Thanks for the 2x4, miketc. Yes, my mother should have called him. It didn't even enter my mind. I don't know why other than the horses were always my responsiblity even when H and I were together. This horse was technically his but I took care of her with the rest of them.

I think I have to admit that I must have wanted to break Plan B. I argued with myself back and forth on whether it was a good enough reason to break Plan B. I guess if I had to argue with myself that much...it really wasn't necessary. In a true emergency, it wouldn't have been a question at all.

2x4 noted.

{{{FNH}}} Good luck at the parents night.

Thank you familycomesfirst. I AM going to stick with Plan B!!

I am going to repeat to myself...Plan B, Plan B, Plan B, Plan B, Plan B, Plan B,Plan B, Plan B, Plan B,Plan B, Plan B, Plan B.

Thank you for the encouragement.

Freshman orientation went pretty well. I got there really early and found a place to sit. I was fairly close to the front so I wasn't sure if WH would show up and just sit in the back. I would have if I was him.

But he didn't, he searched me out in the crowd and came down to sit by me. I was sitting in the aisle seat and would normally have scooted to the next sit so H could just sit down. He is 6'3" and has difficulty folding his legs up enough to be comfortable, so the aisle seat gives him more room. I'm 5'3" so it doesn't make a bit of difference to me. This time I didn't switch seats, I moved my legs a little so he could get past me.

I hadn't said anything to him at all and as he moved passed me he said "what, did you think I would be late?". Which he was by about 10 minutes but the meeting hadn't started yet. I said "no, I thought you might sit in the back." To which he replied "nope, I'm here". We didn't speak at all although WH seemed fairly relaxed and may have if I made the effort. But I didn't.

As the meeting ended I stood and gathered my stuff. WH handed me an envelope and asked me to give it to DD12. I took it from him and said I would. WH was still sitting down...I'm not real sure what he was doing but he was kind of looking down and messing with the papers they gave us. I turned away and left. Just left, didn't say bye, just left. He probably thinks I was mad, although I didn't act like other than leaving without speaking to him or waiting for him to walk out with me.

Gave DD12 the envelope when I got home. It was $10 for lunch money. It's some kind of effort, I guess.

Good job. If there is trouble in paradise, he can't get his fix from you. I know it's hard, but you did right.

I think since he felt free to sit next to you and "chat" you should remind him of Plan B.

Maybe a short e-mail that says "please read my letter again, this includes school meetings. I do not wish to speak to you, see you, or communicate with you until OW is gone."

I need to respecfully disagree with you, Lexxxy. There was no chatting, he spoke two sentences in an hour. I was not friendly toward him and immediately left as soon as the meeting was over.

I'm trying to find the balance between Plan B and doing what I have to do with the other parent for the sake of DDs. This is a big event in DD13's life and I don't want to contribute to the bad memories of this time for her.

He got nothing from me other than to see me. I did not act like a friend. I tolerated his presence and left immediately after. I gave him nothing more than any other stranger that would have sat beside me.

I understand the importance of a dark Plan B but I also have to follow my gut on what I see as reasonable in regards to DDs.

Last night was ok emotionally for me. It didn't hurt me like it would have a month or two ago. I think I fared better than WH did.

Parent/Teacher conferences are Monday. Both WH and I will be attending with DDs. I know I could set up a separate appointment to speak with the teachers but that just doesn't seem right for DDs. I want them to see their mother being the better person and doing what is right for them. And as the D comes closer and WH is after the father of the year award, I have to watch what I do so a judge does not construe it as being difficult and not in the best interest of DDs. Unfortunately, my world now includes what a judge will think of me.

I already hear the arguments in my head about the fact that what is right for DDs is their mother and father back together and that is what a dark Plan B could bring. But I think that this is what is best for me and DDs right now, all aspects considered.

Your "gut" deceives you.

"Getting along" for the kids is part of his fantasy.

The only way to disabuse him of that notion AND actually get peace yourself is completely separating yourself from any and all contact with him.

You KNOW this makes sense...deep down, you have NO desire to be friends with him if he continues down his destructive path. Your "gut" is telling you to be nice and he will hopefully come around. He won't...at least not soon enough to recover the marriage if you keep exposing yourself to him and allow him to make love bank withdrawals.

Mr. W

Your heart and mind are not in sinc yet for Plan B. You find any and all excuses to not stand firm on that boundary. When you are truly ready for Plan B, you will make arrangements for separate appointments for parent teacher conference; you'll let your mother make the calls about the horses; you definitely won't be eating breakfast with him.

Another Plan B letter would be meaningless at this point because he knows you don't mean it - after all YOU are initiating contact or making it easy for him to have contact.

Plan B is all or nothing, Fox!

PS - being friends for the sake of daughter is something you do after you're divorced, and have no more feelings - anger, hurt, or love to concern yourself at all about his presence - you reach a point of total indifference. You are not there yet, but you are clearly on the path to that - no saving the marriage and family for your daughter with these actions.

Friends don't betray, cheat, lie or use friends.

Ouch...I felt those.

FNH,

I know PLAN B can be tough.....because I am in it!

...but I don't discuss ANYTHING with WS...and I don't meet teachers with him... NOTHING!...(although, I must admit...nothing seriously out of the ordinary has happened so far)...and yes, it is NOT to the benefit of our boys.... but then what part of anything involving an affair is!

WS chose A with OW over M, family and relationship with his wife and mother of his children....

...our 2 boys alternate a week each, and at the end of the week with me,if needed....I inform him, in writing, of any FACTS he should know about the boys ...ie. sickness... notices from school... copies of anything he should have as a parent.... to make 'transfer' smoother for boys.... WS is rarely the subject of conversation with boys... they are living 'two' separate lives as a consequence of WS's choices...

My WS would love nothing more than friendly co-parenting...in fact he expected it....so that the 'consequences' of his choices could be minimized...and has on a regular basis attempted to have me break PLAN B for that exact reason.... for the sake of the boys, of course!

He has consistently gotten one response....yes I will, when OW is out of the picture!

...after a year and half of PLAN B....WS seems to just start to take me SERIOUSLY...because it was never his intention to choose anything.... the OW was to be IN ADDITION to a 'relationship' with me...to him it was a given since we had boys in common.....probably also a reason why WS and OW are not 'officially' living together....

...WRONG!

For some WS...reality takes awhile to sink in... all the more reason for BS to be consistent with PLAN B message... because if WS sees a 'crack' in BS's PLAN B....it will just take longer for WS to take BS's boundary seriously!

...and since D-day for me was 3 months into A....I guess reality may also be hitting laland at the same time!

PLAN B takes a great amount of discipline....what makes it easier is when the objective is clear...so that 'excuses' to break PLAN B can be seen as such....

...it's better not to do PLAN B, and put a boundary in place, when BS is not prepared to respect own boundary.....because then...why should WS?

PLAN B is BS committing to N/C with WS.....and now you can see how difficult it can be for WS to committ to N/C with OW...just for future reference!

The challenge in PLAN B is how NOT to break it and have the kids 'suffer' the least...

As has been suggested...the clearer the schedule and arrangements about the kids, and anything else, are in place...the less chance (excuse) you will have to break it!

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> I know, I know <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> It just feels like I am causing harm to DDs when I handle it this way. I know the end result would be the to the benefit to DDs. But what if the end result is not the recovery of the M? Then I've harmed DDs for nothing.

I don't know if I want to save the M anymore..........

I left another message for my lawyer this morning to find out if he was able to schedule another final hearing. I'm getting in a pretty bad spot financially and told him I'd like to hold the final date off as long as possible but get an emergency injunction to force WH to pay support and get definite schedule for DDs. This, too, will cause WH to deal with the consequences and see what D will really be like.

Thank you all for your input. I knew when I posted I would get this reaction, and it is deserved. I appreciate you reminding me of how this should work and why it does. lunamare, thank you for explaining your situation and how it is going for you. It is extremely helpful.

I just really worry about causing more harm to DDs.

Today is the day I'm going to start doing Plan B DARK. I'll call the school and set up a phone call with the teachers instead of going to the conferences with WH. Monday is WH day with DDs anyway, he can take them to the conferences by himself. He hardly ever went before and when he did, the teachers and I did most the talking. He just sat there.

Your daughter wasn't even at the meeting. How did Plan B or no Plan B have any impact on her at all??? Why couldn't you get up and move? That would have sent a mesage to him. He is still thinking life will be friendly post divorce. He thinks he gets OW in ADDITION to his family.

Your daughters are old enough to understand the MB principles and plans.

Have you explained what your strategies are? Help them to understand what you did in Plan A, and what you are now doing in Plan B -- so that they will support you.

Besides...YOU MATTER

If this all fails to resolve itself your kids need a happy and recovered Mom/Primary custodial parent to look after them and to teach them right from wrong. There are consequences to immoral behavior...you WH doesn't have the right to walk all over you then be your friend. HE is responsible for this. His choices, his consequences.

You see...Plan B is also about YOUR personal recovery.

Mr. Wondering

I got it. I didn't handle this particular meeting as well as I could have. Point taken.

Why did I not get up and move? Because I didn't think it was appropriate in that moment during the meeting. The speaker had already begun to talk by the time WH sat down. The speaker was standing beside my seat in the aisle.....it just didn't work the way that I could just get up and move. And I doubt WH would see it as it was intended. I believe he would just think I was being childish.



I have thought of sharing this with DDs. But would they pass it on to WH? I am going to discuss some of it with them this weekend...so they understand why I won't be going to parent/teacher conferences.

Thank you for you thoughts, Lexxxy, they are appreciated.

Teachers are some of the most understanding individuals on the planet.

They should be fully aware of what's going on at home so they can be watching for problems.

They will allow you to have separate conferences. Don't even tell WH. If he asks through the intermediary you just respond that you have scheduled a conference for yourself (without giving him the time and date) and he is free to schedule his own with the teachers. You are NOT responsible for making sure he schedules it, goes or even knows when they occur. He's left the house and the family. If he wants to assume such responsibility he has to figure out how.

Kid performances and activities...arrive late, wait outside and walk in after him so you don't have to move (you just choose a seat away from him)....maybe even ask for permission to stand backstage behind the curtain where your kids see you and know you are there but WH won't get the chance to even lay eyes on you. Just express concern that your husband is divorcing you and you don't want to break down crying in front of everyone if he approaches you and says mean hurtful things. They will let you do what you want then.

Mr. Wondering

Oh, Mr. W, you are good at this carrot/stick concept. First you thwack me with a 2x4 and then you doctor it up so it doesn't sting so much.

In regards to feeling like I matter, I don't want to get carried away with it and become the selfish POS WH has become. I can't let it become all about the fact that I matter at the cost of all others. As a wife and mother, I have often put DDs and H ahead of my own wants/needs. I need to find that spot where I matter but so does everyone else. (----not WH but H)

Thank you for the thwack and the encouragement. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Which of the two do you want to model for your daughters (they are watching you after all...how you handle adversity, what you say and do, etc.)


Model of Strength, perseverence, morality - Your father and I made a solemn vow of marriage on ____, 19___. Your father has chosen to end such marriage. I have tried my hardest to get him to reconcile but he refuses/refuesed. I did not take a vow of friendship. I refuse to associate myself with "friends" that don't follow through on their word. I value the memory of your father as the kind and decent person he was when we were married. I'd like to remember him that way and move on with my life. He choose to leave me; but, I am a strong woman and I won't allow his inappropriate and immoral choices to ruin my life.

Model of weakness - I will accept what he did to me and be friends with your father because I have to. Marriages are disposable. It happens. We just fell out of love (implying to them that they can surely make the same choices some day...do what you want it that is how you FEEL). Your father made a mistake but I forgive him (even though he has failed to apologize and seek your forgiveness...just give it to him anyway). Sometimes MEN just leave...that's the way it is (don't ever put full faith in a man because they will hurt you). Women should just bend over and take it and get along...that's their role...you know, for the kid's.

I'm not being completely clear but I hope you get the point. History repeats itself all the time on these boards. I've seen it many times where a WW or a WH ends up having an affair and divorces at nearly the precise time that their own children obtain the age they were at when their own father or mother had an affair and divorced. Call the Harley's if you don't believe me and for guidance on how you should portray these events and circumstances (er. choices) to your kids. You can't shelter them from reality otherwise they internalize things as something THEY contributed to.

I'm not beating you up....

You are progressing.

But since you've gone to Plan B prematurely FOR YOU (based upon not doing it right yet) and you can't go back on it (unless Steve Harley advises you otherwise)...then it's time to get it....quick.

Mr. Wondering

You are being clear. I'm getting it. Thank you.....really.

I'm processing all you've said......