Got an email from the W this morning...she wants to come live with us for a week. See how things go. I guess this is a good thing. I am a little worried about it because I do not want her to expect miracles to happen in a week. I am not sure what she is expecting this will accomplish? I expect it will be very difficult for her because like anytime you give up an A there is going to be a period of depression. So I am not sure what a week will do except possibly strengthen in her mind that she can't leave OM...it will hurt too much. But on the other hand I see it as a positive sign as she is trying to find her way back...so I will encourage. I am just going to enter into it with a positive attitude...wish me luck.

Maybe I will try and work a MC session that week with Dr H...might be a good time to try that...

SRT,

A session with SH would be a great idea. He has a way of getting through to a WS if they will talk to him.

Like you I'm not sure what a week will do but it is good to have her at least trying now.

Good luck.

Well the situation is still kind of messed up and I am getting tired of it. She wanted to do the week starting next Saturday but then she emails me this morning saying she forgot she wants to go to a concert in the middle of that week. So maybe she will go to that and then come back the next day...etc...etc...excuses. Or maybe we can do the week after her birthday the following weekend...of course she needs to spend her birthday with her friends.

I am going to call the whole thing off...I do not think a week accomplishes anything. I also think it is very damaging/confusing to my son. One day his mom is there the next she is gone again...it is confusing to me too. I do not want her moving in and out...she is trampling me and I am letting her get away with it. I feel like it is time to take a stand and back her into a corner...you teach people how they can treat you and I have been allowing her to treat me like crap...and it has led to more and more crap. I am done with it.

So I am either going to go to her apartment tonight or talk on the phone and probably tell her forget it. I want her to explain why she wants to spend a week here and what she hopes to accomplish during that week. To me the week seems like a vacation for her...more cake eating. If she wants to truly work on the marriage I am going to lay out the conditions: give us three months, no contact with OM, no partying with her single friends, marriage counseling, individual counseling, etc...then after three months we can decide. If she does not want to do that or something very close to that I am going to proceed to plan D.

No time limit, give it all unconditionally or none at all. Took you guys more than three months to get your marriage to the present state and it'll take even longer to make it right again.

SRT...

I think you're making the right decision. If you don't agree with 'her method', don't agree to it. And your reasons are sound...hold your ground.

IMHO a time limit is a recipe for failure. All she and OM will most likely do is just tread water until the time limit is reached and resume where they left off.

A real committment is what you need total and unconditional. No testing the waters just come on in and get started at restoring what is right.

You are probably right that any kind of time limit is a bad thing and what I really want is "total and unconditional" but I just know a week is not enough...3 months at least would give us a chance to really try and obviously I would hope we would do some good work in those 3 months and it would turn into forever.

It does not look good right now anyway...Turned down her one week offer yesterday...she was not very happy about it...she is now not talking to me. I am not upset about it...one week was a vacation that would not accomplish anything. She is now trying to manipulate me into getting her way by using her anger/not talking...if she wants to come back she needs to make a commitment. I am done playing these type games...

keep your eye on the prize

Well it is all coming to a head...the wife sent me and OM an email this week that after Mar 19th she wants to see neither of us...0 communication...no emails, texts, phone calls, etc...she wants to go into seclusion and make a decision. I kind of welcome this as hopefully this will lead to some sort of conclusion of the mess and we can all move on with our lives.

I have no idea which way she will go...I have been crafting a final email kind of stating my case but also letting her know that if she does choose to come back that it must be 100%...no more games. I guess I have the advantage of our son, financial security, dependability, etc...he has the advantage as to the fact they are currently in an affair and the fog that accompanies that...he has a ton of problems in his life and I know that has been wearing on her a little but I do not know how much and in some respects it might help his cause because it makes her feel like he cannot live without her. The last few days he has also been inundating her with love letter type emails...can't live without you...soulmates...will fight for you...you have changed my life...all I do is think about you...etc etc...

I am not sure how to combat this? I feel like I should state my case...but I kind of do not think it is the right thing to get all needy and playing the crying game. I definitely want to send her something before she goes into hiding and have been working on a last message. Her birthday is next week and I have a good birthday planned...going to cook her a special meal and have a nice present (not expensive but very thoughtful...got some of our sons art work framed for her office). My son and I are going to attempt to bake her a cake (which should be an adventure...but I know she will appreciate it).

Maybe I will share my email here (once I get a good draft) and some could critique it and offer some suggestions.

It is such a strange situation to be in...it is like I love my wife, I want her back, I want the chance for my son to grow up with both his parents. But...I refuse to settle or compromise on what I think a good marriage should be...and truthfully if she does choose to come back it will be good but kind of a scary situation because I will need to open myself up to possibly being hurt again. I am willing to take that risk but another part of me is not going to be that devastated if she chooses to divorce as I know I will be ok and it will probably be an easier path for me.

Any ideas of what I can do now to improve my chances?

Bleh I feel like I am losing. If I sent her some of the needy/lovey crap emails that he has sent her she would get pissed at me...I would get the "I am tired of your emails...I know how you feel". What does he get..."That is the most beautiful thing I have ever read...you are so wonderful...you are so good to me...etc".

It is like I feel like I cannot win...I hate being the enemy. He can do no wrong...I can do no right...I will be very surprised if she comes out of her seclusion and chooses to come back home...struggle between her heart and mind...she knows she is better off with me but she is so in love with OM...how could she leave him...makes me ill.

SRT,

IMO I don't think sending the type email that Om is sending will help your cause at all. I do think the Birthday party and time with you and son are great. If you want to send her a message that is positive then something along the lines of a modified plan B letter that reminds her of what whe will be giving up along with a reminder some important events in your life together.

Just state that you do love her and want more than anything else to have her back in you and your sons lives.

That when she is ready to commit to your M you are waiting.

SRT,

Have you seen your lawyer yet? IF so what is the sitaution with that? If not, why not?

God Bless,

JL

And THAT is exactly what the struggle is between.

Her mind vs. her feelings.

If you can only communicate to her that she ought to listen to her mind, b/c that is what is solid and firm. Her feelings can catch up to her mind once she commits to NC.

Would she be willing to e-mail w/ me? I'd be happy to tell her how she can recover her feelings for you again. (I'm a FWW.)

OM will NEVER be half the man that you are...and she KNOWS this. Remind her of the security she has w/ you. Remind her of your strength and determination to always care for her and protect her and your son.

And then let it go.

Schoolbus posted this on another thread...

"Think of this whole thing - of giving it up to God - as a poker game.

You have been dealt the cards.
You are not able to play them yourself.
You stand up and walk away from the table.
God takes your seat, and plays your hand for you.

Now, isn't that easier? You know, if I found myself sitting across from God, I would fold my cards, and tell Him, "You win. Here are all my chips, do with them what You will." Because I would never want to be opposed to Him in any way. And somehow, I believe that He would play the game so that we would all win, in the end, if we left it up to Him in the way we should. The way He wants us to.

And I would never think twice about having Him play my cards for me in ANY game.

SB"

~ Marsh

I wonder if you should not go into Plan B now BEFORE she 'decides' she is going into her so called seclusion, because she won't keep to that. The OM will be there I'd say 99% of the time no matter what she tells you.

Have you seen your lawyer yet? Do you have all that is required in place if you need it to protect you and your son?

You don't think of the future in the fog, just the right now so don't expect too much out of her so called 'seclusion'.

Get prepared right now for the worst. Affairs do not last, but they can continue for some time.

I have seen a lawyer but I have not paid a retainer yet. I had planned on filing a week or so ago but the wife flipped out...did not want a divorce. First wanted to come live with us for a week and then she came up with this seclusion make her mind up test. I figure I owe her that. Basically me pushing the divorce has caused her to wake up some...but I don't know if the fog has lifted enough.

Me and the wife still have an amicable if not very good relationship...after the affair was exposed she has been honest with me. I will know if she is communicating with OM during her imposed seclusion. We have agreed on how we would split up things if we divorce and she still does not want custody. I am taking a risk waiting but I am willing to take some risk to get her back.

I do not think it would do her much good talking to anyone via email...she does good to avoid talking about it with anyone.

The poker reference is kind of funny...to be honest I do not know if I would let god take my cards...I am a semi-professional poker player and I am pretty confident in my skills...lol

It is not only the OM I am battling...it is her whole single life style. I know she has strong feelings for OM...but she has been very open with both me and him that she does not want a future with him. She seems to mostly want her freedom. But part of that is probably BS...fog talk. I am not going to compromise or negotiate after her self imposed exile...there will be no conditions like she can go out with her single friends to clubs or still communicate with OM.

Do I expect a lot? Not really...I would say the odds are stacked against me. But I figure I owe her the chance to make the decision before I make the final decision.

I am not going to Plan B until we divorce...I do not think she would be happy with a plan B and I feel that would be too big a risk to the custody/amicable divorce.

I agree on the letter...I am just going to be honest...straight forward...hopefully she will take the time to read it a few times and something will sink in...

Plan B after D is a bit late. The main purpose of Plan B is to retain whatever is left of your love for your wife as it means you don't have her inflicting direct pain and disrespect ..indirect of course still, it's ancillary benefit is that your wife will find out what it will be like once you are D'ed. The old "absence makes the heart grow fonder."

Little contact with you & then only in regard to your child.

Why don't you get advice from Dr Harley? If you do then it may be a great idea to follow it. Giving a fogged out WS a 'fair' deal like this seclusion and wait thing may not be the best thing to do ... being an FWS I can tell you it probably wouldn't have meant much to me. S also means selfish as a WS.

So what is new?

Wife is supposedly going into seclusion this coming Monday...no contact with me or OM for however long it takes for her to make a decision.

I saw her last night for her birthday. The birthday was actually a smashing success. I got her a gift that she really seemed to appreciate...I had some of our S artwork framed so she could take it and hang it in her office. She really appreciated that. Commented that it was the absolutely perfect gift. Also made her one of her favorite meals and it turned out real well. Son and I baked her a cake the day before and she also thought that was spectacular. So yes I laid it on thick and went all out...I do not think it could have went any better.

By the end of the evening she seemed to be testing me...hinting that she wanted to come back. Little stuff that did not seem to make a lot of sense but they were definitely little tests...like if I come home I want to get new blinds for the patio door...do you think we could take a vacation in June? Basically I was like sure...we can talk about that kind of stuff as soon as you make the commitment to come back.

A week or two ago I would have said there was little chance of her coming back but after last night I would give it 50/50 or maybe better. I know her and OM are also on the outs a little...his problems are starting to mount and he has been lashing out at her...I do not think they are long for each other regardless of what else happens.

Hopefully I will know something in the next 10 days or so. At this point I feel like I have shed my last tear for her and while I would like her to come back it is not going to break my heart if she doesn't. I will just be happy to have it be over.

I wouldn't put too much money on her NOT contacting the OM. Its possible but not likely.

Did you get any professional advice from the Harleys at all?
I do think you are at a place you should consider it, a false recovery may be worst than none right now for you and your son.

I do hope she is serious about wanting her family back but she does seem to be really on a cake eating walk right now.

I still feel a good plan B after you get her to sign custody papers may be effective before a D. However this of course has to be what is right for you. I do hope it can be a positive period while she is is in so called seclusion.
Be sure to look after yourself as well as your son. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Update:

I have it on good authority that afer the wifes "seclusion" she is going to come back and give our marriage a try.

So I may be headed down the long road of recovery...I guess that is a good thing...I am a little shocked she is choosing to come back. I had already kind of written the marriage off and was expecting to proceed down the divorce path.

Now I am thinking about how we start the recovery process? #1 I know she is going to be very depressed when she comes back...I do not think she necessarily wants to come back and I know she still has very strong feelings for OM. I am going to stand my ground and I am done negotiating with her. She must maintain NC, end the single life, end late night partying, MC, IC, etc...

Then again I am not really sure...I see today that both W and OM are a mess and are pining for each other...how can we do this...blah blah blah...how can I ever leave you. So I know when she comes back it is going to be a mess. She was supposed to stop talking to him too today but they only lasted until around lunch time before they started writing each other about how much they missed each other. I have a feeling I am walking into a lot of work for this recovery to have any success. Part of me feels like telling her to get bent and that I now want the divorce regardless. I may be making a mistake trying to recover this marriage but I think I am going to try.

This will really test the powers of forgiveness and recovery. I guess what keeps me going is reading some of the success stories on here of people who went through the same or worse and now have great marriages. Wish me luck.

She is an addict so you will need to keep her busy and cut off all access to OM. Set up spyware and block certain websites, block his email address, delete all his personal info, and change her number. I would suggest taking a week or two of vacation if possible to get away from it all because the first couple weeks are the worst. Monitor her like a hawk, and defend your marital boundaries. Be firm, but do not love bust. Put GPS on her car, whatever it takes. There will be a few "closure" contacts, NC will be broken several times, but the more passing time, the urge will be less. Once the urge is gone, you can start rebuilding your M. I would try and set up a phone consultation with the Harleys for your WW. Expect to not have your needs met for a LONG time, so be patient.