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and I found an ear in my potato Now THATS insane!
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and I found an ear in my potato Now THATS insane! she is a freaking fanatic!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Its Mimi's fault. She told me about the flashlight thingie.
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MrWondering: That why people who had have Personality disorders are not consider “insane”. But They do the same thing over and over again and are expecting different results. Making the same mistakes over and over again. This hold true more so with people who are NDP (Narcissistic Personality Disorder). What is a Personality Disorder:
Personality traits are enduring patterns of perceiving, relating to and thinking about one's environment and oneself that are exhibited in a wide range of social and personal contexts. Only when personality traits are inflexible, maladaptive and cause significant functional impairment or subjective distress are they considered personality disorders. The essential feature of a personality disorder is a continuing pattern of inner experience and behavior that deviates noticeably from the expectations of the individual's culture and is manifested in at least two of the following areas: cognition/thinking, affectivity/interpersonal functioning or impulse control.
This persistent pattern is inflexible and pervasive across a broad range of personal and social situations, and leads to clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational or other important areas of functioning. The pattern is stable and of long duration, which means its onset can be traced back to at least adolescence or early adulthood. This pattern is not better accounted for as a manifestation or consequence of another mental disorder and is not due to the direct physiological effects of a substance (such as drug abuse, medication, exposure to a toxin) or a general medical condition (such as head trauma). Being a student in these studies, I just wanted to put in my 2 cents!
ME:46
DS:15
DS:12
In a relationship w/NPD for 17 yrs.
ended:05/22/06: Thank you God!
Mark Twain: "As I got older, my father got smarter"
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Melody (edited to add...and SAG06) You added the word "mistake"...as in "making the same mistake over and over again expecting a different result". That's not the quote. Somtimes, er, many times, an non-insane person will do the same thing over and over again expecting a different result. It is called persistance...which most deem as an honorable characteristic. It could also describe faith. BTW, I KNOW you have absolutely NO desire to know this...but, my Col. Sanders argument presumed everybody knew a bit about his life story. Here is a short quote I googled up to summarize it (perhaps my example will make more sense) It is said of Col. Sanders that he went to over 900 individuals with his recipe of fried chicken. Time after time, day after day, his recipe was turned down. He could have given up easily after the fourth or fifth try. Yet he persisted and today we have Kentucky Fried Chicken! JO - you really oughta see an otolaryngologist real soon. Soon you'll likely be discovering LOL hippo's in them there ears. Mr. Wondering *thank you all again for partaking in this most magnanimous debate.
Last edited by MrWondering; 12/03/06 01:17 AM.
FBH(me)-51 FWW-49 (MrsWondering)
DD19 DS 22 Dday-2005-Recovered
"agree to disagree" = Used when one wants to reject the objective reality of the situation and hopefully replace it with their own.
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Sorry tried, long day. but hope you get my point...
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No problem. But that's what my family and I called my ex, Nuts! But let's not get into that and spoil the fun!LOL
ME:46
DS:15
DS:12
In a relationship w/NPD for 17 yrs.
ended:05/22/06: Thank you God!
Mark Twain: "As I got older, my father got smarter"
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Somtimes, er, many times, an non-insane person will do the same thing over and over again expecting a different result. It is called persistance...which most deem as an honorable characteristic. It could also describe faith. I don't call that "faith" or "honor," but stupidity, to use a failed method over and over again, expecting to WIN. Persistence is only a virtue if it makes sense and can produce a favorable outcome. It is not a virture if one fails time and time again, because they stubbornly and dogmatically use the same failed method and refuse to learn from their failures. If I try to enter a building via the side door and it is always locked, am I virtuous or faithful if I keep trying to get in the same locked door with no result? Am I showing "faith" by standing there for days attempting to get into the door when the front door was unlocked all along? Wouldn't it be more virtuous to change my tactic and go through the front door if my vision of success is to enter the building? One does not win by using a failed method over and over again, but by learning from their mistake and trying NEW methods. THAT is SMART persistence. If one is smart, they don't try a method that has failed, but a NEW method that will help them win. Otherwise, they........FAIL..AGAIN. Even though it doesn't specify mistake, it is implied in the point of the quote because the action produces NO result. It isn't meant to connote smart persistence, but insanity, after all, for trying a failed method over and over again.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Fanaticism is excessive zeal, defined by overenthusiasm. One doesn't have to have be enthusiastic or zealous to make the same mistake over and over again. They can just be foolish and senseless, and usually ARE. This is where you added the word "mistake" which we are not discussing however you still say they "CAN just be foolish and senseless, an usually ARE" but regardless they must be fanatical if they keep doing it EXPECTING a different result. The term EXPECTING means there IS a belief a differing result should or will happen. To many, that is foolishness, senselessness, ie: insanity. Whereas, fanaticism relates more to an excessive and irrational ZEAL in a specific belief. I just don't see how fanaticism fits, whereas, I can see how insanity, foolishness or senselessness does fit. Assuming the person is not actually insane and they continual do the same thing (not the same mistake...just the same "thing") over and over again....why would they keep doing it unless they "specifically believed" and "expected" a different result. If they KEEP doing it...again and again at some point it becomes fanatically irrational and yet they continue based upon such belief. At this point if they succeed, they are considered persistant. Down the line, at some point, doing the same thing over and over without success may eventually land a person at insane...just not "usually" enough to prove the definition. Mr. W
FBH(me)-51 FWW-49 (MrsWondering)
DD19 DS 22 Dday-2005-Recovered
"agree to disagree" = Used when one wants to reject the objective reality of the situation and hopefully replace it with their own.
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It is said of Col. Sanders that he went to over 900 individuals with his recipe of fried chicken. Time after time, day after day, his recipe was turned down. He could have given up easily after the fourth or fifth try. Yet he persisted and today we have Kentucky Fried Chicken! But did he go back to the SAME PERSON who turned down his recipe over and over and over again? Or did he do something DIFFERENT? Did he go to DIFFERENT PEOPLE until his recipe was accepted? Because I suspect it was the latter, and if so, then this analogy doesn't work. The quote is about doing the SAME THING and failing over and over again. Not about doing something DIFFERENT. And I bet Col. Sanders did not continually go back over and over again to the same person who rejected him but to new people. I bet if he just went back to the same guy who rejected hom over and over again, there would be no KFC chain across this nation. In all areas of my life, if one method FAILS to achieve my goal, I try a NEW METHOD to win. I DON'T try the same thing over and over and over again that gave me a LOSING RESULT, rather, I learn from my failures, refine my method and do a DIFFERENT THING in order to win. That is how winners win. It doesn't mean we aren't persistent, only that we do not reuse failed methods over and over again. We do something DIFFERENT. Let me give you another analogy, because this quote is WIDELY USED in Alcoholics Anonymous. Alcoholics believe that if they just try a little harder they can control their drinking. But it never works. Drinking NEVER WORKS for them but they try it over and over and over again, telling themselves it will be "different" this time. But, it never is and never will be. So, in order for them to be successful, they have to try something completely different.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Ya'll are funny...you crack me up....So glad mr. and mrs. are happy....i wish I cud say the same....
God Bless
A
"If God brings you to it, He will get you through it."
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Insanity: participating in a circular debate about the definition of insanity! **snort** <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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All this talk - I think wil will ask ww to made chicken and potates for dinner tonight. BTW: you are all off a little. How do I know? I have read now over 200 hours on this board and your names are on a LOT of the posts. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> M2L
M2L
ME BH 36 - FWW 33
2 kids
DDAY May 06
Sometimes waywards can be like Laxatives ..... They irritate the crap out of you.
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uncritical monomania is my take on that. I agree "insanity" is not quite correct AND that it's slower than snot running up hill on here lately.
MB Alumni
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O
M
G
Mr. Wondering's new sig line:
[color:"blue"]"The definition of fanatic is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result" - Wayne Campbell and/or Wayne Newton
Also, OWL crochets."[/color]
LOL!
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**snort** <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> he is such a dweeb! lol
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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"Wayne Newton"? And who the bloody h3ll is "OWL crochets"?
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It is said of Col. Sanders that he went to over 900 individuals with his recipe of fried chicken. Time after time, day after day, his recipe was turned down. He could have given up easily after the fourth or fifth try. Yet he persisted and today we have Kentucky Fried Chicken! But did he go back to the SAME PERSON who turned down his recipe over and over and over again? Or did he do something DIFFERENT? Did he go to DIFFERENT PEOPLE until his recipe was accepted? Because I suspect it was the latter, and if so, then this analogy doesn't work. The quote is about doing the SAME THING and failing over and over again. Not about doing something DIFFERENT. And I bet Col. Sanders did not continually go back over and over again to the same person who rejected him but to new people. I bet if he just went back to the same guy who rejected hom over and over again, there would be no KFC chain across this nation. In all areas of my life, if one method FAILS to achieve my goal, I try a NEW METHOD to win. I DON'T try the same thing over and over and over again that gave me a LOSING RESULT, rather, I learn from my failures, refine my method and do a DIFFERENT THING in order to win. That is how winners win. It doesn't mean we aren't persistent, only that we do not reuse failed methods over and over again. We do something DIFFERENT. Let me give you another analogy, because this quote is WIDELY USED in Alcoholics Anonymous. Alcoholics believe that if they just try a little harder they can control their drinking. But it never works. Drinking NEVER WORKS for them but they try it over and over and over again, telling themselves it will be "different" this time. But, it never is and never will be. So, in order for them to be successful, they have to try something completely different. Again...Melody, you've added a concept. You added the concept of "exact" as in "The definition of Insanity is doing the exact same thing over and over expecting a different result". Sure "same" implies precision but even your girl trying to open the door example would be insane not to attempt 3 or 4 differing ways to actually opening the door (however, she could be insane IF she only tries to do it repeated with her laser vision saw). Your alcoholic that receives this quoted advice is, in your convenient example doing the same thing and failing to curb his alcohol addiction...but it's not very often the "exact" same thing. He/she might try to go cold turkey five times, then only drink on the weekends, then only on special occasions, then attend AA for a month, etc. but the quote is still used to deliver the same message...inaccurately. (again, I have no beef with the message...it's poignant, but it's funniness does make it accurate) If Col. Sanders were on a message board in the 1950's after going to 400 restuarants without success the quote would likely again show up (assuming Al Gore had invented the internet by then) telling him to give up or alter his retirement plans. I'm certain he tweaked his sales pitch from time to time also...but he was still in essence doing the "same thing". The BS's we ourselves zealously post the inaccurate quote to are themselves NOT doing the EXACT same thing. We just know they are doing various wrong things over and over. The use of this quote, inaccurately, is NOT limited to situations where the listener did the EXACT same thing over and over again. Maybe this illustration will work Enthusiasm -----1-----fanaticism ------3---2-----insanity From 1 to 2 is doing the same thing over and over EXPECTING (i.e. - believing) they will achieve a different result From 3 to "insanity" - is foolishness From 3 to 2, is the area of utter foolishness or genius...(Edison,Col. Sanders, etc) For 2 to insanity - is utter foolishness with no cognizant expectation or "belief" in any differing result Thus the quote perhaps carves out a little area within fanaticism (btwn 2 and 3)...but it fails to accurately DEFINE the action because there is a whole lot between 1 and 3 it leaves out. Here's some quotes: Overcoming Failure: Thomas Edison Quotes - "I am not discouraged, because every wrong attempt discarded is another step forward." Friendship: Thomas Edison Quotes - "I have friends in overalls whose friendship I would not swap for the favor of the kings of the world." Funny: Thomas Edison Quotes - "I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work." Overcoming Failure: Thomas Edison Quotes - "Many of life's failures are men who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up." Perseverance, Persistence: Thomas Edison Quotes - "Nearly every man who develops an idea works at it up to the point where it looks impossible, and then gets discouraged. That's not the place to become discouraged." Funny: Thomas Edison Quotes "Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work." Very Respectfully, Mr. Wondering p.s. the "OWL crochets" thing is a running comment on the poster OWL. It's the ever so cute recreational activity he and his wife took up together in recovery that I thought needed emphasis.
FBH(me)-51 FWW-49 (MrsWondering)
DD19 DS 22 Dday-2005-Recovered
"agree to disagree" = Used when one wants to reject the objective reality of the situation and hopefully replace it with their own.
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Again...Melody, you've added a concept. You added the concept of "exact" as in "The definition of Insanity is doing the exact same thing over and over expecting a different result". Sure "same" implies precision but even your girl trying to open the door example would be insane not to attempt 3 or 4 differing ways to actually opening the door (however, she could be insane IF she only tries to do it repeated with her laser vision saw). No, I haven't added a concept at all. Doing the SAME THING means very simply: doing the SAME THING. That is the CRUX and point of the quote. It doesn't mean trying NEW things, it means doing the SAME THING. So no, that is not an added concept, that is the POINT, and was all along. However, I have spent much more time on this subject than is warranted and will simply leave it at that. This isn't a biggy on my radar and I have no interest in splitting hairs endlessly about the definition of "insanity" versus "fanaticism" especially when I could do something more productive, like clean the lint out of my belly button. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> Enjoyed the discussion, MrW; take care. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Cool...I win
Mr. W - <snicker>
FBH(me)-51 FWW-49 (MrsWondering)
DD19 DS 22 Dday-2005-Recovered
"agree to disagree" = Used when one wants to reject the objective reality of the situation and hopefully replace it with their own.
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