Hi, everyone--I am so thankful to have found this forum, as every other one I can find has told me to take my kids and run the other way.

My husband started a new job a few months ago. There was a woman working there that I knew he'd have to work with, and, even though our marriage was broken, and since she wasn't attractive, I never thought he would turn to her--but he did. (I know who she is, and she's cheated on her husband before.) WH swears he's telling the truth--he says that working at night with her they got to talk a lot, and they became close. One night, things got sexual, and he swears to me that he couldn't perform because of conviction--he stopped and told her that they had to stop, he couldn't do this to his wife and kids, and she agreed. Well, I could tell something had happened, (and am still having doubts that actual sex didn't take place--but have no proof--we hadn't been intimate for some time prior to the encounter--nightshift ain't good for sex partners!) and he confessed a week later. He had no intentions of telling his boss until OW went to a friend of hers, told her what happened, and her friend told OW to leave her husband, that she and my husband could make a go of it. OW went looking for WH, and told him all of this. He told her she was crazy--he was not leaving his family for her. Since he knew that OW's friend was probably NOT going to keep the news to herself, he told his boss, and they (he and OW) resigned their positions. Another kink in this--my husband is a part-time minister, so the gossip is hot hot hot right now.

I had decided that when I found out, I would just take my kids and leave. I thought I didn't care anymore, but when it broke my heart, I knew that somewhere I still loved him and had to try and mend our broken marriage.

So now, just eleven days after the confession, I'm still trying to find hope. Of course, I have a hard time trusting him--I had a feeling that he talked to her on the phone yesterday, and when I asked him, he denied it. I had checked his call history, and found no lengthy calls in it, though he had talked on the phone for several minutes. This morning, I checked it again, and he's erased his calls list (which made me FURIOUS). I know I want to confront him, though I also know that I can bide my time til the phone bill comes in. The situation is mushrooming, and he may have talked to her about all of the public scrutiny (it's a small town, and since my husband stands behind a pulpit every week, he's not supposed to sin...). If that's true, then he should be able to tell me. I don't think he's had any other contact w/ her besides yesterday.

Yesterday, I did a great deal of house cleaning--it's a form of therapy for me, but I can't help having in the back of my mind that I'm cleaning it so that when I move out, I won't have to do it then. Though I'm a Christian, I'm a pessimist. I'm so afraid that he's not going to try as hard as I am to save our marriage. I don't think I've ever seen him try hard at anything--like now, it seems he's just waiting for a job to fall in his lap, knowing we have four children to feed (I've been a SAHM for three years). I've been doing some other reading, and I am thinking that he has a personality disorder that, from all accounts, is a hopeless case. I pray that this is not true.

He told me yesterday, after I questioned him about the phone call, that he doesn't want to put his heart and soul in the repair process only to have me say that I can't forget, and separate anyway. He's not putting his heart and soul in this yet--I don't know when he's going to start. Am I selfish for thinking that he should be courting me? I think about all of the things I know he did for OW (flowers for b-day, made CD, bought little gifts), and he's not doing anything like that for me. He seems to think all of our problems can be solved in bed. He has talked to another pastor, and we've arranged to meet w/ him next week.

I'm just lost...and I don't know if I can handle this--I've always run from my problems, but now, I have nowhere to run to. My parents are dead, and I don't have any family that has room or money to help me. So, I'm also wondering if I'm staying because I don't have a choice.

Forgive my lengthiness--I haven't really talked to anyone about this, because I don't have anyone I confide in regularly. Any advice from you would help me tremendously.

Hello mama4,

I am very sorry you are here and having this problem. There are many people on the site with the same problem as you have. I'm kinda new here, but I have read ALOT and it helps. If you post on the GQ II part of this site, you will get more replys. Either way some of the pros will be along shortly to help more than I can. Right now remember that you are not alone, we are here and please read about Plan A for now. Your husband is in a FOG and he can't see straight or tell right from wrong so talking too much to him will not help right now. Please read also about what some of the terms are such as WH = wayward husband. This will help when you read other posts. You have a very good chance to save your marriage but it will take work. Also add if you have any kids, when you got married - it helps the people here to help you

best regards,
M2L

Welcome. There are a bunch of us here in similar situations. Glad you've found us.

It does seem like the one who strayed should be trying the hardest to save the marriage. But that rarely happens. Usually it is up to the sane partner - the one who isn't under the influence of infatuation.

What is the personality disorder that you think he may have? We probably have some folks here who are experienced with it.

The starting point is Plan A, where you show him what a great wife you could be, with no disrespectful judgements or angry outbursts. Doesn't seem fair, but that is the best way to get through this.

Also you can calmly let him know that any contact with her is painful to you and dangerous to your marriage.

Part of Plan A is exposure. That includes letting anyone who has influence know about the affair. You can start with the other woman's husband.

Well, I believe that OW was more emotionally invovled than WH. According to him (and, as I said, I'm doing my best to believe him), it was when things go physical that he realized what they were getting ready to get themselves into, that it hit him like a brick (I wish a brick had hit him!). So, he turned off like a faucet, and he said she agreed to stop the relationship as well, But, when she told her friend, and her friend advised her to leave her husband for WH, and she came after WH telling him that, he got ugly w/ her and told her to stay away, that he was not leaving his family for her. (Her husband knows, and as I said this isn't OW's first affair.) IF he called her the other day, it's because there is a GREAT deal of public scrutiny about this. They were in public service, tho not elected officials, plus WH is a preacher, so that's more fuel for the fire, and people want to know what happened. We even had a reporter stop by the other day wanting a comment. If I see anything in the paper tomorrow morning, I don't know what I'll do!

I am doing my best to follow Plan A. I didn't bring up the affair yesterday, and I prepared a new dish for supper that we had never had, and I try not to say anything about job hunting. Plus, I'm trying to be receptive in the bedroom--I hope it's working!

I think this feels so much harder when your husband is in the ministry. I am in the same boat. Only, mine is gone and never stopped before things got out of control.

I think the trust you are giving him could be something you regret later. Really dig to find out the answers you need. It's been 4 months and I just found out this weekend that there is one OW. I had thought, and WH never denied, that it was one night stands, drinking, etc. Every time you find out new info, you feel devastated.

I have never know my WH as anything but a Christian, so this is especially difficult...

I will be praying for you, I know how destructive gossip can be.

I think he's told me all there is about the almost-full-blown affair. I am still struggling with believing him, though. I mean, if you cross the line of kissing someone other than your wife with the intent of having sex with them, but you say you stopped, you've already betrayed your spouse. That's why I'm having a hard time trusting that what he says is true.

He told our church about it, but they have not, and are not, going to ask him to step down. They have a he-who-is-without-sin ideology about it, I guess. He's getting too many pats on the back for exposing the relationship on his own. Had OW not gone to a friend of hers about it, he probably wouldn't have told anyone, not even me. But, I think I would've left by now had he not told me, because I knew in my heart that something had happened.

I'm praying for you vallejo7--you, your husband, and your children.

m4

It is good that they are being forgiving and not judgmental, but there should also be accountability...is that happening? Does he have someone to be an accountability partner for him? Can you find anyone you can trust to "dump" your feelings on?

I know in my situation, I have friend who let me spew all my anger etc, and it helps to vent. It is a safe place to let it out so that it doesn't pour over.

Have you read Surviving an Affair? You and your husband definitely need to read it and get going on the Plan for Recovery...it is realy practical and seems easy to understand.

Dig deep into God...He is your only refuge. Listen to your favorite worship music and find peace. Your situation is painful, but God is a big God and can do miracles.

I have prayed for you these past few days since I came upon your post. I will continue to pray!

Mama4- I know exactly how you feel. My WH had a failed EA (emotional affair) with a younger volunteer youth leader in his youth ministry. She exposed him to our senior pastor and he lost his job. They were willing to re-instate him if he had been able to work on what happened, and even paid for our MC for a couple of months. The superintendent of the conference even told him that this experience would make him a better pastor. But, he quit and then ran.

Knowing your spouse turned away from you and let someone else have your place in his heart is devastating. In the book Torn Asunder Dave Carder says he thinks emotional affairs are the hardest to recover from. That was a good one to read for me in addition to SAA because it let me know the deep pain and roller coaster I was feeling was totally normal. (It was nice to know I wasn't crazy).

Is your WH being held accountable to anyone? Is he being required to go to IC or MC to figure out why he did what he did? I believe that God will shake up churches that don't hold their leaders accountable for their behavior.

Here's my biblical support for that:

In Malachi 2:13-15 the people of Israel asked why God was ignoring their prayers and tears. "...because the Lord is acting as a witness between you and the wife of your youth, because you have broken faith with her...Has not the Lord made them one? In flesh and spirit they are His."

In 1 Tim 3:1-5-Paul tells Timothy the qualities a church leader needs to have which includes having his "family in order". A married man pursuing an OW sure doesn't have his family in order.

Sorry you have to be here, but you will find support here from others who know what you are going through.

No--no one for accountability. I am wondering what will happen if the regional office finds out. He's not ordained, was licensed, but let that go last year. I wish someone were harder on him, I guess. The denomination we're in is pretty liberal, though. Honestly, it's too liberal for me, and I'm hoping that WH isn't in the ministry now just to provide us a place to live. The pay isn't much, but it keeps us afloat (I'm a SAHM). He doesn't even like most of the people in the church. The pastor we were going to talk w/ (b/c we can't afford counseling) has been sick, and we are waiting for him to get better before we talk to him. We live in a small remote place, and have to travel 30 miles just to go and talk to him--we'd have to travel much further for an "official" counselor. But, WH is at a stage that he's been his own boss for a long time, and doesn't like other people's advice or guidance. He's got to get back to depending on God for that.

I have to admit something--yes, I'm a Christian, yes, my husband is a pastor, preacher, whatever, but I am feeling about as far away from God as I can get. When I do start praying about it, I get so angry at God for allowing this to happen, then get angry at WH, and don't want to pray for him. It's selfish, I know. I need to get over this anger in order for everyone to benefit from me praying.

It will help me, too, to pray for you all, people I don't even know, but we share more than one thing, and you're in my heart and mind everyday.

Thank you, my friends.
m4

m4-

I know how you feel-about being unable to pray (or even focus) and feeling far from God. A few things have helped me during this time. First of all, God is big enough to handle our anger. He understands that there are times we just can't talk. After all, He made us with our emotions.

He also made us with free will. It's hard to understand how a man who was called by God to ministry, would choose to destroy his family and ministry in this way.

I journaled to vent my feelings to God. All the hurt, anger, questions etc.

Another thing that helped is knowing that Jesus was betrayed and He understands the hard, tearful, anguishing feelings that come with it. He even asked God to get him out of the path he had to travel.

Something I read this week helped too. In Phillip Yancey's book Disappointment with God, he writes about Joseph. When Joseph was in that prison, God must have seemed far away. Yet in that time, God created a maturity in Joseph. Joseph didn't have faith God would take away the difficult times, he had faith that God would redeem those times. And God did.

When I look back in my journals, I can see these things beginning to happen. I didn't always get answers, but I can see the maturity. I didn't used to be very patient. And I didn't like to be "still." Now that so much of my life is out of my own control (cancer will do that to you) I have found a comfort in being still and clinging to the God who knows the number of clouds in the sky, who knows the storehouses of the snow and calls out the stars by name. I'm okay to be in this place right now. That's a huge change for me.

Your WH sounds like mine was. He was licensed (not ordained) his own boss, and he stopped meeting with other men who might have held him accountable. He also thought other people's advice was "stupid" and would just say what they wanted to hear with no intention of following through or omit certain things because that's not really lying-in his mind.

He does need to get back to God. Just remember this: your WH is God's prodigal, not yours. A friend told me once that God will deal with my WH much more creatively than I ever could. The image that popped into mind was Jonah-getting swallowed by the big fish. Now that's creative.

I will keep you in my prayers as well.

Oh, johnstwin--I feel so petty and small when I realized what you are going through--I pray for your healing. If you don't mind sharing w/ me, what is the prognsis and how long are you doing treatment? The aunt that I lived with after my mother died underwent very aggressive chemo and radiation two years ago, and is doing great, of which I am very thankful for.

I understand what you're saying about God's dealing w/ WH more creatively than I can. I'm just afraid that it will hurt the whole family.

I used to keep a journal, but once, when my husband and I first started going together, he found it and laughed at me. So I don't even share my feelings on paper anymore. This and some other reasons make me think that he is suffering from narcissism and he'll never be the husband/father/minister that he should be. I wish there were someone that he really loved and respected that could jerk him into reality, but there's no one in his life like that. He sounds just like your FWH--he'll tell someone he'll do something, with no intention whatever to do it, or he'll just make up an excuse. He's had more headaches than any man I've ever known.

I was getting ready to ask you some questions about your M, but I just read some of your posts so you wouldn't have to go through all of the telling again. I've gotten to where I'm sick of trying to tell people about it when they ask. But one friend made the comment after her husband stopped by and talked w/ my H that she was glad that "everything's OK." I don't know what my H told her H, but he must've really downplayed the whole thing. I've been trying to call her to see what her H told her, but haven't been able to get in touch with her. I pray that H is telling the truth, and that he did not engage in a sexual encounter with her--the making out was enough for me to handle. I really worry about that. Just from little things he says, like when he told me about his boss calling them both in the office, and questioned her about it, and my husband said "She told him the same thing I had." And my head starts saying "Well, I hope so--it's what you said is the truth!" I pray that God will ease my mind about it if it's the truth. Sometimes I want to get on his cell and pretend to be him and text message her just to see if she reveals anything. But, maybe she's so mad at him for leading her along that she won't reply. It's probably a bad idea.

I just don't know if I can stand anymore testing--if H doesn't make more of an effort to change and be a part of us trying to be better spouses and parents and Christians, I can't say what I'll do. I have no where to go, and no money to go with--I simply don't know what I'll do. I was just working on the bulletin for worship service tomorrow and came across this quote from TD Jakes: "As much as it pleases God to bless you, there will be moments when everything you try goes up in smoke. There will be moments when the one you counted on most walks away and leaves you groping through blinding tears and wailing questions of why. Plans and goals can be circumvented by the most disappointing of times, leaving you learning the art of patience and the acceptance of a denied request." I HAVE to give this completely to God, and thank you for reminding me that God is big enough to handle my anger...

Forgive me for babbling. I said earlier that I don't have anyone to talk with about this, and it shows!

May not post tomorrow, but will try.

m4

M4 (sounds like branch of the British intelligence group-MI6)

I have no problem with you asking about my prognosis. I was blessed to find my tumor early. It was about 1.1 cm (pretty small) but had gotten past the place it started. It had not spread to the lymph nodes. That's always good. The tumor was found to be only progesterone receptor positive and had no other negative features. I will be doing weekly chemo for 6 months to make sure that no microscopic cancer cells may have wandered somewhere else. The chemo is more to give me an even better chance of not having it return.

It's not an aggressive treatment in terms of dosage-just the length of treatment time. There's no telling how I will react as time goes by, but with the first treatment I've just gotten tired by the end of the day.

Please don't think you were "babbling". What you are going through is a roller coaster of emotions. It wears you out and completely makes you think you can't take another step. It's important to have one place that you can come and find some understanding hearts and minds. Don't ever worry about "venting" or "babbling" here. It's a safe place to do it.

I know you are worried about what it will take for God to get your WH's attention. But, you can only be responsible for you. Your WH is still most likely "fogged" in his thinking. That's something you read on the MB site-that our WS's have gotten addicted to the "feel good" high they got around the other person, and it completely fogs their whole response to everything. It sometimes helps to realize they are fogged when they act selfishly. We can only be a lighthouse. There's a thread about being a lighthouse in General Questions. You will find many other kindred hearts there as well.

Besides the book by W. Harley SAA (Surviving an Affair), I would encourage you to look at Torn Asunder by Dave Carder, because he talks about the process of getting through the emotional junk for the BS, and also how hard it is for the WS to get untangled from an EA. The chapter in his book about EA's contains excerpts from a pastor who was writing him during his recovery from his EA (funny-there are a lot more pastors who fall into EA's out there than I originally thought). You can go to Family Life Today's website and read the transcripts of the shows he did with them. Just type his name in the archives of shows for this year. I think it was in April or May.

I hope some of this helps.

Great advice johnstwin. I also will be praying for you.

Another book I happened to be reading when all of my world came crashing in around me was Total Forgiveness by RT Kendall. I know there is so much else going on, but really forgiveness is such a huge part of wht is going on in our situations...especially because they (WS) do not seem to even care about forgiveness or the pain they are causing. It really helped me wrap my mind around some of this, even though it is not A specific information.

A verse that is good to hold on to right now:
Hebrews 13:4-5 (AMP)
Let marriage be held in honor (esteemed worthy, precious, of great price, and especially dear) in all things. And thus let the marriage bed be undefiled (kept undishonored); for God will judge and punish the unchaste [all guilty of sexual vice] and adulterous.

5Let your [a]character or moral disposition be free from love of money [including greed, avarice, lust, and craving for earthly possessions] and be satisfied with your present [circumstances and with what you have]; for He [God] [b]Himself has said, I will not in any way fail you nor [c]give you up nor leave you without support. [I will] not, [d][I will] not, [I will] not in any degree leave you helpless nor forsake nor [e]let [you] down ([f]relax My hold on you)! [[g]Assuredly not!](A)


I love the "I wil not , I will Not, I will not forsake you" It brings me comfort to remember that my God is a BIG God.

Bless you two for your thoughts--johnstwin: I hope today is a good day--and I kinda like the idea of having my own code name!

I can't post as much as I want today, for if H found out I was pouring my heart out here, he would be upset. (another story for another day)

but I was fishing around the internet today, and in terms of H being a preacher, this quote really made me think.



It came from
http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/man-in-the-shadow-of-adultery

It really made me think that H may be a man of God, but he's really got to work on it--no human is perfect, as Solomon attests to that.

Must go.

Thanks so much for your thoughts a prayers--yesterday was not a good day, as I got VERY resentful of his sitting around while I do the necessaries...it's hard to show him love, but I'm going to do better than my best...

m4