1. Wants to be with someone that can always communicate with me anyway they feel most comfortable.
[color:"blue"]Sounds like she has some trouble reading you. Could you improve your communication skills? Whether you get back with her or not, it is worth looking at. [/color]
2. Wants to be with someone that will accept the same from her. [color:"blue"]Open communication and tact can be two different things. Depends on what she means.[/color]
3. Have meals together with no TV or phone interruptions.
[color:"blue"]Reasonable. [/color]
4. Forget about the past mistakes.
[color:"blue"]Forgive and forget are two different things. [/color][color:"red"]RED FLAG! RED FLAG![/color]
5. Someone that wants to get up every now and then and just go somewhere. Not plan everything.
[color:"blue"]Seeks spontanity. Reasonable.[/color]
6. Put her first over everyone including our families.
[color:"blue"]This is important. You want to make sure she doesn't feel 2nd rate around family. That doesn't mean that you cancel family plans because she decides to do something different at the last minute. [/color]
7. Defend her to other people and discuss with her in private anything I don't agree with.
[color:"blue"]Similiar to #6. Very good point. [/color]
8. Be with someone that doesn't have plans to live in our city forever. [color:"blue"]Why? [/color]

9. Be with someone that thinks she is beautiful inside and outside and will love her enough to never make her want someone else. [color:"blue"]First part is good, but you can't make someone else do anything that they don't want to do. [/color][color:"red"]RED FLAG! [/color]

10. Be married again this year if possible. She loved being married and didn't realize it until she let it slip away. She misses being a wife and having to look forward to look forward to a future with someone she loves. [color:"red"] ??? [/color] [color:"blue"] Does she love you or just being married. [/color]

First of all, I am learning alot from your post. Thank you for sharing.

To see if a person is really changing takes a long time. Even actions are not enough. There has to be time and tests to show what motives are or you will end up down another dead end road...sometimes a different one than before...none the less, dead end.

I don't think your ex is getting it. I think the relationship she was in is running its course and it is time to move back to you. If that man owes her that much money and is now not paying like he didn't pay his taxes I would think she would be highly dissapointed in what she thought he was and what he really is.

This sounds a bit like an ad for Match.com or something.

I especially like # 9 and 10: I liked being married too but she wants to be remarried in a year? Sounds to me like a classic case of : "I haven't learned what I need to to be a good partner in life so I'm skipping over that whole boring part and want to move on to the happy happy joy joy parts of what I want,it is all about me". <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> And see (#9) where she basically wants someone else to prevent her from straying. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> Taking no responsibility.

Nope.DD,I say put the ex on the back burner,if at all and see what else is out there for you.You do not have to rush into anything that is for sure.One thing that I have seen over the years in an unrepentant WS is that they don't want the hassle of dealing with what they did and their choices.


The good news is that you are D so you don't have to make any decision right now if you don't want to.You can say,"I want to be alone for a while".If your ex can't handle that you can read about her pending marriage in the paper if she can't wait more than a year and get her life in order first.

IMO she's got it all wrong.

I have told her that there is no way that we would be married this year and she at first had a problem with that, but she has lessened her stance on that one. I told her the only way that we would be getting back together is if she moved out on her own, had a job away from him, and if she wnet to counseling to work on herself and then we went to counseling together. I have been to counseling to work on myself and some of the problems that she said that I had. She told me that she starts counseling next week so I guess I will see what happens. There is no reason to rush back into things like she wants. I told her that if we were to get back together, it would not be in a hurry and I wanted to make sure that all of our problems were taken care of and I was "sure" that this wouldn't happen again.

I feel you are doing the right thing. Be strong. Time won't heal this, but actions will. Including your own...

Being in a similar sitch, I'm not as "nay-nay" to the idea of reconcilliation nor am I as push-push as others here. If that were the case, what hope would most of the folks on the GQII board have?

Just because we divorced, does that mean that the recovery process is still not the same? In the RC church, my ex and I are (and will always be) considered married. We are only legally divorced. Of course, we also have 3 children...

Yet, wouldn't it be true that your X would only now be (possibly) coming out of the fog yet still prone to fog-like statements? Wouldn't she still be apprehensive and unable to take full accountability because she isn't far enough removed from this problem?

The question is, if she were able to met your needs, would you even want her to? Then, go to that part of the site and start there - regardless of your legal position.

Have either of you filled out the EN questionnaire?

MB,

It is good to be able to "talk" to someone that is going through the same thing. I think that the recovery process is the same as people that choose not to D and work things out. I saw the D as my only way out of not having to worry about what my W was doing with another man. I think that I would still be open to the idea of her meeting my EN if it came to that. This is still so new to me, I am not sure what I want right now though. I don't even know if she is going to be able to get out of the fog. I asked her the other day what happened between those 2 to make her want to start working on things with me again and she told me that nothing happened. If she still sees him everyday and lives in the apartment that they used to live in together, I don't see her coming out of the fog anytime soon. I will just play it by ear for now and see how she progresses before I make any decisions on what to do.

That is a good approach. I D'd for the same exact reason. I didn't want to, but felt I needed to because of what was happening with her. Had I stuck with the MB principals, and went thru the steps typically stated on GQII, I would probably be in nearly the EXACT same place I am now, but not divorced.

So, why should we act differently? Because we gave in to a D? There's no finality in that unless we CHOOSE finality in that - emotionally, mentally, phsyically and spiritually.

In my sitch, the X just couldn't "be" with the OM any longer because it was starting to get ugly. Ugly in many senses, but primarily the guilt factor setting in and the children / extended family starting to hit her with reality. And then, I essentially started to become the OM...having secret encounters with her...and "he" couldn't take it. Go figure. In GQII, some encourage that methodology...some don't. To each their own.

It has been just over 9 weeks since their "breakup" and as far as I can tell, there is very little, if any, contact. It's very hard to tell, really. She is not ready to write the NC letter yet -- but has stated that it needs to be done. I can tell she is coming out of the fog, but still has fog-like tendencies. She still has a strong emotional attachment to the fantasy and can't quite admit that it was a fantasy - just yet.

It's a wait and see game. In the meantime, I work on myself, my new home, the kids, and my job. And X and I spend /some/ time together. That's plenty. Also, she is starting to meet some of my needs which is a complete 180 from 3 months ago. That sure SEEMS like a step in the right direction.

Counseling, time (actions), "dating" and within 6 months, I honestly feel that we'll know whether we can do this or not - i.e., she'll feel safer with me and my ability not to LB this mess, and I'll feel safer with her and her desire to REALLY try. And when that time comes, I'll definintely suggest formal reconcilliation and ask for the NC letter.

With the last two being what they were, I'm willing to give it 6 more months while taking the advice of so many here only to "reason" with myself. Ultimately, it's up to us to decide what's best for us. For now...

Peace.

blue

It is funny what you say about being the other man in the whole thing. I found out that I was the same thing for a while. We didn't do anything physical except for kissing each other goodbye, but it turns out that she was telling the OM that she was going to her moms and telling her mom to tell him that she had just went to the store if he called looking for her. She didn't tell me this, her mom did. When I asked her about it, she admitted to it and I stopped being the other man. This happened about 6 months ago and we really haven't been out since other than to the store or to get our dog a burger.

I am not sure if anyone is following this but my wife was supposed to start counseling last night. I didn't hear anything from her in email like I usually do at night so I am not sure if that is a bad sign. I usually get email from her at work and I will post something if anything constructive comes out of it. Hope everyone is doing well.

You still have people following your thread. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Don't worry about not getting an email last night. One of two things happened:

1.) She decided she didn't "really" need to go and didn't want to "talk" about that decision. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

2.) She went and was given a lot to think about. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

Either way, don't worry about it. She will contact you when she's ready.

Stay Strong!

I heard from her this morning and she told me that she did end up going. I asked her how it went and here are a couple of quotes:

"Very hard and very sad and I cried myself to sleep."

"I was finally honest and it hurt to go through it all."

She is supposed to go again next Tuesday so we will see what happens.

dxdog,

Just keep on with your life. It is her life to make work or not. Your life is yours to control. Hang in there, and get on with your life. If she wants to catch up to you, she can.

God Bless,

JL

DD,

Just be wary and remember that actions speak louder than words.Yes she *may have had an epiphany of sorts but that doesn't mean she has learned the lessons of a good relationship all of a sudden.She could very well be sad about the wrong things you know? Like when a cheater gets caught and that's why they are finally sorry.

Like JL said keep on living.

After her first counseling session, she asked if it were possible for us to meet somewhere to exchange the "custody" of our dog for the weekends that she has him. I don't have a problem with that and she picked her parents house to do it. I don't have a problem with that because I still love her parents and talk to them about once a week. When I went there to drop him off, her neice and nephew were there and I hadn't seen them in a while so they asked me to stay and play with them. I ended up staying there for about an hour and a half playing with the kids and talking with her. At times it almost seemed like things were the way they were 2-3 years ago. I know that I shouldn't be jumping to conclusions, but should I take this as an initial good sign on a possible change in things for the future? I am not ready to jump back into anything until she changes a lot more. Any opinions would be appreciated. Thanks everyone.

DDog,

Quit trying to read the tea leaves and entrails. You have plenty of time to make decisions and they should be made on FACTS not inuendo's of actions. It will become very clear to you in time when it is time to change your course.

Right now Captain, it is "steady as she goes", to the helmsman. Your ship is sailing along nicely and there is no reason to change directions. Enjoy your life, your friends, your relatives, even former in-laws. It will all become apparent to you in time.

God Bless,

JL

Ddog,

I'm in a very similar sitch. Having spent the last 2-3 years trying to "read the tea leaves" as JL just noted, my own result was simply suffering "bungee emotions" and even anxiety from illusory expectations. Not encouraged...

Pepperband recently stated that we usually get what we pray for. I've been praying for patience and compassion for many years. So, as Pep so aptly pointed out, maybe that's why I've been presented with an opportunity to learn and mold patience and compassion.

Don't hunt. Let God bring you what you need.

Peace.

Just wanted to give a quick update in case anyone is still following this. The X is supposedly moving into her own place this weekend. That I thought was a good step, but after hearing that she is still going to church with her boyfriend and he has moved back into the apartment that they were sharing, I am officially giving up on any type of reconciliation. I think that it is best that I move on and find something better for me. She is getting the rest of her stuff out of the house Saturday and other than the exchange of our dog for visitation, I am done with her. It is time that I start living my life for me and not wishing for something that isn't going to happen.

DD,

Good idea, in fact an excellent idea. You never know what life will bring you, but make the most of it, learn from it, and enjoy what you can of it. She may end up back in your life someday, who knows, but someone far better may be waiting in the wings now that you are ready to appreciate her.

Life is very unpredictable and trust me after over 60 years I still find it interesting how it twists and turns.

My suggestion: lead your life with peace and grace. You will be a happier man for it.

God Bless,

JL

PS: In case you havn't realized it yet. There was nothing to give up on. You are divorced and on your own.

Peace, DD.

JL- You have got that very right. Once some one has violated vows I can't understand how they will change their ways in the future. The consquences of this behavior is that she lost her husband. The wife is trying to avoid that consequence. "Fool me once shame on you me Fool me twice shame on me"