|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195
Member
|
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195 |
My H bought SAA and HN/HN. He is reading hn/hn right now. I read Not Just Friends which was great. Its hard to get through this stuff though. Its no doubt helpful but hard to go through the pain that they inevitably bring to the surface but thats how you deal with it, right?
My oldest is more than aware. Before I went public so to speak she was addressing it with my H to no avail of course. She was able to name her, blame her, and voice it before even I could. In fact she has asked if he could be followed. The day my H told them he was leaving I commended her on respecting herself to say she would never accept this. She had told my mom the night before that she would do some serious surveillance if she were me. When my H told them I told her I was sorry and with my H there she looked at me said "its not your fault-he didn't respect you enough to not do this so he doesn't deserve your trust or respect right now". No one could have said a more perfect thing to me. I have been so worried about what I was teaching them by not leaving but I guess I fought harder than I thought. While it feels like I just laid down m/b I didn't.
I'll call my dr today. Well tommorrow-they close at 1 on Thurs. for some unknown reason.
I resent my H soooo much right now for doing this. He was my rock. My grandma used to say-depend on no one. I guess her thought holds water. This resentment just grows and has been since Aug 2005. Its hard to move past since this primarily took place while I was pregnant. And it seems that my H lovingly picked all very significant dates through this whole thing.
How do I not associate my sons bday, our anniv, my daugh bday, my last preg and delivery with this? All those dates were huge for me but are now huge for them too. He spent the night at her house on my sons bday. He went to her apt for our anniv. He took off for FL to save them or my daugh bday. The dates just keep going too. Its like every date that was special to us he targeted and used for them.
Mel
"A successful marriage requires falling in love many times, always with the same person"
------------------------------------------------------
BS (me) 28
WS 26
Married in Nov. 2000
DD-11 yrs old
DD-5 yrs old
DS-4 yrs old
DS-17 mos old
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344 |
How do I not associate my sons bday, our anniv, my daugh bday, my last preg and delivery with this? All those dates were huge for me but are now huge for them too. He spent the night at her house on my sons bday. He went to her apt for our anniv. He took off for FL to save them or my daugh bday. The dates just keep going too. Its like every date that was special to us he targeted and used for them. Honey...I know it sounds hard to hear right now...but wait. If he heals this for you...if he does right by you, while in the future you MAY look back and feel twinges of pangs....if he rights this by you, the new memories will supercede those painful ones. I promise. But that part of it is on HIS head and HIS plate. You concentrate on the parts of you that you need to control...and one of those things is calming your incessant thoughts. Once those are calmer, you can take stock of your NEEDS.
I never had to take the Kobayashi Maru test until now. What do you think of my solution?O'hana means family, and family means nobody gets left behind or forgotten. My Story Recovered!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195
Member
|
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195 |
You're right, I know. He keeps saying he'll make it right. It's just that I've heard it all before.
Will ADs calm those thoughts? Or do I need to do that on my own? Right now I just keep thinking that what I need is to leave him. But I know that its more than possible that that stems from the hurt and fear. I just keep thinking that if I walk away now eventually I'll be happy. It's a guarntee. If I stay there is more pain ahead and so many bumps in the road. But I will likely be happier than I could ever be walking away. Time. When you could use more it passes you by and when you need less it moves sooooo slow. The future just seems like such a blur. I know that if he does this right we will be better than we've ever been. But its the IF that gets me. Walking away holds far less risk. But also far less of a chance for far better.
Ambivilance is where I'm at. I just want to pretend this isn't happening. I know how great we can be but that isn't a guarntee. I can't be certain that he will do this right. That he'll fix this. I put my heart in his hands and he crushed it. Now I'm terrified by the idea of ever putting it there again. Being alone with him right now makes me nervous and anxious. The idea of doing things for us scares the ****** out of me. Like if I invest like I've been doing I will only end up more hurt.
I don't know. I'm so confused.
Mel
"A successful marriage requires falling in love many times, always with the same person"
------------------------------------------------------
BS (me) 28
WS 26
Married in Nov. 2000
DD-11 yrs old
DD-5 yrs old
DS-4 yrs old
DS-17 mos old
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344 |
You can't shelve the "ifs" long enough to make ANY decision for yourself right now...right?
I know I'm right...cos I WAS you.
The ADs help with that.
Look, I'm not going to tell you what your decision SHOULD be.... To be honest, I don't know what is best for you. What I DO know is best is for you to take care of yourself. If you are having a hard time staying focused and on task, then you are not there yet.
What I want for you is what YOU want for you. What I will do, is walk with you till you find your path to what is best. Okay?
I'm gonna go home in about a half an hour. I'll check in tomorrow.
What may help you...cos I know it's helped others...is to journal here what you are feeling...people will post on that thread to offer shouders (and sometimes 2x4s covered in nerf) and most often, pearls of wisdom that are like inches of rope to help a person in a deep well get out.
You can do it on this thread or you can start a new one. Whatever you do...please realize you are not alone. That was the biggest thing for me...because I FELT so alone. So..you're not...we're here and we're listening.
- Kimmy
I never had to take the Kobayashi Maru test until now. What do you think of my solution?O'hana means family, and family means nobody gets left behind or forgotten. My Story Recovered!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 6,025
Member
|
Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 6,025 |
Kimmy asked me to come over here and take a look. I was sent something recently from a friend to review before being sent to another friend. I thought it may be applicable to your sitch. Often I think WH, perhaps trying to reconcile but not knowing how, FEAR a lifetime of punishment for their prior misconduct. Perhaps the Restorative Justice concept will make a little sense to him and/or you. Mr. Wondering [color:"blue"] DIE TO YOURSELF . This is a difficult concept - especially for someone in your position. You might feel you've already done this or that you're too far down the line to need to do this. Bro - this is sometimes a difficult concept to describe. It's a humility without self deprication or futilistic thoughts or comments. Dying to yourself requires you to relax, open up, be vulnerable and stop putting YOUR feelings ahead of someone elses. It can't be about YOU it has to be about the "US". You can't have room for anyone else if you close off and become self centered. . Yes - you lied, cheated, stole, drowned the puppies in a burlap bag, stole from blind beggars cup, picked on the fat kid in school, made fun of old ladies in wheelchairs, waved your privates out the back of the school bus window, whatever. You're dirty with sin, a truly despicable person. . Welcome to the club. Take a seat and look around. Find one person sitting in the circle who doesn't have the same amount of dirt on themselves. Maybe the offense is different but each and every one of us is just as dirty. Got it? Good, now get over it. Grace is an amazing thing. It washes even the dirtiest of us. So you're just the same as the rest of us. No better, no worse. . BUT (and you knew there would be a but, didn't you?) you have to do something with this Grace you've been given. You need to pass it on to your wife. You need to open yourself up, lie under the microscope, be examined, poked, prodded, and tested time and time again...with a loving smile on your face. That's a tall order. . That brings us to part 2. . RESTORATIVE JUSTICE . A few years back the United Methodist Church asked a friend of mine to research this concept for them. In the interest of time I'm going to copy and paste someone elses definition of what this is: . Restorative justice is a valued-based approach to responding to wrongdoing and conflict, with a balanced focus on the person harmed, the person causing the harm, and the affected community. Restorative justice focuses on transforming wrongdoing by healing the harm, particularly to relationships, that is created by harmful behavior. The primary stakeholders in restorative justice processes are the person(s) who caused the harm (offender), the person(s) harmed (victim), and the affected community. By collectively identifying and addressing harms, needs, and obligations resulting from wrongdoing, we are able to create healing and put things right again. . Here's the rub. We currently live in a PUNITIVE justice system where you do the crime, do your time, and then more often than not live with a scarlet letter the rest of your life. Once people are labeled "criminal" they are often no longer offered the opportunities to TRULY re-assimilate back into life. Fringe people are kept on the fringe and if you interview enough of them you will find that they never seem able to climb out of their past to build much of a future. As a society we love to pick at other peoples' scabs instead of investigating our own. We're good at looking down our noses at the guy who was busted for tax evasion but can't understand that the deduction "guess" we made on our own return for the "home office" that didn't really, really qualify that one time put us in the same place with one exception - we didn't get caught. So in our own eyes we're not really dirty. Am I clear? I hope so. . Take the restorative justice tack. Restore as much wholeness to your wife through selflessness and humility and you will at the same time be restoring your own standing. I know that if you really put your heart into it you will find that any and all accountability that you must suffer will become ENJOYABLE because you'll see that it is an act of love and an offering of grace to be so transparent to your wife. Then, at some point, it will become HER job to not hold you under the old punitive justice system and instead afford you the restorative system which doesn't paint a scarlet "A" on your chest. . Remember, this isn't all about you and your feelings. Your feelings matter but you'll FEEL differently once you quit struggling. Be still. Be open. Feel the Grace which you have already received from God. Be graceful to others. Gladly open yourself to scrutiny because those who live above reproach have nothing to hide. Be whole in the knowledge that yesterday isn't today nor does it have to be tomorrow. Be patient and don't try to rush the healing. Instead be the salve that protects the wound from anything that would seek to infect it. . Here are a couple more quotes from my friend to rest on today: . 1. Do the right thing because it's the right thing to do. . 2. This too shall pass. It's going to be ok. YOU are going to be ok [/color] Melly - I don't know that your husband is there yet to really internalize the above; but, in time, hopefully. It might initially be a framework for him to understand that the AFFAIR is NOT going to be his scarlett letter the rest of his life. NO man wants to remain on a baseball team (your marriage) where he remains forever the worst player stuck out in right field and batting last in the lineup. There is some in there for you too. You ARE going to be OK. No matter what occurs. The cage door IS open. He must choose to come clean completely and live in truth. Nothing less will suffice.
FBH(me)-51 FWW-49 (MrsWondering) DD19 DS 22 Dday-2005-Recovered
"agree to disagree" = Used when one wants to reject the objective reality of the situation and hopefully replace it with their own.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344 |
Hoping you saw Mr. Dubya's post. It's great (as always).
Also, checking on you....
How are you feeling today?
- Kimmy
I never had to take the Kobayashi Maru test until now. What do you think of my solution?O'hana means family, and family means nobody gets left behind or forgotten. My Story Recovered!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195
Member
|
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195 |
I am doing okay today. I've been doing a lot of thinking. I need to get moving. I keep trying to make sense of the senseless. Which makes NO sense. I have to find me again. Which is so terrifying-I made the classic mistake of wrapping all of me up in my H. Now that he's done this I am floundering around trying to get some air. Instead of focusing on me I'm focusing on what I did wrong to deserve this. I have become so intertwined in him that his wrongs feel like mine. I feel lost without his love. I'm starting to realize that my kids need me to be me for me.
I am still so hurt but I think I'm a little less scared. My H appears to be all in. He seems to be at the place where MrW post might mean something. Its just hard to believe anything anymore so I have my doubts. His eyes have lied to me so many times and now nothing he says resonates. He seems genuine but who knows. Again with that wretched time thing.
I am trying to get a friend of mine to take a dance class with me. My H jumped in and asked if he could take it with me. Should I let him or say no thank you. I got up this morning to get Keith Urban tickets and my H asked if he could come with. I didn't invite him but he still asked if he could go. He says he wants to eat, breathe, and sleep us. We'll see, I guess. I still can't stand the wait and see of it all.
Things are still so tense for me atleast. It's still so soon. I still feel like he wouldn't be doing this if he hadn't gotten caught. He's always said that if we ended he didn't want it to be over the OW. When he left in December he didn't even bat an eyelash. He didn't even seem to care. Now that I know he is begging forgiveness. I just don't understand.
I loved that part in MrW post where it says that my H should be the salve that protects the wound. I love that so much. He can't take it away but he can protect it. He can heal the wound. I just feel so violated.
I cannot thank you and everyone for their shoulders! It means so much right now. Sending good thoughts, happiness, and hugs your way!!
Mel
"A successful marriage requires falling in love many times, always with the same person"
------------------------------------------------------
BS (me) 28
WS 26
Married in Nov. 2000
DD-11 yrs old
DD-5 yrs old
DS-4 yrs old
DS-17 mos old
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195
Member
|
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195 |
I am doing okay today. I've been doing a lot of thinking. I need to get moving. I keep trying to make sense of the senseless. Which makes NO sense. I have to find me again. Which is so terrifying-I made the classic mistake of wrapping all of me up in my H. Now that he's done this I am floundering around trying to get some air. Instead of focusing on me I'm focusing on what I did wrong to deserve this. I have become so intertwined in him that his wrongs feel like mine. I feel lost without his love. I'm starting to realize that my kids need me to be me for me.
I am still so hurt but I think I'm a little less scared. My H appears to be all in. He seems to be at the place where MrW post might mean something. Its just hard to believe anything anymore so I have my doubts. His eyes have lied to me so many times and now nothing he says resonates. He seems genuine but who knows. Again with that wretched time thing.
I am trying to get a friend of mine to take a dance class with me. My H jumped in and asked if he could take it with me. Should I let him or say no thank you. I got up this morning to get Keith Urban tickets and my H asked if he could come with. I didn't invite him but he still asked if he could go. He says he wants to eat, breathe, and sleep us. We'll see, I guess. I still can't stand the wait and see of it all.
Things are still so tense for me atleast. It's still so soon. I still feel like he wouldn't be doing this if he hadn't gotten caught. He's always said that if we ended he didn't want it to be over the OW. When he left in December he didn't even bat an eyelash. He didn't even seem to care. Now that I know he is begging forgiveness. I just don't understand.
I loved that part in MrW post where it says that my H should be the salve that protects the wound. I love that so much. He can't take it away but he can protect it. He can heal the wound. I just feel so violated.
I cannot thank you and everyone for their shoulders! It means so much right now. Sending good thoughts, happiness, and hugs your way!!
Mel
"A successful marriage requires falling in love many times, always with the same person"
------------------------------------------------------
BS (me) 28
WS 26
Married in Nov. 2000
DD-11 yrs old
DD-5 yrs old
DS-4 yrs old
DS-17 mos old
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344 |
Which is so terrifying-I made the classic mistake of wrapping all of me up in my H. Now that he's done this I am floundering around trying to get some air. Instead of focusing on me I'm focusing on what I did wrong to deserve this. I have become so intertwined in him that his wrongs feel like mine. I feel lost without his love. I did the same thing as you. My life was my husband and my family. I did everything for them first....which is why I identify with your hurt so much, I think. Did you read that last sentence in the quoted paragraph? I have to say, what your husbands word/actions are telling me is that you haven't lost his love.... But we shall see. We're gonna put off deciding if the HIS love is lost to see if his actions continually match is words...if they do, then we'll decide if YOU still have love left to give him. Okay? He seems to be at the place where MrW post might mean something. Good. Print it off and give it to him. Now that I know he is begging forgiveness. I just don't understand. I do. Before, he felt as if he wasn't going to lose you. Really. But this time, the reality of your pain has smacked him in the puss and it was a wake up call. He now knows he can lose you...and it scares he beejeebers outta him. I loved that part in MrW post where it says that my H should be the salve that protects the wound. I love that so much. He can't take it away but he can protect it. He can heal the wound. It's true. Once my Wookie realized he was going to lose me forever, he also turned it all around. The ache is still there (sometimes...not always like it used to be), but he's helped make it bearable by his actions matching his words. That's really all it takes. Words are whispers lost in the wind. Actions shout in bellows. - Kimmy
I never had to take the Kobayashi Maru test until now. What do you think of my solution?O'hana means family, and family means nobody gets left behind or forgotten. My Story Recovered!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195
Member
|
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195 |
I always try to teach my kids that sorry is an action not a word. Love too. I always try to show. I've never been a real big words person. I like to show how I feel. Hopefully my H will begin to take a page from my book.
He keeps saying thathe was never going to leave. No matter how many times he said he was going to. He says just what you said. That he always thought he could come back. He never REALLY believed he would lose me.
Now for me...I am going to try to focus on me. I have just spent so long putting my H and kids first that my identity is them. So when he messes up I feel like I've failed the kids, him, and me. But its time. I need to see me again. But where do I start? It's hard because I loved my life. I really did. I never felt resentful or burdened atleast not until the A. After the A started then I was resentful and felt slighted. For which I feel tremendously guilty. I feel awful for the times over the last year and a half that I've thought about the life I now wish I had. I wouldn't give up my kids for anything but in the wake of dday #2 I have definately questioned whether or not this is the life I want. Whether or not I ever wanted it. Nothing feels real anymore-like everything I ever thought was important was an illusion. Our life pre-A feels like a sham. Like everything once true is now a lie. I love the kids so much but I feel so guilty for the resentment I feel about giving up the things I did or not getting the things I wanted or having to do the things I didn't really want to do but had to. I just feel soooooo guilty.
I guess its time that I take controlback for me. Hes had it for far too long. Its just hard and I feel so powerless.
Mel
"A successful marriage requires falling in love many times, always with the same person"
------------------------------------------------------
BS (me) 28
WS 26
Married in Nov. 2000
DD-11 yrs old
DD-5 yrs old
DS-4 yrs old
DS-17 mos old
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344 |
Start small.
Go get a pedi.
I never had to take the Kobayashi Maru test until now. What do you think of my solution?O'hana means family, and family means nobody gets left behind or forgotten. My Story Recovered!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195
Member
|
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195 |
Thats sounds fabulous!
I just have to get up the nerve. I hate this because not only do I have to pry myself away from the wife role but I also have to seperate myself from the kids to an extent.
Mel
"A successful marriage requires falling in love many times, always with the same person"
------------------------------------------------------
BS (me) 28
WS 26
Married in Nov. 2000
DD-11 yrs old
DD-5 yrs old
DS-4 yrs old
DS-17 mos old
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344 |
The first time I got a pedi, I felt so guilty...Like I was keeping somthing from the kids.
But...oooohh! It was so good. Better'n chocolate!
I never had to take the Kobayashi Maru test until now. What do you think of my solution?O'hana means family, and family means nobody gets left behind or forgotten. My Story Recovered!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195
Member
|
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195 |
Thats how I feel too. I found these highlights I want so maybe I'll start there. I don't know. I have this fear that if I'm not everything I'll be nothing, ya know. I hold myself to some pretty high expectations. When I do something for me I think of what I could have done for them. With my H I've been afraid that if I didn't accomodate what he wanted then he'd leave I guess. I always feel like I'm being selfish.
How do I keep from going crazy when my H isn't around me? Atleast while he's still learning to be transparent. What exactly does being transparent entail? I feel like the warden. Like hes become my responsibility. I don't want that. Hes planned a surprise for me and I just keep thinking that its only because he got caught. Like he wouldnt be doing it if he hadn't gotten caught. Instead he'd still be focusing on her.
He keeps saying that he didn't want to talk to her anymore and yet he had talked to her the day I busted him and after.
Mel
"A successful marriage requires falling in love many times, always with the same person"
------------------------------------------------------
BS (me) 28
WS 26
Married in Nov. 2000
DD-11 yrs old
DD-5 yrs old
DS-4 yrs old
DS-17 mos old
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 6,058
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 6,058 |
Melly,
Glad to see you're still hangin' tough.
Kimmy is steering you right and since I'm a little under the weather I'll step aside for now.
Don't give up!
Mark
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195
Member
|
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195 |
I'm really trying. This is definately not for sissies. Kimmy has been incredible.
I hope you feel better soon. I will take your advice and continue to be vigulant about the A.
I just want to run and hide, ya know? I keep coming back to leaving because it's so much safer. I will be in control of what he can do to me. I know the goal is to be able to be in control of me and trust me. After being so connected to him it feels so impossible not to be. How do I become okay with this? I feel like I've lost so much more than my H, I;ve lost my best friend, my security. I've lost my trust in us and our future. I've even lost my trust in what we were.
How can I trust anything about us anymore? Our past, present, and future seem like an illusion. Like something I convinced myself of and never really existed.
Mel
"A successful marriage requires falling in love many times, always with the same person"
------------------------------------------------------
BS (me) 28
WS 26
Married in Nov. 2000
DD-11 yrs old
DD-5 yrs old
DS-4 yrs old
DS-17 mos old
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344 |
It exists and existed IN YOU.
You will never be okay with his actions during the adultry because they are WRONG. You can find peace about it though...through HEALING.
Heal yourself...if your wh heals too, they YEA....but if he doesn't, then no matter what, you'll be okay.
How was your weekend?
- Kimmy
I never had to take the Kobayashi Maru test until now. What do you think of my solution?O'hana means family, and family means nobody gets left behind or forgotten. My Story Recovered!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195
Member
|
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 195 |
Well my weekend was eventful. After the lie detector post my H decided to do it. We got the results today.
HE FAILED!! They asked 3 q's.
1. Did you have any physical sexual activity with Liz?
2. Did you ever initiate a kiss with Liz?
3. Did you ever tell Liz you wanted a romantic relationship with her?
He also told the examiner that he told her he was going to leave me for her. And he told him that he asked her out. He has always told me he didn't tell her he wanted a relationship with her and it was her who initiated them seeing eachother.
He swears the test is wrong. But hello its a lie detector test given by a forensic psychologist. What do I believe?
Can I heal with him here?
Mel
"A successful marriage requires falling in love many times, always with the same person"
------------------------------------------------------
BS (me) 28
WS 26
Married in Nov. 2000
DD-11 yrs old
DD-5 yrs old
DS-4 yrs old
DS-17 mos old
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344 |
Um HELLO!
You believe your GUT AND the TEST!
Tell him that HIS healing will only come when he is 100% honest....and if he wants YOU in his life then he needs to start owning his [censored]. (sorry....maybe not use those words...but he needs to own his stuff...otherwise he's doomed to continue making the same stupid mistakes).
Yes. YOU can heal. Whether he's there or not...you CAN heal. And you will, too...for your sake, and for your babies sakes.
Are you a praying woman?
- Kimmy
I never had to take the Kobayashi Maru test until now. What do you think of my solution?O'hana means family, and family means nobody gets left behind or forgotten. My Story Recovered!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,344 |
BTW: I'm not surprised in the least that he failed.
But I guess you read that, huh?
:-/
They rarely want to own their messes.....
I never had to take the Kobayashi Maru test until now. What do you think of my solution?O'hana means family, and family means nobody gets left behind or forgotten. My Story Recovered!
|
|
|
0 members (),
1,701
guests, and
92
robots. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
Forums67
Topics133,625
Posts2,323,524
Members72,031
|
Most Online6,102 Jul 3rd, 2025
|
|
|
|