Hey fighting,

Yikes!! Your WS does know how to READ, correct? What part of no contact doesn't she understand? I'm glad that you stood your ground, and hopefully you will find more peace and quiet after the LSA is signed.

You will suffer smaller set backs the darker you can be. Your thoughts sound solid, and I hope that your heart follows suit. I agree with the statment regarding WS coming back to the table. That is what I have been looking for...

One foot in front of the other. You're on the right track.

It has gotten a little easier for me each day.

I still think that the erratic behavior of your WS is a good sign. Being able to recognize the difference between your WS and your S is good.

Be strong.

recent update....attempting plan B has been much harder than it looks....WS has still not given me back LSA...still trying to partake in sleepovers...from what I hear has been fighting with OP because WS wants to "see other people" and OP knows that the "other people" WS wants to see is #1 her wife!!(me) they have not been seeing much of each other...so I have heard.

I have only talked to her 3 times this week...I am ready for the 2x4's...I know its 3 x's too much... but without a clear schedule for the kids it is unavoidable. I have asked WS for the LSA each time and she says she forgot...she does NOT like to be controlled...I am not surprised at her behavior... she says that the structure schedule for the kids is not good because both our schedules change. I told her I don't agree. the kids need structure and stability now more than ever. and so it goes.....I have kept the drop offs short and to the point.

thats all I can do for now ....I guess I can consider going the lawyer route and risk being "the heavy" again. but I am unsure how far I want to push it. trying not to build hope into her behavior with OP as she usually plunges right back into the fog eventually.

when I am away I feel so much better...it scares me...as I look over our EN's I see that I met almost all of hers to the 100th degree. she met almost none of mine. lack of respect for me has been a #1 issue, I never really took a stand...we both know that. but she doesn't want me to change that part of me. she says she loves being smothered...so she knows that she is loved. she sees my pulling back as abandonment...which she has issues from both of her parents leaving.

so many issues she has that have nothing to do with me. I am having fun again without her...much less stressed.... no limitations because of her panic disorder....I am wondering what I am really missing in her....conversation, friendship mostly...but I don;t miss my whole life being controlled by her....I am utterly confused again... life might just be easier without her...all the changes she has to make for herself first...then give to me what she never has been able to before...and i still have to be the one to sit and wait patiently for my M. I don't know if i want to put my needs on the back burner for any longer...I want to have fun... I want to live life...for me....maybe she has done me a favor....I'm all messed up again

It's a roller coaster ride which makes almost all riders sick.

Know that it is a long and winding road ahead..... get prepared for the roller coaster and be determined (with a plan) how NOT to get stuck on that wild ride.

The WS is confusing to all life forms, even their own kind. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> Still you know this and can get protected. R U ready?

L.

Orchid...I am unsure whether or not I am ready...it seems to me the most sense is to just get off the ride totally....any hope I have of recovery can only come from personal growth of my WS...which I cannot control...

even in plan B....I am supposed to be removing myself from the pain...bettering myself....and how do you remove yourself from someone and still have hope of recovery, still maintain that sense of belonging together...it is such a quandry...I feel like I am unable to move forward unless I resolve something...there is no resolution and will not be a resolution as I have to wait to see if and when plan B will even work...I guess I just feel overwhelmed at the amount of time people here have been going through this...I am uncertain of my tenacity to remain faithful in my heart to someone who has cast me aside and may never look back.


I just hate feeling stuck...unable to move past it...unable to put it behind...unable to move forward... unable to do much of anything...keep her in my heart...believe we can make it...but move on and do for myself...stop having interest in her life...remove her from your life...but not from your heart...its such a contradiction

I guess it is just so difficult living in such limbo...in my mind I can say "I am focusing on myself" but I am afraid if I put too much distance physically between us..that emotional distance will follow suit...and I am afraid I will never get that back. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

The BS needs a lot of distance from the WS. Otherwise the WS will suck the life out of you.

L.

thanks Orchid...I know that is the truth...sometimes it is easier to digest....

wow...I had worked nights the other day and was seriously sleep deprived...feeling very down....I can see that in my posts....I am feeling better now...

the roller coaster thing.....does it ever end/???? ever???



so so so true....I can almost feel the blood rushing back in...<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

Hi FB,

Glad u r feeling better. Now that u r back in control a bit more, work on your plans to stay in control of you, ok?

L.

thanks Orchid



I am open to ideas for this...

I'm going to focus back on a lot of that self care stuff...get a massage...maybe join the gym...and plan something fun for my kids for school vacation...that should get my attention on what is important right now. me and my kids.

I am stronger and weaker this week. somehow that evens out I guess to just feeling normal. I have been doing much better with contact. WS still has not signed LSA, I am still not ready to make the grand gesture of retaining a lawyer. we have had phone contact almost daily this week for the reason that my 8yr old son was almost hospitalized with pneumonia. he is thankfully getting better.

WS has taken every opportunity to let me know her plans everytime we speak...I am unsure whether to believe it, but from what she tells me OP seems to be absent from her plans, at least what she is leading me to believe. then WS tells me about contact with OP "its not what you think" I have not participated in any of these conversations, pretty much has been her telling me what she is doing, then I steer talk back to the kids and get off the phone.

WS also has been asking to spend time at the house, sleep over again, come by and bring dinner. then asked me to meet up with mutual friends of ours for the past 2 saturdays(usually date night with OP) I have politely and firmly refused all of these requests.

then this morning after dropping off kids she told my 3yr son that "I will talk to mama about me coming back to live at home" of course within my ear shot. I ignored the comment and she went off to work.

it is hard to be strong with her pushing for my attention so hard but I feel rather controlled. I know its not as dark as it needs to be in plan B but I am holding my ground. I hate to feel comforted by her words as they are not to be trusted but I am. I continue to try to have no expectations and have made plans for myself and the kids to go to disney on ice. I am also considering a vacation for myself with friends. something I have never done. it time for taking care of me.

You absolutely have to take care of yourself so that you can be strong. Massage is great, and the trip and fun with the kids ideas are right.

I am encouraged by the results so far, but I also understand that a false return is pretty typical. Don't give up your plan B and try to make it darker. Why do you have to talk to her at all? If she won't agree to NC, don't give in. You don't want to let her control you. Demonstrating that she's not controlling you and that you're not needy is another part of Plan B, I think.

great advice sdg. thanks for the support


I have heard a lot of words, but so far no action. the good thing is...I don't believe a word she says, I want to, but I don't. the bad thing is...I don't believe a word she says, I want to, but I don't <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
I can respond only to her actions...of which I see none. plan B is hard, hard, hard. I haven't even gone that dark and its hard, hard, hard.


I am not interested in false recovery, or continued contact when I know she is not really ready to commit to recovery. so my guard is way up. I don't think my LB could hadnle another withdrawal at this point in time...I have yet to even start licking my wounds.

I am going out with friends tonight, totally platonic and I was not planning on coming home, but staying at a friends. she heard of my plans and is not happy, she knows none of the details and as such a controlling person she is probably feeling insecure...I am unfazed.

my next focus is to go a bit darker.

hey fighting,

sdguy is right. You MUST take care of you, get some relaxing leisure time for yourself. Try as best you can to pamper yourself, even if it's just reading a book or taking a restorative nap.

I totally get what you mean by wanting to believe but not believing and how devastating that is.

Your WS is making some interesting/telling statements, but you are right, there's no ACTION backing them. WAIT for that, really SEE what she is DOING, not what she is TRYING.

Do try harder to darken your plan; Your WS must feel the reality of being apart, and you must enforce it and ALLOW it. YOU are your only roadblock, but you already know this, don't you...

Have a good time with your friends. You will learn how to be alone, and you will grow to like some of it. It may give you time to learn what you really enjoy again. This is always good to take back into your R if you recover, a FRESH perspective.

I can't stress enough that you are not really in Plan B until it truly FEELS like separation, for both of you...keep posting, keep working.

FB, I don't see the roller coaster ending anytime soon. Yesterday, I was feeling better and stronger, today not so much. Maybe anxious over the kidswap tomorrow. But I'm more aware of it now and what to do about it.

You definitely need to go darker if you can, because that's going to be effective for both of you.

And treat yourself with something! Report back to us what it is. Or at least that you did it.

SDG

OK, guys
I went shopping last week and bought some great clothes....love that. then friday I went out club hopping with a few friends and had a great time, got in at 3am, haven't done that in 6 years probably. then Saturday I did the kid swap then went home and listened to my ipod and steam cleaned the carpets....sounds crazy but it felt great!!!I picked up dinner for the kids and I and had a surprisingly good day.

My MIL called to check in on me as she knows how I HATE saturdays (used to be a big deal we made about it being family day and date night). WS and I always spent the whole day together. funny thing is, this is the first saturday I didn't feel like crying...I had a great day without my WS.

kink in the plan...
the past few days my plan B has been really strong, very few words spoken at all, almost no phone contact, no emails. my parents helped with kidswapping so I didn't have to see her.

but today WS caught me on the phone and started crying hysterically...I was very caught off guard as this is unusual for her.... WS was saying stuff like "my life is unrecognizable, I really ****ed up my life"..... I couldn't bring myself to say any of the things I know I am supposed to say as I didn't want to hurt her anymore than she was already (I know that's not my responsibility, but old habits die hard) I ended up just listening and then finally said..."there are some things you will need to do in order for me to address any of these issues with you further." she said "I really can't hear that from you right now, now I just need you to be a friend to me" I listened for a few minutes longer then she went silent...she had mentioned that she may be interested in seeing an IC but didn't know where to go from there. I told her I believed in her and I hoped that she felt better and that I thought she was stronger than she thinks she is. then I got off the phone.

so a few strong days and I am back in the thick of it. I had done so good...but when I heard all that vulnerability I caved...hard... I did do better than before the A though...so maybe I am getting better at defining the difference between my stuff and her stuff. the old me would have gotten on the phone..found a counselor...made an appointment and told her when and where to show up. the new me conveyed that I believed in her ability to fight this battle for herself..I conveyed respect...I hope I did anyway.

any advice from here...should I resend plan B letter? remind her of what I need...I really don't think she remembers what PBL even says.

I would resend the letter, and hang up next time she calls, or don't answer at all, let ALL calls go to voicemail. As long as your kids are okay, and you know it, there is no reason to answer the phone right away, NONE.

Look, read up on my sitch, It STINKS! Don't cave, don't quit. Don't let yourself be a pawn. Even under good circumstances, you can do the merry go round, and you WANT the roller coaster, get it?

SL, huh? I want the roller coaster? I don't get it.. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

OK, PBL resent via email.. no contact at all today!!!
I am back on top. gggrrrrr

SL, I want the roller coaster because it means there is still a chance at recovery?? no rollercoaster means I am ready to move on?? is that what you mean?

The merry go round goes nowhere, you arrive at the same point over and over and over by allowing the WS in to your life, allowing them to sit on that fence, allowing yourself to partipate in said fence sitting. ENABLING the A.

The roller coaster goes up and down and loop-de-loop, and over the river and through the woods. There is CHANGE in it. There is ADVERSITY and the peaks and the valleys. You will learn the hard lessons in the valleys. See merry go rounds have no valleys, no peaks, no change.

So the analogy maybe lost on some, but here's the real answer. You do not want to be ACTIVELY involved with this woman. Do you feel loved by her? Do you keep HEARING her talking of misery where she is, but NO ACTIONs to remove herself from the pain she is causing HERSELF. NO? She will continue to try and lure you onto the merry go round, with it's horsies and bells and lights, it's nice and easy for her. Same [censored] different day!

I sound angry and I want you to know that I'm most definitely NOT. I feel for you, I KNOW the things that are being said to you. It's the same stuff I heard before going DARK in Plan B.

I've hopped on the coaster, MY DECISION. It's a rougher ride, but I'm willing to go it ALONE. If WH wants to join me, that's great, we will learn in the valleys together. When I did Plan B, I decided to jump off the merry go round, and get in the line for the coaster...

If your WS begins to talk to you again about how she has F'd her life up, tell her that she can make the decision to make it better, and that you will be there for her under those circumstances. She needs to know that you will not be there for her until NC is in place with OW. She hasn't seen you enforce that yet...

Good lord, I hope that made sense. I'm finished with the metaphors. Keep talkin' we're listenin..