Good point Owl. Maybe Myspace would be a good place to blog for you- I am sure you'll find a lot more people sympathetic to your plight.

Obviously I was wrong Techie. The mob is out to get you here.

techie,

It is time to break through all of the BS that has been going on here. I am no fortune teller, but I can tell you this; Your marriage is going to fail and you are going to end up divorced. The writing is on the wall, you just refuse to read it.

With that being said, right now the most important thing to work on is yourself and your boys. Regardless of your soon to be failed marriage, those kids still need you. And don't get me wrong here, I HATE infidelity. I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy. But the path you are taking is a destuctive one.

And by your posts here, it doesn't seem you are really interested in changing your stance. Ohter posters hit the nail on the head when they talk about telling SH the WHOLE story. And they are right to conclude that you are just trying to skew the outcome of what he says to your benefit. Fact is, most people HATE the truth, so they lock themselves into their own little fantasy worlds (much like WS's do) Take a good hard look in the mirror and think about how YOU can become a better person. And I am not saying this just applies to you. I had to do it as well as many other people who are on these boards. It sucks to realize that you are part of why all this happened. And unless you this opportunity to change yourself, you will find yourself in a similare situation down the road. You can't fix your wife, just yourself. You need to do that for you and your boys.

Techie, your marriage will fail, and for that I am truly sorry. Use this time to grow, for yourself and your children. I wish you the best.

Good! I wasn't one of the 3 "go awayers"! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Sorry techie. Bear with my sarcasm. It comes from personal experiences/lessons that are similar in many ways 2 your current ones.


noodle is a smart cookie. techie has a lot 2 learn, still. Remember, what you think you WANT may not be the same as what you NEED.


I think more people know the difference between marriage coaching and counseling than you are able 2 acknowledge. Possibly why you're butting heads so much, rather than truly constructively moving forward.

"What you resist, persists."

I suspect that SH appears 2 be doing a "play by play" approach with you, rather than laying out an end 2 end plan because it's 2 early 2 formulate an end 2 end plan - you're far from starting recovery at this point. He needs you AND your W participating willingly before that can start. It's a delicate time in marriage coaching - where the coach prepares 2 entice the WS 2 participate in the coaching process. Notice I didn't say persuade. That won't work, particularly when spouses are doing things 2 spite one another (like separating or having affairs).


I doubt very much that this is what noodle hoped 2 evoke in the way of a response from you. Noodle can correct me if I'm wrong. But this is just another example of you seeking what you think you want, rather than the 2ls you need 2 move forward constructively. Journaling here is fine, but only if it's combined with receptivity 2 new ideas. The old ones aren't serving you particularly well in achieving your perceived goals after all, are they?


I did this for YEARS, and it won't get you a recovered marriage, in any way, shape or form. Forget about what your wife is thinking. You will be wrong anyway.

Remember this definition of "assume?": Assume only makes an a$$ out of "u" and "me".

I finally came 2 the realization that, when I find myself making assumptions of what's going on in my W's head, the first one I should make is that my assumptions are wrong. Because they were. Every damned time.

Since you are separated, you should be focusing your attentions inward. Figuring yourself out. What about YOU is unattractive enough 2 your W that she would make the choice 2 be away from you? That's not a "blame" 2uestion, either. If your W is having an A, that's her own poor choice and none of your responsibility.


It's time for you 2 face a harsh reality, like most of us have had 2 do at one time or another in order 2 move forward 2ward real recovery: You don't have a marriage, except perhaps on paper. The goal isn't 2 force a repair but 2 determine if the 2 of you want 2 build a new marriage out of the wreckage.



I submit 2 you that you will come 2 the realization at some point - probably a year or 2 from now (like I did) - that you're wasting your money because you're trying 2 unilaterally fix your marriage.

Maybe then you'll be able 2 focus your energies where they can do some personal good.

-ol' 2long

I'm sorry you feel that way, Owl. For my part, I very much appreciate the feedback and advice that you, noodle, healingbird, and some others have given me.

I just dont appreciate "advice" from some, that i should go along with what some group of forum posters think is best for my marriage, and that if I dont toe their line, I somehow should be electronically roughed up some more, until I either "do it their way", or I leave the forums here.

They are not trying to "help me": I have them on ignore, so their only purpose in any further continued posting on my threads, is solely to harrass me.

Oh, I have. majorly. Apart from that one evening of "angry outburst", I think I have almost completely avoided DJs, AOs, SDs towards my wife, for 4 months straight.
It's a work in progress, to be sure... I've occasionally slipped on here, and tried to correct myself when noticed, or when pointed out by others.


All that being said... yes, I am very well aware that the odds are probably 95% that my wife wont change her mind, and the divorce will go through.

I had fun with my children yesterday. We got to go bowling, and it was hilarious to see them lug the balls down the alley. One of them liked to do a "shot-putt" type move... but I convince him after a few times, that that wasnt the best thing to do <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

How can they harrass techie, if he's ignoring them? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

more like they'll carry on conversations without him on his own threads.

I haven't put anyone on ignore in all my years here, pretty much for that very reason. I can ignore harrassment without using a button 2 help me do so.

Oh well, investment has now outpaced re2rn.

Bye!

-ol' 2long

techie,

That is great that you got to spend some time and have fun with your children. After all, they are what it is all really about. Focus on doing those types of things over the next few months. They will need you more than ever for the forseeable future.

One thing about making changes in yourself. Force yourself to make the positive changes in you permanent. You may have to 'fake it 'til you make it', but after awhile the changes just become part of who you are naturally. And take some time to reflect on your life and marriage. Try and detach yourself a bit and try to look at it from an outsiders POV. Most likely you will start to see through all the BS that your life has become over the last few months, and it may bring you some internal peace. When I finally did this, I realized "hey, I am really not the monster my WW is trying to make me out to be". This really helps me to put things into perspective when I am listening to the fog speak. I can even laugh a little (inside) when she says some of the things she does.

Good luck to you friend.

Geesh, 3 kids. I have one and he is a handful. I couldn't imagine 3.

"Force yourself to make the positive changes in you permanent. "

yup, yup. I completely understand and have internalized, that this is the best way to treat someone I love. There's no going back for me, in that reguard.

Thanks for the good words.

techie -

One of the posters I believe you have an ignore wrote this:


I can tell you that out of everything I did (right, wrong or indifferent) during the height of my wife's affair and shortly after her return from her 2nd trip to see OM, one thing was mentioned by her on several occasions.

She told me that the single most important thing I did was praying for her, over her and with her ever day (often twice a day together). That single act, repeated many, many times, had more positive impact on my wife than anything else I tried.

It's easy to lose sight of God in the mess and chaos of our daily lives, especially when we're battling infidelity and trying to save our marriages.

I bet you know what happens when we take our eyes of God. We sink like a rock, just like Peter.

Even if you're wife won't pray with you, you can still pray for her (and if you are already doing this, good job). See if on those times you're together you can do devotions or pray together, or if she'll at least let you lead the two of you in prayer.

Never, ever, underestimate the power of prayer. Just realize that the answers to your prayers, whatever they are, will come in God's timing and according to His plan.

Thank you for the reminder.

I think I am walking the path that He wants... but I pray that he make the journey shorter for me.

I pray for my wife, and my family, every day.

techie -


Don't we all (pray for a shorter journey) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> However, something I realized is that the journey for me will be however long it needs to be to get me to whatever point the Lord is taking me to. But I also know He'll be right there with me on every step of the path.

It is vital to seek God's will and direction in all matters; I would advise you to do the same thing that others advised me to do, however. Bounce what you believe God is telling you to do or not to do against both Scripture and wise Christian counsel. This is not a judgement of what you are or aren't doing - simply a suggestion to help you in seeking God's will.


Don't forget to pray for yourself too <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Ask God to give you strength, endurance, wisdom, and to make you over into the man He wants you to be, and the husband He wants you to be and your wife deserves.

I highly recommend picking up a copy of Stormy O'Martian's "Power of a Praying Husband". It's a fairly short book and immensely powerful. I read it in almost a single sitting.

Hi techie -

One more thing. For a really good look at the roles of both husbands and wives, take a look at Mortarman's thread on Husband's and Wives Roles.

It'll give you a very solid idea of exactly what the role of the husband is in a Christian marriage.

I continue to pray for you and family, Techie.

Jo

Very nice.
I already understand about the 3 roles of a husband to a wife, but Mortarman gives some really nice examples, and fleshes it out well.


PS: Thank you, Jo.

Hi Techie,

I'm trying to wade through and catch up on this thread, so forgive me if I ask something that has already been asked and answered.


You said:



Could you please clarify for me what this plan is at this particular stage in the game...plan A?

I'd like to know specifically what your plan A involves...what issues within yourself are you currently addressing?

hiya froz... to update you... yup, Steve has consistently told me, basically, "plan A", even after she served me with divorce papers. Most recently, he wanted me to try to engage her in conversation about MB principles... hence this thread.

More news in a few minutes... I'll be working on a longer post during the next 5 mins or so <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

jumbo update from me. This is one of my typical "blog" type entries. I'm not really asking for advice on "what to do next". I know what I'm going to do next.

I had the children on "my time", for a long 5 day stretch between Christmas and yesterday, because she wants them during easter break for 5 days. My mom came down for the first few days. It was nice to get to spend time with my side of our family and children.

I had earlier invited my W to come with me and our children for a 2-night trip down to san diego, with 2 rooms booked, thurs/fri night. She initially declined, but then changed her mind and said she would come.

I wanted to keep those days stress-free, so attempted to talk to her about "what a good marriage looks like" before then. But it didnt happen, and she suggested "maybe we can talk on the trip" instead.

We ended up having a pretty good time with our children during the day, and then having some serious talks during the two evenings before going to sleep. Steve suggested i invite her to the marriage builders weekend at the end of january. I said to her that I didnt expect her to accept, but Steve told me to invite her, so I did.
She surprised me by not just declining; said she'd need time to think about it, or something like that. Threw off my whole train of conversation <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> so that night's conversation was not at all as constructive as I would have liked. Not bad, per se. just kind of generic "clear the air" stuff, rather than specific constructive talk. The second night was only a little better: the most important issues finally came out at the very end, as usual, when we didnt have any remaining time left to talk.
Some important things did come up, though; we both acknowleged some things; i re-acknowleged that I had treated her badly in the past, and she admitted one or two things that she had done that werent so great.

She brought up again that she had tried so hard for the first years of her marriage, and was tired of trying. I acknowleged that she did put in a tremendous amount of effort then.

miscellaneous other stuff happened... some bad, some surprisingly good.. but not neccessarily lasting good.

Among other things, I commented that she kept saying to our children that we "will always be a family", but i've been excluded from all "family" events that are larger than the 5 of us. To me, that pretty much says we are NOT 'always a family'. She said she'd "see what she could do."

I talked to her briefly online last night, and said i hoped to see our family today. She replied that she was "still working on it", and would let me know.
I was wondering just how long it should take, to get "permission" for her husband to come to a family event...

... but she surprised me this morning, by calling me, and telling me that she had arranged it with everyone, so that I could drop by and say hi to folks for a little while this afternoon. (she has previously said that THEY have claimed being uncomfortable around me. hence why she had to "check with everyone" first. )

This is the first time I will be invited to a "larger family event". Stated purpose by her: "to show that we can peacibly coexist".

[/quote]

I asked her during the trip, to consider giving us more time to work things out between us, by talking to her lawyer on tuesday, and putting the divorce process on hold, so that I dont have to file my response by the 10th of Jan. (I read somewhere that this is possible, but I aint no lawyer)

The concept being that I dont think I can do reconciliation talks, and divorce settlement arguing, at the same time. Which I feel is true.

I truely hope that she does so on tuesday, and continues our talks with me. I think there is some room to negotiate some kind of marriage basis between us, but it will take time to detail out the finer points of it. If she chooses to postpone the nasty stuff to give us peaceful talk time, then it would be a large sign that she is sincere about being open to reconciliation, rather than potentially just stringing me along to maybe get better settlement terms.
"Actions speak louder than words", as they say.

Today's family gathering will be/is a very nice action, and I appreciate it as a large improvement over our existing conditions. To use her own words, though, it is to demonstrate "peacable coexistance". It saddens me that she specifically couched it terms that do not include reconciliation.
If she choses not to pause the legal train, then that chosen non-action by her, would "speak" to me, that she's just trying to keep me dumb-n-happy until settlement time. I'm trying to brace myself for that possibility.

Based on how our talks went during those evenings, I do believe that she cares for me, at some level. The question is, does she care enough to discuss possibilities for our marriage relationship, with an honest and willing heart, or is she going to keep the divorce train rolling on whatever schedule she might have previously planned out?

Guess I'll find out tuesday.
s'going to be a tough 3 days for me.

I pray that Our Father sustain me during these days, and bring our family to the first step on the road to recovery.

Stay strong, and hopin' she's not just stringin' you along!

Best wishes for a happy New Year. May it be better than '06.

Thank you very much <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />