I support your hearing and learning from Orchid's words of wisdom.

But I encourage you not to hang on to the mindset of thinking that you CAN MAKE your H do anything.

I get concerned about your thinking that you can CONTROL HIM...again I say that you CAN ONLY CONTROL yourself.

There's a difference between YOU changing YOUR APPROACH towards him than in you thinking that YOU CAN DIRECTLY FORCE HIM INTO DOING ANYTHING or that YOU CAN STOP HIM from doing the WRONG THING. That is so disrespectful of him and he will sense this. More importantly, you lose your sense of PERSONAL POWER and are likely to FEEL HOPELESS because such CONTROL OF HIM IS NOT POSSIBLE.

Mimi..speaking from experience...

Orchid: Alrighty....here's one...read Mimi's comment below. This will help you get in the correct mindset.



Orchid: Knowing your boundaries...yours and his...

1. You can't change a Ws

2. You can change U.


So what t/d?

A. Create actions which make him wonder....about U. That gives him less time to make his mind wander. Get it? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

B. When speaking, look at him and when he speaks listen carefully. Learn to watch his eyes. Very telling those eyes. If he squints away, you know you don't have him telling all he should. Most can't lie that well.

C. Learn to give him back his guilt.

D. Don't give all info. When he gives you info, don't give more info back.

example:

WS: I didn't get any calls from OW today.

BS: hm.....

WS: Aren't you happy?

BS: Should I be? What would make me happy is this A NOT being an issue in our lives, especially mine. What are you doing about that?

Ws: Oh.... I gotta go use the can. (watch as he scampers away - <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> ).


Learn to make what you say productive or leaves him with the chore of fixing the M. Not too pushy but not totally lax either. You have to use your boundaries to help you take your stand.

Watch those eyes.

I selected a simple opening line when I wanted to approach the Xws with a question. It goes something like this:

BS: Can I ask you a question?

Ws: What?

Now depending on his tone and the severity of my question, I either asked it or dropped it. If he isn't in the mood to listen, don't ask. Even if it is important. Later when something is lost due to his bad mood, remind him why something didn't turn out and point out if his mood was more receptive, THIS (whatever the event or issue is) would NOT be an issue.

Let me know if you have any questions.

take care,
L.

Ok, now how am I to accomplish any of this with him being 7000 miles away and not being able to see his face? And I am not sure how to "give him back his guilt". But making him wonder is a good idea...I guess not being so available to him, right?

Orchid probably forgot what your situation is...

Whatever you do, REMAIN AVAILABLE TO YOUR HUSBAND...

He is in the middle of a WAR ZONE...bombs exploding..people DYING around him... If you are not available to him when he reaches out to you, what do you expect for him to do? He will reach out to who is THERE.

So with that distance you can't to item B (i.e. watch his eyes), but you can make him wonder. Mimi is right, when I went back and read, I posted as if he was back home. My bad. I apologize.

However, if his mindset is still a WS, regardless of the distance, being nice to a WS has no real benefit. So be smart with your communication and do NOT let him give you his guilt.

The object is HE NEEDS TO MISS YOU. How do you think that should be accomplished? One way is by limiting R talk and let him wonder what you are doing and thinking. You know like when you were dating?

Here's a dating type call(I maybe a bit rusty at this..... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> ):

Boy: Hi.

Girl: Oh Hi....babe....whatcha doing?

Boy: Nothing. I've been thinking about you.

Girl: You have? That's sooo sweet. Me too!

Boy: Oh good.

Girl: Tell me what you've been thinking?.....

See the girl usually asks the leading questions. If she offers what she has been up to before he asks, why ask? That could start the cycle leading to non-communication later in their R if the girl gives too much info.
Sometimes guys find it hard to communicate but if you glance over Harley's book His Needs/Her Needs, you will find HOW to talk to the male gender.

So distance requires a bit more creativity but the goal is still the same.

Ask some of the guys around that have either been deployed or are in the military......they maybe able to give you good insight. The BSW's of military WS' maybe helpful also.

JMHO,
L.

OK..please correct me if I am wrong but I want to make sure I understand...Make him wonder what I am up to, let him do most of the contacting (i mean, i am not going to ignore him but let him come to me to communicate except w/ the occasional email to him saying "hi" etc etc.)...limit our R talk, let him ask most of the questions and not give a great deal of info (make him wonder), be pleasant to him but not overly loving, gaga, mushy, etc etc. and just continue to try to release this need and urge to control him and work on ME !!!!!!! Am I on the right track?

With all due respect to Orchid, I think doing any of that would be a MAJOR MISTAKE..putting your marriage in jeopardy.

Well then what in the heck am I to do? I respect ya'lls opinion very much but I am a rookie in every sense of the word. I know the bottom line, and this has been the bottom line from day one, is that I have to focus on myself, getting myself better, working on me, and giving up trying to control him. But what else am I to do? Oh, I so confused.

The answer hasn't changed, Love.

Do PLAN A. It has been working for you. Your H is responding positively to you.

He's in Iraq, Love. There's bombing over there.

I'm not sure what you are asking.

Of course, work on yourself. BUT DO NOT IGNORE HIM...It's not EITHER-OR.

I don't think Orchid is saying to IGNORE him, I think she is saying attract him toward you, by allowing him to be a part of the conversation. Let him guide it. Don't talk about R, let him talk, you listen, repeat important statements. Woo him, as in a new R. Even if he can't see you, look him in the eyes, you remember what that's like...

Was your H the one who chased you? If so, maybe perform the same ritual, try to remember what came so naturally to both of you when courting; begin courtship again...

It's worth a solid try...

SL's got the correct perspective. Mimi wants to win him back but this isn't a game. That w/b ok if he wasn't a WS also and just far away.

Just look at this from another perspective. He is thousands of miles physically but tens of thousands away emotionally and mentally. The WS are out of this world even if they are within arm's reach.

Refocus...... you want him to come back to you, his family. Not 1/2 way but all the way. So don't get hung up on the physical distance.......focus on bringing his mental and emotional state back home. You can do that no matter how far away he is.

Remember you want your H back, better than ever but do NOT settle for anything less.

One way I would describe is plan A your spouse and plan B the WS. No matter what the distance, you can tell when he is being an [censored] (aka: WS) or your loving (what your H was or should be). Respond accordingly.

Imagine the mixed signals if you treated the WS the same as your H. What motivation would your H have to return and think of the power you are giving the WS, why should he change.

But if you plan A your spouse and plan B the WS, he will see the difference and his choice is how you will determine whether you go to plan A or B all together.

This stuff takes time. The quickest way to know your direction is to guide it enough to expose his direction. Your BS instincts s/b sharp by now. Don't dull it by day dreaming of him being the perfect H. Sharpen your wits and be prepared to keep him wondering what his now highly attractive wife is up to.

I recall mine wondering. After I got over the shock of it all (yep, it took a while), my mind and heart went in sync. When it did, even though the A lasted over 2 years from that point, I was able to holdfast. I struggled at times....sometimes it was better NOT to see him (an advantage you have by default which c/b better than you realize). When he came back it was on our terms. Each time he waivered and went out, he had to work harder to come back. The stakes went up not down. His respect for us went up not down.

See, we learned to live without him.....yet he never learned to live without us. So even though he had the A, he was more attached to us than we were to him.

For us t/b attached to him, he had to earn our trust back. That takes longer than the A. So we are still in the recovery mode. Right now.

I'd better stop for now. Sometimes my direction upsets Mimi. We try to help from different perspectives. You do what is best for your situation.

take care,
L.

Me UPSET?? No way!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Sorry if it seemed that way...



Love.. has indicated that things have been going WELL with her H..she has not given this impression...even during his visit..even in recent E-mails..the worse has been that he has complained of being TIRED...so NO REAL INDICATION of continued contact...

My thought has been.."WHY MESS UP A GOOD THING?"....



Yes, Orchid knows that I disagree with this because it is a reinterpretation of the Harley approach which is not advocated or accepted by them. I believe in trying to stick to the system.

You want to continue to FILL HIS LOVE BANK. If you don't, someone there IN THE WAR ZONE WILL, IMO....He is likely suffering and under lots of REAL UNIMAGINABLE TERROR AND STRESS...PTSD is a common disorder for those over there...

But carry on, guys, as you wish..fine with me...NOT UPSET <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Ok LG, it does you no good to see anyone bickering. What we have here are 2 people posting 2 different POVs. Instead of confusing you, YOU need to get in the driver's seat and take charge. You know your sitch better than anyone. Our comments are suggestions only based on your posting.

Whether it is 2 different POVs or 10, practice finding the good and discarding the bad. Ok? No hurt feelings need to be felt on this matter because you w/b doing what is good for your situation.

If you don't take the driver's seat and allow individual posts to direct you, you will be confused. Remember we come from all different experience paths and personalities.

So read what you can but ultimately you set your personal boundaries, take charge of your life and use what you have learned as a guiding tool to help you define and stay on course.

If you do, then you will feel better faster. You will be able to know HOW to handle your feelings and have a clearer perspective on what your H is going through over there.

Yes, he is in a chaotic land right now but his mind was (or is) in a similar chaotic state. I think he is realizing the similarity but that should envoke sympathy of the chaos, rather it should drive him to fix what he can. He can start by fixing the chaotic state of his WS mind. Let him know there are tools that can help him but know it is to help your H and not the WS side of his personality.

Know he may go through withdrawal because the WS does not give up with out a fight. So he must fight to win control back in his life. From this side let him know you can provide support for your H and not the WS. That much strategy he can handle. That may bring him some comfort and in time the ILY's can be handled.

I don't want you to be confused or frustrated. Let me know if my posts are contributing to it and if so, I will stop. Your personal success is way more important than my need to post. ok? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

take care,
L.

"I don't want you to be confused or frustrated. Let me know if my posts are contributing to it and if so, I will stop. Your personal success is way more important than my need to post. ok?"


I totally agree with Orchid on this, Love.

I hope others will post to you in order for you to obtain a different POV.

Orchid, I really don't see myself as bickering with you..just disagreeing....Sorry if you are at all offended..I really respect your right to have your POV...

Hey guys and thank you both for your personal inputs..I really appreciate it...Ok, here is what has been going on since he has been back over there...I do know that the OW has been gone on R and R and will be back tomorrow...I do not know if he has been IC w/ her or not. He has not given me any indication of that but I also have not asked. We have been talking via im about every couple of days. Nothing of any real importance, just chit chat. Whenever we do say "goodbye", he tells me that he loves me. He has not called since about 5 days ago and I go about every 2 days not hearing from him. He did tell me that this past week has been h**l...He has given me no indication of anything about our M or what is going to happen. When he left here, he told me and his family that he was coming home in May. But he has not brought it up again and I have not asked. I guess I am afraid to hear the answer b/c when he goes back over there, he seems like a completely diffrent person. He is still mentioning this finacial plan that we have been planning since he came home so I feel somewhat confident that he is going to follow thru w/ that plan. I don't know guys. I seem to always be available when he calls on me. But I think its b/c I miss him so much. But to be honest, I feel very drained of my love for him right now. Or maybe my will. I feel drained of any will. I know its hard for him to make deposits in my love bank while being over there but I feel so drained. Sometimes I honestly think of just giving up and moving on w/ my life. For some reason, I feel like there is no closure on this. He is not really doing anything to regain my trust. Now, granted, I do not know how much he can go being way over there but he will not allow me to have access to his emails. And obviously, I cannot keep tabs on him. I do not know what is going to happen when "she" gets back. I do not even know if they have been talking. Some days I want to write him a letter stating that this, this, and this, needs to be done in order to save our marriage and if you cannot do that, then I am outa here. But I know I can't. I know that I need to take control of this and I feel that the only way I can do that is to take control of me and my life. But I am so emotionally drained. Sometimes I ask myself, is this really worth it? Is the grass greener on the other side? I don't know.....

Hoping

I am so sorry you are here under these circumstances.

I would encourage you to put out a call to military guys here at mb and military wives. They may be able to help you out by knowing what your wh is going through while be over in a war zone. If I remember correctly he is civilian stationed over there right? However maybe these guys can help give you a better view of what kind of support he needs from you that will help in this situation.

I can give you some examples of what I did while my h was stationed overseas though not exactly in a war zone so to speak. However he did spend some inappropriate time with an op, still to this day I do not know how far it went, unfortunately. Anyway some of the things I did.

One thing was that I started to be very positive, supportive and encouraging when he called. I would ask questions about work as much as I could, I would encourage him in ways as telling him I knew he was doing a great job, that things will get better.....and other things. I stopped giving him any personal info about me or the extended family. I didn't tell him what I was doing, how I was doing. If he asked I would change the subject. I would however let him know how the kids were. However it's a fine line because of not wanting to lead him to feel we no longer needed him, because then I felt he would feel that the op needed him more.

One of the hardest things I did was to make myself unavailable upon occasion. This was hard because we talked so little and I always wondered if it would be the last. However even for people who are not in war zones it could be their last so I could not dwell on that. I became unpredictable in being reached by phone or by email. And like I said this was very difficult for me.

I also prayed and turned my focus on God and what he wanted me to do. I would encourage if you go to church to find a woman who can come alongside you and give you guidance and support. Pray and ask God to send someone to you. This was one of the most important things that happend because she always kept my focus where my focus belonged. It also helped me to take focus off my h was doing and helped me to establish a sense of peace. I've read a couple times about you having trouble letting go of the control. One of the biggest things I did was to let go and release that. Because I was so concerned about which way to move, which way would push him closer to her and farther from me. If I moved away from him he would move closer to her, if I kept pushing on the subject of her and I he would move closer to her. So I had to find a way to let go of the control. Once I did that it was amazing the things that happened. I gave my h over to God and he is here with me. I didn't talke about our marriage to him at all, I only discussed the positive things and encouraged him. I also got the book the Power of the Praying Wife and it really helped.

I also had a very wise mb member tell me to pray for a calm heart, clear mind and once I finally got that it really helped me tremendously. I remeber those words when I tend to let things go awry I try to find that place so I can hear that still small voice speaking to me and guiding me.

You are in a difficult place, however you can do this. And no matter which way this turns out you will be ok. Find a place where you can hear that still small voice, get rid of the extra noise. You may not think you have time however you cannot control what he is going to do while away. You can only control how you are going to react to it.

My prayers for you.

BJS, wow and thank you so very much for that...I did not know that there was even anyone on here that has been thru a similar experience..I guess I do need to yell out to some other military/contractor wives...Your words of encouragement are very much appreciated. And I pray all the time for God to take over and give me strength. I also pray for my M and my H...I will certainly heed your advice b/c it sounds right along the lines of what most people are saying to me. Thank you again.

Now do I have to read ALL FOUR PAGES or can I just responde to the original question, lol!

I found my husband going through my emails, he's legally allowed to go through other people's but with a warrant, pretty funny. Of course there is none. His mail is his, yours is yours, it's like the postal service. If he leaves it up I don't know about that but my hubby leaves his open on accident all the time, so I KNOW the kind of things his parents say about me, lol. No my hubby didn't get ammo, I sent my OM a card for new year's, lol! very low key. IT's hard for me because our home is not his office & vice versa. This is a problem with his work, he can't talk I can't ask. His being in the mid-east for a year was actually EASIER for us because I'm married to a non-talker, lol!

Now for the fun part, do you know WHY he's doing what's hurting you? The weird thing for me is that no one wants to talk about WHY I've made the decisions I have but they wanna discuss what was wrong. But I can't seperate them, at least not yet. The year monsterlab was gone is a blur, trying to pick out pieces is almost impossible. But I do know why. However no one wants to address that.

Anyway an invasion of privacy is an invasion of privacy is a well you get the drift. YES it's wrong no matter why you did it. Appologize & get on with the matter. If he brings it up, remind him you appologized. (Send him a card if need be, kinda hard to say He ignored mail call, we all lived for that) Stupid is as stupid does, reminding you (or him) that someone tripped & fell is just digging the wound deeper, and it's not worth it anyway. get up & get on with things. sincerity is what counts

Ok, from reading MOST of the 4 pages, here's what I can possibly offer to you. I am a 18+ year Navy Wife. I have been in both the WS and BS shoes, and can understand worries when your military spouse(for any other's reading in this situation) gives little or no communication when they are gone. I am one of the luckier ones, who's hubby is usually only gone 6 months at a time, which he is right now. Anyway, I can feel your pain of the feeling of being brushed off. As other's have said, remember WHERE he is right now. He is in the middle of that desert, worrying about dodging bullets or bombs. Not knowing what the next day will bring, let alone the next half hour. In my sitch right now, they are on restricted email. Meaning I can email him, but he can't send anything out. So, I have to rely on the possibility of him calling, but I never know when that might be. It's frustrating, I know, even when we are 6 1/2 yrs into recovery! The old feelings creep in, and you begin to wonder! Now, I have had the chance to have worked on our M LONG before this deployment, BUT, he did go on a deployment just over a year after our D-day in 2000, and that was rough!

The best thing I can give to you right now, being an old "pro" at deployments is to continue your support of him via emails. I agree that you should not get TOO mushy, since your recovery is still SO new and fresh. It's a rocky road, even when the couple is still in the same house. It's just that much harder when you are half way around the world. Your H still needs to know that you are there for him, but he also needs to realize what his actions are doing to you. I was fortunate in that almost immediately after our D-day, we shared EVERYTHING! I have all his passwords to either emails, things like classmates accounts, all that. But, we also had over 12 years of relationship to help keep us "awake" after D-day. I agree that your conversations should be led by your H asking the questions, or at least the leading questions about how YOU are doing. You can ask the ones that were suggested and that is still healthy, cause it will get him to thinking like he did when you were first M'd.

Being a military spouse is one of, if not the hardest positions to be in. You have to deal with not only the deployments, but in many cases, the job requires the upmost secrecy! Unfortunately, some military personnel take that not only from the job, but into their M as well.

As for your own Love Bank, well, take what you can right now. Those days that he is especially loving, make those a double deposit. When he tells you that he's busy, or that he can't really talk, I know it hurts, brings back scary feelings, but remember he also has his job, that is a literal 24/7 requirement over there. Take the emotions with a grain of salt, but with one eye open as well. Try not to dwell on them, UNLESS you hear the major sirens going off in your head. Then, bring those warning signals here and let us help you descipher them before you act.

I think that his talk of the financial plan you guys and discussed/worked out before he went back is a good sign. It means that he still sees the future with you two together. Build on that, take that as a LB deposit.

I hope that I've helped you in a way. I know that even between the branches there are SO many differences, but we are all still a military spouse, and I hope to be able to help you with the sharing of my own experiences.

Thank you Tigger..I so appreciate that...That has helped a lot..I don't feel so alone in this now...I have to take this one day at a time. I guess my questions is, if he is soooo busy w/ stuff going on over there, how in the h**l did he have time to kiss another woman?