Great as in good or bad? Someone on MB recommended Not Just Friends and it was perfect. I don't get a lot of reading time so its kind of slow moving but it gets done.

Mel

I think Pep meant it's GREAT because HE is reading too.

But usually SHE puts words in MY mouth...not the other way around....(hehe)

- Kimmy

I figured.

He is still denying. I feel like an idiot. I can already feel today is gonna be a low day. A day where I spend too much time evaluating all the ways hes betrayed me. He says he doesn't have the answers and m/b he doesn't.

He was planning to leave. Not just leave-leave for her. Which makes this feel like damage control. He's always said he wouldn't let us end over her and now I know so he knows he can't say it wasn't about her.

What isn't a trigger at this point? What doesn't remind me of them?

He wants to cuddle and that is so hard. Is that normal? I feel like its fake. The fact is he would still be talking to her if I hadn't caught him. He claims he was afraid of her telling me and thats why he kept talking to her but ummm...I don't think so. If that was the case then why call her upset because things weren't as easy between them as they used to be?

Like I said...bad day!

Mel

Hey Melly.

Sorry not to have gotten back to you sooner.

Sometimes we have to put our "behinds in the past" courtesy of Pumba. But really...obsessing over it will not change it OR make it better.

Far more constructive is for you to begin mapping out your want for your life and marriage.

- Kimmy

[color:"red"] EGG ZAK LEE [/color]

Its all so overwhelming for someone who is so used to ignoring herself. But anything worth having is worth working for, right?

I know where to start-small with m/b some journaling and outlining. And then branch out from there. It's just hard to start but I am CERTAIN I can do this. I am just so confused as to what I want for my M.

I know what I want in the grand scheme for me. My M is different. I don't know where to start. I love him but I know that's not enough. He needs time to prove he's worth the risk. He does seem different but he seemed different after dday #1 too. I guess I fear that I didn't keep him out long enough, ya know the ineffective plan b. There are so many ifs.

The problem is that I am such a planner. And right now my plan has been shifted and destroyed. I've been mourning what we had for the last year+and now I feel like I'm mourning what I thought we had. If that makes sense. The betrayal feels real. The past we had feels fake.

You must really like Disney-some of the greatest advice comes from Disney.

Mel

Melly,

I know it is really hard to do, but try to NOT think about it so much. By that I mean, work on allowing him to prove himself to you. Let him win you back. Don't even try to fix the R, just live in the present for a while. You can't change the past and the future would scare the H377 out of you if you knew what was going to happen. Just be and let it be for a while.

Mark

I hope you're feeling better, Mark.

It is soooo much easier said than done. I am trying so hard not to think about it-like Rafiki says "it doesn't matter its in the past".

Problem is it does matter atleast in the what am I going to do about my M sense. Everyone knew about the A but me. I am such an idiot. How could I be so stupid?

His friend is so sure he didn't have a physical relationship with her but there is no reason to believe him. And whether he did or not its already been said. Thats a pretty heavy burden on the shoulders of a M.

I need to get my footing somehow. I made an appointment with my doctor so hopefully that'll help.

I don't even know how to begin not doing anything and letting him do everything. He keeps saying he wants me back but I don't want the woman who allowed this treatmet back. She was the fool who took his poor treatment and trusted him anyway.

He did this and I can't help but feel responsible.

Mel

>I don't want the woman who allowed this treatmet back.

GOOD!

We were complacent.

Read here.

Even Dr. Harley tells us that there are areas that we should NEVER blindly trust our spouses in. Accept that....it means ALL spouses need boundries in those areas...you, me, Joe Schmoe down the street...

In your reading, you WILL learn what you want for yourself and your marriage...

Capice?

- Kimmy

God I hope so. I can't trust him and I won't.

How do I get rid of her?

I don't see a future for our M. Is it just too soon? It just doesn't feel right. I feel like there is just too much water under the bridge. The treatment I got through his A has dimmed my spirit. I used to be so extroverted and now I'm ashamed of myself and want to hide from the world.

He was planning to leave in July and I can't help but think that we all would have been better off if he had. Why did he stick around? Did he just want to hurt everyone as much as possible? He has forever changed the people we all were. My kids deserved so much better and I feel terrible for not protecting them from him from his lies and betrayal.

I just want so desperately to feel whole again.

Mel

Melly,

The first person you have to forgive is yourself. Until you have done that, you will never be able to forgive him or anyone else. You did NOT cause it and didn't catch it because you were not looking for it. You weren't looking because you trusted him. The failure was his, not yours.

Also remember that any thoughts of revenge or "getting even" with him will not lead to healing on your part. You must let those things go, too.

Yes, it is unfair!

My prayer for you is that you can begin working on healing and stop trying to make it all go away. My own recent illness has taught me that problems seldom go away. The sooner we get to the healing phase, the sooner we are back to work. I didn't want surgery. I didn't want to take my 3 weeks vacation time lying around the hospital and on the sofa at home. I didn't want to have to tell my granddaughter, "I'm sorry, you can't sit on Grandpa's lap right now." But if I hadn't had surgery last Friday, today I might be in ICU instead of at home. The surgery hurt, but the healing has started (I hope!)

It just takes a really long time.

Mark

To quote Pep

EGG-ZAK-LY

(did I do it wright/right?)

Excellent advice from Ark! I tried to find this last week for you and couldn't....I'm so glad it's been bumped!

BSes............JUST BE STILL..............

Hey!! I actually went and got those highlights. YEAH!!!

I never thought of as trying to make it go away but that is absolutely what I've been doing. I've been trying to explain it away, make it not have happened. I guess I just keep thinking that if I can make it go away I won't hurt anymore. Its the easy way out. I hava a very hard time letting other people help me and having to rely on someone else who has hurt me is even harder.

I need to heal. I need to focus on me and my kids. I need to let him do the work. I have to keep reminding myself of these things. They are just not my usual MO. I am usually the one who fixes it, who does the work. Letting someone else do it is SCARRY. I just want my life back and I know the only way to have that old life is to it so this never happened.

So this healing thing. Frame of mind or action? How do you just be still? i know how stupid that sounds but I am in a constant state of movement. I'm always busy. Its one of my ways of coping. I have to slow down-let him have the reigns when it comes to our R. I just don't know how.

I have to express my most sincere thanks to you all for your incredible support. I couldn't do this alone.

Mel

Melly,

If I've learned nothing else in the past week it is that I don't always need to be moving to be making progress. It is so easy to equate the two, but movement is not an indication of progress, only movement.

As an example I point you to weight lifting...

If I lift weights for an hour every day and always work the same muscle groups, I may gain some strength, but will never build much bulk. The reason is that lifting weights causes the muscles to be damaged. Rest is required so that the muscle can repair itself. It is the resting phase that builds new muscle tissue, not the exercise phase. Thus I make the most progress toward gaining additional strength and muscle mass by exercising and then resting those muscles so that they can heal and gain strength.

One way I decide if movement is needed is to ask myself what would be different if I did or did not do something. If the end result is the same, the motion is only that and does not make progress. Worry is not something that ever advances our cause and in fact, keeps us from recognizing what we should be doing by getting in the way of our rational judgement.

The real trick is to just "let go and let God!" Once you give a problem over to God, it becomes His problem and He always knows what is the best thing.

Hang tough!

I really need to get back to work. I'm thinking WAY too much.

Mark

You are very right. I NEED to slow down or nothing will ever get better. I cannot tell you how much your words are helping me.

I have to find a way to let go. Not even for my M but for me. I will never heal at this rate.

A friend recently said to me-"you may never forgive him for this but he's trying and thats a start. Even if you never forgive, you will never forget, but the fact that hes trying is what really matters. He wants to make it right, atleast let him try."

How do you find the strength to let it go. To let yourself be vulnerable again? How do you find what it takes to give the action doing over to someone whho has hurt you so much?

Letting him work onthis seems like such a risk.

Mel

Mel,

Let me ask you this; if he fails in his effort to rebuild the trust, can't ever show you enough remorse and you continue to trigger on every little detail of every day life, what would the result be? I would venture a guess that you would end up divorced.

But suppose he is able to prove to you that he can be trusted, even if it takes a year or more. And what if he has an epiphany and suddenly says"Doh!" and knows he was an idiot and does everything in his power to try to make it up to you? What if he reads HN/HN and gets it? What if he can be the H he should have been all along (not the one you thought you had, the one you should have had)...Wouldn't you have a really terrific marriage?

My point (you know I always have one) is that you have lots of time to give up and send him packing, but you really have been at this for a short time right now, and in the course of recovery, time moves very slowly. Let him make the effort and see if he can do it. If he falls off the wagon and does it again, you can quit, but don't give up until you have really tried everything.

A question I ask the guys at work when someone says "I've tried everything," is "Have you tried throwing snowballs at it?" Doesn't fix much, but is included in the subset of everything....

Already said; "Let go and let God!"

See first line of my sig line...

Mark

It is still very soon. I'm not yet at that place where I can say one way or the other what it is that I want.

He claims to have had an epiphany. He claims to be in that OMG I can't believe I've been doing this. Problem is he had that same epiphany back in May. The same shows of remorse and the same efforts to fix everything. He is notorious for doing well for a couple weeks or so and then saying I'm done.

This isn't the first time. This is DDay #2 after a relapse in August. This isn't his first time. Fool me once shame on you fool me twice shame on me. I have a quote that I love from Maya Angelou-when someone shows you who they are, believe them. My H has done nothing but show how cruel, dishonest, and untrustworthy he can be. He's lied point blank to my face knowing how much he was hurting our family.

So the Q is how many times does he need to fall off the wagon before enough is enough?

Mel

That is personal for each person...and that's why that "fool me" statement is kinda silly.

My point of no return it different from Marks or Peps or Mels (obviously)...

But...you do know when enough is enough. You'll feel it with every fiber of your being.

- Kimmy

What if I know but I dont want to?

I love him but this is a lot to overcome. I used to see a future with him that was so hopeful. Now I see nothing but pain. I don't know what I want. Or m/b I do and am too scared to do anything about it.

Do I sound like I want this? Like I want to stick it out?

There are just so many lies. So many betrayals.

Mel