<BR> <BR>I understand what you are saying, and can relate to it well.. <P>I know you are right, in that you think you tried everything, and you probably have, no doubt, I know that feeling too.. <P>I guess I am just a true romantisist, and feel there is nothing two can`t concure if given the chance.. I was never given the chance.. I would love what is going on with you, to happen to me.. I would even more so love for the (in my case OW) OW, to know that my H, was confused and couldn`t decide.. I would love for her to squirm, and feel what I am feeling.. I would love for my ex, to say any of the sorts to me again... <P>never having this chance, makes me angry (not at you, just a feeling) that people still choose to stop dealing with this mess. and that is exactly what it is, a mess.. but to stop.. for the OM to take what you already have, together... is (again, to me) outrageous... I would almost kill for that chance... <P>I hope she comes around, for both your sakes.. medic...<BR>lots of luck to you both... what ever happens..<P>Av

Medic...<BR>Been there, too, done that, have the tee shirt, the coffee mug and an album of photos. W made zero progress after 4 months of informal separation and multiple requests from me for joint counseling. Finally, I told her one of us had to do something and I filed for divorce. When she went to see an attorney after I gave her the packet my attorney addressed to her, he and she discussed the marriage and her feelings about the divorce. After considering the responses he got from her about his questions, he suggested....(drum roll)...are you ready for this???....joint counseling. She went along with that and an official response was filed by her denying that the marriage was "irretrievably broken" and that joint therapy was requested.<P>Now, things are not going extremely well and we will still probably divorce, but it at least moved her butt a little. So I can only hope that you will get a similar response, but that your outcome will be better.<P>Good luck....

Hi Heartpain,<P>I'm sure something will come out of this. She called again last PM after I was at the lawyer crying asking repeatedly if I REALLY went to get things started.<P>She still claims she doesn't want I divorce but offers no suggestions regarding reconsiliation. She even asked if maybe we could get remarried after the divorce sometime.<P>She said she has had a terrible headache and stomach pains since our talk on Monday. I told her I know EXACTLY how she feels. I experienced the same symptomology upon discovery. Couldn't eat or sleep for a week.<BR>Wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy.<P>I have not seen this much effort put forth on her part these last 48 hours as in the previous 7 months.<P>I'm not sure which way this will go. But, at least I now have her attention.<P>Wishing us all the Best.<P>Medic

Medic,<P>I know that feeling as well, too. I agree.. No one should have to be in a contest of any kind with their spouse... but! (to me) you already know her better, and have her, and that is the advantage... <P>The confused spouse, (another lucky thing in your situation) has no idea what life is going to be like with this new person... sometimes taking a chance and time seeing just how this will go for/with them, makes for their dicission... <P>Again... paper work makes it much more final.. (not to say never again, but to the confused spouse, more final..) and, I my self and I, would re-think the signing of it all..<P>that is all I am saying... the papers can be all ready to get that signature on them, for a long time to come.. <P>I hope for your sake it doesn`t happen for you...!! lots of luck..<P>AV.....

Hey pal,<BR>I'm sorry your going through so much torment. I know EXACTLY how you feel. My W will not budge on anything I ask for. She is steadfast on her belief that we will never work and she is unwilling to give it the slightest chance. Medic, As you know you must do what you feel is right, If Divorce is right for you and you are comfortable with it, then do it. But, and this is a big but, If there is a shadow of doubt, If it feels like you shouldn't be doing this just yet, Then don't. Your not ready and at that point maybe start plan b. <P>Your between a rock and a hard place. Don't rush into it, I know you've been going through this for awhile but really think it through. Good luck pal and let us know. My thoughts are with you.<P>------------------<BR>Rutger......One day at a time.<P><BR>

medic,<P>I have answered this 3 times, and don`t know what happened to my others posts.. but what I did say in return to you, was... having a slight chance, is much more then some/here have... and anyone of us would give any thing to have what you do have going on... and never want to sign or give up... <P>I know you will do what ever you feel is right, and best for you.. and if that is to sign, then so be it.. <P>I, my self.. would rather,(if being in your possition..) wait it out.. go about your life, for what ever more length if time, and make the best of it, with her... in my case with him.. (if I had that chance.. in which it seems I do not..) You know her better then this OM, and do have that upper hand.. giving an ultimatum, is fine... but signing is final!! (not to say, as we all know, it can never be again...) It is more like in a marriage contract, knowing you are tied as a union, from the paper work.. it is the same in the D papers.. wipping your hands/slate of it all, and portraying *the end...* making it harder to deal with to return...<P>I wish you well... and hope your dicission, works out for the best...<P>AV