Scotty,

I’ve been sitting over here on this bench watching your situation evolve. As much as has happened it always seem so generally slow going doesn’t it?

I have to toss in two cents at this point. I can’t help myself.

“I agree that I can't believe what they are saying. I agree that actions will speak for themselves. That said, wouldn't it be wise to hold of on exposing for now and see if his actions (finding a new job) corroborate what he is saying?”

The affair is wobbly. One or two more good pushes and it will topple. The affair is choking on it’s own bile. But now, right now with your hands clamped around the affair’s throat you are backing off? Backing off to see if it’s still alive? Arrugh.

There is an old saying, Scotty, about carrying a weapon.

Never carry a gun unless to are going to take it out.
Never take it out unless you are going to point it at someone.
Never point it at someone unless you are going to fire it.
Never fire it unless you make sure you kill the ba$[censored].

You are backing off after step two.

You want this affair dead.

Pull the damn trigger.

Otherwise, I predict it will not really end for a long time yet. She will moon over OM for years. You need to make him choose, and choose blatently, because your WW will not.

So the answer to your question is not only no, but he11 no!


Cent number two:

“How do I go about positiong myself to be her lighthouse, her attractive safe landing? She isn't communicating with me. I worry that calling her will make me look desperate. I don't want to give her that impression.”

You improve yourself to the point you no longer need her. Amazing what that does to WS perceptions of reality. Loving detachment + long term self improvement = hard to resist.

Later, when her headectomy has been performed, she will think you amazingly strong for having done all this scary stuff for her, for the two of you.


With prayers,


Oh, and I agree with Orchid. What the heck does an MC session between adulterers look like? Sheesh, this is one of the more hilarious things I have read lately, LOL. Actually, it sounds suspicious to me. Sorry, I have seen sillier things swallowed by BS, err, and tasted them myself.

Kill it Scotty, kill it now.

Be her safe place:
do not talk bad about her actions to her - it will come, but in time.

Be a loving husband and a man at this time - no wimp

let her see her actions (takes time) and then you tell her that as a M couple you two can build a better M.

Scotty, here is a hard one for us BH to understand - sometimes the WWs hurt more than we do. You lost your wife (just for now) - your wife lost you and the OM at about the same time. I told my wife that I feel bad for her because of this and she looked at me like I was nuts and told me "how can you M2L feel bad for me - I cheated on you?" I do hurt like He!!, but if I want my family back and better than b4 I need to man up.

Just do what will help her out and don't do anything to be the cause of her pain right now. She will be calling more as the days go by.

best wishes,
M2L

Aphelion,

I appreciate all of your advice on here, especially considering that you are well versed with the ED problem and have been through it yourself. I considered calling the Harleys as you advised but am just not in the financial position to do so. I did discuss the problem with some ED counselors and they basically said that WW had likely cross addicted over to the affair and there is really not much I can do with respect to how she will handle her ED in light of all of this. So I made the decision to expose. She would have been facing this reality at some point anyway. If there is something that I should be doing in light of the ED I would gladly listen any advice that you may have.

From what I heard this morning, OM has already made it clear to WW that he chose his W and Kids, not WW. But, like I said, all I know about what OM said or plans on doing comes from what my MIL told me; MIL talked to WW last night after the meeting between WW and OM.

WW has been pretty honest with her family. She exposed to them herself an hour after I found out about the A. So although I know I can't put a lot of stock in what she says, it is enough for me to hold off on writing the letter to her work for now.

I still hope that OMW calls me and reaffirms what MIL told me. If I haven't heard anything from OMW in the next couple of days, I will try to call her. If OMW confirms that he is going to be leaving his job, then that will be something I can put a little more stock in.

My concern with writing the letter right now is that the affair may have already choked to death on its own bile. If I fire that bullet WW will prosecute me and our M for its death. Now I would be acquitted in the end, but why put our M through a long agonizing trial that could very possibly result in the death of our M if it is not necessary? Especially considering that the bullet could still be fired if necessary (albiet with less chance of success). It is classic risk/reward. I have to put these types of decisions to my clients all of the time, and am finding that it is not at all easy to do.

Right now I'm in the hard spot of being pretty much the only relevant player not being in the loop. WW will have to call at some point. We are supposed to get together this weekend to go through our office at home and start getting some junk out of there to get the house in presentable shape to put on the market.

I will be as pleasant and inviting as I can be. No disrespectul judgments, no angry outbursts, no selfish demands. Although I wish that she would open up to me and at least want to lean on me for some support, I doubt that she will do so right away. I can only hope that she will begin to come around.

Thanks for the continuing support. This truly is my lifeline.

Scotty

You are underestimating the pull of adultery. Especially to an ED.

It takes a hot poker to get the adulterer's attention. Nothing less will do.

You are in a position to do your WW a favor. You can force such consequences upon OM he drops her like a hot potato, and then she hates him forever.

Or you can let things just evolve and watch her suffer much withdrawal.

And you will wonder when it will start up again.

Half measures are doomed.


Regarding her ED. The real work will start after the A ends. Rest of her life, rest of your life with her, work. Until she controls her ED, and understands its connection to her affair, another affair is waiting in the wings.

With prayers,

ed: Medical and IC attention for her ED should be a condition for reconciliation.

Scotty,

you know your wife, we don't. Do what you think is best right now. Some say wait a few days, some say tell boss now. It's hard isn't it?

I would wait for today and see what other "pros" here have to say.

M2L

Scotty,

I gotta admit that pulling the trigger is the right thing to do. Butttttt...........

I have to think that if you can get one last piece of intel on this, then maybe you dont pull it. MAYBE! My call is you do not wait on the OMW to call you to confirm. There is too much riding on this and as everyone has said...time is crucial here.

In military terms, you have the high ground right now and the enemy is reeling. Many say fire at will into the valley below and insure that the enemy is dead forever. And I agree! but, if that enemy is already dead, then firing may not make any difference accept to waste ammo and maybe even have "political" issues about how you fired on corpses!

So, I do understand your take on this. But you have to right now...right now...send an intel unit down into that valley to confirm the enemy is destroyed. You cannot wait. If you cant get the intel...then you must fire...and risk the consequences.

The enemy must be destroyed. The enemy is the affair. It must be destroyed completely. Exposure is the artillery rounds used against an affair.

So, call the OMW immediately and discern what the situation is concerning this. And if she confirms that he is leaving his job, then tell the OMW that it must be done immediately, that you cannot allow your wife to continue to work with him. That you will have to do something about it, if OM does not leave immediately. Tell her you will check back with her by the end of the week to confirm he has resigned. If not, she must be made aware that you are going to go to the manager/boss at that time. Tell her you are not doing this to hurt her...but that you must do what you have to to keep them apart for good.

So, find out if he is leaving for sure. If he isnt, then fire! If he is, then tell OMW that you will fire at moments notice if any further contact is made between them...and that you will fire at the end of the week, if he has not resigned.

This is war. Prosecute it as such.

I'll assume that I am underestimating the pull of her affair. That said, isn't the OM setting up a meeting with her for the sole purpose of telling her that he loves his wife and kids and does not want to have anything to do with WW anymore a hot enough poker to get WW's attention? According to MIL, she absolutely despises him right now.

Now, maybe that's WW lying out of her [censored]. But if she isn't and I write that letter, I'm just rubbing salt into a fresh, deep wound and that seems to me to spell possible disaster for our M.

If I find out that OM has no intention of leaving his job, then the letter will be sent as I know that my marriage has no chance if they continue to work together. But it sounds like him leaving his job is a possiblity. Again, I will want to confirm that with OMW.

If I do reconcile with WW, I have already written down as a condition that she get counseling for her ED and possible alcoholism. And it is something that the two of us will talk about on a regular basis. My failure to communicate with WW was a factor that led to the affair. I know that the ED is something that we would have to work on for the rest of our lives, but I am willing to do that work if she is.

Scotty

Scotty,

you sound like a great H. many men would have left by now. Here is to your wife seeing that one day.

M2L

My wife came back from a trip to Florida with the OM, after movign out and leaving me and the kids...and after the OM during sex down there, called my wife by his ex-wife's name. My wife came back wanting nothing to do with him...saying she wanted to reconcile. Angry as heck. Even began counseling sessions with me, came and spent the night a few times and we even had sex once.

Three weeks later, she was back with him!

Never underestimate the addiction!! Destroy it! I should have continued to try to destroy it, rather than believe her supposed anger at him.


All of this is very good.

You may also find out that he is "planning" on leaving his job and has "intentions" of getting another job. If this is the case, then you will know that he talking crap. You must have independent verification that he is going to leave his job SOON. These people are NOTORIOUS for talking smack just to get others off their back. I wouldn't believe anything unless its very, very convincing, such as he has given NOTICE. Answers like "he is looking around for another job" is almost always a delay tactic.

I took the advice and called OMW. OMW confirmed what I heard from MIL. OM did meet with WW last night. The counseling session was the original plan, and WW had apparently initially agreed to it, but later changed her mind (she had to have known what he was going to say at a counseling session). Anyway, they met at a coffee shop and it didn't sound like WW took it well, telling OM that her life has hit rock bottom. Apparently WW ended up telling OM during the middle of his talk that she knew everything he was going to say so she got up and left. Whole thing lasted about 10 minutes.

I wasn't planning on telling OMW about my intent to send a letter to thier work, but got caught up in the moment when talking to her about them having no contact and told her that I have been advised to do so. In hindsight, another mistake. I guess I hoped that it would persuade him to find another job. Stupid. There is a slim chance he could try to implant the jealous husband theory with the bosses, but I would flush that out and make him look like an even bigger idiot.

OMW did say that OM was going to start looking for other job possibilities, but she was not going to put her foot down on that yet as she wanted to see what was going to happen over the next month or so. I told OMW that if they continue to have any contact whatsoever, there is a strong possiblity that that the affair could be continue or at some point start again. She did acknowledge the possibility, but she does believe that OM is fully committed to her and to ending the ending the A. I told her that I hoped he was.

Anway, I did tell her that I was getting ready to send the letter to the hospital exposing the affair to HR and to their bosses. Nothing I can do about that now. I told her that shedding as much light on the A was absolutely necessary if they continued to work together. She said that she knows that I am going to do what I feel needs to be done, and then asked about the possibility of OM going to the bosses. I said that there is no way I could trust him doing that, other than receiving a call from the boss letting me know that they know and what they intend to do about it. In hindsight, the problem is that if he does tell them WW likely finds out it was becasue I was going to do it and that makes me look weak for not doing it. It was a mistake on my part. OM and OMW have a counseling session tonight and she is going to talk to him about it and get back to me later this evening.

OMW also stated that WW had told OM last night that she intended on packing up and moving to AZ to start her life over. WW has said the same to me a week ago, and actually received some paperwork from the Arizona board of pharmacy inquiring about her getting a license there. It's a possibility, but I don't think WW really plans on doing it anytime soon, if ever. She has said that she has friends and a life here. And deep down she knows that her problems are going to follow her to AZ.

That said, if she did follow through with that, at least it would probably end all contact. But it likely wouldn't be until our house sold and a divorce was finalized. That will take months. And like Amph says, she will likely just go out and find somebody else. I can't pack up and chase her to God knows where on the hope that she comes around, nor will she even likely invite me to do so.

Here is what has me the most concerned, yet I feel helpless. OMW told me that WW text messaged OM on Saturday night and didn't finish what she was typing. OMW said that she was extremely drunk (not sure how she knows that, but ostensibly from OM). I am really concerned about WW right now as she herself says that she has hit rock bottom (to both her mom and to OM) and she could do some bad things to herself physically and emotionally with the ED and with alcohol if she doesn't get some help.

Oh, and I forgot to mention that OM apparently told WW last night that she should come back to me, to which WW told him that he was the last person that she was going to take marital advice from.

Scott

When OMW calls this evening regarding the letter to their work, any advice as to what I should say to her. I know that I screwed up telling her, but I can't undo that now. What if she were to agree, with OM's blessing, that the two of us write the letter together?

Scotty, I wouldn't count on anyone else to do this for you. There are too many untrustworthy elements in this whole thing. I would just tell the OMW that you are still thinking about this and change the subject. If you leave it to the OM to do this himself, you will NEVER have any way of knowing if the truth was ever told.

You cannot trust a liar to bust himself.
He could just as easily go there and tell them that you are insanely jealous and are accusing him of pursuing your W. You will never be the wiser. Except that you will have squandered your credibility so if you ever do call, they won't believe you.

Please compose the letter tonight and have it delivered overnight registered mail. You have a very small window in which to do this and waiting only harms your position by giving SEVERAL ppl the opportunity to neutralize your weapon.

There are no real intentions here to leave their job, so it will be up to you to expose at work. It has to be done, Scotty. And it needs to be done by someone who a) who will do it and b) who will tell the truth. That only person IS YOU.

Every minute that you wait to do this gives the affairees more opportunity to gather strength and to pre-empt you at their job.

You only have the word of a proven liar about what he and the WW spoke about at their PRIVATE meeting. For all you and the OMW know, they met and set up another meeting, just going further underground. That is the MOST LIKELY scenario. If he were really serious about ending his affair he would END IT, not set up a private rendevous.

Do you think that the OM would tell his W anything different from what he told her about their "goodbye" meeting?

Mel,

Could Scotty talk to OMW and tell her about a NC letter to Scotty's wife? Good idea or not? This letter would be mailed by OMW. I know that OM can write it and have OMW mail it, but not hold true to it. Just a thought.

Scotty,

My wife told me that she wanted to move to a city about 30 min from our home. She wanted a clean start. I think that the WW are so lost that they don't know what to believe or trust in. My wife is still in our bed everynight and is showing some guilt. My Dday was 5-8-06 and last NC was 8-4-06. It takes time.

Could your wife move in with your MIL? Your wife hates her apt anyway. This would help by having someone around for her that cares about her. Watch over her eating, drinking and someone who would give her love. You could stop over to vist both of them. I think you wife will crash hard one day and it needs to be you there when that happens.

Lastly, call HR and set up an appt with them. Tell then in person. That way they see you are not a nut job, but a loving H. If you called with saying "I would like to talk to the head of HR about two employees having an A and one of them is my wife and the OM is her boss." That should be their attn right away. JMO

Best wishes,
M2L

Scotty

Listen to Mel. I talked to the OM twice and both times he swore to leave my WW alone and apologized. Guess what "HE LIED!!" Think of asking a crack addict whose been arrested if he will stop smoking crack. Of course at that point in time he is going to say yes. Well, saying yes and being able to leave the crack pipe and its allure alone are a whole different story.

Also, after having exposes WW and idiot at their workplace if I had it to do over again I would have actually went to the workplace (after setting up an appointment) and sat down across from the HR director or someone more important and talked to them. I sent a well written letter and even talked with the HR director on the phone twice. My WW and OM denied an affair when asked by the person assigned to investigate and then turned it around that I was a looney, jealous husband who she was divorcing and was accusing her of having an affair. So in hingsight I would have forced the company rep to look me in the eye and know me and my face and the faces of my children (take photos) and then dare say that I was looney.

Hope,

Scotty doesn't have kids.

Scotty, like Hope and I said face to face today!!!

face
+ face
+ today
_________

= break up of an A

Come on man, you wife has an ED and drinks too much she NEEDS you to help her even though she doesn't want it or know it yet.

M2L

Was supposed to get a call from OMW last night, but she did not do so. I am thinking about trying to set up a face to face with the HR director and the director of the pharmacy.

M2L and Hope suggest face to face vs. the letter. Anybody disagree with this approach?

Scotty

Scotty, I like what hopeandpray had to say about this. I would first arrange a face to face and then follow up with a registered letter. He is correct that the affairees often characterize the BS as a jealous nutjob. I am very concerned that the OM will go in today and pre-empt you, so I would suggest you go do this ASAP.

Face to face------Vote yes

The sooner the better. My ww's work place would have done no good. Her boss was in an affair with another employee. (small company) but if I had your set of circumstances I would do it in a heart beat....Well, knowing what I know now.
Back then I was chicken so I might not have done it.
But today HEII yeah I would and I know it would have helped me.
I am 100% sure of it. Plus it would have put a little conflict in there as well and conflict is way better than withdrawl..imo

Good Luck
Jeff