As a lawyer speaking...she is a feather in your cap as far as any custody dispute goes. I'd definitely put her on your witness list (if you have to present one). This is especially true seeing that YOU are estranged from your family. One of the "best interests of the children" factors includes extended family. By visiting ggma you are indicating that it is important to you to maintain relationships with extended family, albeit WW's extended family and that they are willing to accept you into their homes.

This is the most likely one big reason that WW and MIL were dead set against such visit happening in the first place as they are attempting to build a custody case against you. Good to see you being uncooperative.

Oh, to be a fly on the wall at ggma's next weekend. She ain't gonna buy it and WW is gonna be very upset. Watch for the blame shift...it's sooo gonna be YOUR fault ggma's mean to her. WW and MIL will likely try to take the route that THEY are no longer going to speak with ggma and it's all your fault for filling her head with lies.

Mr. Wondering

p.s.- OM gave your wife a lovenote at your rehearsal dinner?? What a loser!!! If you recover your marriage and get NC with OM, I'm betting things COULD be much better and different without that fool angling away at you behind your back. He's had an agenda and been emotionally entangled with your wife, marriage and family from day one. I personally would fight for every second of custody possible to protect my children from contact with this demon.

I've caught so many lies lately that it's not even funny. I even went back and read her affidavit from our first court appearance and she lied in it - said she only saw OM one day last year but I have proof she saw him twice.

On your comments about OM - I agree that he has let himself entangled but at the same time WW has played a role in that herself. She is just as emotionally entangled with him and I have her journal entries showing this. I believe this is exactly why she never lets me read her journals - she wants to keep secrets, not have privacy.

OH, E...I'm so glad that things went so well for you!

That's awesome...how great did it feel to have her on your side? WOW!

I have to say that I don't think very highly of your WW and wonder what your W is like...b/c it seems to me that she has been W from the beginning...

You are doing SUCH a wonderful job! You are amazing!

I just hope I don't get hit with the "blood is thinker than water" concept here.

S4B - yes as much as I hate it and don't want to admit it, W has been WW for 10 years - yep even before we were married. I was stupid then, called off our engagement for about 4 months, then we were back on when she supposedly decided that I was the right one. They had some contact through her senior year of college when we were living together, then the whole rehearsal dinner thing. I just wanted to stay blind to it in hopes that it would go away - a lot of good that did me.

Anyway, I wanted to post some info about how I am trying to deal with my kids that I posted on another thread so maybe I can get some advice.

I took an opportunity to explain to DS6 in terms he could understand what was going on. As far as I know, WW only tells them that we (her and I) and having "Mommy and Daddy problems." Well that's fine but I thought he needed more truth than that (I am on a truth kick here lately).

This summer he had asked me about my wedding ring, and I explained that it is something that Mommy gave to me, it meant that she would love me forever, and I always wore it to remind me of that. I also told him that I gave Mommy a ring that meant I would love her forever and she wore it to remind her of that. Then, so innocently, he asked when he could get a ring and I just said maybe one day someone will give you one.

Well Saturday he asked again why Mommy doesn't live with us anymore. I asked him if he remembered what we talked about with the ring - he said yes. So then I just said that Mommy doesn't love Daddy anymore and that is why she left, and she does not wear her ring any more, but that Daddy still loved Mommy and that is why I still wore mine. I told him that we would always both love him and that I would never leave him. He seemed to accept that.

I also have a book about divorce and the effect on kids- can't remember the title - but we will probably read that together soon.

So was that TMI for him? I am not sure how else to explain it to him.

That was beautiful.

I teared up reading it.

How fortunate your children have such a wise and loving father.

~ Marsh

Eph,

I have never posted to you before, but just had to jump in on your conversation with DS6.

I have DD6 and we had almost the exact, identical conversation! They are Extremely smart and very perceptive little creatures. I made a decision from the outset of my sitch that I will not lie to her about this.

It is a fine line to walk to be sure we give them what they need to properly answer their question, but not too much information.

I think (obviously) that you did a great job with him!

God Bless!

WOW, E!I feel your pain...that's a tough one...WH has been W since we were dating too...

Funny denial, I just kept hoping that he would mellow out as the years went by...

I wouldn't say that you were stupid by any means...don't kick yourself so hard! I have the same trouble...just naive...happens to the best of us!

Thanks Bugsmom and Marsh - I think WW would rather hide the truth or make up an alternate truth (like in the exchange we had last week about me not coming into her house and DD3 asking about that).

S4B - yes, Marsh said the same thing to me last week about calling myself stupid about her being wayward for so long. Wow, are we living a parallel life or something? So many (unfortunate) similarities in our situations. Ugh. Keep on strivin' <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Good job talking with the kids. I strongly believe in not lying to them. I know that my WW would rather not discuss it with them, hiding behind the "It's not age-appropriate" rationalization.

Went to dinner with the men in my SS class tonight and we had a short devotional on 2 Corinthians 1:3-5 (The Message):

All praise to the God and Father of our Master, Jesus the Messiah! Father of all mercy! God of all healing counsel! He comes alongside us when we go through hard times, and before you know it, he brings us alongside someone else who is going through hard times so that we can be there for that person just as God was there for us. We have plenty of hard times that come from following the Messiah, but no more so than the good times of his healing comfort—we get a full measure of that, too.

I just thought this was so appropriate to what goes on here at MB - those who have been through the hard times are coming along side those of us who are going through them now.

Thanks all of you!

On another subject:

I was going through old e-mails and found one WW sent to her psychiatrist back at the end of April where she said:
" I feel like I am at rock bottom. I am having trouble getting up and going in the mornings, I am depressed (big time), I am tired, I hate life and don’t know why I bother with anything, I don’t know why I am alive. I am emotional—angry, crying, irritated, and on and on."

I want to send this dr an e-mail and say:
"Dr - my WW sent this to you at the end of April and within 5 months she wants to D me. You diagnosed her bi-polar. What do you think is really going on? We have never talked about my WW because W never really allowed me to be a part of her treatment process. I would like some kind of explanation. WW told me you told her she has to take care of herself - so are you encouraging her too D me?"

I will also refer him to the quote in my signature <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

OK, I am so tired now. Must get sleep....

OK, just need to vent some tonight.

First of all, I had my annual review today. I busted my tail all last year (OK maybe until October when my WW decided to leave me and I became an emotion wreck for 3 months). Anyway, we had a LONG list of major accomplishments and such, and I get a stinking 6 rating (on a scale of 1- 10), and a pitiful raise. Well at least I did get a raise, but anyway I told my boss I could have gotten all that even by accomplishing HALF of what we did. There is no reward in busting your tail, almost like that is expected.

Then I go pick up the kids this afternoon and DS6 is getting sick AGAIN. Fever, tired,, gosh I hope he does not throw up tonight. WW was going to take him to the doctor but I told her I would do it since I am already going anyway for myself. Well at least that did not turn into an argument.

Then after the kids go to bed my mind starts racing with questions:

Why is this crap going on?
Why am I trying to save my M? Is it worth is?
Why did I do ____ in our marriage?
Why didn't I do _____ in our marriage?
Can I really make a difference?
Why is she doing this to our kids? She has gone through this herself.
If we D, what am I going to do about SF? I don't want to do the premarital thing again this time, to me it's absolutely one of the most beautiful things in a M and belongs only in a M.
What is she telling her psych? Does he know that OM sat in the car when she was in his office on 12/12?
Since she has been under his care, she has changed into a person I don't even know. How is that?
What does she think the words "until death do us part" mean?
Does she remember our vows to one another before Gos, our families, and friends? Well I remember what I said:

B, I commit my love to you
And willingly share my life with you.
I pledge myself to be your best friend,
and give myself to share your burdens and dreams.
I give myself to be your companion,
'til death do us part.

I really just want to scream at the top of my lungs - why? why? why?

There has been so little interaction this week with her. BIL is staying with her this week and he won't even talk to me. MIL and BIL are two freaking A supporters in my mind.

I hate this.

Oh, and I am preparing to mount up another run at exposure, but I am going to do it right this time. My early attempt was too feeble.

Sorry about not getting a big raise. They say you should list your accomplishments (sounds like you did that), and then ask your boss for another eval in 6 months.

Also, did you ask how you can improve?

You are right...we were in the same place today...same questions, exactly. I wish I knew the answers...for both of us. We can both keep praying for divine inspiration to give us those answers.

God Bless, and good night.

LilSis

(((((((((E)))))))))

What a day for OUCHS, huh?

Try to keep centered...I know you are venting by don't allow yourself to spiral...it's not good for you and certainly not the kids...

Do you really think that exposure will help? E, she has been this way you're entire M...

I understand that God doesn't like D but consider this please...YOU are God's Child, and how your WW is treating you is how she is treating GOd...DO you really think that he wants you to be treated in this manner?

I'm not saying get a D...please don't misunderstand me...I'm asking you to look at the cold hard facts and ask E what does "E" really want...

Do you really want a WW who has been cheating on you all these years? DO you really feel that exposure will make any difference? Do you think Plan B will do you justice?

What is best FOR YOU and those kids?

Take three days...to think...just like Good Friday and Easter Sunday...LOL..you're probably better at the story behind it...three days...

I was listening to someone share at a meeting the other night and they talked about 3 days and how the problem is usually solved in that time...

I'm supporting you all the way...no 2X4's, no kicking...just a true friend who is concerned for you and your family...the choice is yours...

I wish you a blessed night and three days of peace with God's help! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I would let her shrink know about her 10+ year affair with OM if he does not already know. That might shed some light on things for him.

OK a new day is here.

Thanks everyone for your words. WW has the kids this weekend, and our church is doing a big outreach thing on Saturday that I will be a part of, otherwise I will have some time to myself to think things through.

DS6 has a virus so that will be fun to deal with one more day - then WW gets to have fun with it. Dr. also increased my ADs since I feel like the stress level has increased in the last week and I foresee it maybe getting worse as we start to move into mediation.

WW barely spoke to me when I dropped the kids off. She basically cracks the door open to let the kids in, says maybe a few words, then closes the door. When I dropped off DS6 after the Dr. visit, I was waving at and talking to DD3 and she shut the door on me.

I'm sorry, but that it just petty.

Much to think through...

A friend at work sent me this e-mail today - again God's timing is perfect.

Sounds like a great message!

take some time I say...LOL!

Need some assistance in replying to my WW's little letter she wrote to me last week. This is what I have:


As I mentioned she wanted me to sign hers but I am not going to. And while I would rather respond verbally and talk it out like adults, I probably need to document it and this would be the best way.

Any tips or changes?

problem solved. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Thanks fiatflux - I completely missed that.