ccw,
My H had an EA with an old hs girlfriend. He did not view it as an EA while he was in it. He did not feel that the communication had anything to do with his M which he truly valued. He knew he was keeping his communication with her secret from me and he knew that that was wrong. He thought he was just having innocent "fun". She told him she was driving through our town (she lives in another state) and they arranged that she would call him when she passed through town. He arranged to be running errands nearby at the time he expected she would be calling. They met and had coffee. Their correspondence had been going on about a month before this meeting took place.

After about an hour of talking with her, he had an uncomfortable feeling: What is this all about, what am I doing. He brought her back to the house pretending he had just "run into her"

What helped him understand that he was on a "slippery slope" to a PA and was actually involved in an EA (even though he loved me and felt there was nothing wrong in our M) were a few things:

I told him I just knew he had not simply "run into" her that day even though he kept saying he had. He finally admitted that they had arranged to meet. He had to acknowledge that he had lied to me and set it up to meet OW behind my back.

within a week, I found some of their e-mail correspondence on his work e-mail that he had "saved". It was not extremely romantic or anything but some of it was clearly seductive. He was trying to "impress" her and make her "like" him.

I could also see that they were in e-mail contact multiple times a day.

Once he knew that I knew these things, he could look at his behavior through my eyes and he saw that he was being "unfaithful" to our way of life and our marital vows. He could not even look at the things he had written to her because he was so embarrassed. He felt that he was acting like a teen ager and he was very embarrassed.

Reading the info on this web site made him understand the slippery slope he was on. He then wanted no more contact with her and was very relieved to write a NC letter.

During that week when I was uncovering things, he knew that I was hurt but he still wanted to protect OW from pain also, so he had been trying to slowly ease out the situation with her. Once he saw the pain I was in and felt the intensity of the pain, he no longer cared about her feelings, he only cared about my feelings and sent the NC letter. He went through no withdrawal at all. I think because he was really not interested in her, he was only interested in himself and reliving old hs times through talking to her.

He read another article on a web site that helped him say good-bye to that happy, popular teen that he had been. He now knows that that teen is gone. He basically shook hands with his youth and acknowledged fully that it was dead and buried.

Can you get at those e-mail messages that they were sending back and forth? Maybe he would give you the password if there is no other way but I would try to get at them without him knowing it so he does not have the opportunity to get rid of them.

For us, "Exposure" really meant fully exposing it to me. That was the exposure that was needed for him to see his behavior as ugly, not "fun".
Lake

My husband's A was with old girlfriend as well. It was online and telephone until they met to 'talk' and ended up in bed.

Find out everything you can about her and expose to her husband - even if they are seperated - expose. They may be seperated because of your H. You never know.


You should be able to check online for credit card bills.

Can you quit your job and move to where he is and get a job? You really do not need to be sperated- that is never good for a marriage.

good luck

Since my last post, I have been reading a lot of the discussions and it somewhat helped me to recover some emotional sanity. There are still times that I get emotional but would recover easily.At this time there is nothing I can do to stop whatever they are doing since my H is still in Fl. I have done some Plan A and now part of Plan B. When I tried to detach my self emotionally from him, I have noticed that he would call me all the time and sometimes I don't answer his calls until he called several times. I would always make excuses that I couldn't answer his calls and wonders why I can't call him. He started to use terms of endearment again and sounds upbeat when we talk since I don't try to sound depressed.

Here's the thing that makes me confuse sometimes and I need your thoughts about it. Why is it that when my H's ex-GF calls him I feel so upset and jealous even though he says that they are just real good friends who have reconnected from the past and he doesn't think that it is an affair. He can't understand why I am trying to stop him from talking to an old friend when I can talk to an ex-suitor who is married from California and we talk about his family or general topics and old times and I don't find it a problem?
I still consider my old boyfriends as friends and sometimes wonder how they are doing? Is there double standard here? That it is ok for me when a male friend calls but not ok when a female friend calls my H? Any thoughts?

Yes. Do you understand Harley's position on remaining in contact with "old flames"? Just as your H's continued contact with an old GF affects you, your continued contact with old BFs affects him. Harley's position is that there should be NC, and I think you're beginning to understand why.

If you both value your M, then you know what you need to do - stop acting as a source of unhappiness for each other.

Thanks Manin Motion for your thoughts. Does this mean that we can't maintain friendship or communication with "old flame"? What should we do when they call us? Just tell them to stay away and pretend that they never existed because now we are married?

I am trying to make sense of the situation. Believe me it is so painful when I found out though my H refused to admit that he's having an affair. He is treating this friendship the way he treats his other friends even though they had a relationship in the past. What i am afraid of is that if I keep on pushing the issue, the more he will go to her for his emotional needs because now I become the bad guy.

He is supposed to come back Nov 1 from Fl now that the hurricane season is over and no hurricanes this year so far. Thanks the Lord, He's giving Fl a break this year.

Anyway, I have a week off starting 11/7 and I wanted to o other places when he gets back but vacation packages kinda xpensive, thus H suggested to come down to our house in Fl since the weather is nicer than NY and that it is cheaper. Since I booked my flight, I am having second thoughts of seeing him since emotionally I am starting to recover and doing some Plan B and I am afraid that I will be an emotional wreck again once we're together. Is this normal? I don't know what I feel right now but I know I don't have this very heavy feeling in my heart. We have been talking everyday and he does most of the calling and he is using terms of endearment to me again.

Here is my take on this question. No, you are not pretending they never existed.

You can write a simple no contact letter that both of you approve of. The letter would say something basic for old flames that you have had basic contact with a few times a year--something to the effect that you are renewing your commitment to your marriage and that you are saying good-bye to old flames as part of that renewal and let them know that you will not be contacting them and ask that they not contact you.

My husband had a three week EA with an old HS flame. He was in a fog about what he was doing. Once I discovered his actions and he saw it from my perspective, he was extrememly embarrassed and remorseful. He wrote a no contact letter and has had no contact.

After this happened, he realized, the EA was not about her but it was about that old high school guy that he had been--popular, athletic, on top of the world. He was re-connecting with that guy through this former girlfriend. He read an article on a pop web site that really helped him to "say good-bye" to that high school guy that existed 35 years ago. He was then able to "shake the teen-agers hand" and say good-bye to him. He buried that old self and feels good about it.

He has another former girlfriend that has e-mailed him a few times over the last ten years and visited the house once. In my recovery from the EA he had with the other girlfriend, I used a computer program that brought back all his old e-mails including ones to this girlfriend that has e-mailed a few times. All of these e-mails were very explicitly written to her with "we" words--Lake and I or we. I feel comfortable that we not send her a no contact letter. She may e-mail him but I am confident he would tell me immediately. Also, we have a rule that he no longer uses his work e-mail address for anything personal related. He has changed over all e-mail to our family address of which I am the primary user.

I suppose some on this site may disagree with this and say I am asking for trouble. But I would feel more hurt and pain by disconnecting from this old girlfriend who has not contacted us in a couple years. I like her and would have no problem with seeing her again. She has a full life including a significant long term relationship.

Do not remain in contact with anyone that makes your spouse feel uncomfortable. Make sure you use radical honesty with your spouse when relating to anyone of the opposite sex. Tell them everything. Do not correspond with someone of the opposite sex socially by yourself--write these correspondences with your spouse at your side. There should be VERY few of them--maybe a Holiday card or congratulatory card. Do not ever meet with someone of the opposite sex for coffee or dinner, etc. alone.

These are my rules and my H's rules.
Lake

Thanks Lake53 for your response. I know you could relate with me since you have been through the same situation. I am happy for you that you were able to resolve the problem right away and wishing you all the luck even though once in while that "event" will pop-up once in a while. In my situation, I am giving my H the benefit of the doubt and I think I'll be "OK" with their friendship if he will be radically honest with me and everything should be out in the open including emails, phone records, credit card bills.
My H is a good-hearted individual who is very kind, caring and generous to all his friends and the type of person that you can count on if you need anything. That's why, I am having a hard time believing that he could do such thing to me because he always spoiled me and my family and friends envy our relationship.But I guess it could happen to any good and solid marriages.

CCW,

You can't use the same level of comparison with other friends and his 'friendship' with the OW. The EA of it makes that impossible.

When he or the OW get angry when you question their 'supposed friendship' right there you know it has gone tooo far. Throw that back at them and tell both of them, what right do they each have to put their 'friendship' ahead of each's family love, care and security?

Then watch the reaction. The OW has already stooped to lying to cover the EA so you know she is not worth having as a friend (unless your H is into having liars as friends). Find out if he is or not. That's the art of reverse babble at work. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

L.

Please do not misunderstand me. I would not be comfortable with my H maintaining the relationship that you have described regarding your H and this OW. I would insist on no contact. She has lied. You don't really know for sure if your H has lied.

My H is also a great guy and very giving. That is probably part of what helped him stay in a fog for a few days about what he had done. He was framing it that he was "helping" her or giving her "support" as she had mental health problems.

I encourage you to be on guard about this relationship and I urge you to ask for no contact.

You and your H need to decide what you will do about other old flame relationships that you have. But I would not want my H interacting with a woman who lies about the R and about herself.

Remember, my H has no contact with the EA old flame.
Lake