First let me say how grateful I am to find this website. You guys have done an awesome job in putting out so much information about marriages. The time and effort put into sharing your thoughts and advice with others is purely amazing.

Now for my situation.

My wife and I have been married for 10 years. We have a 9 year old son and a 1 year old baby girl.

I had an affair about a month ago with an administrative assistant at my office. It developed slowly, over years until it reached a breaking point and we became intimate.

I immediately told my wife, the very next day. She took it hard but the marriage survived. I apologised profusely and insisted there would be no more contact with the OW. Going as far as to tell the OW's mother about the situation and to keep her daughter away from the office.

A week later, more trouble brewed. The OW persisted in making contact, saying she was suicidal and such. I caved in and we met. Sure enough, we became intimate again.

Being the transparent person that I am, my wife immediately found out. She was destroyed.

I could not convince her that I would stop seeing the OW this time, having just failed to do so a week ago. Stupidly, I asked if she would suffer the affair until it ran it's course as I was very committed to our marriage and our family. She agreed.

Two days later, she goes ballistic and says that the pain is too great and she cannot live with the affair. She too played the suicide card. I caved. Told the OW it was over and that I would stay with my wife. The OW went ballistic and promised to marry me and go the distance to keep the relationship going.

Foolishly again I went back to my wife with another indecent proposal. Telling her that I tried and failed to call off the affair and if she would be willing instead to live together as room mates until we could afford to be separated. As is, our lives and finances are very much intertwined, making it difficult for a clean break. She agreed.

A day or two after that, my wife says she too is having an affair with a guy called Tony, someone I did not knew. At first I did not beleive her but sure enough the tell tale signs began to appear. Private phone calls, locked phone so that I could not see her text messages, etc..

A week later, purely by accident, I came across voice recordings on our business phone of conversations between her and the OM. We record all phone conversations for Quality Control purposes. He happened to have his cell phone off and she called him on the office phone out of desperation. To my surprise, it was not a stranger but a friend of mine from the office.

I felt doubly betrayed. Hurt and Angry. The very pain I had caused my wife was now my own. It was too much. Immediately I called the OM and he confessed. Followed by my wife, who also confirmed the fact. Saying that at first it was just out of revenge but feelings have since developed. This broke me even more.

She then moved out of the house to live with her mother where she currently is.

We both agreed to do counselling and have been to about three sessions thus far.

The very first advice the counsellor gave was to end the affairs if we had any intentions of saving the marriange.

We both agreed.

I have now made 9 painful days without responding to the OW. She has attempted to contact me via text message every day. None of which I respond to.

Unfortunately my wife has not been as succesful. I confronted the OM and he confessed that she had been communicating with him after the therapy.

She says she no longer loves me and that without love, she cannot find her self back in the marriage. At this, I began to act desperate. Begging for her to take me back and to give us one more chance.

Classic mistake.

I have since listened to "Light Her Fire" and read many "How to save your marriage" advisories on the internet.

Following their advice I started a more strategic Plan A of support and making deposits in her Love Bank.

This has been going on for say about 5 days. (Too short to expect results judging from the hundreds of posts I have just read on this forum)

Naive though I was and filled with yuletide season in my heart I expected her to warm up to me.

The disaster came when on Christmas Day, at midnight mass in the church where we sat together with our baby girl. She pushed me away...saying that she did not feel comfortable with me being close to her. I was completely destroyed and moved to a distant pew. Fuming.

At the end of the mass, I carried her home along with her mother and grand mother who accompanied us to the church. Took back the gifts I had brought for her and sped off in a rage. The therapy and internet advice came back to me while driving and I reconsidered my hasty actions. Turned the car around and returned to her. Opened the presents, amongst them her wedding ring.

She refused to put it on. I said we are still married even though separated and saw no reason why she would not accept the ring. We were not divorced yet and are currently in therapy. She still refused and insisted that I leave. Seeing this as a signal that she did not want to save the marriage, I got incredibly inflamed and did the unthinkable. I snatched our baby girl from her arms and ran to the car, with her mother in hot pursuit.

Her mother, surprisingly swift for an aged woman, caught me by the car and prevent me from closing the door. Giving my wife's father enough time to come out and retrieve the baby girl. I was devastated at what I had done. In a single moment of insanity, my chances at saving our marriage may have been completely blown away.

Drove off in a suicidal mode. Crying and bawling all the way to the nearest hotel, which is where I have been staying for the last couple of days. No contact with anyone, not answering the phone, etc... Contemplated killing myself by jumping off high points but couldn't gather enough courage to jump. Got a knife to slit my wrists but couldn't make the cut. It takes a braver man than I to do the act of taking one's own life. Now I am left with living this nightmare.

This entire affair situation has been precisely that, a nightmare. Even when it was just my infidelity alone. Now with hers, it is doubly scary and grim. The worst case scenario.

Am I totally screwed?

Is there any chance of recovering from this catastrophic act? I don't think my wife will ever trust me around her and the child again.

Would attempting to continue a Plan A even make sense now?

Is there any hopes of saving this marriage?

I do love my wife and am willing to go the distance.

Thanks for hearing my situation.

I suggest you read as much as you can on this site. Start with the Infidelity FAQ's and Pep's Plan A linked below in my signature.

Then, I suggest you telephone Steve Harley - follow the counselling links on this site. Make an appointment.

Welcome to Marriage Builders

Thanks for the quick response.

By the infidelity FAQs do you mean these?:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5059_qa.html

I would love to telephone Steve but I am outside of the united states so it won't be toll free for me. Coupled with the fact that I've just about spent all of my disposable income over the last three weeks (thanks to OW and wife)

The internet and local counsellors are the only weapons I currently have in my arsenal.

Going to check out Pep's Plan A.

So you don't think she would be so bitter at this point that a Plan A will just provide a comfort zone for her to maintain her relationship with the OM? Having her cake and eating it too.

Plan A has a carrot AND a stick. And yes - that is the right FAQ.

Thanks again but after reading Pep's Plan A I find it incredibly difficult to expect a positve response, having committed the very crime myself only a few weeks prior.

This is a pure case of a revenge affair, remember.

As a result, parts of the "Stick" will land squarely on my shoulders as well.

For example:
Not accepting blame for the infidel's choice to become adulterous.

Let the consequences of adultery and infidelity fall freely upon the heads of the adulterous.

I am guilty of these just as much as she is. That pain is still festering within her just as it is now freshly introduced to me.

Is there any examples of couples that went through a revenge affair situation and what steps they took to save the marriage?

Or is my situation unique. I hope not.

Appreciate any help you can offer.

Are you ready for the hard truth?

You both lack the maturity at this point to save your marriage.

That being said, maturity can come through hardship and experience like this. Some examples of what not to do - read Papa3 - while not a wayward husband, the maturity factor to do the right things and say the right things and to keep his mouth shut the rest of the time was beyond him. He went against the advice freely given here so many times.

You are a wayward husband and while your wife is also cheating, you must take full, 100% responsibility for your behavior and betrayal of your marriage.

You must demonstrate full action to save your marriage - that means no more working at the same company with the manipulative OW who yanks your chain every chance she can. That means not trying to get your wife calmed down, but to demonstrate that YOU are calmed down. Go about meeting all 10 emotional needs, since you don't know which ones are most important - do ALL of them - except SF which right now is not safe for either of you until you've both been tested.

If she resists, just quietly continue the domestic support, good father behavior and everything else you can. It will take weeks for you to demonstrate that you are a changed man.

For now, don't tell her about Harley - instead read the books and leave them laying around the house but don't ask her to read them. DON'T tell her about this web site for the time being.

To start off with: Your situation is NOT unique. There are a number of marriages that have recoverd from very similar circumstances. One very prominet poster here: LovingAnyway has recovered her marriage from very similar circumstances.

As your counselor has already pointed out, the first step is to end the affairs! BOTH of you must do this and must agree to NEVER EVER AGAIN have any contact with your former lovers. We refer to this as NC (no contact). This means for LIFE!

In this particular circumstance you may need to go to extraordinary efforts to achive this. One of the unfortunate consequences of a workplace A is that one HAS to leave. Usually both wind up leaving because things become "uncomfortable" for the one that remains. I have seen this play out many times through out the years.

I would HIGHLY recommend that you both find a new positions elsewhere. Even accidental contact is still contact and WILL hold everyone back.

Plan A is a relly good place to start. But I will tell you right now that the payoff well be MONTHS from now. There is no quick solution to these issues. You can not "hurry" yours or your W's healing. You CAN greatly lengthen it. Do you know what DJ's and LB's are yet? Have you figured yours out yet?

BTW: You can pretty much forget about having your EN's meet by your WW while she is still active in her affair. Realize this now and prepare for this. This will be a long term process of getting over HUGE hurts and restablising broken trusts! Again this is a long, sometimes years long, process.

If you haven't figured out the abbr. that we use here: the link is: http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...0&fpart=all

Keep posting back, we'll help you as best we can through the process.

Stay Strong!

Thanks for the support thus far.

I have achieved NC with my OW. She no longer works at the company and I am seldom there myself. Though I plan to return in full force as soon as my emotional strength has returned.

It is reassuring to hear that someone has recovered from a similar double infidelity situation.

I am going in search of her story right now.

I do know what Disrepectful Judgements and Love Busters are. The trick is in practicing avoiding them all the while being rejected.

Staying strong is my problem. Constantly revisiting this website and re-reading the material is my only hope to keep my strength up.

*****
Quick update, searched for LovingAnyways thread on her her marital issues but could not find it.

Could not PM her either.

Anyone could assist in finding me her success story?

thanks again.

Here, Here, but at least you seem intent on trying and that's a positive step. I was really bothered by your bringing your child into the middle of this and using her as a weapon against the other person, bad move for all three of you.
Read all you can here and try to maintain the high road. Your OW sounds like a psycho. Does the OM have a wife who you can inform about the A btwm him and your W?

You're in the right place if you can swallow the medicine.

V/r,
No way

Yes, that drama with the child was the saddest moment of my life.

I regret it so much.

My OW is a bit psycho yes. It has been an ordeal getting her to give me space. That has been a failure as I have countless voice messages and text messages from her. At this very moment she is calling my phone. I have maintained my end of the bargain though and have not answered nor replied to any.

Unfortunately, the OM is a lady killer. Just a young Rico Suave out to nail as many women as he can from my friends best account. He has a child but does not live with the mother.

Would it make sense to inform his child mother all the same? Maybe his parents?

I have all intentions of swallowing the medicine. My only hope is that I can find the strength to follow through. From all indication on this website, the process is going to be a LONG one!

Expose to EVERYONE that would be in a position to end the affair including the OM's parents and, since the person works with you, maybe to your/his boss. I'm sure if he were just out to bang women without caring about them, he would run like ****** if his job was threatened.

Call up Steve Harley and get a plan. He is so good with situations like this.

ophel,

Forget the OW and your WW's OM and every other acronym.

Work on the only person that you can change.....you.


You can start by accepting responsibility for everything , including your WW's A. I know that goes against our MB principles but there are exceptions to every rule.

YOUR MOTTO : Whatever it takes for as long as it takes

Ophel -

Welcome to MB. You're getting some really good advice here.


LA has been here quite a while, so her thread is probably buried. PMs are disabled on these forums because of the high incident of affairs starting on the internet. Most posters here, by personal choice, won't engage in e-mail conversations with members of the opposite sex either.

You can post a new topic asking for LovingAnyway, and she'll probably take a look at your thread when she gets a chance.

Ophel -


Change your number. NC is not just an agreement to have no contact with the OP for life - it requires extreme measures to maintain. Change numbers, change jobs, move, get restraining orders (if the OP won't go away), etc. WHATEVER it takes.

You are 100% responsible for your affair. Your wife is 100% responsible for hers. You are both 100% responsible for your individual contributions to your marriage that left it vulnerable to an affair.

You need to identify what it was within you that led you to choose to have an affair. Why, in a moment of weakness, did you choose to break your vows? Your wife has to do the same. You cannot do this for each other.

What you can do for each other, once the affairs are over and withdrawal is complete, is to make yourselves the best spouses and parents you can be.

Finally, unless your wife has a restraining order against you, get yourself back home. Working on a marriage is best done when you're together. DON'T use your children as pawns. Keep yourself together - come here to vent.

Read, study, and ask. You will get good advice here. It's up to you whether you use it or not.

Tell your cell phone company that you are receiving unwanted, harassing calls, and they may even waive the fee.

Even if not, the $30 or so is a small price to pay.

Your WW will not do any of these things herself, but you need to start showing her in every aspect of your life that you are being trustworthy. Whether she notices or not.

Thanks again for all the input.

First some good news.

I spoke to the OM today and he says she has not been in contact. That is INCREDIBLE news.

Maybe naive again, but I believe he is telling the truth.

This means my WS is actually holding up her end of the NC agreement. I am so excited.

The bad news,

Spoke to her today and she wants to migrate to another country, alone.

This sent me into another crying and bawling spell after I just spent the past three days recovering from the Christmas Night disaster.

PS..there appears to be no limit to how much a man can cry.

My phone is a company phone but I should be able to get the number changed. Great advice. Hadn't thought of taking it that far.

Healing bird,

Our therapist has gotten to the root of our infidelity.

In my case, it was sexual. My wife was not meeting some of my sexual needs and confided this to my OW, who was close to both of us. When the OW made it known to me that she would be able to meet these needs, the path to the affair began. I gave in to the temptation.

For my WS. It was two fold. Part of it was revenge, to hurt me as I did her. Secondly, it was to have her emotional needs met which I have been neglecting for most of our marriage. There was a bit of insecurity as well, since she felt inferior to the OW and needed reassurance that she was still an attractive and desirable woman. The OM gave her this feeling much moreso than I could.

Cymanca, I agree whole heartedly. My focus has to be on me. My inability to stay sane for a full 24 hours is evidence that there is much work to be done. Returning to my job and being able to function normally is priority one. Ditto for dealing with my kids. As is, I just want to cry when I hold them and think about the fact that they won't be there in the morning when we get ready for work nor to greet me when I return home in the evening.

Coming to terms with the situation and toughening up.

Still in a pretty sad state. Went to the movies to see Casino Royale after hearings the bad news about my WS wanting to migrate and could hardly focus on the show. I cried half of the time. Pathetic.

Maybe I should go on meds?

time to man-up for the children regardless of your wife right now..

how often are you seeing your nine year old..and the baby...

you need to seek legal counsel to see what rights you will have about her NOT moving the children out of state/country.

you MUST establish concrete calm interactions with your children..

you two adults caused this chaos...
don't punish the children for this..

also have you apologized to wife...and all family members present for x-mas eve

have you APOLOGIZED for your insane thinking that having your OW as part of a big old happy triangle was INSANITY and painful...

you got alot of apologizing for that one considering how unstable this OW of yours is....and you put your wife and children at risk from her hysterical chaos...

read up on plan A ...for you certainly can do the actions...

calm rational interactions
NO relationship talk
signs of hope
etc...

this is an emotional rollarcoaster....
expect your wife to waffle day to day minute by minute with her emotions...

don't react...

take her a coffee or small dessert...
go over and watch the kids after giving her a bottle of bubbblebath...

be very very very wary of your actions you are one step away from a restraining order from her...

ARK^^

"Infidelity does not kill marriages, the lying does"

Thats a good one ! My husband has been unfaithful, yet he lies so much what he did and did not do, I would forgive if i could get the truth out of him.......... does it exist? maybe not in him..........Life is short, lets get HAPPY soon. Im tired of being unhappy too.....I wish us all the best to figure out what plan we need to do..good luck.

~debbie [color:"blue"] [/color] <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Hey Ark,

I have seen the kids sparsely since the separation and not at all since the incident on Christmas night.

I don't think she intends to take the kids when she leaves the country. Being back home by her mother has given her a sort of freedom she never had since being married. That is like a new lease on life and it is hard for me to compete with that.

Option A) Stay with mom, the perfect baby sitter and be free to do as you please.

Option B) Return to hubby and have to slave after kids day in day out.

I'd go with Option A myself. lol

As for the incident, I have apologized to all present except her father. He does not talk much but as soon as I see him, I will do so. Apologized for the triangle idea. It was stupid. Apologies flow from me like water from the nile. Sorry is my middle name.

Now for an update that is pure insanity.

Today, a big surprise. My wife came up to see me.

I was blown away. She even wore the top I bought for her on Christmas. It was the wrong size but she wore it anyway.

My hopes were raised.

We had a good day, did some office work together and talked at length on many issues. Even laughing at some of the things that happened. Amazing!

Then in the evening my OW appeared. I was shocked. Totally breaching our NC aggreement. My greatest fear is that my wife would think she was accustomed to meeting me by the office and that my apparent shock was a farce put on for her benefit.

The OW herself was shocked to see my wife there and even moreso to see us being civil to each other. She left immediately.

The tension was in the air but we still tried to carry on as though nothing happened.

Fast forward a couple hours and the OW returns. This time, she approaches us and says..sorry for all the trouble I've caused, I've overdosed on some pills and I am going to die.

Seeing us together again was too much for her.

Well I followed some advice read on here about such things and called an ambulance immediately. Got her to the hospital and she is OK now.

While that hospital drama was going on, my wife remained at the office.

Who would walk in at the office then other than the OM. She says she did not interact with him individually but just spoke in a group setting. Drinking beers. My wife NEVER drinks beers with the boys.

Needless to say this totally ruined what started off as a very hopeful day.

My wife says she does not feel that the day was such a loss but seeing that we both broke our NC agreements in one fell swoop, I think it was a veritable disaster.

The clock has been reset once more.

Sigh.

Neither of the contacts were planned, and they sort of zeroed each other out. What better time to both review all the measures to establish a solid no contact platform, and discuss what will be done if contact is made. POJA...policy of joint agreement...building block of a healthy marriage. Start by being on the same team, plotting against the enemy...the OP's!

Best wishes,
SD